So now flirting or asking a girl out is sexual harassment

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
Ok, suffice it to say I was responding to what I believed you had meant. I didn't know I was incorrect in my interpretation and didn't think I needed to ask for clarification. BTW, I am the one who posted that Debbie Schlussel said her claims did not amount to sexual harassment in any legal sense.

Got it?

There is no reason to continue, now, so drop it!!!!

(Three exclamation points should end this.)

Are your last two lines asking me to stop from speaking with you in particular from this moment on? Or do you just want me to stop talking about the point I was making in that reply? (I honestly cannot tell.)

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: UKTruth

Agreed.
Just coerced sex through seniority of status in the organisation is the problem.
Male or female bosses, too often people look at it as a solely male crime.
I've seen and experienced equal issues with female line managers.
We just don't admit women can be as exploitative as men.

I find the entire gender argument to be somewhat insane. Men do not all think or act the same way, and neither do women.
Some women get offended by the slightest (and most innocent) of remarks. So do some men.
I agree that any abuse of power for sexual (or any other reason) is wrong and should be punished, however, any such claims of abuse of power should require proof before any action is taken. No one should just be believed, in a legal or punitive sense, when it comes to such matters.

There is some discretion when it comes to co-workers in whether either have any power over the other. With that said, testing the waters only ONCE on a negative reply I don't see as sexual harassment. Continued engagement is what the word harassment is all about.

Last time I looked sexuality was still a part of human nature.

a reply to: namelesss

Yeah and women abuse men as well, never mind my previous posts in this thread, when I was 18 the sister of the local drug gang leader told me she'd tell her brother I'd abused her if I didn't shag her.
He would have had me buried in Dartmoor so I shagged the ugly fat botch.
Rape if you switched genders in the story?

a reply to: UKTruth

We agree then, women can be as exploitative as men.
I've challenged the gender issue throughout this thread with my contributions.

a reply to: Dark Ghost

When in doubt, just stop when strongly asked to.

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
When in doubt, just stop when strongly asked to.

We are on an online forum within a public member area (posting wise) where all members and non-members can see everything we are saying. We are not having a private conversation where you are in the position to dictate whether I am permitted to ask for your clarification. So no, I will not just shut up completely because I touched a nerve of yours and therefore be silent. This topic is more important then you or myself. But anyway, you have now just confirmed my earlier suspicions that you do not want to be here to improve anything for anybody else except your own sense of victim-hood.

All the best in your future endeavours!

originally posted by: grainofsand
We agree then, women can be as exploitative as men.
I've challenged the gender issue throughout this thread with my contributions.

It really doesn't even need to be challenged. Bring these points up to any non-feminist (ANY other female or male) and they will at least question their own biases immediately. They will at least admit some of their beliefs are biased and misguided. The problem is with one group specifically — and no, this group is not identifiable by gender alone.

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: UKTruth

We agree then, women can be as exploitative as men.
I've challenged the gender issue throughout this thread with my contributions.

Well, of course they can!

I never doubted that. In the last few decades women have taken on positions of power and authority in numbers that have started to rival men.

And let's all be honest, when it comes to QUID PRO QUO sexual harassment, it really has nothing to do with gender...it's TOTALLY a power issue.

Not unlike most of the other oppression in this world. It's the people in power and with authority that oppress. It's not ordinary republican voters living paycheck to paycheck and casting a vote for a sh*t candidate, once in four years, because they are convinced there are only two sh*t candidates to choose from.

It's not black Democratic voters who voted for Obama because they were inspired to vote for the first time in their lives.

It's the SH*THOLES with the power, authority and resources at their fingertips that make them think they can abuse their positions to get their way with other human beings.

a reply to: 727Sky

Need a bodycam to work around women.

Documentation of everything, similar to a dashcam when dealing with cops.

a reply to: Dark Ghost

And you have confirmed that strongly-worded and followed up demands to stop are a jack-sh*t, over-simplified, and ineffective solution.

A solution you once suggested would be 99% effective against unwanted behavior.

a reply to: Dark Ghost

I think it is always worth sharing stories in a gender sense for clarity.
Assange is charged with having sex without a condom when the agreement was sex with a condom.
I insisted I wouldn't have sex with a girl a few years back unless she was on the pill, she admitted she lied that night, she wasn't on the pill, rape under swedish law.
The contract was a lie.

originally posted by: ItCameFromOuterSpace
a reply to: namelesss

Trump's crotch-grabber comment was commentary on what some women will allow a wealthy man to do.

History is filled with powerful men intimidating women into all sorts of things despised.
One doesn't argue with a 'gun/money/power'!
Trumps crotch grabbing is a commentary on Trump, a corrupt, immature, insane, spoiled child disguised as a 'man'!
My guess is that you'd 'act like a woman' yourself, with a gun at your head, or at your Loved one's head!

Being offended by the comment speaks volumes.

Any sane person would not be 'offended' personally by his corrupt despicable spoiled behavior, but would certainly denounce it!
Your implication seems rather impotent.

a reply to: MotherMayEye

Another lie and misrepresentation of my original AND my subsequent argument.

You aren't doing yourself any favours. You are destroying your credibility. I highly recommend you stop replying to me (or take further part in this thread yourself for that matter) from this moment onward. Remember, that is a suggestion, not an implied threat.

(I can take some comfort in knowing I have made it a lot easier for everyone else to point out which members can be reasoned with and which members cannot be reasoned with.)

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: Dark Ghost

I think it is always worth sharing stories in a gender sense for clarity.
Assange is charged with having sex without a condom when the agreement was sex with a condom.
I insisted I wouldn't have sex with a girl a few years back unless she was on the pill, she admitted she lied that night, she wasn't on the pill, rape under swedish law.
The contract was a lie.

You can't take anyone's word on that...or anything you ask when it comes to stipulations given just before sex.

If a man says he has a condom on, he doesn't if I didn't see him put one on or see one on.

Don't ask a woman if she took her pill. Ask her to take one in front of you if you want to know she did. And even then, you are opening yourself up to STDs.

I'll be honest, if I was about to have sex with a guy and asked him if he had any STDs, I wouldn't trust his answer if he said, "no." I would insist he put on a condom...and even offer to do it for him.

a reply to: MotherMayEye

Are you defending the girl who lied to me when we agreed the conditions that sex with me was only permissable if she was on the pill?
Under Swedish law that is rape same as Assange is facing.

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: MotherMayEye

Are you defending the girl who lied to me when we agreed the conditions that sex with me was only permissable if she was on the pill?
Under Swedish law that is rape same as Assange is facing.

No. Lying is wrong...especially when it comes to sex.

I am just giving you advice based on the fact that a lot of people lie.

a reply to: namelesss

No it's not. It's more a comment on women throwing themselves at successful, powerful and celebrity men.

a reply to: MotherMayEye

Yes people lie, and under Swedish law Hannah would be a rapist as she broke the contract of our agreed sexual terms.
Do you blame female rape victims for trusting their male attackers as well?

Fascinating how it's only an issue of significance when men lie to get sex from women, but not so important or even relevant when women lie to get sex from men.

Wow, this conversation has really derailed from the opening post where we are now talking about "the issue is that EVERYONE lies" is being used as a defence of female perpetrated sexual harassment on male victims.

Remember everyone: the critical piece of information to take away from this whole discussion is that everyone lies, so don't focus on female-perpetrated sexual harassment toward males!