The Absolute Power of Christianity!

Originally posted by shaunybaby
the thing is, obviously my friend came out with this 'jiberish' (as that is usually what the speaking in tongues language usually sounds like to the listener), and people must have heard her, and she must have willingly spoke this 'jiberish'. the same as she willingly pretended her body was possessed and she couldn't move, or use her legs etc. at what point do you start to say 'hey this person might be a little crazy'.

I did visit two churches where there was all kinds of activity like this. In the opening prayer of one, the minister broke down into what I can only describe as 'baby talk' with phrases like "boojie boojie boo" etc. Now, I'm not a linguistics expert but I'd like to point out a few things. Usually sentences have quite a lot of variation and punctuation among other things that tell your brain, "hey, they're communicating in another language here". The second thing I'd like to point out, is while I was praying with him, my prayer was broken. I looked up to see what was happening and apparently only one of us was talking to God at that point. Thirdly, nobody understood this man, so to what benefit is it? It was followed by a lot of interpretive dance by practiced ballet folk. I don't understand the reason for this show and my sense was this was chaotically unfocused and not right. From what I know of God, He's one of benefit, purpose and understanding. I saw none of that there that day. It could be that God talks to different people different ways, but this was clearly not where I should've been.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
the thing about these possessions and speaking in tongues...it just screams 'cult' to me.

I can understand why. It weirded me out too.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
not sure if she's a pentacostal, but she doesn't go to a 'regular' church. she goes to some newly brick built baptist church.

I'm surprised. I had a baptist church home for about a year and didn't see any of that.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
not sure why she felt the need to brag, but it sort of made her feel smug that she was possessed and that everyone saw etc. i think there's some psychological aspects at work here for sure.

I'll agree if she was smug. In Matthew, the proud don't inherit anything, rather the humble do.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
the thing is she remembers what happened, which makes me more suspicious. normally when you have a real out of body experience you don't always have a perfect memory of what happened. to me it sounds like she made it up because she described in detail what happened. OBE's are sort of like sleep paralysis, and temporal lobe epilepsy because of the fact that you don't actually 'know' what's going on, hence should have no recolection of the event.

This is interesting. It gives me confirmation that I haven't had OBE's and temporal lobe epilepsy. As far as your friend, I don't know. I haven't had her experience. According to the Book though, I'm heaven bound so I guess I don't need to either.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
maybe i'll just stumble across one day, as you did. so far i've done no 'stumbling' across anything. to be honest my friend who tells me about the tongues and possession puts me of christianity a lot, basically because it makes it seem less plausable.

I can understand that. I don't recall a desire to being possessed. I can say I've been filled with the Spirit, but that's not the same. I had control and consciousness. It was a washing over of relief, happiness, and freedom from all the things weighing me down. Hard to describe really. No tongues, paralysis or unusual bodily functions.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
this is a very good question. the short answer would be no. the reason for this is that a christian could say that he/she believes that god created evolution and put it in motion, whether it be cosmic, or micro-evolution, i see no harm in saying god started it. however, parts of evolution suggest that we once shared a common ancestor with apes, but christians still need to believe that god created humans. another flaw is that evolution needs millions and billions of years for it's process to be recognised,

My beef with evolution is actually separate from Christianity. I know that's hard to believe and everyone tags bias on me for being Christian. S'okay, I'm used to it, though I disagree. The schism started because evolution was not taught in my public high school, so when I got to college, it seemed to be the piece of the puzzle that doesn't fit. Square peg, round hole. Just my perspective, and there are more than plenty of Christians who believe evolution is a fact.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
and again the bible if interpreted literally states the world is only 6000 years old.

I don't even know how anyone can literally interpret the Bible to say that. I've heard the argument for it but seems quite a stretch to me. I also don't know many Christians who agree.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
i do think if you're a christian and really believe in evolution, then perhaps it's time to re-think your beliefs within christianity, and whether those are 100% accurate. evolution theory sliced and diced might just fit with a christian's beliefs.

I don't see a conflict.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
i saw the paint shop pro idea online, and even after i saw both squares were 120 120 120, i still couldn't believe it, because they still 'looked' different.

