OBE Experience Meeting Aliens

I've had OBEs since first memory and also come from a clairvoyant ancestry. I did not know others in my family had experiences until I was an adult. As a child I never told anyone of mine and my mom never shared her experiences with me. I couldn't tell you why that is.

My 6 year old grandson talks about a past life as a girl, but clams up about it if you ask him anything. Like it's not something he's suppose to talk about. He also remembers his birth. It was a bit unusual and he drew it and wrote about it in a school project "some personal thing about you, you remember". It was kind of shocking when I realised what it was.

I used to "fly" all the time when I was about 5/6. In the "gray place" I met a very tall man in a long white robe. He told me it was too confusing for me, because I was so young, to live in both the physical world and the spirit world. He basically grounded me from "flying", telling me I was needed in the physical world.

So, yep, I know more is going on then just the "here and now".

I have had other experiences, and I can feel more --- but, I've apparently had a block put on me.

I think it's just plain silly to think physical life on earth is the only existing physical life in our universe.

I think there's both energy consciousness in physical and non- physical.

Sticking with the physical, I personnaly believe the Terra Papers are closest to the physical history of earth and humans. I'm not saying it's 100%, but along those lines.

That being said, I believe the myths of the big "War in Heaven" was an actual war over control of earth and it's inhabitants.

I personally believe there is a Federation of Planets and the universe is as political as here on earth.

So, YES! I believe your experience.

a reply to: AgentShillington

I am sure you are smart enough to realize you just made a claim.

However, with all of the scientific study that has been done, and the increasingly large mountain of evidence against it's existence

Since I am not aware of any peer-reviewed literature that argues strongly in favor of either position. I stated,

the evidence is still very much inconclusive about what's happening when people experience OBEs.

Yet for some odd reason you just went on a four paragraph rant that can be summed up, "No! Show me proof of Out of Body Experiences!" Was I somehow not clear enough when I said, "the evidence is still very much inconclusive about what's happening when people experience OBEs?"

Maybe you want proof that people have weird experiences where they think they are out of body and there is instrumentation to prove that something is actually happening?

That is easy enough.

The earliest quantitative metacognition experiments by Kahan and LaBerge, published in "Behavioral and Brain Sciences" in 2000, showed that "lucid dreamers can remember to perform predetermined actions and signal to the laboratory [to] allow them to mark the time of particular dream events accurately, allowing experiments to establish precise correlations between physiology and subjective reports, and enabling the methodical testing of hypotheses."

The paper was titled, "Lucid Dreaming: Evidence that REM sleep can support unimpared cognition function and a methodology for studying the psychophysiology of dreaming"

Thankfully we have made some progress since 2000.

In mid-May of this year a German research team published a paper in Nature Neuroscience titled, "Induction of self awareness in dreams through frontal low current stimulation of gamma activity."

The team basically sent 40 small shocks per second to the test subjects temples. To the team's delight the experiment had the happy side effect of inducing lucid dreams in the volunteers with about a 70% accuracy (granted we are talking about a sample set size of 27 volunteers). Still, though, that is a pretty damn good result! They score extra points in my book because it is trivially easy to make a homebrew version.

Anyhow all of this is to say -- yes there is evidence something is really happening.

It is not all just imagination.

a reply to: Annee

Thank you for sharing.
Oh, I've had many of those experiences you described. Including the block, though I don't remember who put it on me.
I was told by another 'reader' and mentor of mine once about the block on me, who helped lift the block partially.
She said it was better that way -she couldn't lift it completely-. So this is something I didn't know that happened to others as well.

Very interesting.

originally posted by: Rainbowresidue
a reply to: Annee

Thank you for sharing.
Oh, I've had many of those experiences you described. Including the block, though I don't remember who put it on me.
I was told by another 'reader' and mentor of mine once about the block on me, who helped lift the block partially.
She said it was better that way -she couldn't lift it completely-. So this is something I didn't know that happened to others as well.

Very interesting.

I think it's interesting that I was allowed to keep the memory of the tall man in white robe "grounding me".

I am definitely being guided through a plan.

But, I think it's individual. I think some have more free will then others.

