Originally posted by RANT
I didn't exactly say it was fluff. I actually think this particular tower of babble stands as grand testament to the conspiracy that is neo-christianity.

Constant cries of persecution and pleas to be above examination during it's bid to take over the government, then the world as it spreads the gospel in every context it can aside from spiritual.

Maybe its time to tally up the attacking posts. Start a tally.
There is a difference between being examined and being attacked. The difference between a scalpel and a machete.
If you cannot see any of it then it is because you have chosen not to.

I'd just like the posters to expand on their efforts beyond "people don't convert when I tell them to so it's a conspiracy against me."

I'd like to see the posters quoted on that instead of just receiving the credit for it

I'm sorry you can't locate the threads "targeting" Islam. Have you tried the War on Terror forum?

This is a good thing?


I can provide some more, 'real world' , researchable things if you like. I've been meaning to do a comprehensive thread of that type for a while now.
In it you will see some things that seem simple and normal to you, but are part of the falling away (which is the culmination of satans conspiracy to run the world and have it worship him) that we are now in. I know you will disagree with it, but if you think it might be entertaining, I will be encouraged to complete the work.

And it's a foreign language blog with blue smilies. Granted, blue smilies are evil: and not as Christian friendly as the this little guy: ...but a conspiracy?

All other things aside, I found that hilarious

Originally posted by shaunybaby
just because people are against christianity doesn't mean there's a conspiracy. for centuries christians tried to wipe out other religions because they weren't doing things how 'christians' thought things should be done.

it's just people expressing their oppinions on organized religion over the internet.

And for centuries before that, Christians were fed to the lions in Rome, marched over by Roman legions, and rooted out and expelled from their homes in Israel. Actually, Paul was one of those doing the rooting out, until he literally "saw the light".

doesn't mean there's a conspiracy. rome in the end adopted christianity anyways.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
doesn't mean there's a conspiracy. rome in the end adopted christianity anyways.

Uh? Here's the definition of Conspire: When two or more people follow through on, or lend support to, a plan they know will result in a wrongful act. (Websters)

By that definition, you don't have to be one of those who throws the punches...just one of the many who laugh at the bad jokes, who sends a check to the "freedom" foundations, or especially one of the many who turn away when it comes time to round up the bad guys.

As far as Rome turning Christian, well, that didn't come about until the middle of the fourth Century. Does that discount the 350 years of lions getting fat on Christian meat?

[edit on 5-8-2005 by Toelint]

Originally posted by Toelint
As far as Rome turning Christian, well, that didn't come about until the middle of the fourth Century. Does that discount the 350 years of lions getting fat on Christian meat?

Roasted witch anybody?
What the Romans did to christians pales in comparsion to the crusades [genocide], inquisitions, child abuse [and child stealing], abusing nuns etc etc... the difference is many christians have been abusing others for alot longer that '350' years.. and still are.. it's a bit pathetic for a group to cry persecuted victim when the same people have contributed to another thread futher down bragging about 'the power of christianity'.. how can something so strong be so weak? Thats a bit of a contradiction. It's kind of like the school bully beating up some nerds for fun and claiming it was self defence.

Originally posted by Toelint

Originally posted by shaunybaby
doesn't mean there's a conspiracy. rome in the end adopted christianity anyways.

As far as Rome turning Christian, well, that didn't come about until the middle of the fourth Century. Does that discount the 350 years of lions getting fat on Christian meat?

[edit on 5-8-2005 by Toelint]

Rome never 'turned' christian. Constantine , like any politician, found a way to manipulate things to consolidate power under him.

Riley
Roasted witch anybody?
What the Romans did to christians pales in comparsion to the crusades [genocide], inquisitions, child abuse [and child stealing], abusing nuns etc etc... the difference is many christians have been abusing others for alot longer that '350' years.. and still are.. it's a bit pathetic for a group to cry persecuted victim when the same people have contributed to another thread futher down bragging about 'the power of christianity'.. how can something so strong be so weak? Thats a bit of a contradiction. It's kind of like the school bully beating up some nerds for fun and claiming it was self defence.

