Rebuttal to "I just got back from a FEMA Detainment Camp

OTS makes some good points...

We actually have a esteemed representative that cared so much that a misunderstood view of the evacuation was taking place, that he responded to this ON OUR BOARD (target central)...

and as a fellow Okie...leave the guy alone, or you go on my spitball list...

I think he acted with honor, and seeing his previous experience... I respect the man...

as to whether he is trying to cover something up...
If there was a bio weapons lab in NO... then some VERY BIG mistakes have been made at top levels... that show that we are being led by morons...
we aren't... (until recently) so don't worry...
I don't think they would be screwin around with nasty viruses in a swamp below sea level... (OH LORD I HOPE NOT).

As to his answers... they made sense to me, and I can see why they wouldn't want fresh food there... it is presumptious to assume that they could...
And as far as Val goes... she has a big heart, and I am glad to share the state with her...
as far as dealing with the Gov goes... she doesn't have the ability, because she didn't come with her team of civil rights lawyers... so she was put in queue the minute she arrived.

She gets the same ABC answer everyone else at the scene gets... no special treatment for anyone... (it is in the training)
Ed went outside that procedure when he responded... and he will probably draw some fire for it... so let us thank him for that at least...

Thank you Ed, for attempting to resolve the misunderstanding...
please feel free to rebute anything else in the future...
we are an even handed bunch, so matter what the initial impression may look like...

I'd like to point out that 'death threats' constitute CRIMINAL ACTIVITY!!!

I DON'T agree with Val's term 'idiots'.....it's too much of an understatement for my liking.


[edit on 12-9-2005 by loam]

Very true! We must. Something I often say to people I know off the internet but I rarely say online is - that if we don't keep people in power 'on their toes' then it will allow corruption to blossum.
A balance has to be made though between keeping people 'on their toes' and just trying so damn hard to always find something corrupt that you will go to extraordinary lengths to try and prove something that is highly unlikely.

This not only damages the reputation of alternative thinkers, but it also clouds any ideas which hold firmer ground.

This particular case is unfortunate though as we had this unique oppurtunity that has never happened before either on this board or in fact on any alternative subject board on the Internet (to my knowledge).

It was an ideal stepping stone in creating a good, interactive relationship between official figures and our community and sadly a few people appear to have blown it for everyone. Not by asking questions but simply in their attitude.
It was a shame that people not only lacked the foresight to look at the present oppurtunity in relation to this specific event, but also the foresight to see how it may influence the future of the board and perhaps encourage more interaction with official figures in the future.
When Ed appeared it excited me that we had this never seen before opportunity to actually interact with the 'other side of the coin' so to speak.
The ability to actually interact with a human being rather than read biased interpretations through various media sources was a first.
It brings back memories of my news story last year on the meteor sightings :

www.abovetopsecret.com...

The article that sparked it off was this:

Thousands of reports tonight across Texas, Louisiana, Arkansas and Missouri of a big ball of fire with a tail, flying across the northeast sky. Calls began coming into our newsroom a little after 9:30, all with the same story. Witnesses describe something that looked like a meteor or a comet. Authorities across East Texas are looking for answers tonight.

A spokesman for the National Weather Service in Fort Worth said the sightings were not tied to a weather event and were likely a meteor shower.

NORAD has told FEMA today was the first day of heightened meteor showers that could last the rest of the month.

Me and several other members including Valhall contacted various people. The story being propogated on the wire was that NORAD had warned FEMA about the meteors. Anyway I did some emailing and I got thisreply if you recall:

Thanks for your e-mail inquiry about the meteor everyone saw last week. In talking with my staff Meteorologists who were on duty that evening, it is my understanding that they heard from some source (I'm not sure who) that FEMA had talked with NORAD about what everyone saw that night. My Meteorologists passed this along in conversations with the TV weather folks which then reported it on their website. So it sounds like a case of second, third, or fourth hand information.
I later talked with an Officer at NORAD and she informed me that they do not track or report on non-man made objects in the sky. So to answer your question, it is my understanding that NORAD does not issue warnings for meteors.

I hope this helps clear up any confusion or misunderstanding on the subject.

Thanks
Lee Harrison
Meteorologist-in-Charge
NWS Shreveport

The point is, by talking with officials we can get to the heart of the matter, it enables us to quash rumours and to get to the facts. Things a open to mis-interpretation. This was an ideal example in that something that was misunderstood or rumoured after a chinese whisper routine quickly became 'fact'.

This is a responsibility that we have to seriously consider in this case especially. Val's article now carries a huge amount of weight behind it, it has the potential to make headline news and that may not even be necessary.
The accusations being made or implied are not to be taken lightly, this isn't just about impressing or swinging the views of a few peers, as this site grows we have the potential to influence significantly many people's ideas and views on a number of subjects.

