Thousands of snow geese die-in air! Another BS excuse laid out.

originally posted by: TWILITE22
your correct there's much more to this!! viruses bacterial infections don't work this way it takes time for these things to spread and they spread one by one not all at once not to mention if they were that sick they wouldn't be flying. absolutely ridiculous so tired of the bs that's being fed to the public they just say whatever will shut us up... this has to be the dumbest nation on earth and in recorded history.
I may believe it when I see people dropping in droves. whomever is reaching for an explanation and it's not a very good one

And you base this on what? Is this just a thought you have or are there legitimate resources you can point to that show that these diseases don't work this way?

Here is the field manual that discusses avian cholera and how/what birds it affects and plenty of other information:

Source

Death can be so rapid that birds may literally fall out of the
sky or die while feeding, with no signs of illness.

Now, that is a manual based on research and study of avian diseases by actual scientists with degrees. Do you have any form of evidence to dispute this, or just baseless claims and speculation as seems to be the theme of this thread?

I am highly doubting anyone will actually read that link on here though, as it seems folks would rather guess and wonder than do any actual research on the subject.

As far as people dropping in droves....guess you have never heard of bubonic plague? Maybe research that a little too....it dropped 10's of thousands of humans a day...or maybe it was invisible horse carts running over them?

a reply to: TWILITE22

Actually bacterial infections work exactly like this. The birds drink from a contaminated source and they all get sick at once. Not one by one.

a reply to: TWILITE22

I may believe it when I see people dropping in droves.

I think the current counter for Ebola is at +- 10000 deaths. However, I wouldn't advice you to travel to West Africa to actually see them 'dropping in droves'.

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: Rezlooper

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: Rezlooper

And mass animal die offs are not what is being discussed....this is avian die offs as in the OP.

No, what we are discussing is how the OP said to not believe this BS for an excuse. You say it's not BS and I say it is.

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: Rezlooper

I can't account for other animal deaths, but birds can fly through a methane pocket with no problem. Can you point to a story where a mass avian death was researched and methane was the definitive cause? Why would that be something to hide? Methane gas has been attributed to whole villages dying near where the gas came from a volcanic lake/crater in the past.

I personally believe that it's plumes of hydrogen sulfide that are taking out these flocks of birds. This gas is erupting from these water sources just as methane and like the OP states, this happened near bodies of water. And no, methane is never given as a cause of these dieoffs. The reason we know of those past die offs in Cameroon is because it was new, and extremely rare back then, but escaping methane is no longer a rare event. It's happening through melting hydrates, fractured earth crust, sediments in lakes, permafrost thaw, fugitive methane through fracking just to name a few. It's not supposed to be happening like this and it threatens our existence...that is why they can't be forthcoming. Slowly, methane is gaining ground in the climate debate, but not fast enough, and the real dangers we face can't be acknowledged...not now, while they attempt to control it. I believe they did find a way back in the 90's to slow it down, investigated after those lakes in Cameroon killed all those people, but something set off methane release again in 2007, and "they" don't know what or why.

How could it be hydrogen sulfide?

See, if all the naysayers on here can point to the one article and say all the birds were in one location as evidence (which the article clearly does not say), then I can go with the same mindset and say that the article said they dropped out of the air mid-flight and say that your hydrogen sulfide theory on this is incorrect as it is heavier than air and stays close to the ground and would have been nowhere near the birds in the air, therefore it could not have killed them.

See how that works when you only use the stated article to argue from without checking on previous deaths and how they occur and the likelihood that Avian Cholera is the cause is very high?

Hydrogen sulfide plumes can and will blow up into the air, sometimes pretty high, then because it is heavier than air, will slowly drift back to the surface.

a reply to: Vasa Croe and AutumnWitch

Hi Vasa, Autumn,

While looking whether NWHC, APHIS or OIE had already confirmed the avian cholera outbreak, I stumbled upon the following: apparently there is also a highly patogenic avian influenza outbreak going on.