Pretty cool, I think. I like a lot of M.C. Esher's work too. A real feather to tickle the brain.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
why was this voice the christian monotheistic god, rather than any other numerous amounts of gods? i'm very curious to know.

I don't know. At the time I didn't care who showed up, but if no-one did, then I had my proof that there was nothing beyond the human realm....or so I thought. Perhaps deep down I was expecting nothing. Back then, it would've given me self-justification for doing whatever I wanted or killing myself off to escape the pointlessness of reality.

[edit on 30-9-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by junglejake
God is Alpha and Omega. He is the same today as He was yesterday and He will be tomorrow. He has promised us these gifts. Why do we reject them,

Uno momento por favor, Senior JJ. I've not rejected any gift I've been given. What I'm saying is I find it strange that a whole church received 1 gift, instead of each of us receiving an individual gift per the Bible quotes you've cited. I believe God to be very personal, giving each what God desires for us, not what we want from God. That's the concept I'm wrestling with.

Also the passage (Acts 2) talks of speaking in a different tongue, not a tongue that no-one understands. Am I correct in saying a different tongue meant another language? Genesis 11 talks about God creating the confusion of languages. Was not the pentacost a reuniting of languages so that all could understand the gospel, no matter their native tongue? It seems to me that the pentacost and modern day speaking in tongues are two different events. For example, speaking in tongues is done in the church building these days, whereas when the apostles went out to speak, each heard their native language. So it was an evangelical event, not a fellowship service.

Originally posted by junglejake
and denounce other Christians who do not?

I have no right to denounce anybody, nor is it what I'm saying. I'm saying I don't understand, never had the experience, and in fact, sometimes seems to be in conflict of what I've read. Brother Jake, neither of us have the right to judge people, I think we both know and respect that.

A note to observers: What Jake and I are talking about is not relevant to salvation. This is one of those details us Christians like to discuss. Right Jake?

May love, faith, and hope be with you always,
God bless.

Originally posted by junglejake
I find it very interesting that a witness's testamony is not sufficient to convince you that something may actually be taking place,

Ah! Maybe I missed reading between the lines. Have you experienced speaking in tongues Jake?

Originally posted by saint4God
I did visit two churches where there was all kinds of activity like this. In the opening prayer of one, the minister broke down into what I can only describe as 'baby talk' with phrases like "boojie boojie boo" etc. Now, I'm not a linguistics expert but I'd like to point out a few things. Usually sentences have quite a lot of variation and punctuation among other things that tell your brain, "hey, they're communicating in another language here". The second thing I'd like to point out, is while I was praying with him, my prayer was broken. I looked up to see what was happening and apparently only one of us was talking to God at that point. Thirdly, nobody understood this man, so to what benefit is it? It was followed by a lot of interpretive dance by practiced ballet folk. I don't understand the reason for this show and my sense was this was chaotically unfocused and not right. From what I know of God, He's one of benefit, purpose and understanding. I saw none of that there that day. It could be that God talks to different people different ways, but this was clearly not where I should've been.

you're a christian and you find this hard to comprehend, and it even makes you feel like you're an outsider...how then are actual outsiders supposed to percieve this.

This is interesting. It gives me confirmation that I haven't had OBE's and temporal lobe epilepsy. As far as your friend, I don't know. I haven't had her experience. According to the Book though, I'm heaven bound so I guess I don't need to either.

usually such events would be brought on by certain aspects of your life, such as stress, a close relative dying and depression can affect the way your body and mind works. if you're experiencing either of those three i can understand that you would want to be closure to god, and what's closure to god than feeling the holy spirit in your body.

My beef with evolution is actually separate from Christianity. I know that's hard to believe and everyone tags bias on me for being Christian. S'okay, I'm used to it, though I disagree. The schism started because evolution was not taught in my public high school, so when I got to college, it seemed to be the piece of the puzzle that doesn't fit. Square peg, round hole. Just my perspective, and there are more than plenty of Christians who believe evolution is a fact.

we didn't really learn much about evolution in school, up until last year i thought it meant we came from the apes that are living today. but now i know it's that we once shared a common ancestor. it's after leaving school and doing my own educating of myself online and through reading that i've found out more about religion and evolution. i think once you leave school and see how much there really is out there, you have some sort of 'want' to learn more about the world you live in.

