Anyone feel good about this? What does this mean for us?, page 1

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Topic started on 4-11-2008 @ 11:53 PM by Haiku

I have an unusual request,

First off, I must say, the electionresult has me scared to death!! I have done some research on Obama's proposed policies, and they are terrifying!! If you are not looking for a 'gimme' what does this administration offer you? And even if you are looking for 'assistance', if you look past the pretty package of rhetoric Obama has his handouts wrapped in, isn't the price too high?

I feel like our rights were voted away today

My request is, I know there are alot of Obama supporters here, Someone, please, help me feel a little optimism? I see very hard,very divided times ahead. Anyone who feels the same feel free to please let me know I am not the only one.

edit to add:

Does this mean If I work extra, or I work my fingers to the bone to get 'ahead', that if the government thinks I have made too much, that they can take it and do what they will with it beacause they have pre-determined what my requirements/needs are?

looking for people who are like minded and people who can offer optimism

[edit on 4-11-2008 by Haiku]

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 12:03 AM by jsobecky

Just curious...it looks like you are from London, if we can believe what we see.

How would our election affect you?

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 12:04 AM by justamomma

hmmm... something positive. This is not a problem!

1. Life will go on.

2. You are still free to choose how you will respond to EVERY circumstance that would and will come in your life regardless of a man we label "president."

3. Regardless of what you feel concerning his stances, you DID see a moment in this country that no one has or ever will see again... the first black President elect.

4. The Bush administration is about to come to an end.

5. And best of all... the election season 2008 is OVER!!!

See, your man doesn't HAVE to win to notice and appreciate the fact that there ARE still positive things all around you just like there would have been for those opposed to McCain should he have been elected.

p.s. oh and an added bonus.... no more of the trainwreck otherwise known as Sarah Palin!

[edit on 5-11-2008 by justamomma]

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 12:10 AM by lordtyp0

*sigh

Reading your post made me want to do what your icon shows...

To start with, he doesn't want to "Spread the wealth" in anything similar to a socialist/communist sense.

In the US for decades the upper percentage has been getting massive tax cuts. Most have so many loopholes they dont have to pay anything in taxes. There are methods like creating a non-profit org to do nothing but pay your bills, you contribute X money to it for a massive right off and it in turns pays your mortgage etc..

This is ignoring the 'golden parachutes'. Those companies released a plan of 7+ billion in bonuses and paychecks right after accepting a 6 billion 'gimme' from the government for doing illegal activity anyway.

What Obama wants to do is cut the tax the middle class pays (been getting the short end for my entire life) and increase the taxes on those who make a quarter million a year. You know, the people who can afford to get out of paying taxes with lawyers.

How is this somehow bad? Is my hard work not warrent me having a bigger chunk of my pay? Why should I have to pay more in taxes (percentage) than people who could be millionaires in under 5 years? Why is it somehow more evil for the rich to pay more than the bulk of the populace who get screwed constantly anyway?

As is, I pay 30% taxes between state, federal, social security etc. etc.. My money went to give the wallstreet people billions.. just part of the Bush fleecing of world it seems.

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 12:12 AM by red_leader

reply to post by Haiku

Did you catch the part in the speech where he says the american people wil need: " A new spirit of service , a new spirit of sacrifice."??? Sounds a little scary, no?

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 12:16 AM by Haiku

reply to post by jsobecky

lol... I went to London for a couple of weeks. Changed it just before I left. I simply haven't changed it. I am a U.S citzen , more accurately NC. Guess I should Change that huh?

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 12:21 AM by Haiku

reply to post by red_leader

I don't know If you're being sarcastic or not, but I actually do find that frightening. How much more can we possibly sacrifice?!?

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 12:22 AM by anachryon

Originally posted by red_leader
Did you catch the part in the speech where he says the american people wil need: " A new spirit of service , a new spirit of sacrifice."??? Sounds a little scary, no?

Scary? Sure. We no longer have the free-flowing credit we've had for the past 8 years to spend, spend, spend. We're not getting it back. We'd have to have a spirit of sacrifice no matter who won tonight; far fewer people will be able to get mortgages for McMansions and loans for giant SUVs for a long, long time. Having less disposable income is indeed scary, but I'm not sure how that relates to Obama.

In context
(context is very important!)

What began 21 months ago in the depths of winter cannot end on this autumn night.

This victory alone is not the change we seek. It is only the chance for us to make that change. And that cannot happen if we go back to the way things were.

It can't happen without you, without a new spirit of service, a new spirit of sacrifice.

So let us summon a new spirit of patriotism, of responsibility, where each of us resolves to pitch in and work harder and look after not only ourselves but each other.

Let us remember that, if this financial crisis taught us anything, it's that we cannot have a thriving Wall Street while Main Street suffers.