There's two kinds of debunkers/skeptics; the scientifically oriented unemotional ones who are honestly trying to learn; you can tell them by the response of 'that's fascinating, tell me more detail'; they're not trying to catch you in a lie or contradiction, only trying to honestly learn more.

Then there's the other kind, the kind with an emotional reaction, cognitive dissonance. They'll try desperately to find fault, ridicule (sometimes subtly, sometimes not) and overrule what can only be a personal experience.

I feel sorry for the second kind; they've never experienced something they can't explain with 'modern science' and their immaturity is showing. The universe is a far bigger place than any of us can imagine, and we only know and understand a tiny percentage of it.

If you want to get a good overview of the teenage mentality of the second kind of debunker, go over to the 'Amazing Randi' JREF forums and read for a while. You'll see they have little to offer except bullying and ridicule. It's a kneejerk reflex, not an intellectual inquiry.

originally posted by: Xtraeme
a reply to: AgentShillington

I am sure you are smart enough to realize you just made a claim.

However, with all of the scientific study that has been done, and the increasingly large mountain of evidence against it's existence

Since I am not aware of any peer-reviewed literature that argues strongly in favor of either position. I stated,

the evidence is still very much inconclusive about what's happening when people experience OBEs.

Yet for some odd reason you just went on a four paragraph rant that can be summed up, "No! Show me proof of Out of Body Experiences!" Was I somehow not clear enough when I said, "the evidence is still very much inconclusive about what's happening when people experience OBEs?"

Maybe you want proof that people have weird experiences where they think they are out of body and there is instrumentation to prove that something is actually happening?

That is easy enough.

The earliest quantitative metacognition experiments by Kahan and LaBerge, published in "Behavioral and Brain Sciences" in 2000, showed that "lucid dreamers can remember to perform predetermined actions and signal to the laboratory [to] allow them to mark the time of particular dream events accurately, allowing experiments to establish precise correlations between physiology and subjective reports, and enabling the methodical testing of hypotheses."

The paper was titled, "Lucid Dreaming: Evidence that REM sleep can support unimpared cognition function and a methodology for studying the psychophysiology of dreaming"

Thankfully we have made some progress since 2000.

In mid-May of this year a German research team published a paper in Nature Neuroscience titled, "Induction of self awareness in dreams through frontal low current stimulation of gamma activity."

The team basically sent 40 small shocks per second to the test subjects temples. To the team's delight the experiment had the happy side effect of inducing lucid dreams in the volunteers with about a 70% accuracy (granted we are talking about a sample set size of 27 volunteers). Still, though, that is a pretty damn good result! They score extra points in my book because it is trivially easy to make a homebrew version.

Anyhow all of this is to say -- yes there is evidence something is really happening.

It is not all just imagination.

Right, and I stand by my assertion that there is a mounting pile of evidence that Astral Projection and OBEs don't exist. Absence of evidence can be evidence of absence, especially when the entire point of Astral Projection and OBE studies is to verify their existence.

My claim is simple.

Astral Projection and OBE doesn't happen.

The methodology for falsifying my claim is simple. Evidence a claim to the contrary.

While the experimentation cited evidence of something, it certainly isn't evidence of Astral Projection or OBE as it is defined by people that experience it. Lucid Dreaming is real. I've experienced it myself and have shown others how to do it as well. I applaud your effort, I really do, but it isn't the standard of evidence to prove the existence of Astral Projection and OBE, and it certainly isn't evidence of using Astral Projection to talk with aliens (that themselves haven't even been proven to exist).

a reply to: AgentShillington

And my claim is simple too.

OBE does happen.

Ps: Just to give you a gentle heads up that this thread is not about proving whether OBE exists or doesn't.

Why not make your own thread on it?

a reply to: AgentShillington

I was kind enough to answer your question directly. Perhaps if I give this a go a third time around I might actually be lucky enough to get a reply from you that actually addresses my question.

You claimed,

However, with all of the scientific study that has been done, and the increasingly large mountain of evidence against it's existence

What tests or experiments do you know of that have been conducted by a university or any sort of accredited research body (the CIA Stargate Project and the TMI research, for instance) that have failed to produce results in verifying out of body experiences (as in people actually exiting their body and walking around planet Earth to identify what they see) and where the results have come back negative? I know of zero such tests. Maybe you do! If you would be so kind to share, I would be interested to read such a study. I don't know of any.