If Jesus Christ supported one of those things, then they were christian. If He did not, then you are ignorant.
Rome, or any other organized church who burned witches, acted out of their own desire, not that of Jesus Christ.
Your belief that they are the example to point at as christian..is proof of the conspiracy. The truth requires you to read a handfull of pages in the bible. You know what it will say of Christ and by Christ in there...and you choose to ignore it so you can say christians did all those things.

maybe there's a conspiracy against jews, with hitler etc...

i don't think romans went out to try and kill all christians, the people they killed just happened to make good food for their lions.

it's in no way compariable to the crusades where christians purposely went out to try and dissmantle other faiths.

Originally posted by riley

Originally posted by Toelint
As far as Rome turning Christian, well, that didn't come about until the middle of the fourth Century. Does that discount the 350 years of lions getting fat on Christian meat?

Roasted witch anybody?
What the Romans did to christians pales in comparsion to the crusades [genocide], inquisitions, child abuse [and child stealing], abusing nuns etc etc... the difference is many christians have been abusing others for alot longer that '350' years.. and still are.. it's a bit pathetic for a group to cry persecuted victim when the same people have contributed to another thread futher down bragging about 'the power of christianity'.. how can something so strong be so weak? Thats a bit of a contradiction. It's kind of like the school bully beating up some nerds for fun and claiming it was self defence.

Now, let's compare ALL these deaths to those attributed to purely secular reasons. You know...Murders incured during Robberies, Rapes, Assaults, Arsons, Oh, and let's not forget the WARS waged for purely secular reasons like Territory or Resource aquisition, or at the very least Power over such things while they stay in foreign hands...Riches, and last but not least, Revenge.

You mention the Crusades. Well, how many Christians died during the Crusades?? (Which, by the way, drove VAST numbers of marauding Muslims out of Spain and Western Europe.)

You also mention Child Abuse (child stealing??) and abusive nuns! Oh, and the inquisition. Hasn't it dawned on you that these things occurred not because of Christianity but inspite of it?If you can find ONE quote from Jesus that backs up these acts, please print it!

Oh, and one more thing...REread The Absolute Power Of Christianity thread again...it's a "hit piece" on Christianity! Tell me seriously you didn't notice that!

it's in no way compariable to the crusades where christians purposely went out to try and dissmantle other faiths.

You people need to reread your history on the Crusades. There is NOT ONE EXAMPLE of Christians trying to drive Muslims off of what is recognized as Arab territory. The Crusades were limited to Europe, portions of the coastline in Lebanon, and a small swatch of land between Europe and the area around Jerusalem, and that mostly was for the safe pilgrimage of Christians from the North to the South.

Ya know, it irks the heck out of me when people point at Christians and scream, "REMEMBER THE CRUSADES??" Then don't even mention the Ottoman Empire, which conquered HUGE portions of Eastern AND Western Europe, and Palistine, not to mention Asia and some of Africa. How many Christians did these Muslims kill?


Let's face it...when ever and where ever in the world, there's a systematic "cleansing" (see genocide) of Christians...Nobody...says...ANYTHING!!!



[edit on 7-8-2005 by Toelint]

[edit on 7-8-2005 by Toelint]

yeah christians have had it so tough, look how strong their religion must be to still be going errrrr wrong. what about jews, 6 million alone were killed by hitler (see world war two).

no one faith has had it worse than any other, they've all been targeted. the jews by hitler, christians by romans and for example cathars by christians.

however, if someone really wanted to wipe out christians back in the day, then why not burn the their bible. the reason why someone or a group would murder people of a faith is because they don't agree with it, not because they want to wipe out the religion, hence there would be no conspiracy to try and do that. now if we move on to book burning, that would be a scenario where you could say 'they're trying to wipe it out'... now who loves a book burning session better than the nazis...yep, christians.