This form may cause disease that affects multiple internal organs and has a mortality rate that can reach 90-100% often within 48 hours. (1)

* Detection of Novel Highly Pathogenic A vian Influenza Viruses in Wild Birds; January 26, 2015
* Update on Avian Influenza Findings
* (1) Key Facts About Avian Influenza (Bird Flu) and Highly Pathogenic Avian Influenza A (H5N1) Virus

Authorities will take this one a tad more seriously, as it will affect poultry exports. Maybe hence the delay in the diagnostic results.

originally posted by: Agnost
a reply to: Vasa Croe and AutumnWitch

Hi Vasa, Autumn,

While looking whether NWHC, APHIS or OIE had already confirmed the avian cholera outbreak, I stumbled upon the following: apparently there is also a highly patogenic avian influenza outbreak going on.

This form may cause disease that affects multiple internal organs and has a mortality rate that can reach 90-100% often within 48 hours. (1)

* Detection of Novel Highly Pathogenic A vian Influenza Viruses in Wild Birds; January 26, 2015
* Update on Avian Influenza Findings
* (1) Key Facts About Avian Influenza (Bird Flu) and Highly Pathogenic Avian Influenza A (H5N1) Virus

Authorities will take this one a tad more seriously, as it will affect poultry exports. Maybe hence the delay in the diagnostic results.

But but but.....it can't be! This is a cover story I am SURE of it! /sarcasm

Thanks for the update! Seems logic and science have proven correct once again!

originally posted by: AutumnWitch657
As soon as you show that a snow goose is a small bird.

Really? It's easier for you to buy a story about a methane cloud than some bird disease? .
You don't think that takes a bit more imagination than disease?


a reply to: Rezlooper

Many of these die offs are due to disease. I only doubt that excuse when it comes to these sudden die offs, which there are many world wide. Originally, the quoted story said one of the experts said, "It was like they all just fell from the sky." So, that tells me it was sudden and not a disease which would have a slower progression. Even if they all contracted the disease at the same time, the onset of the virus is going to be different for each bird, not sudden death for each and every bird. But, of course, I see that statement is being left out of the press release and they are saying the birds "stopped" by the lakes, then died. So, if that were true, then yes, I'd believe it was disease, but, why has the story changed?

originally posted by: Rezlooper

originally posted by: AutumnWitch657
As soon as you show that a snow goose is a small bird.

Really? It's easier for you to buy a story about a methane cloud than some bird disease? .
You don't think that takes a bit more imagination than disease?


a reply to: Rezlooper

Many of these die offs are due to disease. I only doubt that excuse when it comes to these sudden die offs, which there are many world wide. Originally, the quoted story said one of the experts said, "It was like they all just fell from the sky." So, that tells me it was sudden and not a disease which would have a slower progression. Even if they all contracted the disease at the same time, the onset of the virus is going to be different for each bird, not sudden death for each and every bird. But, of course, I see that statement is being left out of the press release and they are saying the birds "stopped" by the lakes, then died. So, if that were true, then yes, I'd believe it was disease, but, why has the story changed?

The story hasn't changed. That quote is still there in the OP link that was stated by a spokesperson from the Idaho Department of Fish and Game. He is far from an expert of any kind though and even stated right after:

He said biologists were awaiting results from a state wildlife lab to confirm the birds died of the highly contagious disease, which is caused by bacteria that can survive in soil and water for up to four months.

So he would have no clue about anything scientifically or any type of expert analysis of the situation. He just stated what he thought it looked like, and I would probably think/say the same thing if I saw a couple thousand birds in a day scattered over a few lakes and land....they would probably appear to the average person as having dropped out of the sky, and likely some did.

originally posted by: Rezlooper

originally posted by: AutumnWitch657
As soon as you show that a snow goose is a small bird.

