It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Church can reject gays, single mums for employment

page: 1
5
<<   2  3  4 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 08:19 PM
link   
This is sort of a news story, but I thought it may fit here

Pretty much, it is now legal in the state of Victoria for religious groups to discrimante against gays people and single mothers, by refusing them emplyment!!!!

So pretty much, we are back to the stone age where people have no rights again if they are considered "different" then the normal person.

Even more ridiculous....and this one deserves a complete facepalm is the statement made by the archbishop



Melbourne Catholic Archbishop Denis Hart told the paper the move strikes "a fair and correct balance".


How is correct and balanced when they wont allow a certain person to work there??

What is everyone elses take on this? Especially interested in those who are from a religious background? Is this right, or is it discrimination hiding behind a religious shroud as we've seen before in the past?

Link to article

news.ninemsn.com.au...



+11 more 
posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 08:30 PM
link   
Technically, it is discrimination. Technically, it is also discrimination to bar sex offenders form working in day care centers. Technically, it is discrimination to refuse to hire people because they do not have a college degree. Technically, it is discrimination to require someone have any requirements for any job.

The church is not the government. The church is an organization founded on certain principles, right or wrong, that the members adhere to and/or believe in. As such, the organization should have the right to hire whomever it wishes and to set standards for the job positions offered.

You discriminate every day of your life, as do I and everyone else on the planet. You treat people differently, based on personal information about them. Do you hire a babysitter who you know has already been convicted of burglary? Do you treat the guy walking down the street whom you have never seen the same as your siblings? Do you stop in to visit people who you do not know but who live in the slums, or do you only visit the people you know?

Some discrimination in society is appropriate.

TheRedneck



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 08:40 PM
link   
reply to post by TheRedneck
 


Well said mate


You are completely correct. Im sure many of us would hire the sexy blonde with absolutely no credential (or sense), rather than the old chubby woman with loads of experience. Figuratively speaking of course...

But is it right for the church to have a seperate law to every other organisation? Just as a comparisonn, my organisation would never be allowed to do something like this (legally), despite the beliefs of our head of department. Just like we wouldnt be allowed to discriminate on basis of religious preference...is it right for them to have their own set of rules?



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 08:44 PM
link   
reply to post by TheRedneck
 


It sure is discrimination. And I was one to think that churches were against descrimination and a place you could turn to in need of help/assurance. Certainly isn't in this case.




[edit on 26-9-2009 by Scooby Doo]



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 08:47 PM
link   
reply to post by TheRedneck
 


Maybe the answer is to never employ discriminating Christians and to equate them to criminals, burglars, sex offenders and to set standards for the vacant jobs. This would rid from the workplace the piously dictatorial and yet morally hypocritical who have little critical thinking ability and set higher worldwide standards. I am sure that will be acceptable to Christians…what’s good for the goose and all that.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 08:53 PM
link   
This is morally wrong no matter which excuse you try to make for it. There is a BIG difference between discriminating someone who might not be suitable for a job due to inexperience or lack of credentials, and discriminating someone simply for having a different sexual preference or being a single mother.

This just goes to show the male-dominant system that the church still follows to this day. Unlike Islam, which threats women as second class citizens openly, the catholic church apparently does the same but instead of being open about this sort of discrimination they try to hide behind "tradition" and subtlety.

Discrimination due to not having qualifications makes sense, discrimination due to sexual preference or being a single mother is just plain bigotry.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 08:54 PM
link   
Yeah, because I'm sure all gay community organizations just jump all over right-wing conservative applicants.


Let's be reasonable here. These are religious organizations who are organized as a Church for the sole purpose of congregating people who share their same beliefs. There are many churches with many divisions of belief. I don't understand why that's so strange or discriminating? Most, if not all churches believe in one-man-one-woman marriage and are pro-heterosexual because that is their belief.

This is not "discrimination", they are simply congregating people who share similar beliefs and faith.

I'm not religious or conservative by the way. If that matters.

I don't necessarily agree with any of it, and I find the single-mother issue a little peculiar, but it's really not my business. We're not talking about common employment facilities here, this is a church organization. Not exactly a popular place to apply for a job, is it?

[edit on 26-9-2009 by SyphonX]



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 08:56 PM
link   
Im sure there are rabbis and mulahs and high priest satanists who do the worse with the discriminating tastes.
ummmm they ARE PRIVATE orgs BTW.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 08:59 PM
link   
Seems to be a little anger in some of the post. TheRedneck summed it up perfectly. It is discrimination no one on this thread is saying otherwise. But as Redneck said. It’s their choice to hire who they want to. I personally think it’s a croc. To me everyone you don’t believe belongs in your church are the exact people you should have in your church if you truly believe in doing Gods work.

Besides in most organized religion of the Catholic persuasion homosexuality is wrong so they need not be there. It’s their right to say who they want working for them and who they don’t. They need a reality check but such is life.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 09:00 PM
link   
My take on this, having been raised Catholic in America:
Seems like they can hire whomever they choose.
Being gay is against Church law.
Being an unwed mother would also be against.
So, I guess they choose to not hire people who they feel do not represent their Catholic beliefs


hmmm,....maybe this is why I stopped believing the Church


[edit on 26-9-2009 by DontTreadOnMe]



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 09:01 PM
link   

Originally posted by Clearskies

Im sure there are rabbis and mulahs and high priest satanists who do the worse with the discriminating tastes.
ummmm they ARE PRIVATE orgs BTW.


