Ahmadinejad tells West: Accept Israel imminent collapse

reply to post by TheWalkingFox


The idea of a Jewish homeland did not originate without its request, by said Jewish people, so I am not sure what you think you are talking about but you apparently do not know. As far as evangelical christians I am not sure, perhaps besides the accepting of prophecy about the jewish homeland and their identity, what you think they have to do with it.

This is just a off the hip statement for you, obviously you dont get out much. Want to read some truths? I doubt you will, but just in case try reading "From Beirut to Jersusalem" a excellent commentary on that particular part of the world......which has done nothing for Americas hold on the Middle East.

Originally posted by birchtree
The idea of a Jewish homeland did not originate without its request, by said Jewish people, so I am not sure what you think you are talking about but you apparently do not know.

I know. The Zionists who requested it actually went to Germany first with hte request - after all, Germany was itself an exclusivist ethnic nationalist state, surely the Reich would understand, right? The strength of the Zionism movement in Germany in the early hears of the Nazi regime, and the appearance of the possibility of it actually succeeding might have been a big reason for the increased immigration of European Jews into Germany at the time, which in hindsight, is a horrifically ironic twist.

I know they asked for a Jewish homeland. What of it? The Saami people have asked the nations they live in for a homeland, with no go. The Chechens aren't allowed a homeland. The Basques aren't allowed to have one. Native Americans only have independence when it comes time for someone to pick up the bill. Palestinians are asking for the nation promised to them by the UN, and that doesn't seem to be happening.

As far as evangelical christians I am not sure, perhaps besides the accepting of prophecy about the jewish homeland and their identity, what you think they have to do with it.

Their prophecies call for a big messy war where 2/3 of the Jews are killed and the rest convert, then Jesus comes down and does his thing. To this end, Evangelical Christians - these are the guys running the US government - give endless financial support to Israel and defend it from any international action in order to fulfil the first part of the prophecy - the existence of Israel. They then instigate, inflame, and utterly refuse to allow any peace to take hold in order to ensure that a big messy war that will kill 2/3 of the jews in Israel will happen in the near future.

Take away this end times bull#, or at least, withdraw American participation in the region, and I PROMISE you, we will see meaningful peace rear its head within four months, and take strong root in two years.

This is just a off the hip statement for you, obviously you dont get out much.

And obviously you don't floss nearly enough!

Want to read some truths? I doubt you will, but just in case try reading "From Beirut to Jersusalem" a excellent commentary on that particular part of the world......which has done nothing for Americas hold on the Middle East.

Looks interesting, I may pick it up if I find it at the library (I tend to not spend money on books I'll probably only read once )

However, do note that the book talks about the situation in the area as it was over a quarter of a century ago. Times change.

[edit on 30-1-2008 by TheWalkingFox]

Our-maid-in-Ejad is Ahmadinejad. Ah-mad-in-ejad....

try saying them. say our maid 1 first, then ahmad.

Say em slowly too. then you will uncover the secret of teh rune tang.

When dealing with Israel you MUST sperate Religion from Politics - this is something the governement of Israel do NOT want you to do - they are desperate to intertwine the 2 - but for an unbiased view you MUST seperate religion from politics when dealing with israel.

reply to post by AshleyD


I am sorry if I might have offended you in anyway. I didn't mean to blame you of being false prophet, just said that you'd fit the description; but certainly may many truth speakers fit this description.

Here are few descriptions:

"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'"
Matthew 7:15-23 NIV).

"Therefore thus saith the LORD concerning the prophets that prophesy in my name, and I sent them not, yet they say, Sword and famine shall not be in this land; By sword and famine shall those prophets be consumed."
Jer 14:15

Now after I've done what you asked, could you do this:

Originally posted by TheStev
Could you point out which verse says woe to those who divide the land of Israel?

[edit on 31-1-2008 by Geemor]

Originally posted by birchtree

In 1917 Arthur J Balfour came up with the idea of a "National Home" for the Jewish people in what was considered Palestinian Territory based on the UK's Partitioning after the World War I by the way Arthur J Balfour was the British Foreigh Secretary and the decision was known as the Balfour Decleration"

You`re getting there, but leaving out a couple of the major players.

