Labor claims Australia poll win, page 5

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reply posted on 27-11-2007 @ 05:26 AM by tezzajw

Originally posted by RAAFY
As for the new leader of the opposition, I would like to see Dr Brendan Nelson elected at caucus. (Yes he was the ex Defence Minister, but he is the only one I trust...

Brendan Nelson is completely incompetent.

He further helped to ruin the education system while he was in charge of the port-folio with his views on 'basic language reports'.

He insisted that schools must rate each student in quartile bands for each class they are in - yes that also meant Prep students had to be rated too... A totally moronic, shortsighted, idiotic decision from a man who had no friggin idea what education should be about.

Brendan Nelson should be sacked without receiving his golden-handshake pension, for his failures as a Minister.

He's a pig-headed, stubborn man who threatened to withdraw the funding from schools who did not comply to his views on how schools should alter the way they report student progress to parents. I don't know him personally, but I know someone who did know him when he was Education Minister - his opinion of Nelson was dim.

reply posted on 27-11-2007 @ 10:08 AM by mad scientist

Originally posted by tezzajw
He insisted that schools must rate each student in quartile bands for each class they are in - yes that also meant Prep students had to be rated too... A totally moronic, shortsighted, idiotic decision from a man who had no friggin idea what education should be about.

Really why ? >snip<

He's a pig-headed, stubborn man who threatened to withdraw the funding from schools who did not comply to his views on how schools should alter the way they report student progress to parents. I don't know him personally, but I know someone who did know him when he was Education Minister - his opinion of Nelson was dim.

Hmm ok. I have met him on several occassions. I found him to be quite articulate and engaging. >snip<

Mod Edit: Please See This Thread -- Courtesy Is Mandatory

[edit on 11/27/07/27 by junglejake]

reply posted on 27-11-2007 @ 10:24 AM by Shar_Chi

When I met Brendan Nelson his mere presence made me feel ill. Others I know have said the same thing. Ironic isn't it?

reply posted on 27-11-2007 @ 07:32 PM by RAAFY

reply to post by tezzajw

How do you know that his policies and ideas wouldn't have helped?
Why are people scared of innovation?

The schools now are in a mediocre state by not doing anything.

I think people underestimate how hard making a policy actually is.

Take it easy

RAAFY

reply posted on 27-11-2007 @ 09:27 PM by Cthulwho

Just repeating what I said about Brendon Nelson:

Brendan Nelson (Defence Minister): Decided to spend $6 Billion on the Super Hornet without consulting the airforce. Interestingly Andrew Peacock was the representative for Boeing in Australia.

Here's some references:
www.abc.net.au
www.defence.gov.au
www.smh.com.au
www.crikey.com.au
www.minister.defence.gov.au

He's also done some other silly things as defence minister. I'm sure he's a smart guy, but I wouldn't trust him to run a hotdog stand let alone a country.

[edit on 27-11-2007 by Cthulwho]

reply posted on 28-11-2007 @ 01:37 AM by gogosam

reply to post by Cthulwho

In regards to AWA's you said yourself you are a white collar worker. If so, then most white collar workers I know are not under and AWA, instead it is those blue collar workers who get their hands dirty and grind themselves to the bone for minimal money and under howard were looking forward to little Job security, no overtime etc... I dont know if you are under an AWA, if so then forget this post but if not I urge you to consider it from a different perspective. It is not nice to worry constantly about how to feed your family.

reply posted on 28-11-2007 @ 02:16 AM by Cthulwho

Sorry, I meant in Western Australia, especially in the mining sector. We've had a lot of bad experiences with workers strikes over here in WA, the last thing we want is miners striking, that would virtually stop our economy. And no I'm not on an AWA, but I have a lot of friends who work up north that are. They definetly don't have to worry about how to feed their families (if they had any). Most of them earn upwards of $200,000 a year, and that's 2 weeks on 1 week off.

reply posted on 28-11-2007 @ 05:35 PM by morphonius821

reply to post by Cthulwho

[My comments:]
I think it would be naive to think we can get by without an army ETC.,....
But realistically unless we spend our entire GDP on weopons we are not going to be able to match the millitary might of the much larger nations that surround us..... which is why we are so keen to be cozy with the US.