I don't even know how anyone can literally interpret the Bible to say that. I've heard the argument for it but seems quite a stretch to me. I also don't know many Christians who agree.

the genology from jesus back to adam and eve, i thought in the bible only reaches back 6000 years? there are people who believe this is the case, and there are also people who believe the earth is flat, i am not one of those. should i respect people who have those beliefs that are founded on no evidence whatsoever other than their imaginations? i find it kind of silly to think the earth is flat or only 6000 years old.

I don't see a conflict.

ultimately evolution says we shared a common ancestor with the apes today, and that life came in to existence by chance and luck. i guess a christian could still say that god created the big bang, the spark that generated life, and maybe god made adam & eve and they looked like an ape-like creature, and evolved in to man...i'm really not too sure. i guess there is no huge conflict if you fiddle around, then you can fit it in with god.

I don't know. At the time I didn't care who showed up, but if no-one did, then I had my proof that there was nothing beyond the human realm....or so I thought. Perhaps deep down I was expecting nothing. Back then, it would've given me self-justification for doing whatever I wanted or killing myself off to escape the pointlessness of reality.

is it perhaps that the closest religion to you is christianity as you live in the states? did this not have an affect on why you chose christianity, because it was unlikely that it was allah, the muslim god or buddha that spoke to you?

Originally posted by saint4God
A note to observers: What Jake and I are talking about is not relevant to salvation. This is one of those details us Christians like to discuss. Right Jake?

Hehe talkin's fun! As to reading between the lines based on my comment to spamandham about witness testimony and connecting that to my little essay about speaking in tongues...Unexpected that such a connection would be drawn, but yeah, I have. As I told you in that U2U, though, what I wrote about speaking in tongues was not directed directly at you. This is something I've found many Christians are not open to despite it being spoken of in the Bible. I know the 5 of us are not the only audience here on this thread, we just contribute quite a bit in our give and take in this debate on Christianity. So unless I name someone specifically, I'm usually talking in a general sense addressing several statements from here and/or elsewhere.

Besides, I love going deeper into theological discussions

I do understand what you're saying Saint, though, and you, too, shaunybaby. As Paul says, Tongues is a personal thing, where you speak with God. From what I can gather of Saint's post, the entire service was conducted in tongues. That sounds a lot like the pastor was trying to glorify himself with his holiness, because as you said, shauny, what would anyone who was not a long time member of that church think if they came into there?

I've never seen a service such as that, though I have been to some very powerful services that were held in the Spirit. I've also seen services where the pastor has spoken in tongues, but never to the audience. It was actually very interesting, she was delivering a message on the tabernacle, and as she was going she started to stumble on her words and forget where she was going. She turned around, looked up and uttered some incomprehensible words for a very brief moment. She then turned back to the audience and delivered the message with authority.

Shauny, I'm still convinced the Flat Earth Society is a joke. As to the 6,000 year thing, yes, there are. There are also Christians who do not. The figure is ascertained by the genealogy as described in the Bible. We have a date for Jesus, and we have every ancestor of his through the mists of time documented. Judging by that, it would mean that, at the least, civilization is between 12,000 and 6,000 years old. I have yet to read of an archaeologist who disagrees with that figure.

As to the Christian evolutionary explanation for Adam and Eve, there are two I've read about. One states that the story of Adam and Eve is figurative and is an illustration of man's turning away from God to glorify themselves. It's also been said it's an illustration of man's pride and distrust in God, in that he did not think God made him with everything he needed, and so he went against God to try to become better.

Another theory regarding this is that there really was an Adam and Eve, and God placed them in a paradise on Earth. However, they were not the only man and woman on the planet. God created them in His image, but He is spirit. These two people were the first to possess souls, and the first to be able to commune with God. They were the first humans who were not just animals, but had become something more. So man was no different from an ape until God breathed His spirit into us.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
you're a christian and you find this hard to comprehend, and it even makes you feel like you're an outsider...how then are actual outsiders supposed to percieve this.

Yeah. I guess we're in the same boat on this one.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
usually such events would be brought on by certain aspects of your life, such as stress, a close relative dying and depression can affect the way your body and mind works. if you're experiencing either of those three i can understand that you would want to be closure to god, and what's closure to god than feeling the holy spirit in your body.