Chaim Weizman: Invented a method of producing acetone for cordite. This process became essential to the British war effort. He met Balfour long before the declaration was written, and indeed first proposed the idea - the idea being that British Government support for a Jewish Homeland would be acceptable payment in lieu of royalties (he got both). Eventually became the first President of Israel. More here

Baron Walter Rothchild - to whom the Balfour Declaration is addressed.
On any other website, I`d feel the need to offer a lengthy bio of the Rothchild line, but do I need to do that here? I mean, it`s kind of like posting a description of a hockey puck on a hockey forum...

Nahum Sokolow - Leader of the World Zionist Conference, journalist and translator. Today, he`d be known as a lobbyist - and a very successful one.

The three above, plus Balfour himself, are exclusively responsible for the declaration - along with a man named Mark Sykes - although I`ve never been all to clear on how exactly he fit into the picture.

It`s an odd story - and one with more questions than answers, it seems. 4, maybe 5 people, what looks for all the world like a back-room deal, and you`ve laid the groundwork for what will likely be a war well into the NEXT century.

reply to post by runetang


you never answered my question as to what that means. could you clairify what that means?

My 2cents is that all these events are fabrications. The guy heading Iran is nothing but a western puppet saying and doing what is needed to perpetuate the fantasy of war and enemies. Wars are fabrications of the bankers. I'd encourage you not to take what you see at face value. The degree to which people are planted or cultivated as instigators or agitators in local and world events is something we just can't begin to grasp.

I suggest studying the work of Bill Still -- video.google.com...

Originally posted by birchtree
As far as evangelical christians I am not sure, perhaps besides the accepting of prophecy about the jewish homeland and their identity, what you think they have to do with it.

This wasn't addressed to me, but I think I can provide a simple answer. Not a LOGICAL answer, however; but when it comes to Christian theology, logic doesn't often seem to be of great importance.

Genesis 12:1-3
1 Now the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew thee:
2 And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:
3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

Most interpret this not as meaning Abraham's offspring but as directly applying to the 'children of Israel.' Jacob was renamed Israel and Jacob was Abraham's grandson.

Abraham had a LOT of children with several wives. It is very possible he fathered all the Arab nations, too. And the Jews we have today are really only descendants of the tribes of Judah and Benjamin, which were but two of the total 12 sons of Jacob/Israel.

Also, see that last verse. Now, Christians then totally ignore their 'own' part of the bible, the NT, where it says:

For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Romans 10:12

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
Galatians 3:28-29

Paul further says:

Romans 9:5-8
5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

Remember, even in Paul's time, there was no nation 'Israel.'

Israel, as a name, is defined as 'WHO PREVAILS WITH GOD.' Whomever overcomes the ways of the world (greed, fear, envy, violence) by trusting in GOD and by obeying the law which is LOVE.

So...everyone is judging these things on physical rather than spiritual value which causes physical turmoil and spiritual confusion.

Mostly what I hear is that the Christians fear NOT somehow helping the nation of Israel (as opposed to the people called Israel which is a designation open to all souls equally) because of what it says in Genesis. BUT, the way I see it, it isn't TRUE help, out of the goodness of anyone's heart but rather what they might see as a sure and easy way to make sure they please GOD.

BUT to please GOD is to love on another, according to my own understanding. The situation in the ME is not one borne out of love but confused religion and selfish motivations.

I'm not trying to persuade or promote any sort of belief; I just wanted to share my own understanding of the religious roots of the problem as related to Evangelical Christians. I hope that helps.

Originally posted by JSR
reply to post by runetang

 

you never answered my question as to what that means. could you clairify what that means?

His first name, Mahmoud:

Means "praiseworthy" in Arabic, from the same root as MUHAMMAD. This was the name of the first Muslim ruler of India (11th-century). It was also borne by two Ottoman sultans.

From Behind the Name

Just FYI for interest.

Originally posted by Geemor
I am sorry if I might have offended you in anyway. I didn't mean to blame you of being false prophet, just said that you'd fit the description; but certainly may many truth speakers fit this description.

No worries. But keep in mind a false prophet usually prophesies something. I haven't. Just pointing out what it says clearly in the Bible.

