Church can reject gays, single mums for employment

My ex worked as a supervisor in a la senza store (in the uk) and she told me it was against store policy to hire men and that there was a specific provision for it in the discrimination laws (no idea if its true I doubt she would lie about it).

If it is true I would image its covered in the states in the laws protecting your right to practice your religion.

reply to post by gYvMessanger


We are in different countries

Its just what I was told, but the friend wasnt a supervisor

As an employer I will never hire a Muslim person because it will disrupt my business. I will not hire a overtly gay person as it is detrimental to my business. I will not hire a person who insists on wearing a turban as it is detrimental l to my business. My goal in business is to earn a profit and I will not allow anyone or agency to tell me how to spend my money. If a person wants to work work for me they should be the best candidate for the position be they male or female, white ,black, asian etc... I am not white and I do not condone Racism in any form.

I believe if your in Australia you may well be right, I'm not suggesting your a liar or anything.

I just think that its within acceptable boundaries for organizations to be allowed to discriminate, if they have an established ethos around certain subjects.

There is a thing as being "too" PC, its a very tricky area to try and legislate for. I have nothing against homosexuals and certainly have nothing against single mothers, but I very much dislike the idea that business' should ever be obliged to hire someone, as long as they are honest in what is acceptable from prospective employee's and race is not an issue.

Companies and Organizations have vested interests to protect, you wouldn't cry discrimination because someone with an IQ of 88 failed to get the job as CEO of Microsoft, but the end of the day the kid was born retarded its not his fault. Likewise The Church has a stance against Homosexuality and sex out of Wedlock and doesn't see people who engage openly in such activities as being good prospective employee's and I think that's their right.

Originally posted by newworld
This is morally wrong no matter which excuse you try to make for it. There is a BIG difference between discriminating someone who might not be suitable for a job due to inexperience or lack of credentials, and discriminating someone simply for having a different sexual preference or being a single mother.

This just goes to show the male-dominant system that the church still follows to this day. Unlike Islam, which threats women as second class citizens openly, the catholic church apparently does the same but instead of being open about this sort of discrimination they try to hide behind "tradition" and subtlety.

Discrimination due to not having qualifications makes sense, discrimination due to sexual preference or being a single mother is just plain bigotry.

Please take your Feminist rubbish somewhere else. Last time I checked women were granted the same rights as men and not secretly considered second class. If I were the spiritual leader of a Mosque and did not hire somebody because they were Jewish, would you call this bigotry? Oh, but I'm sure this would be ok in your eyes because the "perpetrator" is not Christian.

Homosexuality is against the teaching of the Christian Bible. How can a religious institution (Church) hire people who take part in such behaviour? Single mothers on the other hand should not be refused work in my opinion. Last time I checked, it was not against the values of Christianity to hire a woman (or man) raising a child on their own. Being a single mom does not automatically mean her child was conceived out of wedlock.

The PC brigade are working on creating a system where nobody can be offended or feel discriminated against...except White, Heterosexual Christians.

To all of those crying "Gay Rights" I ask you this: would you be fine with a Gay Bar choosing not to hire a heterosexual male? The Church does not ban homosexuals; it chooses not to HIRE them to work for the Church - big difference imo.

[edit on 27/9/2009 by Dark Ghost]

Originally posted by OzWeatherman
reply to post by TheRedneck

 

Well said mate

You are completely correct. Im sure many of us would hire the sexy blonde with absolutely no credential (or sense), rather than the old chubby woman with loads of experience. Figuratively speaking of course...

But is it right for the church to have a seperate law to every other organisation? Just as a comparisonn, my organisation would never be allowed to do something like this (legally), despite the beliefs of our head of department. Just like we wouldnt be allowed to discriminate on basis of religious preference...is it right for them to have their own set of rules?

As a private enterprise they should be entitled to hire any person based on the criteria they feel suits their interests best. The Govt. should not be telling any business who they may or may not hire.

Originally posted by habfan1968
As an employer I will never hire a Muslim person because it will disrupt my business. I will not hire a overtly gay person as it is detrimental to my business. I will not hire a person who insists on wearing a turban as it is detrimental l to my business.

What business is that?

I thought you were not racist?

Originally posted by hotpinkurinalmint
reply to post by Silver Shadow

 

First, we have to distinguish pedophiles from gay people. Pedophiles harm children. Pedophilia is wrong and illegal.

Gay people on the other hand engage in consensual sex acts with other gay people, just like heterosexuals engage in consensual sex acts with other straight people. It is not fair, nor logical to compare a lesbian to a pedophile.

Second, we have to make a distinction between the secular parts of the school curriculum and the religious parts. I am assuming every religious school has both secular and religious components. I think it is fair to only allow qualified people to teach the religious component, and the church should use any criteria they want to determine who is qualified to teach the religious component.

On the other hand, the school should not be allowed to discriminate with regards to the secular component. This is a secular activity that the church happens to be engaged in. Once the church starts getting involved in secular activities, it should be governed by the same laws that govern all of us in our secular activities.

In what sense is it fair for anyone to tell this particular school who to hire?