Perhaps that may explain one incident, but there are other ways to catch the Spirit from very positive precursors. For example, a lot of times it's talking to someone about God, prayer, reading the Book, singing at church (something that rocks for me, hymns usually put me to sleep), etc. What's really interesting is when it happens without explaination.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
we didn't really learn much about evolution in school, up until last year i thought it meant we came from the apes that are living today. but now i know it's that we once shared a common ancestor. it's after leaving school and doing my own educating of myself online and through reading that i've found out more about religion and evolution. i think once you leave school and see how much there really is out there, you have some sort of 'want' to learn more about the world you live in.

Totally agree, and I still have that desire. That would explain why I'm a CNN/C-Span addict.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
the genology from jesus back to adam and eve, i thought in the bible only reaches back 6000 years?

I think some assumptions have to be made for that lineage vs. age of the Bible theory to work...and I don't like assuming things about the Bible.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
there are people who believe this is the case, and there are also people who believe the earth is flat, i am not one of those. should i respect people who have those beliefs that are founded on no evidence whatsoever other than their imaginations?

I believe we should respect everybody. As far as being personally convinced, I think that's where we need to do some discovering on our own through study and prayer.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
i find it kind of silly to think the earth is flat or only 6000 years old.

I don't think the earth is flat (nor know many Christians who do) and don't know how old the earth is.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
ultimately evolution says we shared a common ancestor with the apes today, and that life came in to existence by chance and luck. i guess a christian could still say that god created the big bang, the spark that generated life, and maybe god made adam & eve and they looked like an ape-like creature, and evolved in to man...i'm really not too sure. i guess there is no huge conflict if you fiddle around, then you can fit it in with god.

I'll be sure to ask when I get there.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
is it perhaps that the closest religion to you is christianity as you live in the states?

Actually Greek mythology was the most near and dear thing to my heart at the time. It had an air of romance and legend to it, whereas I considered Christianity yawning dribble.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
did this not have an affect on why you chose christianity, because it was unlikely that it was allah, the muslim god or buddha that spoke to you?

For a good number of years, if anyone said "allah" to me, I'd go "okay, sure, what's the difference?" After reading the Quran, I found out was the difference was and said "that's not the God I know". Buddha was more clearly defined with the golden statue and ideals not fitting what I encountered. A lot of things occurred that I didn't understand until later. For example, that experience of being filled with the Holy Spirit, I didn't call it that until reading the Book and talking with others about their experiences. When it was a match, then I felt comfortable using the term as a descriptor. It's easier to explain it now I think.

[edit on 30-9-2005 by saint4God]

Just a link this time. To a secular news paper. Read it if you dare, refute it if you can. Most importantly, don't judge until you've read it.

Much healing is done from within. I do not discount the power of GOD's involvment in such. However, I'm not big on people putting others in their prayers, etc.

GOD knows what the problem is to begin with. It is up to the individual's power that was given to one by GOD on whether the mind can convince the body.

Yet God gave man authority over the Earth. He respects that authority He has given us, and let's us invite him to come and intervene. We invite him through prayer. He knows what we will pray before we even do it, but He still wants us to do it.

Originally posted by junglejake
Yet God gave man authority over the Earth. He respects that authority He has given us, and let's us invite him to come and intervene. We invite him through prayer. He knows what we will pray before we even do it, but He still wants us to do it.

o.k...i'm convinced

Originally posted by shaunybaby

Originally posted by junglejake
Yet God gave man authority over the Earth. He respects that authority He has given us, and let's us invite him to come and intervene. We invite him through prayer. He knows what we will pray before we even do it, but He still wants us to do it.

o.k...i'm convinced

Glad to hear it!

Originally posted by shaunybaby

okay...because you say fish have rained from the sky, we just believe you right? what were they salmon, trout, perhaps some species of shark

Skept all you like, here's a LINK which documents strange rain.

Strange Rain

i don't think science is 'out to get religion' because 200 years ago most scientists would have believed in god. the only reason they don't is because 150 years ago a guy named darwin had an idea. an idea that religion didn't like, and still don't like...even though the pope accepts it, and the arch bishop of canterbury. so we have scientists, and the very top people in religion who accept evolution as a process...but it's still an unreasonable theory to believe in?

