Project Serpo: Postings by "Anonymous" -- Breaking news?

Originally posted by Damocles
the fact that he's posting troop movements on a public forum down to unit and destination. talk about a MAJOR breach of OPSEC.

Actually, he was digging up OLD journal entries he had written (note the date at the top is 2002). He wasn't posting current troop movements. Although I suppose someone might make the argument that information from 2002 is still useful to the enemy. That's not really something I feel like debating at the moment...

back to topic. all the guys asking 'oh annon got replaced? why how by who etc...re read waht bill wrote...he said his associat WAS OF THE OPINION THAT...

so lets not go tear the guy to shreds like a pack of dogs lookin for a milkbone in his pocket

LOL - I like the metaphor - and I agree. His associate was simply speculating on a project he knows nothing about and has no connection with. I have a friend who works on NSA computer systems and has worked in Cheyenne Mountain. He is free to speculate all he wants (and he has speculated on project Serpo - we both agree there's not enough information to decide either way) as long as he isn't passing any classified information from his own projects or any other classified information THAT HE IS AWARE OF.

Bill's associate has NO classified information to share with Bill. He's just giving his opinion on a project no one knows even exists.

-rdube02

[edit on 26-1-2006 by rdube02]

[edit on 26-1-2006 by rdube02]

Originally posted by DaFunk13 It doesnt matter if your best friend is 007, this guy is doing this for us.

or to us.

it should be noted that he could be a party to a haox, not just a pawn.

Mr. Ryan I am sorry but you are so full of C#$P that this has truely turned into a joke.

ABSOLUTELY NO CIA, CIA, NSA, DIA or AFFILIATE WILL EVER EVER EVER SAY that something that is TOP SECRET is AUTHENTIC TO SOMEONE WITH ABSOLUTELY NO SECURITY CLEARANCE.

Period.

Regardless of what you might believe, they will say "no comment" or "thats not something I would have knowledge on" or "sounds nice but are you serious?" or "sounds like an interesting concept".

ALWAYS ALWAYS something vauge without agreeing or disagreeing.

regardless of what the subject matter is, it could be something as small as, whats your boss's name. Or where were you on Friday.

They would not even give up who deep throat was (and yes they knew) do you think they would admit to something involving aliens as being true and authentic.

Please. You are very confused about who you think we are Mr. Ryan

Would your response be filled with such venom if the individual involved were SUPPORTIVE of disclosure???

Originally posted by Shawnna

Would your response be filled with such venom if the individual involved were SUPPORTIVE of disclosure???

Hey I am supportive of disclosure I just dont know what everyone is expecting the Goverment to say.

The fact is that they dont have all the answers, thats why there is no disclosure.

They just know a bit more then we know, the rest.....

Well.. its anyones guess at the moment.

You want them to "disclose" well we dont know where, well we dont know how many, well we dont know exactly when, no we dont know their intent, no we dont know if there are "others"

WHAT are you really expecting them to tell you.....

Originally posted by robertfenix

Please. You are very confused about who you think we are Mr. Ryan

I think you are the confused one.

A brief look at your posting history, gives claims to you being an "agent"/working for NASA and having now having an Aerospace friend, who discussed with you a project so secret that only when it was complete did the people who actually worked on it tell each other....but he told you about this process.....hmmm ok......

Ahh the magic of the internet, where normal people are superheroes.

Originally posted by Alpha Grey

Originally posted by robertfenix
Mr. Ryan I am sorry but you are so full of C#$P that this has truely turned into a joke.

Will the Mods please ban this guy....insulting Bill Ryan is WAY over the line !

BILL RYAN DOES NOT DESERVE THAT IN ANY WAY !!

Alpha Grey,
Just when is a person not allowed to voice their opinion on ATS?
How do you know what Bill Ryan deserves? You don't know for a fact that he is who he says he is. NONE of us do.
In my opinion I need proof of who all of these people are and until I get it I'm not going to stop voiceing my OPINION.
To make something clear here: I have always believed in UFO's and visiters from another world and I am not a skeptic but something about this really bother's me. Something is just not right here about this story.