Originally posted by Toelint
Oh, and one more thing...REread The Absolute Power Of Christianity thread again...it's a "hit piece" on Christianity! Tell me seriously you didn't notice that!

Have you taken JungleJake to task for his anti-Christian hit piece or are you referring to the responses he got that don't agree in the Absoluteness of Christianity?

Originally posted by Toelint
Now, let's compare ALL these deaths to those attributed to purely secular reasons.

'Secular?' It's as though you are inferring that this is the opposite of religion.. it just means religion isn't relevent.. it's not atheism.

You know...Murders incured during Robberies, Rapes, Assaults, Arsons,

These are social problems.. there is no reason to assume that perpetrators are not christians [or other credes].

Oh, and let's not forget the WARS waged for purely secular reasons like Territory or Resource aquisition, or at the very least Power over such things while they stay in foreign hands...Riches, and last but not least, Revenge.

And religion is usually used to wage these wars over territory.

You mention the Crusades. Well, how many Christians died during the Crusades??

Alot less than pagens.

You also mention Child Abuse (child stealing??) and abusive nuns!

By your over use of '?' I take it you think I'm making it up? Aboriginal children [an entire generation] were stolen from their familes to be raised in orphanages to be taught 'christian values'.. they certainly learnt that. The nuns.. there have been grand coverups recently in the church of priests habitually raping nuns. Apparently it's quite a problem.. at least they've progressed from children to women now though.

Oh, and the inquisition. Hasn't it dawned on you that these things occurred not because of Christianity but inspite of it?If you can find ONE quote from Jesus that backs up these acts, please print it!

The bible says 'thou shal not suffer a witch to live'.. I can't remember the exact quote but it basically says she should be executed.

Oh, and one more thing...REread The Absolute Power Of Christianity thread again...it's a "hit piece" on Christianity! Tell me seriously you didn't notice that!

All I noticed were christians attacking me and others for not being christian and for being a humanist.. and then they had the gall to tell me [from their moral highground] they were trying to 'help' me be a better person despite obvious signs that they themselves weren't as moral as they insisted but judgmental, biggoted and hypocritical.. not very good poster kids for the cause.

You people need to reread your history on the Crusades. There is NOT ONE EXAMPLE of Christians trying to drive Muslims off of what is recognized as Arab territory. The Crusades were limited to Europe, portions of the coastline in Lebanon, and a small swatch of land between Europe and the area around Jerusalem, and that mostly was for the safe pilgrimage of Christians from the North to the South.

Again you conveniently forget about all the pagens that were slaughtered.

Ya know, it irks the heck out of me when people point at Christians and scream, "REMEMBER THE CRUSADES??" Then don't even mention the Ottoman Empire, which conquered HUGE portions of Eastern AND Western Europe, and Palistine, not to mention Asia and some of Africa. How many Christians did these Muslims kill?

Moslems.. we are talking about another religion ALSO based on the OT? Both religions have much in common historically.. saying "But they did it too!!" doesn't make christianity more virtuous.. it just makes the similarities between these religions even more obvious.

Christian vs Moslem.. it's kind of like sibling rivalry.

Let's face it...when ever and where ever in the world, there's a systematic "cleansing" (see genocide) of Christians...Nobody...says...ANYTHING!!!

If you are refferring to the middle east.. everyone has their turn at being blown up or massacered so yes I agree. Next time you hear about christian clensing on the news which involves a church in the west being blown up [as opposed to bars, trains and towers].. please post it and I will say how disgusting it is.

[edit on 7-8-2005 by riley]

Originally posted by riley
These are social problems.. there is no reason to assume that perpetrators are not christians [or other credes].

Hm, how about referring to their manual. After all, Christians follow Christ, do they not? What did Christ do? What did these "Christians" do? See a difference? No? Then I suggest reading the Book again.

