Bigelow, UFOs, MUFON and ‘DeLonge’ Road to AATIP

a reply to: mirageman

Human minds evolved with certain weaknesses.. half of human history has been about
how people exploit those weaknesses.

Kev

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: 1ofthe9

Thanks for the link. This gets curiouser and curiouser.

To give John Greenwald credit here. His FOIA request to the Department of the Navy on March 14th, 2018, which asked for the following: Photos, videos and report related to the “Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program” plus reporting procedures, manuals etc.

The response has resulted in yet another blank:

In the course of processing your FOIA request this office has contacted the most likely offices to hold such records of , Naval Air Systems Command (NAVAIR) , Commander , Naval Air Forces Pacific (AIRPAC) and Chief of Naval Operations O ffice of Information Warfare (OPNAV N2/N6) to conduct a search for applicable records . Subsequently these Commands have searched their databases for records relating to " ... the Advanced Aviation Threat Identification Program ... " and have advised DN S-36 that they have found no records responsive to your request

Source and full text : www.theblackvault.com...

Great Zeus!

I listened to a show last night that discussed FOIAs and they claimed (I have no experience with submitting FOIAs) that anything classified will often lead to replies like "they have found no records responsive to your request"... which if true, doesn't make the above reply helpful in the slightest.

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

I have to say, that these people in dark corners of power, if they really believe in Greek Gods seem to be nut cases to me.

Personally I prefer Roman Gods.

Note who is holding onto a musical instrument in the picture. I believe the correct term is a lyre. But make no mistake they are really after your lute.

Hey mm your being a little too disrespectful. You know one day these guys may be the George Washington and Thomas Jefferson of UFOlogy or in your case Winston Churchill and let’s see, maybe
( my English history is a little rusty) umm…maybe Winston Churchill and Francis Bacon of Ufology.

a reply to: Harpua

John Greenwald has over two decades experience at raising FOIA requests. He owns and runs the website blackvault.com

A more complete history of his requests to this specific case can be viewed at : www.theblackvault.com...#

There are also comments from John himself on this matter:

Occam's Razor: I have filed more than 8,000 FOIA requests in the past 20 years. I have been able to discover through the use of FOIA nearly 2,000,000 pieces of paper ON TOP OF the videos and photos etc (many of which were formerly classified TOP SECRET). What's more likely? That now nearly every government agency that Mr. Elizondo mentioned is all in a concerted effort to lie and cover-up AATIP and destroy ALL the evidence (even though the DOD has spoken openly about the program's existence)?

Or, is it more likely that AATIP (which I have never doubted to exist) is being embellished and over-stated all because the guy who has come out to speak about it, is tied to a corporation aiming to take in your donations to the tune of $50,000,000?

Sorry -- but to me -- that's motive for embellishment, and until some of these issues are addressed, I am sticking with the latter above.

Source : www.reddit.com...

a reply to: mirageman

I believe the Navy.

But on the other hand, if the records are stored in some old shoe box,
they won't find them.

Such storage methods are the "cats meow" in this age of presumed digital
copies.

In seeking to better understand the esoteric philosophies in the TTS realm and Levenda in more depth, I've been doing a bit of research. There is much of interest especially where communicating with entities and relating them to Aliens/UFOS/UAP is concerned.

I'll save some of that for another day (or another thread) but in the meantime I ran across this article that might be of interest to some.

Into this bubbling swamp of spiritual fecundity stepped Peter Levenda, aka "Simon." Charming, soft-spoken and aloof, well-versed in all aspects of occult theory and practice, he eased his way to the center of the scene. The Necronomicon was a team effort. Herman provided the sponsorship, while the design and layout were the work of Jim Wasserman of the OTO, a raving cokehead from Jersey named Larry Barnes whose daddy had the production facilities and a fellow who called himself Khem Set Rising (who also designed the sigils)...

"Simon" was also Levenda’s creation. He cultivated an elusive, secretive persona, giving him a fantastic and blatantly implausible line of bull# to cover the book’s origins. He had no telephone. He always wore business suits, in stark contrast to the flamboyant Renaissance fair, proto-goth costuming that dominated the scene. He never got high in public.

In short, he knew the signifiers and emblems of authority, and played them to the hilt. He hinted broadly of dealings with intelligence agencies and secret societies operating at global levels of social influence. He began teaching classes in the back room, and showed a genuine knack for clarifying and elucidating such baroque encrypted arcana as John Dee’s Enochian magick system in such a way as to make it understandable even to a novice...

...Simon decided to start a group of his own, one that would span the different traditions and merge the gentle current of the wicca with the rigorous scholarship of the Golden Dawn/OTO trend under the umbrella of the Necronomicon. Heavily inspired by the Illuminatus books and Timothy Leary’s exopsychology theory of the eight-circuit brain, he launched Stargroup-1 at these parties.

...Not all of us took Simon’s hints of dabblings in intelligence work all that seriously, but apparently the Feds did. An agent infiltrated the OTO with the apparent intent of getting close to Simon, who was doing a great deal of consulting for the local lodge and seemed to be flirting with affiliation. As the noose tightened, Simon became more and more critical of the OTO, finally denouncing it as "fascist" and vanishing, some said to Singapore. Other reports placed him in Hong Kong or Shanghai. The truth is, no one knew.

The Doom that Came to Chelsea

GUT, the penultimate example of that would be Allen Greenfield's stuff.

originally posted by: 1ofthe9
GUT, the penultimate example of that would be Allen Greenfield's stuff.