If they are Catholic they should be following the doctrine as prescribed by the Holy Bible which would not permit gays to be in anywhere near that school.
If this school is funded by the Federal Govt. which is your tax money then it is totally different and they should be following federal guidelines as the public schools do, but i suspect that is not the case.

Originally posted by OzWeatherman

Originally posted by habfan1968
As an employer I will never hire a Muslim person because it will disrupt my business. I will not hire a overtly gay person as it is detrimental to my business. I will not hire a person who insists on wearing a turban as it is detrimental l to my business.

What business is that?

I thought you were not racist?

I own a health club, and I am not racist.

Originally posted by OzWeatherman

Originally posted by habfan1968
As an employer I will never hire a Muslim person because it will disrupt my business. I will not hire a overtly gay person as it is detrimental to my business. I will not hire a person who insists on wearing a turban as it is detrimental l to my business.

What business is that?

I thought you were not racist?

I have friends and family that fall into all the a fore mentioned categories but I will not hire any of them.

Why would gays want to work for those who are against gays?

This is a reverse discrimination. Gays would not work for those who are against gays.


HAHAHA. How's that for irony?

Originally posted by habfan1968

I own a health club, and I am not racist.

Yet you wont welcome muslims? How is a muslims presence detrimental to business? How is a flamboyant homosexual detrimental to your business?

I dont understand

reply to post by Dark Ghost

Homosexuality is against the teaching of the Christian Bible. How can a religious institution (Church) hire people who take part in such behaviour?

That teachings have been proven to be erronous. It is a simple a matter of their biased opinion.

Gays have been proven to be more than capable to do any kinds of work.

I ask you this: would you be fine with a Gay Bar choosing not to hire a heterosexual male?

Then it would be very wrong on their part. Who says that a heterosexual man can't do his job in a gay bar?

The Church does not ban homosexuals; it chooses not to HIRE them to work for the Church - big difference imo.

Um what?

Originally posted by OzWeatherman

Originally posted by habfan1968

I own a health club, and I am not racist.

Yet you wont welcome muslims? How is a muslims presence detrimental to business? How is a flamboyant homosexual detrimental to your business?

I dont understand

I have never been to a health club in Australia so I cannot comment on how the culture is there.

I have many, probably 10% of my clientele are Muslim, another 5% are openly gay. I have lesbian clients, single moms etc.. however My income depends on the majority of my clients who are, well, not any of those types of people so I hire people that would cater to the majority of my customers. It is a private business and while I do not hire these types of people I do not discourage any of them from joining the club. I do however, disagree with the notion that I should change how I run my business to observe some one else's religion. I am Catholic but the club is open on Christmas and Easter, I work the club myself those days.

Business is business.

Do they think that by hiring gays the gays will gay up their businesses and their clients?

Personally, I'm torn on this point.

For instance, if you were trying to hire someone for a department store Santa, you wouldn't select a skinny black women over a bearded jolly fat bloke.

I can understand why they wouldn't hire gays (in a messed-up kinda way) but single mums? That's a bit harsh isn't it? Single mums almost never manage to live as well off as married mums and so may rely on the church more.

But also, I'm not sure why a gay would ever want to work in a religious organisation especially one where gays aren't allowed. Some religious groups seem to almost share the superior race mentality of Hitler.

[edit on 27-9-2009 by Welfhard]

Something stinks here.

I think it's my feet.

Wait that's not it.

A religious organization would rather hire a straight married person with NO qualifications than hire a gay with plenty of experience and qualifications?

Originally posted by Deaf Alien

That teachings have been proven to be erronous. It is a simple a matter of their biased opinion.
[...]
Gays have been proven to be more than capable to do any kinds of work.
[...]
Then it would be very wrong on their part. Who says that a heterosexual man can't do his job in a gay bar?

I agree that it is biased, but as a private institution they have the right to decide who may WORK there. We are not talking about having signs outside Church saying "no homosexuals allowed", we are talking about their policy of hiring homosexuals to do Church duties.

I agree with you that one's sexual preference does not determine their ability to achieve something or capability to do things. The same as ones race or religious adherence does not either.

The Church does not ban homosexuals; it chooses not to HIRE them to work for the Church - big difference imo.

Please look at the thread topic and read it in full.

"Church can reject gays, single mums for employment"

[edit on 27/9/2009 by Dark Ghost]

reply to post by Dark Ghost

The Church does not ban homosexuals

Yes, again. WHAT?

They DO ban homosexuals. In fact, they would like to see them jailed or even killed.

Originally posted by Deaf Alien

Yes, again. WHAT?

They DO ban homosexuals. In fact, they would like to see them jailed or even killed.

You have truly been misinformed. You are basing your views of a majority off an extremist minority. Most Christians will still offer you peace and compassion even if you are a homosexual. You are still welcome to pray in Church and will not be rejected because of your sexual orientation. Yes, there are a few minority Churches that probably would want to do those things you mentioned...but there are bad apples in all the different bunches of this world.

In all my years of walking past Churches - from all kinds of denominations including Chinese Churches to Catholic Churches - I have NEVER seen a derogatory sign or suggestion made about any particular race, religion or sexual orientation. Almost every single one has a sign along the lines of "The Lord welcomes all to enter and pray before Him..."

[edit on 27/9/2009 by Dark Ghost]