Originally posted by Toelint
Oh, and let's not forget the WARS waged for purely secular reasons like Territory or Resource aquisition, or at the very least Power over such things while they stay in foreign hands...Riches, and last but not least, Revenge.

Whoa! Truth.

Originally posted by riley
All I noticed were christians attacking me and others for not being christian and for being a humanist.. and then they had the gall to tell me [from their moral highground] they were trying to 'help' me be a better person despite obvious signs that they themselves weren't as moral as they insisted but judgmental, biggoted and hypocritical.. not very good poster kids for the cause.

I think it would be very helpful if you were to take a step back and see who is 'attacking' who here, blaming Christians for all deaths, wars, rapings, etc. as well as those other nasty traits you've listed here before casting stones.

Originally posted by Toelint
Ya know, it irks the heck out of me when people point at Christians and scream, "REMEMBER THE CRUSADES??" Then don't even mention the Ottoman Empire, which conquered HUGE portions of Eastern AND Western Europe, and Palistine, not to mention Asia and some of Africa. How many Christians did these Muslims kill?

Originally posted by riley
Christian vs Moslem.. it's kind of like sibling rivalry.

Why are you smiling? Toelint is talking about the death of either group , and that's your reaction?

Originally posted by riley
If you are refferring to the middle east.. everyone has their turn at being blown up or massacered so yes I agree. Next time you hear about christian clensing on the news which involves a church in the west being blown up [as opposed to bars, trains and towers].. please post it and I will say how disgusting it is.

"NEW YORK, Feb. 25, 1999 ---- National Council of Churches General Secretary Joan B. Campbell today hailed the arrest of an Indiana man who has admitted to setting some 30 to 50 church fires in Indiana and other states over the past five years."

30 to 50 churches. That's a lot.



[edit on 8-8-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by riley
These are social problems.. there is no reason to assume that perpetrators are not christians [or other credes].

Hm, how about referring to their manual. After all, Christians follow Christ, do they not? What did Christ do? What did these "Christians" do? See a difference? No? Then I suggest reading the Book again.

Many pedo priests read the bible daily.. obviously they found loopholes in it. The bible is NOT a cure all and does not make 'bad' people good.. you may say they are not true christians but some may say the same about you. It's all relative.

Originally posted by riley
All I noticed were christians attacking me and others for not being christian and for being a humanist.. and then they had the gall to tell me [from their moral highground] they were trying to 'help' me be a better person despite obvious signs that they themselves weren't as moral as they insisted but judgmental, biggoted and hypocritical.. not very good poster kids for the cause.

I think it would be very helpful if you were to take a step back and see who is 'attacking' who here, blaming Christians for all deaths, wars, rapings, etc. as well as those other nasty traits you've listed here before casting stones.

Okay. Lets pretend history never happened because it makes christianity look bad. Great idea.
Lets also ignore your one little snide comment of how I 'didn't look hard enough' for god which instigated my being 'politely' flamed by christians from all angles.. [mob mentality- they smelt blood] simply because I can't believe. Hmm.. I think the last resulting comment was that I was led by the devil. Good job SAINT.. a real achievment.

Originally posted by riley
Christian vs Moslem.. it's kind of like sibling rivalry.

Why are you smiling? Toelint is talking about the death of either group , and that's your reaction?

I was being ironic about the evilness OT has created.. I suspect you probably know this but still tried to utilise an opportunity to paint be as a callous sadist that likes death. Flawless.

"NEW YORK, Feb. 25, 1999 ---- National Council of Churches General Secretary Joan B. Campbell today hailed the arrest of an Indiana man who has admitted to setting some 30 to 50 church fires in Indiana and other states over the past five years."

30 to 50 churches. That's a lot.

Why did you not list the fatalities? We were talking genocide. Christian clensing would usually suggest christian deaths in the hundreds. I guess you forgot.