Allen Greenfield's stuff is interesting and I've posted his books often here.


I would call his stuff noir UFOlogy. He sort of makes the ridiculous somewhat sublime.


As for Levenda, one can’t praise him enough for Sinister Forces.

Though, actually, I wasn’t aware he was really into UFOlogy so much since his occult books don’t really cover that.

a reply to: Willtell

UFOlogy = Occult + Deception.

The very first mentions of aliens, alien masters, other worlds and "UFOs"
are in old occult books.

It was a big concept called "the plurality of worlds"

www.jasoncolavito.com...

Most modern UFOlogists don't even realize that they've been infected
with a meme from a Russian con woman from the 1800's + the deceptions
of the US intelligence agencies.

Kev

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Good point about the "plurality of worlds" aspect. It fits with some other things I'm revisiting and re-thinking as regards the nature of the philosophies that the TTS gang are suggesting. The old is new again.

"Con woman" also reminds me of Hansen's observation about liminal personalities in The Trickster & The Paranormal---the lines often seem to blur.

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear
a reply to: Willtell

UFOlogy = Occult + Deception.

The very first mentions of aliens, alien masters, other worlds and "UFOs"
are in old occult books.

It was a big concept called "the plurality of worlds"

www.jasoncolavito.com...

Most modern UFOlogists don't even realize that they've been infected
with a meme from a Russian con woman from the 1800's + the deceptions
of the US intelligence agencies.

Kev

Are you referring to Blavatsky?

Oh, my goodness. A theosophical/Alien/UFO conspiracy theory!
You'll have quite a time proving that.

Some also blame her for the Nazis

How about old Crowley?

Let me straighten some of this out.

You need to throw Alice Bailey in there...

The branched sprouting from different trees often meets and produces a strange stew of beliefs.

Some of the early theosophical adherents spread out into Ufology true. Check out Greenfields work—more Crowley than theosophical.

Blavatsky wasn’t really into Enochian magick but more towards the Vedanta mysticism.

And there were merges of Indian Hindu popular mysticism somewhat with early UFO buffs but more towards the mixture of the Enochian magick and a little Ufology

Btw, that’s what Levenda is a maven in not theosophy

Regarding the "Greek Gods" aspect to this discussion, I'm wondering if it might in part be a sly "hat tip" to the collegiate system of fraternities and sororities that are found at most Universities. The connections made amongst members of fraternities seem to be valuable for establishing power and status in the financial realms. I agree with KPB that its an odd selection, seeing as how there are many known civilizations and magickal systems that predate the Greeks. I'm also thinking it might be an example of pandering to a bigger and more affluent audience. There are probably more people interested in reading about Greek Gods than Sumerian stuff, or Mycenaean, etc. The Greek Gods angle seems designed to target the mainstream American consumer class, there was even a Star Trek Original Series episode where the crew encounters Greek Gods on an alien planet.

a reply to: Willtell

It's not a conspiracy theory... most things ARE NOT.

I said MEME and I meant MEME.

Many things we discuss to this day are DERIVATIVE of Blavatasky..
still after all this time.

So nothing to prove...

Kev

originally posted by: Willtell

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear
a reply to: Willtell

UFOlogy = Occult + Deception.

The very first mentions of aliens, alien masters, other worlds and "UFOs"
are in old occult books.

It was a big concept called "the plurality of worlds"

www.jasoncolavito.com...

Most modern UFOlogists don't even realize that they've been infected
with a meme from a Russian con woman from the 1800's + the deceptions
of the US intelligence agencies.

Kev

Are you referring to Blavatsky?

Oh, my goodness. A theosophical/Alien/UFO conspiracy theory!
You'll have quite a time proving that.

Some also blame her for the Nazis

How about old Crowley?

Check out Men Behind the Flying Saucer Review. Theosophy and the far right pop up in UFOlogy more then people would think.

The Greek thing is strange I agree. Are any of our charecters Greek per chance?

a reply to: Willtell

True... there is a tangled web.

I could mention a few more big names.. and all of them were occultists.

Kev

a reply to: Willtell

I studied Alice Bailey stuff when I was 12.
She was derivative of Blavatsky, that's why I didn't mention Alice Bailey.

Kev

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

I know Bailey was a Theosophist but I was trying to connect the idea of UFOlogy with theosophy. It’s really not a direct connection other than Blavatsky’s cosmology theories.


Some of the early alien believers did mix a light theosophy with their UFOlogy, but I wouldn’t myself blame Blavatsky for that. True, she did postulate racial superiority theories but Judaism, Christianity, and Hinduism started that long before she did.

visupview.blogspot.com...

Here’s a great link you may be aware of on the connections of early Ufology, light occultism, and right-wing politics.

GUT turned me on to this site.

Beginning with the fifth installment I began to consider the possibility that groups affiliated with the US military and intelligence services possibly had an interest in Pelley's metaphysical system. The Collins Elite, an alleged far right group long tied to military intelligence, and their interest in early UFO contactees such as George Adamski and George Hunt Williamson (both of whom likely had ties to Pelley) were considered at length.

visupview.blogspot.com...

You got a lineage and connections that go back to Puharich.

The Nine, Gene Roddenberry, a bunch of theosophical related channelers

This connection between aliens, occultism, and light spiritualism is pretty old.

Levenda knows about all of this but I doubt he draws much from it.

Levenda is an occultist expert, not a UFO expert to my knowledge.

a reply to: Willtell

Indeed.

Kev