Do You Hate Muslims If So Why, page 9
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reply posted on 23-12-2008 @ 09:58 AM by pavil
reply to post by magicmushroom


Three Quick ones would be French Immigrants and the Riots, the Sharia Court Requests in Britain and the Unrest in Denmark. All three basically go to them not integrating with the whole of the society and actively keeping themselves separate.

Like I said previously, Muslim immigrants seem to have a harder time "fitting in" in Europe as opposed to America.


reply posted on 23-12-2008 @ 10:10 AM by pavil
Originally posted by 04326
what i am trying to point out is that there is inherent prejudice built into the system regardless of what country one is in. This is the primary thing which discourages immigrants from becoming one of 'them' and these desperate people become more and more insular in their ways and does nothing but promote the Us vs Them mindset.


I don't disagree with much of your post. However, I would definitely say it's a two way street with Muslim immigrants. Natives don't like them and distrust them and the Immigrants don't want to change and don't like and distrust the Natives.

That's the immigrant path however, what makes it harder for the Muslim community is that they also have a different religion than the locals as well as language and culture. However, that hasn't seemed to be the problem here in America, so I would think it has to do with America being much more culturally diverse and a melting pot and Europe being primarily White with smatterings of "others".

For all of Europe's high ideals, from my personal observations ( I have traveled there extensively), they are way behind on the "getting along" with each other scale than here in America. Not saying that we are much better here in America, just that our population mix is jumble of nationalities, religions, cultures ect, we have to learn to get along, we are such a mix of people. Europe has one monolithic central race, religion, culture ect in most nations, making it doubly hard for immigrants to "fit in".


Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to everyone here


reply posted on 23-12-2008 @ 02:18 PM by 04326
Originally posted by pavil
Originally posted by 04326
what i am trying to point out is that there is inherent prejudice built into the system regardless of what country one is in. This is the primary thing which discourages immigrants from becoming one of 'them' and these desperate people become more and more insular in their ways and does nothing but promote the Us vs Them mindset.


I don't disagree with much of your post. However, I would definitely say it's a two way street with Muslim immigrants. Natives don't like them and distrust them and the Immigrants don't want to change and don't like and distrust the Natives.



exactly what i am trying to say - but further to that with the new war on terrorism, every muslim is being painted a Terrorist and the distrust of the locals towards these new immigrants is getting worse.

Now i do not make the above statement lightly. Another example if you may from my own personal experience... (i know i know, i should get out more :p) is of the mass propoganda post 9/11. The coverage of the "all muslims are terrorists - and moderate muslims are closet terrorists" propeganda is so widespread that it more often than not makes an intelligent person buy into it all. My husband was born a buddhist but even after knowing me since high school still fell for the whole thing himself. What hope does the average joe have especially when they don't know any muslims. And the one's they do are held at an arms length and automatically stereotyped b/c of the propaganda campaign. Seems like every generation needs an 'enemy' to be fearful of.

It is indeed sad how we see the cycle of systematic blind discrimination being played out throughout history. First it was the Japanese, then it was the Soviets (and to some extent the chinese), then it was the whole "indian's are dirty people", and now 'Muslims are terrorists". Can't humanity just grow up.


[edit on 23/12/08 by 04326]


reply posted on 24-12-2008 @ 12:08 AM by pavil
reply to post by magicmushroom



I think America, maybe not Americans is more accommodating to immigrants. After all, the vast majority of Americans are immigrants and we are the "land of opportunity". Europe can be pretty xenophobic when it wants to be. I agree with your post. I think the main reason for the turmoil in Europe's Muslim immigrant population can be traced to the Saudi funded Wahhabi Mosques. America doesn't have as many Wahhabi Mosques, most are more mainstream Sunni. For those that don't know the difference, i suggest you research yourself. Wahhabism is pretty whacked out IMO. That sect/branch of Islam is the deep root of the problems we face.



reply posted on 24-12-2008 @ 02:22 AM by crimvelvet
reply to post by magicmushroom




Templar, Quite correct religion has to masters, control of knowledge and control of the masses. It is religeous hate that is at the origin of so many wars and suffering.


As far as I am concerned the reason for any religion is to control the masses. War is used to divert attention from a poor leader or from a troubled nation. It is to the advantage of a nation's leadership to give the masses something to take their anger out on besides them. Global Warming is a classic example of giving the masses a target.

On Muslims
My feelings are based on three sources:
1. My personal interaction
2. The thoughts and stories of friends who have lived in the Middle East
and a very distant third is printed information

From the last two sources I will say I do not like the treatment of females in the Middle East cultures.

