Questions about Masonry: an open and honest forum

I'd like to ask why Hitler had so many Masons put in the Camps, and also did they suffer the same fate as the Jews/Gypsys or were they just jailed like the Trade Unionists?

Masonry has always been a threat to tyrants because they value liberty and think for themselves.

Civil and religious liberty are strong tenant of Freemasonry as is opposition to despotism. As for how they suffered, anytime you have war, you have distortion of fact so it is hard to say precisely but here (pdf) is an intresting article written in 1941.

Originally posted by Muffinresearch
I'd like to ask why Hitler had so many Masons put in the Camps, and also did they suffer the same fate as the Jews/Gypsys or were they just jailed like the Trade Unionists?

Rank and file Masons were subject to imprisonment and "re-education". Masonic leaders, however, were subject to the death penalty.

many Masons may have died without ever being identified as well..

Such as Jewish Masons, or Catholic Masons..

Also an unknown number of Masons died fighting in the war.. as with all wars.. such as the America Civil War, Masons on both sides died in the fields, and sometimes Confederate Masons would find a Union Mason injured and assist them.

Actual numbers of how many Masons where killed in WW2 is unknown exactly, except for what Hitler took records of (or at least I have never seen any such records of how many Masons died either in the camps or Hitlers war..)


As for "why" ..

There are many reasons Hitler had for killing different groups, is officers often killed their own enemies as well..

But for the most part Hitler was paranoid of anyone with power other then himself.. no doubt there may have been Masons in an opposing political party, or he may have suspected plots against him inside lodges.. Masonic lodges, while barred from discussing politics, have been used before for revolution and plots against despots.. just look at the American revolution..

In the end it all comes down to the fact that Masonry is a very socially liberal organization, open to free speech, free thinking and freedom of religion and political views. One of the reasons why the Church did and still does bare its members from being Masons, and why many times Masons are looked at suspeciously by despots and tyranical governments.. freedom of thought typically inspires revolutionary thoughts against tyranical governments.


PS.... I am hyped up on cold medicines, I hope that even made sense.....

[edit on 4/19/2007 by Rockpuck]

Thank you for your informative replies gentlemen.
When I look at the state of the world today(post 911) it is reassureing to think that Masonry was labeled 'anti-facist' in Hitler's time.
I hope you guys are still wearing your white hats

Was driving through the city today and noticed this building

www.sydneyarchitecture.com...

Hello, I'm a new member here and hope to be able to add to this discussion soon as I will be petitioning to become a mason in the near future. I don't have any questions, and not able to answer any yet, (unless maybe "why join"), but I do hope to change that soon.

Originally posted by aylyan
Was driving through the city today and noticed this building

www.sydneyarchitecture.com...

That is a typical and ordinary Masonic Center.

Maybe not ordinary in architecture.. but ordinary in what goes on - a few pages back I linked pics to the Masonic Center I belong to and many others - they are all different.

This one is only remarkable in how ugly and utterly 70's it is. I would expect better from Sydney Australia!

Originally posted by WhoMe513
Hello, I'm a new member here and hope to be able to add to this discussion soon as I will be petitioning to become a mason in the near future. I don't have any questions, and not able to answer any yet, (unless maybe "why join"), but I do hope to change that soon.

Well I certainly hope you enjoy Masonry if you sign up. There is all kinds of information not just on this page, but many of the Masonic threads on this site. Masons here take good care in brining the best and most truthful information.

If you need anything else, don't hesitate to U2U any of the open Masons of the board.

Originally posted by WhoMe513
Hello, I'm a new member here and hope to be able to add to this discussion soon as I will be petitioning to become a mason in the near future. I don't have any questions, and not able to answer any yet, (unless maybe "why join"), but I do hope to change that soon.

Welcome to our thread, and most of all, welcome to ATS.
I do hope you enjoy your time here.
Best of luck with your petition.
Let us know how it turns out.

-WK

Good Afternoon everyone,

I am new to the site and this is my first post.

I do appreciate the time each of you put forth to be able to answer queries that many of us have.

I am extremely interested in joining a masonic lodge near my home. Currently, I am looking to find someone from a lodge to make contact with. I have not been very successful.

I respectively solicit your opinions on the pros and cons of entering large city lodges versus small community lodges. I am close to both.

My follow up questions are:


1) How can I find someone from a lodge?

2) How do I approach that person (since I most likely will not know him prior to our meeting)?

3) How do I solicit his help in entering the brotherhood?

As always, any and all direction you can provide me in my quest is greatly appreciated.