OK so now we have Bill getting direct emails from the ANON source who was emailing some other guy, who would then post the information onto a site created by Bill. I remember Bill stating that he, at first, had no direct connection to any of the parties involved prior to this event starting. NOW, Bill has CIA friends who are vouching for the valedity of this story. I thought Bill was the messenger in this. His posts are more liken to a cheerleader or defense attorney. At every level he is defending these posts. Messengers are supposed to be objective if that is there true intentions. Go through and read his posts for yourself. This thread only gains steam after he posts, and quite frankly the only thing its got going for it is the fact that he is extremely articulate, which leads me to the opinoin that he may not have the best intentions. He posts the message, then defends the message in a very eloquent fashion. Now he has friends on the inside who support his claims, I mean, ANON'S claims of this being a pluasable story. Bill and a BUNCH of anonomous individuals are this stories only means of validation. WOW, ATS were smarter than this, arent we?

Originally posted by timb3r

A brief look at your posting history, gives claims to you being an "agent"/working for NASA and having now having an Aerospace friend, who discussed with you a project so secret that only when it was complete did the people who actually worked on it tell each other....but he told you about this process.....hmmm ok......

Really when did I ever say I was an agent, I am sure I have posted several times I am in no way connected to the goverment by any means.

And as for my friend yes he worked for Rockwell/NASA in Southern California. Specifically an electrical systems engineer for Rockwell Aerospace who was contracted to build things for NASA like the space shuttle for one, along with all kinds of control systems, fly by wire, guidance systems, radar sub components etc.

And yes while the projects are in development they can hold a high level security clearance, once they are "fielded" say become planes or flying in an operational format like the space shuttle etc. Then they become declassified to an extent that the people working on them can say hey I worked on that. But they still can not say, look see I have a drawing and this is how we got around the voltage problem that resulted in lots of failures until we figured out the solution.

Some technical aspects are still classified while general programs they can talk about. It would be like my friend denying there is even a fleet of space shuttles. Of course he can talk about it, it is in existence in the public domain. But he still can not talk about things that still might be highly classified about how the shuttle operates.

And yes it is a fact that design teams are kept apart its the whole premise of compatmentalizing projects. You want to be able to pinpoint leaks if you have too. Say information about a guidance system is leaked, you are not going to investigate the group that is working on landing gear.

Its really not that hard to understand.

[edit on 26-1-2006 by robertfenix]

Originally posted by robertfenix

Originally posted by Shawnna

Would your response be filled with such venom if the individual involved were SUPPORTIVE of disclosure???

Hey I am supportive of disclosure I just dont know what everyone is expecting the Goverment to say.

The fact is that they dont have all the answers, thats why there is no disclosure.

They just know a bit more then we know, the rest.....

Well.. its anyones guess at the moment.

You want them to "disclose" well we dont know where, well we dont know how many, well we dont know exactly when, no we dont know their intent, no we dont know if there are "others"

WHAT are you really expecting them to tell you.....

I think we all would appreciate it if you would temper your posts to reflect your opinion about the subject and avoid personally attacking people. Telling Bill Ryan he is full of C$*&P was not necessary. While that may be your personal opinion given your obvious bias, it certainly isn't necessary to start a flame war if we are to get everyone's insight into this topic.

Originally posted by MagicaRose
Alpha Grey,
Just when is a person not allowed to voice their opinion on ATS?
How do you know what Bill Ryan deserves? You don't know for a fact that he is who he says he is. NONE of us do.
In my opinion I need proof of who all of these people are and until I get it I'm not going to stop voiceing my OPINION.
To make something clear here: I have always believed in UFO's and visiters from another world and I am not a skeptic but something about this really bother's me. Something is just not right here about this story.

first off.....yes everyones opinion is welcome here....but personal attacks are NOT !! (trust me..I know this lesson well.....)

second......do you deserve someone saying that your full of crap when you make posts?? no you do not and neither does Bill Ryan.

third.....if something is not right with the story....research it and prove it. It that simple.

For what its worth...Mr. Ryan could just say "screw it...I am out !" and dump his ATS membership and leave everyone floundering for answers...but he does'nt. But my guess is that if more people give Mr. Ryan a hassle...he might decide we are not worth the extra hassle and leave. Remember.....he's the one with his neck on the line so he should get the benefit of the doubt.