You obviously like to hear what you want. I said nothing about evolution, and as for it, evolution is a somewhat sound theory with some holes. It is a reasonable theory. There are various other reasonable theories, I was referring to the unreasonable ones. The ones science instantly dismisses.

wrong. science can accept another reason may exist. like i said 200 years ago most/if not all scientists were religious. the thing about science is that it changes and reshapes it's beliefs. science is never shut to new ideas...whereas christianity is very much so shut.

I like how you said "WRONG" about a "WHAT IF", very sharp there.

Science is very much shut to certain new ideas, ideas which threaten to overturn long held beliefs. It is the same for any religion, tradition outweighs progress in many circumstances. Not to say Science as a religion isn't better at moving things forward, I argue that it very much is... but don't dare hold onto illusions that science is "Open" and "Accepting" of new theories. There's a reason why science and skepticism tend to go hand in hand, after all.

So reread what I said, I said science rejects irrational reasons, often without examination.

what exactly are the ''foundations'' of science that are going to make science cease to be true?

Hmm. Well, as a perfectly bad example... it is logically assumed the sun will rise tomorrow, because it rises every other day. Repeatability. Or if it doesn't rise, that there's a rational explanation for it. In science, the sun can't just "FEEL" Like not rising today, it has to be affected not to rise, because a ball of gas doesn't have feelings.

For a better example, what would happen if measurements of all kinds were no longer reliable? I don't mean "DIFFERENT", I mean every time you measured something, the answer came back different than all the other answers.

Or, better yet, what happens if will begins to actively shape reality in more than a subtle way that allows people to change their local phenomena fundamentally?

There are a lot of things science NEEDS to be true in order to operate and functionally move forwards. Otherwise everything science is falls apart.

you might be a scientist but you don't seem to have a clue what science is actually about.

[sarcasm]
I like how you made this ad hominem, it certainly validates your stance and makes me surely look the fool. [/sarcasm]

[edit on 9/30/2005 by TheCrystalSword]

Originally posted by junglejake
I find it very interesting that a witness's testamony is not sufficient to convince you that something may actually be taking place, even if they have the reasoning wrong, yet it is enough to convict a person in a court of law to death.

In court, the accusations fall within the bounds of the ordinary. Yet even in court, you don't usually get a death penalty conviction without physical evidence. How much more compelling should the evidence be before we accept extraordinary claims?

Originally posted by junglejake
Also, the reason I didn't think it could be both is because you have been asserting that it doesn't happen, unless I misread, which I may have. If people do experience it, what is it?

I would say that some people probably do experience it, and in that sense it happens. However, just because someone experiences it doesn't mean it's supernatural. A hypnotic state is a plausible explanation. Having been to charismatic services where these things happen, I know first hand the services (at least the ones I've seen) are practically designed to induce a hypnotic state with repetitive songs and jumping with the minister playing the role of hypnotist telling the members what to do.

Originally posted by junglejake
Why is it that, even those who don't have the gift of interpretation, can pick out words in what they're saying and understand what those words are, but only after having done it for a while? That seems unusual for talking in jibberish.

It seems more like you're creating a new language. Those who have been exposed pick up on it after a while. I've heard this stuff many times, and the same gibberish gets repeated over and over within a given church, being learned by other members and repeated.

Originally posted by junglejake
How do you know this? What scientific data do you have that shows some are faking while others are really experiencing it?

I know that some people fake it, because that's what they've told me. I'm willing to accept the possibility that everyone else is faking it too.

Originally posted by spamandham
I know that some people fake it, because that's what they've told me. I'm willing to accept the possibility that everyone else is faking it too.

Ahh, but that's just a witness's testimony on the extraordinary

In regards to the churches where everyone seems to speak the same language or whatever, I have no explanation. I've never been to one of those services, and never seen it done, but there's a lot I haven't seen or done. That doesn't mean it's not true. It does sound like, from what you and Saint have been saying, that in cases like this it may just be people trying to glorify themselves and look as "Godly" as their neighbor in the pew. Then again, it could be something more, I don't know.

