I believe I can tell when I've encountered a True Christian. After, oh maybe, five minutes of steady conversation, I get this "glow" inside (no, I'm not kidding). It's like I can feel the spiritual energy radiating from them. I feel lighthearted & compassionate, then, the reassurance fills me that there really are truly good people left in the world. There is an immediate desire to be in fellowship with the person, and I tend to ask them way too many questions about their philosophy (which they never attempt to dodge through ambiguity or confusion). Interestingly enough, this effect is not restricted to only Christian followers; I have had the same experience with Buddhists (1), Judaists (3), and even (brace yourself) a True Druid (1), whose beliefs are not connected to the Neo-Pagan version popular today.

I've no doubt in my mind (or heart for that matter) that these individuals were open channels to the True Creator. Oh, I gave a count for everyone except my True Christian friends.....(5) in my whole 43 years.
You know, the interesting thing is.....They all shared practically the same philosophy, and it was all good.

(edited to correct syntax)

[edit on 31-7-2005 by Lordling]

Blackguard is way off base and wouldnt understand.

Well, isn't that a loving thing to say. I might be, but maybe you are 'way off base', maybe, I am not so omniscient as to know whether your choices and conclusions are right for you or not. Though I would bet they are, I don't know that, and you do not know that I am wrong. I could be right. And I feel very sure that I am right for me. And I would tell Jesus that to his face if I met him. I admire Jesus, though the presumption of some of them that they know what is right for me is something I don't admire at all.
Gandhi once commented, 'I admire Christ, but not Christians.' That is not exactly how I feel, but I can sure relate to why he said it.
I understand lots thank you very much, and am happy to find out when I am wrong. But I am thankful that I don't go around saying others are way off base cuz I happen to differ. maybe we are both right, which I bet.... and of course you think that I am wrong, no worries, I don't.

The thing you were off base about is what a christian is.

Fact: A christian is someone who follows Christ.

You said that christians commited (insert act here).
First learn what a christian is, then start accusing.

Now, compare my statement with your new post, and I was right.

You did not understand. Now you have confirmed it.
Your pride will be your undoing. Lose it while you can

My definition of a Christian is not a common one, and you, like many people who 'know' they are right, and I am wrong, feel it is your duty to tell me that 'fact'.
Well..............you could be wrong.
I could too, the only difference here is that I am willing to accept that your beliefs are right for you, even though they differ from mine.
I call that respecting others as equals.
You seem to be convinced that you have some inability to be wrong.
You don't.
If millions of people agree with you, and none agree with me, you could still be wrong. It could be a case of 'herd' mentality.
Thanks for the advice, but it is of no value to me whatsoever, since it insults my ability to choose my own faith.
Who can tell you what to believe?
I sure won't.
But you are repeatedly proclaiming you are right and I am wrong.
Maybe.
But................maybe not.
There is a chance you are not infallible, you know.

The only "definition of christian" that was in question here was the one you used so that you could blame the crimes of the rcc on Christ and His followers.
When you receive Christ you are a new person. You dont have a desire for the old ways. You do not keep going to the brothel, stealing, etc.
If there is no change of some kind, then there is no Christ.
Even JWs do many works, but I can tell by the doctrine that it is not of Christ.

So back to the crimes of the RCC that you credit to CHRISTians. Those people were not followers of Christ.
I dont need a 'MY' definition because Jesus Chirst, the only begotten Son of the living God, gives it to us in the bible.

I said it before, I will say it again. Until people remove
Me
My interpretation
My view
The way I see it
I feel it should
and let Gods word speak for itself..they will not hear God

The way I see it, we have enough room in theology for us to accept the chance, the possibility, the faint hope, that we are both right. Both views are just as true, just as valid, and just as righteous. Yet we differ. I give God enough ability to have as many aspects and facets that we can all see a different one and all see God. The RCC may not be a Christian Church to you....... but it is to me. It has incorporated all kinds of other religious bits and pieces and added them in, some Pagan, some eastern, etc.
But when you get right down to it, it is THE Christian church, the original one. Protestants are called that precisely because they developed later, from within the Christian RCC, and chose to protest against it. But they came out of it.
The crosses, Jesus paintings, Mary statues, etc. are good solid tangible evidence that they are not Buddhists, Muslims, or Hindus. They are the first recognized church that was based on the texts attributed to Jesus. The fact that crimes happened in their name does not revoke their heritage. The Nazis were protestants, so can I say that protestants aren't Christians? Of course not. And I have attended Jehovah Witness services, and you have to dig pretty deep to find any differences between them and any other Christian church. Whether Mormons, JW, Baptists, Catholics, Anglicans, Orthodox, etc., on to about 4000 variations, the cross, and Jesus' central prominence clearly show what they are, You don't think so, and are sure you are right. Well you may be wrong. Maybe all the worlds faiths are equally righteaus, and God doesn't play favourites. I would be very disappointed to find that an omnipotent, creator of the universe was biased. Native Americqn spirituality is just as Godly as your church, imho.
I could be wrong, God might be only on your side, and the rest of us are screwed, but if so, I am fine with that. Buddha, Mother Teresa, Gandhi, and the Dalai Lama will be with me then. That works for me.

