The only hope for this country is democratic socialism & equal redistribution of wealth

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posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 05:47 PM
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The only hope for this country is democratic socialism & equal redistribution of wealth.

We must immediate liquidate the Fed and redistribute wealth equally in the WHOLE WORLD.

That way, a person will stand or fall by their greed or love.

It's very simple.

Fortunes like Bill Gates' that were built by ripping off wage-earners -- he never would have gotten so rich unless he over-charged for computers. There's only a couple hundred dollars in each one. The parts for the orig mac were $38.




posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 05:52 PM
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Your desire to punish people with more money than you does not solve the worlds problems. Whom will you steal from when the rich no longer have any money left to take?



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 06:09 PM
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A few problems here, but I agree with the premisse... to a point. And Bill Gates made his money mostly on software by the way, but I'm nitpicking.

In my opinion we would be better off by letting people work and get rich, but have a high wealth cap... let's say 1 billion dollars just as an example. That number is high enough to be an incentive for 99.999% of the population, so people would not feel like they were being downtrodden by a communist economy but it would also have the benefit of cutting the legs of wannabe czars and fascists as well as keeping family wealth below the point of geopolitical relevance.

I have no problem with people being stinking rich and playboys and generally having a blast of life, but when they have enough money and property to influence the course of nations with whatever tired old and almost without exception totalitarian philosophy they peddle, they should get their financial wings trimmed.

If this were the standard around the world, if corporations were democratized in this way, well, standards of living would increase and market manipulation would decrease.

[edit on 24-6-2008 by Zepherian]



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 06:19 PM
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Who decides who gets stuck doing the work?


I wanna be one of the guys who gets to sit around waiting for my check....



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 06:27 PM
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Why do assume it's a hand out? Redistribution of wealth can be done more equitably within the working contracts. I've seen cases of companies paying only 30% of their gross income on all expenses, including worker pay, and the rest is pure profit. It happens a lot in the service sector, especially with government contractors or contractors to big organizations like airports and other infrastructure. Imagine if instead of 70% almost pure profit you have most of that pumped back into everyone's wages. Equitable redistribution of wealth, or in corporation socialism. Sure, some jobs make a better base salary, I can agree with that, but in highly profitable companies a lot of the money should be given to those that make it happen, day in, day out. Some companies have so much money they don't even know what to do with it. If that cash went back into the economy there wouldn't be things like housing crysis or depressions, just ocasional localized corporate problems.



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 06:33 PM
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Over my cold dead hands clutching my checkbook !!
You can't be serious...oh...so... like it works so well in Cuba, yes they're all so happy in Cuba aren't they? And the U.S.S.R. and like it did in China BEFORE they started to get all capitalistic? And let's take France, they like it so much they voted in a conservative this time


And who's going to be in charge of this so-called distribution of wealth? This can't be a serious thread lol.



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 07:13 PM
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reply to post by Zepherian
 


No, it cannot be done equitably.

Who gets to decide how much your job is or is not worth? Why would anyone have an incentive to take a job that requires a lot of studying (like a doctor) when they could just be a janitor and get paid the same amount? Who gets to decide who is doing the "real work" for a corporation? Currently, the market sets the salary - if its too low no one will apply, if its too high the company will lose money compared to the competition. You would have the government magically pick the numbers out of the air?

Who gets to force corporations to pay all of their profits out? The government. The United States Congress recently just privatized the house restaurants because they were losing money when being run by the government. And you think these people are smart enough to order companies how much money they have to pay to their employees? They can't even run their own food services without going in debt millions every year! It would be funny, if you weren't serious...

[edit on 24-6-2008 by ALightinDarkness]



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 07:22 PM
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In Cuba they are currently allowing bonuses to be paid to workers who are more productive. Also many communes in Israel are now having to pay second generation members different wages based on ability and work ethic.

Also redistribution of wealth sure has worked for Zimbabwe???????



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 07:23 PM
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You're trying to punish the hard workers who take risks.
Do you know what bill gates did before he invented Windows? He
was a big time nerd with no gf, no social life. He found every chance he
could to work on computers. He sacrificed to get where he is with his
hard work.