From a personal perspective I have no dislike of Muslims. From the business perspective I can not stand them. We have dealt with Russians, Koreans, Chinese, Japanese, Mayan, Aztec, a variety of USA Native Americans, Africans, Europeans....Muslims are the ONLY group we gleefully gave to our competitor. Unfortunately he could not handle them either and gave them back, sigh

Is this a racist problem? No since my grand father was a Lebanese Muslim. I think it is just a clash of cultures. We normally set a price and set the conditions. Once the discussion is over we consider the deal set in concrete. The Muslims do not and are always angling for a "better" deal up until the product is delivered.


reply posted on 24-12-2008 @ 11:39 AM by Anonymous ATS
There are pitiful conditions of living for women in most countries that have proclaimed Shariah law. Their children are brought up with the ideology that killing non-believers is the best thing they can do to go to heaven. Muslims try to project this image of brotherhood - and that is all it is - a brotherhood who first exploit their sisters and then others who they deem fit for exploitation. Most Muslims have never understood the Kuran and they cite some meaningless phrases to justify their end and then their means. Please explain to me why Muslims should not be hated under these circumstances. Most Muslim countries do not have an economy to speak of - there are exceptions like Saudi Arabia and Kuwait - but most Islamic countries have pitiable living conditions. Their main thrust in knowledge is to know the Kuran since they claim that it contains all the answers. We know that no one book that man writes can contain all answers that apply in all times. Even the US laws are changing rapidly to accommodate the advances in technology. Then how can the Muslims claim that some book can cover every aspect of life? Especially when it is biased and outdated? This combined with the continuous Jihad that Muslim terrorists wage against every other faith in the world are enough reason to hate them. There is nothing like a liberal Muslim - either they are fanatics or they are not considered Muslim. They foment hatred among each other and against others and hence they deserve what they are getting today.


reply posted on 25-12-2008 @ 12:09 AM by pavil
reply to post by Anonymous ATS


No offense, but that's a rather shallow view of over 1 Billion People. Most Muslims are just like everybody else, they want the same things most of us do.


reply posted on 27-12-2008 @ 10:54 AM by pavil
reply to post by footfall


And this got a star????

Nice generalizing of 20% of the world there. If they were all as hate filled as you claim, the world would be in a terrible mess. It is a very relative minority of the adherents to Islam that are giving it (Islam) a bad name.



reply posted on 5-1-2009 @ 02:15 AM by NYCMedic
My First "real" encounter with Muslims were two men about to leave a TV set after they did their weekly Muslim show. In the Control room they told me about "Infidels" and how they tolerate them . . . they were smiling as they spoke. One turned to finish a play-back of the recording they did. What they spoke of was hypocrisy. It was to preach violence against anyone "not Muslim". “We are a Billion strong!” they quoted with that same smile. That was in 1999.

My Wife alerted me that something bad happened and I raced to the TV. I saw the second plane hit, ran to the window and saw the black cloud above downtown. I was putting my uniform on as I ran out the door. My car was in the shop so I flashed my badge in the street and a Van stopped. A young Jewish couple were inside, the lady opened the side door. The news was on and they drove me down Queens blvd. They were from Israel, they went through this before I learned as I leaned forward between them. The smoke from the WTC site could be seen almost in front of us. I thanked them and ran into a NYPD Sergent heading that way as well in a RMP. We got there just as the south tower fell. Later, I would find out a friend who was in my academy class never made it out. We went in, retreated, went in, retreated . . . bldg 7 went down about 5pm or so. I assisted with a patient and at the hospital saw footage from overseas on TV.
Muslim Men and Women were celebrating in the street. One was ranting something in half English. “This is wonderful!” He had that disgusting smile on his face.
I got a lift to Queensboro plaza and took the Subway home. Men and Women on the train looked at me and cried. I was coated completely in the gray dust remnants of possibly Men and Women who never knew what hit them.
Then I saw one man, short beard, middle eastern looking.
He was smiling at me. The same disgusting smile I saw back in 1999.

To say I hate Muslims would only make me one of them. That, to me, would be repugnant.


reply posted on 7-1-2009 @ 08:59 AM by Anonymous ATS
reply to post by Kr0n0s

I often wonder why people have such short memory of the past or so little knowledge of history.I am not of the Islamic faith or of any other religion but i like to be fair in my judgment.Islam has been the victim of western greed since the so called crusades which were conducted under the pretest of defending the Christian faith but in reality were fought only with the intention of plundering and robbing the people who happened to be of the Islamic faith.This went on and on until the time of the British Empire who submitted with force those Countries of the Middle East plundering their riches and keeping the population in the most rigorous poverty.When Finally after bitter fight the British gave them independence (because it became uneconomic to keep the colonies,they created borders arbitrarily,Iraq is a good example and so is Kurdistan,in both cases those Countries were split,in the case of Kurdistan they completely obliterated it.If this is not enough,against International agreement,the Jewish fleeing The European postwar II theater settled in what was then Palestine and with murdering and unlawfully expropriating the original owners of the land (thanks to the blessing closed eye of the British who were supposed to stop the Jewish people to settle there).Since then the State of Israel has treated the Palestinian as if they were not human beings and stripped them not only of their land but even of their dignity. How could you be surprised if they fight back with the only means available to them,to the point of committing suicide in the process? If you were in their place what would you do? How long will it take for you to loose your patience with the farce of International one sided peace talk? after the truce was declared last June It was Israel to break it in July and with no provocation from Hamas.How would you like it if the government lawfully elected in your Country was disliked by your neighbor and your neighbor would systematically assassinate the members of your parliament? Think before you judge!
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