Originally posted by BlackGuardXIII
The way I see it, we have enough room in theology for us to accept the chance, the possibility, the faint hope, that we are both right.

I can agree on this. I am not into the secular definition of religion or theology. I only want to have a relationship with God. I do.

Both views are just as true, just as valid, and just as righteous.

Not according to Jesus Christ. This is where we part ways

I give God enough ability to have as many aspects and facets that we can all see a different one and all see God.

Same here. But God always looks the same no matter what the facet.

The RCC may not be a Christian Church to you....... but it is to me.

Bowing in front of statues to people and praying to those people is frowned upon by God. Adding people to the throne room in heaven is also not a Good thing.
Pennance is useless. Priests cannot pronounce you forgiven. Popes are not infalible.
You can call the RCC a christian doctrine, but you are wrong according to the bible and CHrist.

It has incorporated all kinds of other religious bits and pieces and added them in, some Pagan, some eastern, etc.

You just made my point for me. You should have put this line earlier.

But when you get right down to it, it is THE Christian church, the original one. Protestants are called that precisely because they developed later, from within the Christian RCC, and chose to protest against it. But they came out of it.

You are now speaking catholic dogma. They are not the original church. They are not mentioned in any of the scriptures no matter how hard you wish and twist.
"Come out of her my people"

The crosses, Jesus paintings, Mary statues, etc. are good solid tangible evidence that they are not Buddhists, Muslims, or Hindus.

Exo 20:4 -, Mat 22:37-40

They are the first recognized church that was based on the texts attributed to Jesus.

Read the NT for the books of Corrintians, Colassians, Thessalonians, Glatians, Hebrews, and then start looking for others inside the texts of those books. Then Goto the beginning of Revelation for 7 more.

The fact that crimes happened in their name does not revoke their heritage.

Revelation 2:5 anad 3:16 says different

The Nazis were protestants, so can I say that protestants aren't Christians? Of course not.

The protestants didnt do the holocaust. It was the Nazis. Your logic reversed itself.
Do not expect me to speak up for some protestant organization or religion. Man made lables are impossible .

And I have attended Jehovah Witness services, and you have to dig pretty deep to find any differences between them and any other Christian church. Whether Mormons, JW, Baptists, Catholics, Anglicans, Orthodox, etc., on to about 4000 variations, the cross, and Jesus' central prominence clearly show what they are,

The very heart of the intention of this thread is shown there. Satan steals by deception, not brute force.
If you believe Christ and keep his commandments...and they are not grevious...

You don't think so, and are sure you are right. Well you may be wrong.

If Jesus is wrong, then I dont wanna be right. I have no other hope. I have thrown everything I am and have onto that.

Maybe all the worlds faiths are equally righteaus, and God doesn't play favourites. I would be very disappointed to find that an omnipotent, creator of the universe was biased.

Get ready to be dissapointed if you meet Him for the first time after you die.

Native Americqn spirituality is just as Godly as your church, imho.

Im not into spirituality. Im ONLY into a relationship with the God of the universe.

I could be wrong, God might be only on your side, and the rest of us are screwed, but if so, I am fine with that. Buddha, Mother Teresa, Gandhi, and the Dalai Lama will be with me then. That works for me.

It will work for about 1/1000th of a second. If you rely on people who the world touts as great, then you will miss the one that God holds as the greatest.
Im not telling you to believe me, or that you have to do anything.
Being a christian is the easiest thing in the world, but sometimes its the hardest choice to make because it requires faith.
But once you take that step, you will see more then you could imagine....and the imagining is prolly the most powerful thing we can do with our brain.
Above all else, being a christian requires faith in Christ, which is faith in His written word.

[edit on 4-8-2005 by jake1997]

.
paranoia - putting yourself in the melodramatic starring role of your own personal psychodrama. Grand delusions and vast schemes, with you at the center.

As is standard for many organized religions you put yourself in the role of victim of the evil person, groups or entities somewhere vague out there.

"Us poor suffering Christians, carrying our cross/burden, as we drive our SUVs on the freeway to and from our suburban enclaves."

If you really want to know where animosity towards Christians comes from you might go look in the mirror, and pay more attention to what comes out of your mouth and body language when you meet someone who doesn't believe as you do.
Or you may just be one of the ones who stands quietly beside as some caustic Christian bigot spews and never says anything to check them.