Regards,
Brian

Bdrice...

Thank you for posting your question.. it is difficult to answer. We do not recruit members on ATS. People read the truth and decide whether or not its for them, and then they join and come back as a Mason. That would be what I did. But if people ask questions like yours, it may seem like we are recruiting. BUT.. we are not. It is against the T&C of the site, to recruit for any reason on ATS to a group.

However, I can answer your question in describing how a typical average person, not associated with this site at all, would go about joining.

1) How can I find someone from a lodge?

Typically when someone wants to join a lodge, they either know someone in the lodge already or something along those lines. For someone who does NOT know anyone, which is very common, the best way is to actually go to the lodge its self and ask someone there. Don't be afraid to show up and ask about membership, the Masons love talking to new members

Lodge information is typically posted on a website, or a announcement board outside their lodge. (I know, not very sneaky for a secret society..)

2) How do I approach that person (since I most likely will not know him prior to our meeting)?

A typical person when approaching a lodge would typically say something along the lines of "hello" and maybe a comment on the weather. Just be honest.. your interested in joining but you are clueless as to what you need to do. Then be prepared to have everyone in the vicinity tell you everything you need to know, how to do it, someone will bring you a petition, the petition is I believe $150 (includes first years dues) and someone will sign it.

3) How do I solicit his help in entering the brotherhood?

A typical person won't need to solicit anything, someone will always be there with the information you need and telling you what to do next. It would be damn near impossible to do it yourself WITHOUT help. Actually, 100% impossible.

Find the lodge, find a member at the lodge and express your interest, exchange business cards and congrats, you most likely just made a new friend. Last line was a bit cheesy.

It is a lot more easy going, laid back and lighthearted then many think, especially if you read what "anti's" say about us.

Rockpuck,

Thank you so much for your detailed response to my multiple queries.

As usual, it seems the best answer is the most basic, a little Occam's Razor if you will.

The past few days I have been reading through the posts, I have noticed you actively participate in this sight. I look forward to many discussions with you and others on this sight, as I begin my quest.

Bdrice -

Locate a lodge where you live

Also

Valley of Atlanta

Your "location" in your profile says Atlanta and Czech Republic -- not sure about Czech, but here is some info for Atlanta.

The Czech Republic is where me and my wife (A Czech native) spend our summers. I like to go there to study and research the history of crime, folklore, and banking, in Central and Eastern Europe.

Thanks for the links. I see one in the community I live. I will update you on the progress of my quest.

Thanks again!
Brian

[edit on 4/24/2007 by bdrice12]

Okay it's my first post so I'll start with hello and I hope Yer all Okay.

Right my Dad is a Mason and has been for many years, now while I have never really asked Him about what goes on behind closed doors, purely out of respect mind, the thought of it doesn't worry me in the least.
In fact since He's been a Brother He's, to be honest chilled out at bit and I've asked Him many things over the years about Theology (not Religion, don't confuse the two) and I've learnt a great deal about Solomans Temple Mount and Saladin and tons of other famous or infamous historical figures. And all from every walk of life and faith. It's very very interesting. The little He lets me know makes me all the more curious though, not sure whether I want to take that whole "Leap of Faith" stuff mind.
Being an areligious community it's, I guess, something that should be embraced a little more, rather than shunned to wierdnessville. Afterall the Brotherhood do a great deal more for our communites than many people give them credit for..

Blue,

"behind closed doors" is typically two things..

Degree work, which is not discussed simply for respect of tradition and, quite honestly, its no ones business...

If every one knew every detail about every little thing within degrees and so forth.. it looses that mysticness (I don't think thats a real word )

The other thing is usually bills, boreing, dull, so on and so forth. Not at all "exciting" or anything remotly close

I am sure if you openly ask your father, he would probably tell you all about it.. since you have not asked before, perhaps he thinks it may bore you, and make him seem old, lame or "uncool" who knows. If you show intrest, I am sure ya'll will have a nice conversation about it.

PS. Welcome to ATS, the both of you.

[edit on 4/24/2007 by Rockpuck]

Rock, I understand what You are saying.

I've re-read my post and it does come a cross as a a little juvenile. Sorry mate.

I guess the only reason I've never asked my Dad about the mysteries of Freemasonry is because it's His time alone from the, pardon my language, bollocks of life in general.

While someone explained to me once, a while ago, what "bollocks" meant, I think I forget..

Anyways, your probably right, it is his "away" time and space, I would still imagine that he would like it if his son was interested in what he was doing.. Never hurts to ask eh?