Now after I've done what you asked, could you do this:

Could you point out which verse says woe to those who divide the land of Israel?

See: HERE

This passage in Joel is the clearest and my favorite although there are a few others. God is promising to regather Israel in the last days and will judge all of those who harm the revived country or attempt to divine up His (note: not Israel's but His) land. In other passages it is stated the land does not belong to us, the Palestinians, or even the Jews but that it is His to give to the Jews. Here is the passage:

"For Behold! In those [last] days and at that time when I shall reverse the captivity and restore the fortunes of Judah and Jerusalem, I will gather all nations and will bring them down into the Valley of Jehoshaphat, and there will I deal with and execute judgment upon them for their treatment of My people and of My heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations and because they have divided My land." -Joel 3:1-2

Many interesting things. We know by the context and wording this is a last days prophecy. We know Israel will be a unified nation and not split into two separate countries like it was in the Old Testament times. We know it is referring to this dispora and not the Babylonian captivity because God promises to bring them back from all nations. During the Babylonian captivity and other captivities, they were only the prisoners of one nation. After the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D., the regathering of 1948 (prophesied to the year) was the first regathering from all nations all over the world. He then says he will judge those who have mistreated the land of Israel, try tried to uproot them, and anyone who attempted to divide their land.

Our maid in Ejad is a symbolic representation.

In the land of Ejad, in my mind, there is a ruler, she is a maid, and she is in totalitarian control of the land of Ejad through religious edict of matriarch ism.

She's referred to as the "Holy Maid" because she tries to clean up all of the bass-ackwards edits and decrees of the Holy Matriarchal Council of Nuns, who secretely control the land of Ejad supremely.

So there.

reply to post by AshleyD


Way I understand it, that prophecy talks about dividing God's land, which I suppose refers to whole globe. Just my opinion.

Originally posted by Geemor
Way I understand it, that prophecy talks about dividing God's land, which I suppose refers to whole globe. Just my opinion.

That doesn't make any sense, though. First of all, the entire fiasco with the Tower of Babel was because the people were disobeying God's direct order: to spread out into different nations and people. They did not do this so the tower was destroyed and the languages were confused. The ruins of the tower of Babel and inscriptions of the language being confounded still remain to this day. We are told to spread out, be fruitful and multiply, and become many nations.

Secondly, the very context to the judgment of dividing the land specifically mentions Judah, Israel, and Jerusalem in the last days. I don't know how we can come to any different conclusions when we take the entire Bible into account. Hope that helps. See? Not a false prophet if we agree with exactly what the Bible is trying to say.

[edit on 1/31/2008 by AshleyD]

Making foreign policy based on an ancient religious prophecy most American's don't even believe in is a very bad idea...

Fortunately I expect the next administration will be considerably less beholden to the Religious Right, and less interested in overseas adventurism as well.

Even a McCain administration is likely to be quite a bit less aggressive than the current one.

Hey Ahmadinejad

Why should i support you in any way ? my girlfriend can not even visit your land without having to wear islamic clothing and walking alone outside

You know, you would almost think Ahmadinejad is a zionist heathing Israel and America up to bomb Iran

Originally posted by AshleyD
That doesn't make any sense, though.

Yeah, I don't want to be to sensible

They could talk via PSI back then. But then they got too proud and they were degenerated so that they couldn't use PSI anymore and eventually divided to various nations speaking random languages

Originally posted by Geemor

Yeah, I don't want to be to sensible

They could talk via PSI back then. But then they got too proud and they were degenerated so that they couldn't use PSI anymore and eventually divided to various nations speaking random languages

Then I will accept your apology regarding your "false prophet" accusation at your leisure as you now see what I was saying came directly from the Bible.

You cut me to the bone!

Israel has survived for thousands of years. I don't think one madman is gonna make a difference in their current position. That's not even mentioning the fact that Israel has one of the best fighting forces in the world...

[edit on 31-1-2008 by Cronus111]

reply to post by winterass


What astounds me is that there are actually people who think putting a scarf over the top of their head when visiting a foreign country is terrible... but make absolutly no gripe about having the crap beaten out of you if you chew gum in Singapore