Kinda funny you mention this. I don't remember the last time someone brought to light on how discriminatory a lot of synagogues are, or for that matter.. the "Church of Satan".

I realize Christian and Catholics are a real crazy bunch of wild-cards, but I'd just like to see a little more diversity when it comes to the mud-slinging. Just every once and a while.. you know?

There is more to the world besides Christians and Gays... It's starting to turn into a political scapegoat.

... and frankly, on that note.. I'm starting to see a little more motives in other areas. Hm.

[edit on 26-9-2009 by SyphonX]



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 09:09 PM
link   

Originally posted by Clearskies

Im sure there are rabbis and mulahs and high priest satanists who do the worse with the discriminating tastes.
ummmm they ARE PRIVATE orgs BTW.


Oh yeah I do agree with you

It was just that the Catholics church was the one that was in the article. I apologise if it seemed I was pointing them out alone. I just find it a bit ridiculous how catholic people consider themselves "good" people yet they treat fellow human beings like this.

We all bleed the same colour regardless of belief, but to think you are better than someone else because they are different to you, in my eyes, is unthinkable.

And to bring single mothers into the equation is ridicuolous too.....what if they have been raped, and remember the catholic church doesnt allow abortions...meaning they have to keep the baby (unless they give it up for adoption). Its almost the same as a muslim stoning to death their own daughter for being raped...althought not to the same degree.

Its kind of hypocritical dont you think?



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 09:14 PM
link   
reply to post by OzWeatherman
 


If you only function inside the constraints of most organized religions you will find them all full of hypocrisies. In my opinion, that’s why mainstream religion has such a wishy washy view to anyone outside of it.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 09:16 PM
link   
reply to post by OzWeatherman

But is it right for the church to have a seperate law to every other organisation?

No, it is not. Any private organization should be free to hire whomever they wish for a position without the silly worry over discrimination. I make one exception: if the people decide as a society to limit their government to not discriminating in employment, then that is a decision made by the owners of that organization, and the organization (government) should be required to adopt such a policy.

=============================
reply to post by Scooby Doo

It sure is discrimination. And I was one to think that churches were against descrimination and a place you could turn to in need of help/assurance. Certainly isn't in this case.

First appearances would indicate you are correct.


However, I would hope that this church, when dealing with the public, would be much more open to those in need being different than they are when looking for prospective employees. I would hope that, although I would never go so far as to demand they change their ways. Neither do I allow anyone to demand I change mine, within the limits of the law.

=====================================
reply to post by oneclickaway

Maybe the answer is to never employ discriminating Christians...

I suppose that is your right as well. If you feel so strongly, I suggest you not employ Christians.

Ummm, this was a Christian church, right? My answer never indicated any particular religion because I didn't realize it mattered.

Oh, I see Oz already answered that.... it is Catholic.

TheRedneck



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 09:19 PM
link   
soooo...
Love one another as i have loved you,
or
Let the first who has not sinned cast the first stone
....... doesnt apply to this organisation?



[edit on 26-9-2009 by zazzafrazz]



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 09:23 PM
link   
reply to post by TheRedneck
 





No, it is not. Any private organization should be free to hire whomever they wish for a position without the silly worry over discrimination.


Well that may be as you wish , but thats called discrimination and against Victorian state law.

So shall I just hire muscled ex football stars because my company is also private, why should the secular laws protect peoples rights ?

That is the lamest arguement i have seen on ats to date....congratulations


[edit on 26-9-2009 by zazzafrazz]



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 09:23 PM
link   
double post

[edit on 26-9-2009 by zazzafrazz]



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 09:25 PM
link   

Originally posted by Ant4AU
reply to post by OzWeatherman
 


If you only function inside the constraints of most organized religions you will find them all full of hypocrisies. In my opinion, that’s why mainstream religion has such a wishy washy view to anyone outside of it.


Yes, I agree

I only went to church a few times, but those few times I went, I got the feeling that I was not welcomed as I mentioned to them, I was not a practising Christian.

My fiancee had a bizzare experience with one of her ex boyfriends who was a member of a small religious organisation, who had there own school. Three of the four teachers at the school were convicted pedophiles who had apparently found god!!! Im at a loss as to why someone woudl allow convicted pedophiles around children....unsupervised

I hope nobody gets me wrong here....I dont hate religion, nor do I think less of people that practice it, I just dont understand how they think they are all high and mighty, yet they dont tolerate equality between people



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 09:28 PM
link   
Separation of Church and State gives the ability to do that. Like it or not that is their freebie card they can play when they want to do what they want. So not all laws apply to the Organization know as a Church. Is it BS 100% but it is what it is.



posted on Sep, 26 2009 @ 09:30 PM
link   

Originally posted by Ant4AU
Separation of Church and State gives the ability to do that. Like it or not that is their freebie card they can play when they want to do what they want. So not all laws apply to the Organization know as a Church. Is it BS 100% but it is what it is.


When it comes to employment rights there is no separation,
they a ebreaking the law.Equal Emploment Opportunity as a organisation they must adhere to if they are paying someone whether they like it or not.

We aren't talking members of clergy here, we are talking secular employment positions.
They are discriminating and breaking the law, pure and simple....



new topics

top topics



 
5
<<   2  3  4 >>

log in

join