Really? It's easier for you to buy a story about a methane cloud than some bird disease? .
You don't think that takes a bit more imagination than disease?


a reply to: Rezlooper

Many of these die offs are due to disease. I only doubt that excuse when it comes to these sudden die offs, which there are many world wide. Originally, the quoted story said one of the experts said, "It was like they all just fell from the sky." So, that tells me it was sudden and not a disease which would have a slower progression. Even if they all contracted the disease at the same time, the onset of the virus is going to be different for each bird, not sudden death for each and every bird. But, of course, I see that statement is being left out of the press release and they are saying the birds "stopped" by the lakes, then died. So, if that were true, then yes, I'd believe it was disease, but, why has the story changed?

Are you a veterinarian? You know how long this disease should take and you're offering this as your expert opinion? So how long does avian cholera take to bring down a bird? What are the symptoms and why if you're such an expert don't you know that cholera is a bacterial infection not a virus? What was the original story if you believe the story "changed"? Did you even read the story or are you just throwing you two cents of conspiracy theory into the mix because the government sucks and lies like the proverbial rug and you just refuse to entertain the thought that in this case the story is true?

a reply to: AutumnWitch657


Why so hostile ? i did not think any more needed to be said to display my disbelief ?

Well i apologise i did not give you more information it was just , well what it was

I will be mindful when submitting anything that may upset you ok

a reply to: AutumnWitch657

Oh and can i just say i struggle to type because of serious injuries and being 50 does not help , my avatar being part of it.

So even though i would love to type long responses i tend to keep it short as i have seriously damaged my hands and arms, typing this is hurting not trying to make you feel bad, but you where hostile without knowing a persons position.

Dont make me bore you with my list of damaged bones etc lol i would surly bore you

Peace

I call What you did a drive by shooting. You didn't add anything to the discussion. reply to: Quadlink

a reply to: Quadlink

Checking you posts in other threads I saw at least on that was a wall of text. I'm not unsympathetic but people lie on here all the time. I'm not saying your lying just that I'm going to take what you said with a grain of salt. Why join an online forum which depends entirely on text if you have so much trouble typing? BTW I'm older than you by seven years. Fifty is not old.

a reply to: AutumnWitch657

I see, you are dismissing any higher consciousness on their part. 'They are just birds, they don't know nothing…'

And yet you agree…

A small lake that was there one year might be dried up the next. A river that was teaming with fish may be low due to lack of rain or snow or may be flooded and raging so it can't be used.

Considering that, they may well starve on the next leg if they aren't able to replenish their reserves.

How do you expect them to find that same lake, by the way? Every year they go that way ands rest up on stops along the way. Only the most experienced "lead' birds know where they are along the route. They know how long it is to fly there, the same as you know how long it is to grandmas house. Even better than us. Can you navigate thousands of miles and wind up in the same place without instruments?

By the way, all that honking geese do? Thats called language. Its meaningless to you because you don't understand it.

A coworker shot a few of them today. He is bringing me two of them.
I plan on cooking them nice and slow. I will let you folks know how they turn out.

a reply to: intrptr

I'm not dismissing it. It doesn't exist. There is no consciousness in a bird higher or lower. They are totally self unaware. Don't give them qualities they simply do not possess. Do you know what will happen if you took one of these geese and tucked it's head under its wing? It would go immediately to sleep. Any time of day. Theyre just dumb animals.
. They can recognize water when they see it and unless they're flying over the Mojave desert they will usually find a lake or river to get food at and rest for the night. And if they don't well then they die. They don't plan any part of the journey. If they're lucky they eat and complete the trip. If they're unlucky it's a different story. I don't expect them to find the same lakes. I said that because you said they plan out the trip. I was simply pointing out that if they had a plan to stop at Howard Johnson's lake or holiday inn river those spots may not still be available. They don't plan anything. They fly on instinct the same way salmon swim up stream to die in the place they were born. Do you give consciousness to a fish? To steal a line from JAWS regarding the shark. "All they do is swim and eat and make baby sharks" just replace the word shark with geese and fly for swim.