[edit on 26-1-2006 by Alpha Grey]

Mr. Ryan

Thanks for the latest of your update. As usual, it is (to say the least) intriguing. A quick question if you can spare a minute.

Related to the statement made by your contact with respect to Anon. He stated that he felt that Anon had been replaced. Do you have any further color that you can add to that statement (related to what indicators lead him to believe that we are now seeing Anon version 2.0)? It could certainly explain the length of time between postings.

As always, I appreciate the time you have spent with us here at ATS!

K


edit changes to correct a horribly malformed sentence

[edit on 26-1-2006 by jonke05]

i serpose that if you were to look at the data in total and the connections therein, you would see a pattern emerging.

any disclosure, any, is dependant on the number of people who see the pattern being 'significant'.

Originally posted by CrossBone
OK so now we have Bill getting direct emails from the ANON source who was emailing some other guy, who would then post the information onto a site created by Bill. I remember Bill stating that he, at first, had no direct connection to any of the parties involved prior to this event starting.

He didn't, initially. It appears that Anonymous decided to send this last post directly to Bill. Most likely due to his dissatisfaction with the way Victor would edit his information before passing it along for posting.

What's the problem with understanding that this situation is dynamic. Things change. They evolve. Bill didn't have contact with anon. At some point, anon made contact directly with Bill. Anon then sent his last post directly to Bill.

NOW, Bill has CIA friends who are vouching for the valedity of this story. I thought Bill was the messenger in this.

Victor has expressed tremendous pride in the "pedigree" of his list. That list includes many people with intelligence backgrounds, military connections, academic backgrounds, etc. Yes. There are former high-level CIA people on that list as well (I've confirmed this).

Now he has friends on the inside who support his claims, I mean, ANON'S claims of this being a pluasable story. Bill and a BUNCH of anonomous individuals are this stories only means of validation. WOW, ATS were smarter than this, arent we?

I thought so. Deny ignorance -- embrace the possibilities. I think you're simply dead-wrong about Bill acting as a "cheerleader". He's been extremely cautious, both publicly and privately, to remain neutral in his assessment of Anon's evidence. Bill does see the possibilities (real, false, hoax, disinfo, etc.) and he states them openly. Listen to the 2 our of 3 amigos interview to see what I mean.

Can anyone explain how Bills neck is on the line? Thats like saying the US mail is responsable for all the anthrax letters. Is he a messanger or is this his story!!! Quit defending this man! He is more than capabable of doing that himself! More importantly he shouldnt care! He has no ties to this story or does he?

[edit on 26-1-2006 by CrossBone]

Originally posted by robertfenix

Originally posted by Bill Ryan


a colleague with extensive high-level CIA experience,

3) Interestingly, he is of the opinion that:

a) The Serpo account is authentic (at least largely so)
b) The latest log is authentic (he has experience of the analysis of military logs written under extreme stress and states this is exactly what they are like) – whether or not it's an audio transcript
c) Anonymous has been replaced.

Best, Bill

Mr. Ryan I am sorry but you are so full of C#$P that this has truely turned into a joke.

ABSOLUTELY NO CIA, CIA, NSA, DIA or AFFILIATE WILL EVER EVER EVER SAY that something that is TOP SECRET is AUTHENTIC TO SOMEONE WITH ABSOLUTELY NO SECURITY CLEARANCE.

Period.

Regardless of what you might believe, they will say "no comment" or "thats not something I would have knowledge on" or "sounds nice but are you serious?" or "sounds like an interesting concept".

ALWAYS ALWAYS something vauge without agreeing or disagreeing.

regardless of what the subject matter is, it could be something as small as, whats your boss's name. Or where were you on Friday.

They would not even give up who deep throat was (and yes they knew) do you think they would admit to something involving aliens as being true and authentic.

Please. You are very confused about who you think we are Mr. Ryan

robertfenix, YOU ARE BOTH WRONG AND UTTERLY OUT OF ORDER.

You are making a fool of yourself again. You are falling prey to your previous lack of judgment of being prematurely overopinionated without bothering to ask a few simple questions to check your understanding.