Having said this a few things become apparent to me anyway....
Why should we buy all our big ticket millitary hardware off the US...I guess they do spend trillions on millitary R&D and so obviously have some "nice" things... but seeing as it is vertually impossible to match the milliary power of our neighbours why not put our defense dollars into developing the capacity to create our own big- ticket millitary hardware.....
That way we create jobs with the money we spend instead of running up huge debts and fostering dependance on the US further.....

Its it totally beyond our capabilies and outside the relms of practical possibility that we could design, build and manufacture our own fighter jets or tanks or what ever.......?????

Perhaps its easier and even cheaper in the sort to medium term...(perhaps im naive) but if we are going to spend a trillion dollars on mainly US hand me downs and a select few super hi-tech toys and still not be in the ball park of our neighbours it seems rather futile.
The money would be better spent in a way that creates jobs in australia

reply posted on 28-11-2007 @ 11:43 PM by mojo4sale

originally posted by gogosamIn regards to AWA's you said yourself you are a white collar worker. If so, then most white collar workers I know are not under and AWA, instead it is those blue collar workers who get their hands dirty and grind themselves to the bone for minimal money and under howard were looking forward to little Job security, no overtime etc... I dont know if you are under an AWA, if so then forget this post but if not I urge you to consider it from a different perspective. It is not nice to worry constantly about how to feed your family.

To suggest that white collar workers dont struggle to make ends meet as much as blue collar workers is naive imo.
I have mates working in the trades that make twice what i make.
Im on a contract and salary as most white collar workers i know are now, i get paid the same whether i work 40 hrs or 60hrs or 80hrs, which we are expected to do. We dont get paid overtime, where as a mate of mine in the manufacturing industry can do an 8 hour overtime shift on the weekend and double his pay.
A white collar employee where i work was forced to take a redundancy because she wouldnt sign her contract, what makes you think white collar employee's arent contracted?

Originally posted by morphonius821
why not put our defense dollars into developing the capacity to create our own big- ticket millitary hardware.....
That way we create jobs with the money we spend instead of running up huge debts and fostering dependance on the US further.....

Its it totally beyond our capabilies and outside the relms of practical possibility that we could design, build and manufacture our own fighter jets or tanks or what ever.......?????

We already do, Collins Class submarines, i believe Melbourne may also have won a significant defense contract lately.
We are also among the best in the world when it comes to Defense research.

reply posted on 28-11-2007 @ 11:57 PM by Cthulwho

Morphonius821, I wasn't arguing against military expenditure, I was arguing against spending $6 Billion on the Super Hornet as an interim fighter, and that Brendan Nelson made the decision without consulting the military. Basically, Andrew Peacock lobbied Brendan Nelson to buy the Super Hornet, against Australia's interest.

but seeing as it is vertually impossible to match the milliary power of our neighbours

If by neighbours you mean Indonesia, Singapore, Malaysia, Thailand etc, then I strongly disagree. We are a very wealthy/educated nation, and can quite easily maintain military dominance in south-east Asia. But if you're referring to China and India, then yes, they're going to be very hard to keep up with.

[Breaking News]

Brendan Nelson is the new leader of the opposition, Julie Bishop is his new deputy.

au.news.yahoo.com...

Quite obviously Tony Abbot and Co. have elected him as the new leader because they know they're going to lose the next election, so they're using Brendan Nelson as cannon fodder.

[edit on 29-11-2007 by Cthulwho]

reply posted on 29-11-2007 @ 02:18 PM by mad scientist

Originally posted by morphonius821
Its it totally beyond our capabilies and outside the relms of practical possibility that we could design, build and manufacture our own fighter jets or tanks or what ever.......?????

Unfortunately it is. Further more if we were willing to invest teh 10's-100's of billions of dollars building a high tech arms industry it would still tak decades to put the infrsastructure and expertise in place.

Perhaps its easier and even cheaper in the sort to medium term...(perhaps im naive) but if we are going to spend a trillion dollars on mainly US hand me downs and a select few super hi-tech toys and still not be in the ball park of our neighbours it seems rather futile.

A trillion dollars ?

reply posted on 29-11-2007 @ 11:10 PM by Shar_Chi

makes peace seem relatively cheap...

reply posted on 30-11-2007 @ 11:11 PM by tezzajw