How about all the risk takers who start businesses with no money, they
take out loans or use their savings or home equity, like the lady who
invented Baby Einstein, not knowing wether they'll end up in bankruptcy.

This country was built by hard working risk takers.
Would you sacrifice all your time or money to do what these people did
with no guarantee on return?



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 07:35 PM
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Sounds like a vote for Obama to me. He is offering just the socialist platform you are looking for.

BP



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 08:00 PM
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You are crazy man. That will never happen. We need to take this country back and restore our Constitutional Republic, regain our foothold as the greatest industrial nation, bring all our troops home to protect America, disband the Federal Reserve and try them for treason and institute money issued BY the PEOPLE PER THE U.S. Constitution, like it was BEFORE the stock market crash that even Ben Bernake has admitted was the Fed's doing, that is on their own website. America does not need to change, their Government does. We are a great country with great people who would never torture someones child with pliers ripping our their genitals, yes John Yoo said this. They are devaluing our dollar on purpose, gas is expensive because the dollar has lost 60% of it's value. Gas is $2.00 in MEXICO and 12 cents in Venezuela. Not all but most of the price is the dollar, look up the OPEC articles, even they say they can pump till they are blue in the face, doesn't change anything if the dollar is worthless.



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 08:17 PM
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Yeah, "redistribute my wealth" lol, good luck with that one.



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 08:31 PM
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Instead of going to redistribution of wealth, I'd like to take it to the other extreme...

You can't pay for food?...you don't eat.
Can't pay for your school?...you don't get an education.
Can't pay for a doctor?...stay sick.
Can't pay for a house?...live on the street.
Crops fail?...better luck next year. Don't they have private insurance for that?

Not one penny of government welfare! Think about all the money the government could save. It would be enough for a huge tax cut, and everyone would be able to keep more of their money!



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 08:34 PM
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This sure sounds a lot like Communism's original breeding ground. In order to better assist the people, take everything away redistribute it among everyone. The problem is that no Government can be trusted to do something like that.



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 09:48 PM
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Hi All,

Been laying low for a while. Too much bad Juju in the air.

To the OP, great thread. There's no better way to rile the "free market capitalists" than by suggesting we should kill Democracy.....or some such nonsense.

OK folks, here's the deal. There has been no such thing as a free market since the days of Thomas Jefferson. Period. (Even then, things were squirrelly{think SLAVERY}). Only a cursory look at a few current financial blogs will reveal LINK, LINK, and LINK.

The majority of these sites have articles with headlines straight from Apocalypse central. "$2 Trillion $ in credit markets shrinking", "Market collapse this fall", "Oil at $200.00/bbl".

This is not conspiracy theory. This is not tin-foil-hat central. This is the financial blogosphere. These are not fringe nut-jobs. These people hold down "good day jobs".

What we are seeing today is the deflation of one of the biggest Ponsi schemes ever created. I must digress. Check out these videos if you haven't yet:

Money as Debt (47 min)

The Un-Constitutional Federal Reserve (A long one)

So here's my take. We have been taken to the cleaners since 1913 {Britain MUCH longer}. By the folks who brought us 'money'. Instead of allowing the Congress to mint money (as was allowed, and encouraged by the Constitution!) we have been duped into giving that power to the Fed. Since then we have accrued over 9 TRILLION Dollars of debt (as USURY interest). All of it has been to pay for WAR and debt for WAR. Since the 1970's we have also acquiesced to the removal of our regulatory structures (think Glass Steagall Act )

Those laws, passed in the 1930's, were put in place to keep th "Investor class" from F$%^&*G the worker class. Those laws were repealed by Bubba Clinton (I voted for him twice, unbeknownst). Globalization and the continuation of the FIRE economic model (Finance, Investment, and Real Estate) has brought the world to where we are.

So here we are. America has stopped building and making things. We have become a "consumer" culture. Our M3 (Look it up!) money supply has outpaced our productivity. Our banking system is BANKRUPT. The value we have been 'paying forward' is no longer valuable. We are at the end of capitalism as we know it. The next 6-24 months will be enlightening-to say the least.