a reply to: intrptr

What I meant was they're not saying oh only ten more miles to the next watering hole. Most of that honking is so they can locate each other in flight.
But here's something you will appreciate. Geese mate for life and some upon becoming widowed will never mate again. They will also stay with an Injured mate even if it means death to them too. They have emotions like our dogs or cats but even fido is not self aware. If you hold them up to a mirror they will never realize that the animal staring back is them. But a human child will by about six months of age realize that the reflection is them. They will look and then touch their own face. Yet my cat will meow to the lady in the mirror any time he's on my dresser and I'm standing there. I just tell him she can't help you. He never looks at himself.

a reply to: AutumnWitch657

There is no consciousness in a bird higher or lower. They are totally self unaware. Don't give them qualities they simply do not possess. Do you know what will happen if you took one of these geese and tucked it's head under its wing? It would go immediately to sleep. Any time of day. They're just dumb animals.

Riiight…

nvm

originally posted by: AutumnWitch657
a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Did you tell these vets that these birds all fell out of the sky at the exact same time? If so you are purposely misleading them to follow some half fast agenda. The story says they were found around lakes(plural) and wildlife management areas (plural again)
Did you ask about avian cholera or just said they all fell out of the sky?

There's a way to ask that will get you information and a way to form a question that sounds so outlandish and impossible that all the vet could do was laugh.

That was the story that that I first heard, and I made reference to this thing which if in error, was not corrected until later in the thread. I was responding to "watch him eat croe" because he said that these birds died all at the same time from a disease. And gladly made fun of anything else said to be the cause even to the point of ridiculing veterinarians and saying they need specialization in migratory water fowl in order to do basic addition and subtraction about the most common things only requiring a moment of deductive reasoning for anyone, and when that didn't get me to believe that they all died at the same, began to ridicule belief in gigantic alien mother ships, even though it was only a prop argument against that which was impossible as far as common diseases and creatures work, that these birds died at the same time. Not that they actually crashed into an alien mother ship.
I responded that this is simply not possible. In fact it is so outlandish, that I also said that it would be far more likely that these birds flew into a gigantic invisible alien mother ship, than die at the same time all from a disease. And this is still true, if in fact they had died all at the same time. It is just that simple,. But people kept arguing that a disease could actually do this without anything but blind trust of policy pushers even though perhaps no one had ever made that claim, but they thought they were supporting the bandwagon, and we see people doing this all the time in a bi-partisan ceremonial fashion.

I'm so glad that the facts are now reflecting that they did all die at the same time, because I never believed it happened by a disease. But they did all die in a long trail of death which does make sense from a historical and a solid medical history, although in other cases where birds die in the air from blunt force trauma is not the usual, and no one has ever mentioned a disease that hammers birds to the ground in big flocks, so it probably isn't a disease. A super microburst? Those can rip the wings off an airframe, but I would always save the "it was an alien mother ship" for the really "weird cases" And even then it might pay to wait for a very large consensus, but even if it does happen, there isn't a whole lot anyone can do about it.

originally posted by: Vasa Croe
Guessing you are talking about this story?

Source

Though it appears that this CAN kill in mid flight in large numbers.

And you drop dead with all of your friends at the same time while you all happen to be out for a night on the town from the flu as well? lol, you can not believe anything kills so fast, that they would not land and walk around a bit. My bet is they flew through a radioactive cloud from Fuka as they fly high and Fukashima is only getting worse.

75 percent of ALL sea lions babies died last year in the Pacific!!!! That is 50,000 BABIES of a Sentinel species. They have found 16,000 this year alone that have washed up on the California coast so far and its only March. Sea Lions show the health of the ocean and its dieing. Never mind the 3,000 square miles of ocean they can not even find a minnow alive.

Sadly one more Biblical Prophecy coming true. If you eat fish your insane as that is where 90 percent of all the U.S. fish for food is caught. In that current. The Salmon in Alaska are now radioactive as they migrate into the ocean currents and they have now carried that to every species in Alaska.