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 12:24 AM by kosmicjack

reply to post by Haiku

Exactly how could our rights have been voted away? The American people used our democratic system to overwhelming vote for change. Millions of our citizens - black, white, latino, asian, young, old, gay, straight, Christian, Atheist, Jew - feel more a part of our democracy than ever in its 221 year history. Literally, more citizens are invested in our success. Children across America, of all races, will wake up tomorrow knowing that, if they work hard, they can do anything. Tonight the entire world knows that America IS everything it has always promised to be.

Not to mention, we elected a man who just happens to be a Constitutional Law expert. He understands the value of our rights as citizens. We are a lot better off right now than we were even yesterday. We'll be even better come January 20, 2009.

Don't let fear be your barometer. G'Obama!

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 12:27 AM by jam321

My fellow Americans have spoken for good or bad. Only time will tell which one. In the meantime, I will cut President-Elect Obama some slack and see if he lives up to the promises he made. He has no excuse especially with a Democrat led Congress.

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 12:32 AM by kosmicjack

reply to post by jam321

You, Sir, are a good citizen and a true patriot. Thank you, he could ask no more. I hope others follow your good example.

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 12:40 AM by conspiracy nut

i am very proud today that my country actually voted in a man of color, and that there is going to be an african american family in the white house!!! imagine that move over cleavers, hello obama's!! it gives me goose bumps! even though i am not the biggest obama fan and am not star struck by the man whatsoever. have to admit, this is huge!

imagine a whole generation of young minorites that have a person of color to look up to instead of some gangsta mtv caricature! just think the message this will send to millions of impressionable youth. even after all the crap i talked about you, prove me wrong!! i am rooting for you obama, make us proud! give this nation our sense of pride back.

so all the obama haters give the man a chance, i am. he is our president elect give him the respect he deserves and has earned. don't be a sore loser, mccain wasn't. after the past 8 years we can now say we can look forward to some change!!!

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 12:42 AM by Haiku

reply to post by kosmicjack

Do you not worry about his own statements regaurding energy? There is a real possiblitity that next year, you will not be able to pay your electric bill because of a penalty 'tax' because you have used more than was predetermined necesary for you. How about, they are considering charging people who use more gasoline, more for that gasoline. I am all for energy conservation, but do you honestly think the government should penalize you for choosing not to buy a smaller car? Or penalize you for taking that out of state trip to visit your family? I feel, the people who are driving more, or driving 'gas guzzlers' are paying more due to the amount they must purchase. Should we send them to the corner in 'time out' because they can afford it?

Let's say it proves too big a problem to control the populace with penalties, so they go after industries. What would we think about government penalizing (or worse)Ford if they didn't agree to stop manufacturing the Excursion? Would that be an over step, or would we applaud the long arm of the government for taking yet another choice away for our own safety?

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 12:59 AM by lordtyp0

Originally posted by Haiku
reply to post by kosmicjack

Do you not worry about his own statements regaurding energy? There is a real possiblitity that next year, you will not be able to pay your electric bill because of a penalty 'tax' because you have used more than was predetermined necesary for you. How about, they are considering charging people who use more gasoline, more for that gasoline. I am all for energy conservation, but do you honestly think the government should penalize you for choosing not to buy a smaller car? Or penalize you for taking that out of state trip to visit your family? I feel, the people who are driving more, or driving 'gas guzzlers' are paying more due to the amount they must purchase. Should we send them to the corner in 'time out' because they can afford it?

Let's say it proves too big a problem to control the populace with penalties, so they go after industries. What would we think about government penalizing (or worse)Ford if they didn't agree to stop manufacturing the Excursion? Would that be an over step, or would we applaud the long arm of the government for taking yet another choice away for our own safety?

Hrm,
On a quick thought. It could force people to walk or ride a bike to work-less obesity and strain on the medical system since people would be more fit. Less air pollution-people more fit. Less pollution in general - possible it could help with this whole global warming concept. If that means I have to turn the TV off and you know-read.. I think I could live with that.

Whether someone who bought a hummer is hurting, I could care less. Such items are luxury goods. Nothing is requiring them from buying their crotch extensions anyway.

As for the rest. Its just paranoia. The point is we have to be off oil. We have to invest in new energy tech. If that hurts the ability to fly to disney land every 2 months. OH NOES!...

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 01:13 AM by Haiku

reply to post by lordtyp0

Directly after I reading your post, I had to look and see if you were a U.S citizen. Are you serious friend?Your post puts the death of 'The American Dream' into words, the American dream, is to work hard so you CAN have these things, and be free to enjoy them....I agree, obesity = bad and health = good so on and so forth, but isn't all of this personal responsibility? Should government be able to reach down on individuals and implement this?

Further:
People work hard so they can afford the Hummer or what ever... True, some don't... However, punish all? Has the 'new American dream' become 'if I can't have it, nobody can'?

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 01:20 AM by lordtyp0

Originally posted by Haiku
reply to post by lordtyp0

Directly after I reading your post, I had to look and see if you were a U.S citizen. Are you serious friend?Your post puts the death of 'The American Dream' into words, the American dream, is to work hard so you CAN have these things, and be free to enjoy them....I agree, obesity = bad and health = good so on and so forth, but isn't all of this personal responsibility? Should government be able to reach down on individuals and implement this?