Sadly though, it strikes me that some people are more eager to try and prove their point, whatever the means and wherever right or wrong, rather than actually attempt to find the truth.
Which is what I thought the whole community was about.
The thing is though, that what we say is starting to carry more and more weight, and a brash statement or comment may cause incredible damage.
It may also cause good, however, but we must be cautious.

To coin a phrase from a movie..

"With Great Power comes Great Responsibility.."

Think about it.

[edit on 12-9-2005 by AgentSmith]

Oooops

[edit on 12-9-2005 by ZeddicusZulZorander]

Think you hit quote instead of edit there buddy! LOL

[edit on 12-9-2005 by AgentSmith]

Originally posted by Valhall
Oh well isn't that just ripe!

To all the f***ing freaks out there that can't contain yourselves. Thanks a lot. Thanks a great deal.

Well, let's keep in mind these calls were hopefully not from ATS members. This board could be viewed by anyone, and Ed probably shouldn't have posted his number. I really found it odd that he would.

At least we know it wasn't the thread itself that turned him off. What a damn shame!

by Agent Smith:
To coin a phrase from a movie..

"With Great Power come[s] Great Responsibility.."

Absolutely correct!

BUT!? . . . that's a double-edged sword and can often times be difficult to swallow . . . if you get my gist?!

IOW, how that power and/or responsibility is handled will ultimately demonstrate the morality of he who holds said power and/or responsiblity.

I just wanted to point out the dire relevancy of the "comes" part.

Originally posted by 12m8keall2c

Ed joined this site on Sunday, Sept. 11, 2005

?!homework Muaddib homework?!

There was one post from 2004 that is linked in this threat, I believe, in which Ed participated. That's why I said he seems to be an old member. Maybe he left the forums for a while and came back.

[edit on 12-9-2005 by Muaddib]

Originally posted by 12m8keall2c
I intend to reply with an inquiry asking if he will answer some of the questions raised, that truly deserve a response and need to be addressed . . . hopefully he will.

You should also express the outrage of ATS members that anyone would threaten him. He should not be left with the impression that this site is populated with criminal morons!

This whole thing just makes me sick!!!!

"I wanted to open a dialogue with the good folks on the web site, however after receiving a number of calls with "death threats" and "what a jerk profanity remarks" I abandoned the idea."
______________________________________________________________________
What would anyone here have to gain from placing "death threat" and "profanity remark" calls to Ed because of his rebuttal? Who here is dissatisfied with Ed's rebuttal enough to threaten his life and profane him on the phone? I've seen comments that could not be described as "friendly" but I haven't seen any comments that could be considered hostile enough to warrant such behavior. It's obvious that this would result in Ed not answering our questions. Some of us have questions that we want answered. Others want to bury the topic, drop the subject, and forget the questions. I'd think everyone would want this situation at Falls Creek clarified. Hopefully Ed will answer the questions in a subsequent e-mail. It would be helpful.
_________________________________________________________________



"Problem is, so many people seem to want a conspiracy so bad they will do anything to entertain it"
_________________________________________________________________

While there are some conspiracy theorists out there, Val isn't one of them and neither am I. She has questions that need to be answered. Her questions are valid. So are mine. Asking questions instead of just believing whatever we're told by a government employee isn't being a conspiracy theorist. It's seeking clarification on issues that have not been addressed. VALID ISSUES. We're not sheep who are going to be herded in any direction someone wants to point us in. We're not half baked nut cases who hear voices in our heads and figure that the government is behind it. We have questions. No one is answering them. They need to be answered. it isn't conspiracy theory. I'll drop the subject after the questions are answered to my satisfaction. Until those questions are answered I will continue to ask them.

Originally posted by Valhall
Oh well isn't that just ripe!

To all the f***ing freaks out there that can't contain yourselves. Thanks a lot. Thanks a great deal.

I can't believe some one would threaten this guy...PERIOD...But what for, because he came here and started talking to us?

IDIOTS.

Well, you know what? i hope that whoever sent these threats are found and that Ed presents charges against these people.
That should stop anyone else from trying anything similar.

Were the threats being sent from ATS u2us or emails?

Originally posted by Muaddib


Well, you know what? i hope that whoever sent these threats are found and that Ed presents charges against these people.
That should stop anyone else from trying anything similar.

I'm in full agreement. I hope the moronic idiot(s) is tracked down and busted. This is disgusting and tremendously saddening.

I don't suggest at all we drop the subject, I just think a little respect doesn't go amiss and people don't have to be so cynical all the time.