Centrist will know who this person is and has also been in private correspondence with him. I will not disclose any clues to his identity and neither will he.

Originally posted by kenshiro2012

c) Anonymous has been replaced.

Bill, Please clarify this some more. Are you saying that the origional poster going nby that handle is no longer the same one that has been making the last few posts on the serpo site?
Does your friend beleive that this new anon is a disinformation specialist?

In straight answer to your good questions, this is the hypothesis that I now think is the best to explain recent events. At the moment, I'd put a lot of money on it.

Anon A has been replaced by Anon B. In between there was a hiatus.

Anon B is approaching the release in a different way, though still working to the agreed program/schedule of materials to be disclosed. One aspact of his approach is that he insists on things being much tighter. Not a word is to be altered, added or deleted, and the controls are far greater. It's being more professionally done this time.

The data is still coming from the same source(s) behind the scenes. The Anonymous messenger is different. He is just a relay.

(Theoretically, it could of course be the same guy who has been ordered to adopt a different approach... or, following discussions with his colleagues, has agreed to do so. I mention that for completeness. Operationally, I'm given to understand that a replacement is more likely to have been the case.)

Originally posted by Whiterabbit29
Is there any chance that the new ANON will be a bit more forthcoming with the release of the information?

I'm fully expecting that there'll be more. But I have no idea what the material may be, or when it may appear. My guess is that we'll not experience any more long gaps as long as things go according to whatever plan has been decided.

Originally posted by Whiterabbit29Is the extremely slow release of Info anything to do with why he has been replaced? If not do you know why he has been replaced?

These are my own ideas only.... no more than that. I may be quite wrong, but for the sake of ideas on the table:

There may have been an internal behind-the-scenes conflict because of the way the original material had been edited by Victor in November and December. I have to point out that Victor has said that Anon (or Anon A) was fully supportive of Victor's editing. But Anon's colleagues or superior(s) may not have been.

One can conjecture that this is why there may have been a replacement. Like: "OK, now we're going to do this by the book as we originally agreed. No more messing around. We'll select a route where we can be confident that no changes will be made under any circumstances. We need tighter control of what is being released."

They would have known by now that this was my stance, which I've stated before in this forum and elsewhere. Victor thought it best to be an Editor, and I think it best to be a Reporter. We've been communicating about this in the last couple of days. Victor feels I should have edited the piece I posted on Tuesday. I disagree with his view.

We remain friends and I support Victor's integrity totally. There's no rule book for how to handle this kind of situation; neither of us had even been faced with this problem before, so each of us has been doing his best, making the best judgments we could. Because we are different people those judgments will be bound to differ sometimes. But we continue to work together to figure it all out.

While there's suddenly a step change in the number of items on the table to discuss and analyse, what I'm really excited about is the possibility that there will be more. The very fact that the postings have resumed – with a difference – seems to me to suggest that this disclosure effort is serious and does not intend to be stopped.

Best, Bill

The Mods have stated that Bill Ryan is a guest here. He should be treated with respect . It's not hard to state your opinion in a mature, reasonable and respectful way.

Originally posted by CrossBone
He has no ties to this story or does he?

Well IMO he has to be connected to the "story". You cant have no idea who Anon is, then say you know without a doubt its Anon, without knowing whom Anon was in the first place.

It should be just the facts and not be dependant upon revisions made to address specific criticism.

There should be no emotional attachment whether or not the material being presented gets slammed as being erroneous data based on nothing but fiction.

So yes IMO I think Mr. Ryan is a wee bit more involved in the evolution of PROJECT SERPO the EBEN's then he cares to admit to everyone.

here's a fun example!

alternative/line 19 reads well for the synchronisity set!

www.mbhs.edu...


but with a little inside knowledge maybe a code can be found within the data.





[edit on 26-1-2006 by lucianarchy]

Can anyone tell me what page Bill's last but one post was? (The one that mentions Anon being replaced) - I can't find It!!

(Ive read everything since p1 but seem to have missed something between p111 - 115

Thanks

Interesting that Serpo has only two anagrams...the 'prose' you mentioned and the more relavent 'spore' you didn't.

I don't understand why you would post something so obfuscating.

Could you explain?