To get back to the OP, think of 'money' as "value-frozen-in-time". We, as a society, need to confront what we value (beyond the Jingoistic, Patriotic, Racist, Flag-waving nonsense we've come to expect from the MSM). I am sick do death with the privatization of profit at the expense of socialization of cost(failure of bad bets!). Bear Stearns, and their Ilk should be left to die on the killing floor. These folks (Ben Bernanke, Hank Paulson, et al) need to find new ways to get out of my wallet(put the $ back on a Gold standard!). I would be open to a system of Capitalism that didn't involve inflationary market shennanigans. Silly me. I would also be amenable to tying the currency to the value of work produced, forget gold and silver, I want a truly market driven currency.


Wait...What was the question?



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 10:03 PM
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Originally posted by RRconservative
Instead of going to redistribution of wealth, I'd like to take it to the other extreme...

You can't pay for food?...you don't eat.
Can't pay for your school?...you don't get an education.
Can't pay for a doctor?...stay sick.
Can't pay for a house?...live on the street.
Crops fail?...better luck next year. Don't they have private insurance for that?

Not one penny of government welfare! Think about all the money the government could save. It would be enough for a huge tax cut, and everyone would be able to keep more of their money!


Wohoooooooo RR for prez lol....the only people I ever see advocating this system are of course, the "have nots" and America is the country of the wealthiest "have nots" on the planet.....

What is the poverty level in the U.S. right now?


2006 HHS Poverty Guidelines
Persons in
Family or Household 48 Contiguous
States and D.C. Alaska Hawaii
1 $ 9,800 $12,250 $11,270
2 13,200 16,500 15,180
3 16,600 20,750 19,090
4 20,000 25,000 23,000
5 23,400 29,250 26,910
6 26,800 33,500 30,820
7 30,200 37,750 34,730
8 33,600 42,000 38,640


aspe.hhs.gov...

$33,600 for a family is the POVERTY level in 2006, in the U.S.!!

Do people when they read this, have any clue what this means when you are in a 3rd world country, making $.12 cents a day??

The poorest of OUR ghetto poor, our homeless, our UNEDUCATED in the mountains, the big cities, the streets...are so far ABOVE the poverty level of India's meanest streets, Bangladesh's ghettos and mean streets, Micronesian Islands where you're lucky if you have a straw hut....Cuba's fly-ridden hospitals, Serbia and Croatia's concrete barracks, don't make me go on and on....



posted on Jun, 24 2008 @ 10:51 PM
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The problem with talking about economic systems with a lot of americans is they go hiper defensive and think the reds are coming to steal their precious bodily fluids. Meanwhile you guys fail to notice that capitalist concentration, ie big buisness getting even bigger, is just as big a threat to population wellbeing as runaway communism. And nobody is suggesting communism, just a rewrite of the social contracts so there is more fairness in the distribuition of wealth. If 5% of the population owns 80% of the wealth how is that better than left wing policies? Or do you guys feed on dreams?

As I read on another forum a couple of days ago, liberals fail to realize that it's not just the state that takes away peoples liberties, other people can do that also through economic pressure.



posted on Jun, 25 2008 @ 11:25 AM
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reply to post by counterterrorist
 


Very active argument is going on at www.abovetopsecret.com...

I've been challenging a flag-waving apparent cointelpro agent provocateur trying to disrupt ATS with capitalist propaganda, and mind-control robotics.



posted on Jun, 25 2008 @ 11:27 AM
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Man! this is going to be a monster thread! I wish i'd thought of it!

and I would have to disagree with you, i inherited all my money the hard way and you can't have it.



posted on Jun, 25 2008 @ 11:28 AM
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reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas
 


Harriman funded the bolshevik block of the soviet union, then in 1921 founded ruskombank and ever since has been a traitor, by exporting U.S. technology to the communists and supplying ussr with us technology to use in Vietnam against our GI's.

Along with Harriman, the Bushes were also the original communist-sympathizers as were Brown Brothers Harriman.


It's all documented here, but getting through this post is a bear, so don't read it at first, just skim through the pages looking for key words www.abovetopsecret.com...


[edit on 25-6-2008 by counterterrorist]





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