I don't mean it in the case of this topic as it is very, very far from dead, but so often I see people vainly flogging a dead horse it makes me almost feel phyisically ill.
It doesn't matter how much you explain to them that the horse is dead they just glare at you and just keep... whipping away like they think the thing is going to rise up.
Problem is maggots are coming out and it's starting to smell and everyone is getting nauseous.

I know it doesn't apply to this topic but it gets to me and I fear similar things happening here because we won't have the answers. And to see a perfect oppurtunity to actually get some answers just thrown away is very, very sad.
And it will more than likely affect any further participation in the future by anyone of any official standing that is tempted to participate

People often ask "Why won't they tell us the truth about.. (let's say) ...aliens?"

Well you've just seen your answer..

[edit on 12-9-2005 by AgentSmith]

If in fact a member of this board did make those threatening calls to Ed, that is indeed a crime and they should be prosecuted. At least we now know why Ed hasn't responded. I hope that he does engage in e-mail dialog with the original poster of that e-mail response, so that we can get our questions answered. It is indeed sad and sickening when individuals do stupid things like this.

Originally posted by Mirlin11
stupid things like this.

Let's see....we have....

IDIOTIC, CRIMINALLY MORONIC, STUPID PEOPLE???

Nope, still an understatement.....

Originally posted by Mirlin11
"I wanted to open a dialogue with the good folks on the web site, however after receiving a number of calls with "death threats" and "what a jerk profanity remarks" I abandoned the idea."

I made an appeal to keep things civil and approach the questioning of this government official in a professional manner, because I could see where it was going, and there's no way we would get any information out of him with confrontational, acerbic responses, regardless of how his initial tone was perceived. Subsequently I was lambasted by a few who told me that "he's tough, he can take it", and actually abused by one member for daring to "tell him what to do". Now I see the hostility went even further than I originally thought it would. I sincerely hope those weren't ATSers that called him and made those abusive/threatening phone calls, but the possibility can not be ruled out.

This here is opportunity lost and, as SkepticOverlord remarked, a lesson for the future to us all.

[edit on 2005-9-12 by wecomeinpeace]

As has been demonstrasted over the past few days, this thread has grown well beyond the confines of ATS and is currently linked to from a rather sizeable portion of the [interested] Internet.

I posted verbatim my inquiry and Mr. Kostiuk's response and there is really no way to determine if any of the supposed calls came from members of ATS.

Impossible, definitely not, Improbable, don't know?!

?Maybe that should be addressed in a reply? dunno tho

His response, though I'm not sure I actually expected one, seems true to the [neutral]] feeling I was trying to convey in my inquiry. However, he did not respond as to the questions posed . . . hopefully he will to a follow-up reply?!

IMO Valhall has not in any way jumped to any conclusions!
She has the great gift of empathy! If you were in the situation these people are, lost family members, no homes, no food, no money, no job, their whole life lost! Just think about that for one minute, what would YOU do? How would you feel about boarding a plane not knowing where it was taking you? How would you feel about being dropped off at a camp where you couldn't choose what you wanted to eat or when you wanted to eat? Couldn't choose the toys for your children! Not to mention being seperated into male or female cabins! I know, I for one would want to be with my husband and son. I also would accept and appreciate having visiters and making new friends, how else could I possibly start a new life?
All I ask is to put yourself in their place. What would you do? How would you feel?

Originally posted by wecomeinpeace
This here is opportunity lost and, as SkepticOverlord remarked, a lesson for the future to us all.

Including a lesson for people that post their name and phone number on the internet in angry response to one of the most widely linked and e-mailed articles currently making rounds around the world.

His rebuttal (phone number and all) is all over now too though we have removed the contact info here. There's no reason to assume a villain among us specifically as opposed to lurkers or anyone else in the world with an in-box.

For future reference (to anyone), just don't do it. The administration of most sites (and certainly this one) will happily confirm an official's identity in private and keep that information confidential with an authoritative introduction to the public at large as to credentials. I'm just putting this out there for the benefit of future guests and also in defense of our members that by and large meant no harm and did none.

It's just smart internet 101.

[edit on 12-9-2005 by RANT]

There we were, apparently taking on an air of respectability, what with our own news service and Valhall's article pulling in the masses. We had an opportunity and then the underbelly of the internet reared it's ugly head. With all this wonderful technology and access to all this information it still surprises me how dumb we can be. We now have links bringing people from all over to our little corner of the web and look at the impression they are getting of us. Post here for Death Threats and Harrasment. How embarrassing........

If Ed responded to a polite email, would he not also respond favorably to doing an interview for ATS, be it PODcast or otherwise? Even better somebody go in and open the windows and blow the cobwebs out of the Guest Speaker forum. A person of Ed's experience with a controlled forum could provide the motherlode of information on a range of different events.

With that sort of weight behind the information being presented, maybe we could get back some of that previously hard-earned respectability.