A question arises, though, in regards to someone who goes to a church where speaking in tongues is not mentioned, and if someone brings it up after the service or in a small group, people from the church look at them like they're nuts. Even those who take a less hostile reaction, such as saying something to the effect of, "well, I've heard about that, and I've heard people do that. Anyway, what we're going to talk about today is..." Where does this come from for them? What about the person who is not in a hypnotic state, but sitting there in their car, singing along with the music they're listening to in their mind while their mouth is saying something-or-other, or else as they're praying alone in their room they slip into speaking in tongues then go back to praying in English, or whatever language they speak? Why would these people do such a thing, knowing that it's possible they could be ostracized from their church if it were discovered they do something like that, but they believe God's will is more important than the reaction of the church-goers? What is their motivation, and where do they pick up on this language?

heh, it's a good thing I have Word here...I keep misspelling testimony

Originally posted by TheCrystalSword
... if there IS a god (let us assume momentarily there is), but science can explain away things that in the past would be considered "Miracles" such as fish raining from the sky in Brazil (Which has happened), does this mean science is correct in assuming there isn't a God because there's another reasonable explanation...

Science makes no claims regarding the existence or nonexistence of gods. Science presumes that the universe behaves regularly, and it presumes all observations have natural explanations. Both of these assumptions could prove wrong, but they haven't so far.

Originally posted by TheCrystalSword
What if the Universe functions in ways we understand ONLY because God Wills it?

There are any number of possibilities (in the sense that they can not be disproven) that can not be proven or disproven. Why accept any of them?

Originally posted by junglejake

Ahh, but that's just a witness's testimony on the extraordinary

True, they could be lying. However "I faked it" is a more ordinary explanation than "I experienced the indwelling of the Holy Spirit", and whereas there is motivation to say the latter, there is typically motivation not to admit the first.

So one explanation that is in line with what you believe is acceptable, while an explanation that isn't in line with what you believe is unacceptable. I suppose that's a fine way to reinforce your belief, but is it really intellectually honest?

What about my other question?

Originally posted by saint4God
A lot of things occurred that I didn't understand until later. For example, that experience of being filled with the Holy Spirit, I didn't call it that until reading the Book and talking with others about their experiences. When it was a match, then I felt comfortable using the term as a descriptor.

Ok, can someone please explain something to me. I remember reading about the pouring out of the Holy Spirit in the Bible. I see no reference to it after Biblical times. Actually I don't recall any passage after Penticost that refers to this. How does that translate into our time?

And please, go slow, my religious days are 20+ years ago.

Originally posted by intrepid
Ok, can someone please explain something to me. I remember reading about the pouring out of the Holy Spirit in the Bible. I see no reference to it after Biblical times. Actually I don't recall any passage after Penticost that refers to this. How does that translate into our time?

And please, go slow, my religious days are 20+ years ago.

I think JungleJake's verses are a good references, saying that there will be gifts (all quotes after Acts 4). I believe these gifts can be anything from nudge now and then to make a right decision to overcoming major obstacles. At the time of my change, I knew two things for sure: 1.) God existed, Jesus was Christ, and did the right thing coming to Him and 2.) Something spiritually lifted me up, kicked out the weights that were holding me down. The Holy Spirit wasn't something defined for me before. After more reading and talking to others I was able to pin down, "yeah that was it". It's a very excitingly free feeling.

This is interesting. I opened my Book and noticed this verse right away:

"And you were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession - to the praise of his glory." - Ephesians 1:13 & 14

According to this, all believers receive the Holy Spirit and it stays with us until the redemption (referring to Revelation 21?). So then, I guess sometimes we feel it moreso than other times.

[edit on 30-9-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by spamandham
I know first hand the services (at least the ones I've seen) are practically designed to induce a hypnotic state with repetitive songs and jumping with the minister playing the role of hypnotist telling the members what to do.

Yeah, they're called boring services. I feel ya my friend. My advice is to get a church with a band. You know, bass, guitar, drums, etc.

So not only am I insane, but I'm permantly hypnotized too! Wooohooo!

[edit on 30-9-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by intrepid
Ok, can someone please explain something to me. I remember reading about the pouring out of the Holy Spirit in the Bible. I see no reference to it after Biblical times. Actually I don't recall any passage after Penticost that refers to this. How does that translate into our time?

And please, go slow, my religious days are 20+ years ago.

I don't really follow what it is you're asking...