Further:
People work hard so they can afford the Hummer or what ever... True, some don't... However, punish all? Has the 'new American dream' become 'if I can't have it, nobody can'?

Indeed it is personal responsibility. But with all that comes accountability. If everyone in an area depletes a resource, does it not punish everyone else? I saw the gas issue 3-4 years ago, thats why I bought a vehicle that gets around 40mpg. I have to pay more in fuel costs anyway because of the whole scarcity. In Utah there are huge amounts of 4x4's, large vehicles in general.

The American dream part I really have to disagree with. It is about success, not toys. It is about being able to be what you want. It is about the downtrodden ascension. Not bling, $3,000 bottles of champaign and vehicles that go 5 mpg while making it so kids cant breath while playing outside. If your version of the American Dream is an episode of Baywatch or a rap video.. I am sorry.

Edit:
Along the lines of government reaching down to mandate... If this american dream were not already cancer ridden why would so many states be rushing to ban same-sex marriage? Guess the dream didnt apply to all Americans anyway.

(second edit for typos.. *sigh*)

[edit on 5-11-2008 by lordtyp0]

[edit on 5-11-2008 by lordtyp0]

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 01:27 AM by Haiku

reply to post by lordtyp0

If you work yourself to death to be able to afford a few 'above mediochre' items, is this not success?

I think'yet again' it is the individual's part how they define success....

I don't think we should be told by government what we can/ cannot have... and to control through price? what's the word I'm looking for...

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 01:37 AM by lordtyp0

Originally posted by Haiku
reply to post by lordtyp0

If you work yourself to death to be able to afford a few 'above mediochre' items, is this not success?

I think'yet again' it is the individual's part how they define success....

I don't think we should be told by government what we can/ cannot have... and to control through price? what's the word I'm looking for...

The control through price IS the 'free-market'. When companies arnt colluding to keep costs up anyways. While the fuel costs were insanely high due to no supply etc-why did Exxon post record profits (thats, after bills) 2 years in a row?

Anyway, sure its for the individual to define their success. I just cant imagine someone's basis of success as being based in "keeping up with the jones'". To me 'success' is the ability to live life without fear or worry. To never have to be in want of food, or shelter etc.. Said "success" is almost mythical.

I work my butt off for a company who reported record profits last quarter. Then the stock crash hit and suddenly 54 people were laid off. The board people wouldn't have been hurt in any tangible way, they just made 35% less in sheer profit estimates-hence they possibly bankrupted 54 people-basically to keep fuel in their proverbial hummers.

I still work my butt off while looking for another job. Your argument can be applied to them as just living the American Dream.

Sounds like slash and burn/rape everyone for a bottle of Crystal.

I am so damn glad the elections are over, damn TV has been leaving everyone I know with deep seeded rage it seems.

This "Dream" when it lacks humanity also loses it's soul. leaves us with nothing but the walking dead who are just happy with the HDTVs and regurgitated sitcoms or romcoms to show everyone the next item they should buy to prove they are worth something.

:/

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 01:56 AM by dreams n chains

The candidate with the most money wins. It is easy to brainwash our society as long as you have the money to do it.

Obama's evil associations and lack of anything in his past to make his claims of a future utopia valid were not allowed to be reported on. His inabilty to even find the strength to lift his hand during the pledge of allegiance, his church of 20 years that preaches "god damned America" and that "white men are raping the black man"..... yeah..... this is some pretty scary stuff. No it does not make me feel good.

It is good that we'll finally have an African American as President so everyone can stop griping about it. Maybe sometime there might be a female president... and a homosexual president... etc.

The first decision I saw Obama make was to not have Clinton as V.P... his ego not able to handle it.

Obama supporters in these threads always speak in visions of grandeur of how ideal it will all be... but it is currently as illusive as proof of aliens and UFOs or bigfoot. So...... for once...... I claim "HOAX! Show me proof!"

Because we haven't seen anything yet...... yet.... he has been elected on this rhetoric by glazed eyed worshippers.

No.... I don't feel all warm and fuzzy right now.

reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 02:03 AM by sos37

Originally posted by jam321
My fellow Americans have spoken for good or bad. Only time will tell which one. In the meantime, I will cut President-Elect Obama some slack and see if he lives up to the promises he made. He has no excuse especially with a Democrat led Congress.

I am not optimistic. At all. Especially in light of Chuck Schumer's comments made about the Fairness Doctrine yesterday and wanting to see about having it reinstated - that's how our rights were potentially voted away.

We've been here before though - the first two years of Clinton's presidency were a disaster and America responded by voting in a Republican led Congress. The very same will happen here.

Mark my words - the Obama presidency is the beginning of financial hardship the likes of which this country has never seen before.

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