[edit on 8-8-2005 by riley]

jesus also taught 'turn the other cheek'. all-loving, yet has no meaning whatsoever in our human existence. almost everything jesus taught we now do not follow. when jesus turned over the tables in the temple he was fighting against money lenders, which is precisely who the world is run by now. we are the ones in debt.

from certain actions you can't expect there not to be consiquences.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
when jesus turned over the tables in the temple he was fighting against money lenders, which is precisely who the world is run by now. we are the ones in debt.

from certain actions you can't expect there not to be consiquences.

I thought he was fighting against the idea of people selling inside the temple, turning a house of God into an opportunist's money machine for personal wealth. "...'My house will be a house of prayer', but you have made it a 'den of robbers'" Luke 19:46.

Originally posted by RANT

Originally posted by Toelint
Oh, and one more thing...REread The Absolute Power Of Christianity thread again...it's a "hit piece" on Christianity! Tell me seriously you didn't notice that!

Have you taken JungleJake to task for his anti-Christian hit piece or are you referring to the responses he got that don't agree in the Absoluteness of Christianity?

What I should have said, is that JungleJake's thread has been conveniently hijacked and turned into an anti-christian "hit piece". I hope that makes it clearer.

As for "Christianizing" Capital Hill, I'll stick to the ole, "Render unto Ceasar that which is Ceasar's." appraoch, and leave Capital Hill to the politicians. If they happen to be Christian...well...what can I say?




[edit on 9-8-2005 by Toelint]

Originally posted by saint4God
I thought he was fighting against the idea of people selling inside the temple, turning a house of God into an opportunist's money machine for personal wealth. "...'My house will be a house of prayer', but you have made it a 'den of robbers'" Luke 19:46.

many churchers and places of worship were and still are run like that.

i saw a program about heron of alexandria and he invented the first coin despensing machine. people would come in to the temple, put a coin in, and some holy water that was blessed would come out so they could wash their hands...also they had to do this to come in, so anyone who wanted to go in had to pay. to the people coming in this was a miracle with the water coming out, but just another clever design by heron. if the same was used today, people would still go to church. they just collect using a collection plate now to make it look they're giving their money away by their own free will.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
many churchers and places of worship were and still are run like that.

I believe it, though I don't know of any.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
i saw a program about heron of alexandria and he invented the first coin despensing machine. people would come in to the temple, put a coin in, and some holy water that was blessed would come out so they could wash their hands...also they had to do this to come in, so anyone who wanted to go in had to pay. to the people coming in this was a miracle with the water coming out, but just another clever design by heron.

Now that is an interesting tidbit. I'd not heard it before. Blessing aside, it's a good idea to wash your hands before church since you're often shaking someone else's hand.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
if the same was used today, people would still go to church.

Maybe what's inside a church is more important than dropping a coin on the outside. Hmmmm?

Originally posted by shaunybaby
they just collect using a collection plate now to make it look they're giving their money away by their own free will.

How did I know this was coming. Oh wait! I know! Because we've had this discussion before. Unlike the merchants peddling wares, a person may or may not give money to the church. THE CHURCH! Not individuals seeking wealth. If there is anyone getting wealthy off of it, then indeed there's a problem, time to find another church. The giving of money though, is not for the church, but rather the person doing the giving. It is healthy to get into the frame of mind of giving and letting go. You don't have to give to a church. Give to a charity. Give your lunch to that guy on the street. Just plain give. The more opportunities the better.


[edit on 9-8-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by Saint4God

How did I know this was coming. Oh wait! I know! Because we've had this discussion before. Unlike the merchants peddling wares, a person may or may not give money to the church. THE CHURCH! Not individuals seeking wealth. If there is anyone getting wealthy off of it, then indeed there's a problem, time to find another church. The giving of money though, is not for the church, but rather the person doing the giving. It is healthy to get into the frame of mind of giving and letting go. You don't have to give to a church. Give to a charity. Give your lunch to that guy on the street. Just plain give. The more opportunities the better.

Bravo! I couln't have said it better myself!


[edit on 12-8-2005 by Toelint]