Ain't no conspiracy.
It's just you getting some return of what christian zealot bigots put out.
.

just because people are against christianity doesn't mean there's a conspiracy. for centuries christians tried to wipe out other religions because they weren't doing things how 'christians' thought things should be done.

it's just people expressing their oppinions on organized religion over the internet.

I didn't exactly say it was fluff. I actually think this particular tower of babble stands as grand testament to the conspiracy that is neo-christianity.

Constant cries of persecution and pleas to be above examination during it's bid to take over the government, then the world as it spreads the gospel in every context it can aside from spiritual.

I'd just like the posters to expand on their efforts beyond "people don't convert when I tell them to so it's a conspiracy against me."

I'm sorry you can't locate the threads "targeting" Islam. Have you tried the War on Terror forum?

And when Buddhists or Wiccans start trying to revise history, change the laws to reflect their authoritarian views, wage crusades, blow up abortion clinics, receive tax support for their doomsday cults and anti-science disinformation campaigns or try to hijack the political party running a superpower you let me know, and I'll start a thread exposing those power hungry monks myself.

Originally posted by RANT
I didn't exactly say it was fluff. I actually think this particular tower of babble stands as grand testament to the conspiracy that is neo-christianity.

There's nothing "neo" about Christianity. What Christian claims this title?

Originally posted by RANT
Constant cries of persecution and pleas to be above examination during it's bid to take over the government, then the world as it spreads the gospel in every context it can aside from spiritual.

What do I care about government? Does "my kingdom is not of this earth" sound familiar?

Originally posted by RANT
And when Buddhists or Wiccans start trying to revise history, change the laws to reflect their authoritarian views, wage crusades, blow up abortion clinics, receive tax support for their doomsday cults and anti-science disinformation campaigns or try to hijack the political party running a superpower you let me know, and I'll start a thread exposing those power hungry monks myself.

I'm not even going to go there. Start a new thread about it and I'll jump on. I can summarize to say that they are not without sins of their own and should not be casting stones.

Thanks for your response saint4God, but did you have evidence of a conspiracy against Christianity to flesh out for me or not?

I can wait.

admire Christ, but not Christians.' That is not exactly how I feel, but I can sure relate to why he said it.

It is sorta like the writer up above stated about meeting "true" members of any religion. True Christians do not push, do not involve themselves in politics, do not do a lot of things being done by the so called "Christians" of today. Most true Christians are very spiritual relaxed people who are at inner peace with themselves because of their relationship with the father.

The ones running around now pushing their truly anti GOD agendas are the hypocrites that Jesus warns about. They are everywhere doing the work of Satan, and doing it well.

Originally posted by RANT
I didn't exactly say it was fluff. I actually think this particular tower of babble stands as grand testament to the conspiracy that is neo-christianity.

It's the same "ole' time religion", trust me. Some of the messangers may have gotten the message wrong, but that's only because they don't refer enough to their notes...you know...Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John.

Originally posted by RANT
Constant cries of persecution and pleas to be above examination during it's bid to take over the government, then the world as it spreads the gospel in every context it can aside from spiritual.

The last time I checked, you still had to win an election to run a government. If what you say is true, why did Pat Robertson lose out so badly?

I'd just like the posters to expand on their efforts beyond "people don't convert when I tell them to so it's a conspiracy against me."

*sigh* It's true that a lot of Christians are thinskined. Does that mean there isn't a Conspiracy?

I'm sorry you can't locate the threads "targeting" Islam. Have you tried the War on Terror forum?

LOL!! Yeah, I checked. I'm sure that somewhere in that 187 pages, There's something that actually puts down Islam.

Whoa! Found one...maybe two...right here between Soldiers roast Iraqi babies over barbique pit and U.S. Soldiers force Iraqi Mothers To Eat Their Own Young. (Okay, I'm kidding there!)

And when Buddhists or Wiccans start trying to revise history, change the laws to reflect their authoritarian views, wage crusades, blow up abortion clinics, receive tax support for their doomsday cults and anti-science disinformation campaigns or try to hijack the political party running a superpower you let me know, and I'll start a thread exposing those power hungry monks myself.

RANT, by definition, a religious belief is SUPPOSED to be authoritarian. You're SUPPOSED to base your life around it. Buddists and Wiccans don't do this?

Uh...Wiccans and Buddist arn't anti-science? Neither do they have their own versions of History?

LOL RANT, you forget I live in California...we have Wiccan and Buddist College courses out here...hmm...I don't see Studies in Christianity listed in the Los Rios College catalog.

BTW, there are 57 OFFICIALLY Islamic countries in the world, and abortion is illegal in ALL of them. Now, what do you suppose the penalty for abortion is in THOSE countries?




[edit on 5-8-2005 by Toelint]

Bowing in front of statues to people and praying to those people is frowned upon by God.

Is this not what is done with the cross? Jesus frowned upon it as does the father yet those who claim a belief in Christ do exactly what he asked not to do.