Also, please, lets skip the whole "why would anyone study unicorns" crap. This isn't a case of "unicorns" because we can verifiably show people do experience something physiological. So claiming "evidence of absence" in the absence of any known testing isn't evidence of anything. It is just wild ass speculation and conjecture.

originally posted by: Rainbowresidue
a reply to: AgentShillington

And my claim is simple too.

OBE does happen.

Ps: Just to give you a gentle heads up that this thread is not about proving whether OBE exists or doesn't.

Why not make your own thread on it?

Seriously!

Skeptics who want proof of an experience are like "lead balloons" in these threads.

Do they not understand they have personal experiences of their own? Can they prove they had breakfast without video taping it? Then prove it was actually videotaped by them, without having a certified video crew?

No, they can't.

Nice Op. It is always refreshing to hear about an individuals perspective relating to what we all know inherently. Keep your light shinning brightly my dear.

Here's a site that actually is about parapsychology study: carlossalvarado.wordpress.com...

Gonna take some time to read and follow links. So, I just put the link for now.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: Rainbowresidue
a reply to: AgentShillington

And my claim is simple too.

OBE does happen.

Ps: Just to give you a gentle heads up that this thread is not about proving whether OBE exists or doesn't.

Why not make your own thread on it?

Seriously!

Skeptics who want proof of an experience are like "lead balloons" in these threads.

Do they not understand they have personal experiences of their own? Can they prove they had breakfast without video taping it? Then prove it was actually videotaped by them, without having a certified video crew?

No, they can't.

I can invite you over for breakfast and then teach you how to have breakfast for yourself. We can then, in turn, teach everyone how to have breakfast, and then breakfast is information that can be repeated by anyone that would want to have that personal experience.

originally posted by: AgentShillington

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: Rainbowresidue
a reply to: AgentShillington

And my claim is simple too.

OBE does happen.

Ps: Just to give you a gentle heads up that this thread is not about proving whether OBE exists or doesn't.

Why not make your own thread on it?

Seriously!

Skeptics who want proof of an experience are like "lead balloons" in these threads.

Do they not understand they have personal experiences of their own? Can they prove they had breakfast without video taping it? Then prove it was actually videotaped by them, without having a certified video crew?

No, they can't.

I can invite you over for breakfast and then teach you how to have breakfast for yourself. We can then, in turn, teach everyone how to have breakfast, and then breakfast is information that can be repeated by anyone that would want to have that personal experience.

Not the point. Once you had the experience it's unprovable.

You can tell me about what you did yesterday, what your experience was, but you can't prove it.

The experience came and went. All you have is hearsay.

originally posted by: Annee
Not the point. Once you had the experience it's unprovable.

You can tell me about what you did yesterday, what your experience was, but you can't prove it.

The experience came and went. All you have is hearsay.

You're absolutely right. And that experience that I tell you has no value in a practical sense. It doesn't matter what I did yesterday... until I want to repeat what I did yesterday. Then I need to begin to formulate how I went about my day, reconstructing my actions, testing them to see if I am able to achieve the same events, until, eventually, I am able to completely reconstruct the events of that day and am able to pass those directions on to others.

originally posted by: AgentShillington

originally posted by: Annee
Not the point. Once you had the experience it's unprovable.

You can tell me about what you did yesterday, what your experience was, but you can't prove it.

The experience came and went. All you have is hearsay.

You're absolutely right. And that experience that I tell you has no value in a practical sense. It doesn't matter what I did yesterday... until I want to repeat what I did yesterday.

You can't repeat an experience from yesterday. You can't repeat an experience. In the physical world you can only reconstruct a setting to create a similar experience. But, who cares?

The OP was sharing an experience. That's it.

She did not apply for or request to be a clinical test subject.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: AgentShillington

originally posted by: Annee
Not the point. Once you had the experience it's unprovable.

You can tell me about what you did yesterday, what your experience was, but you can't prove it.

The experience came and went. All you have is hearsay.

You're absolutely right. And that experience that I tell you has no value in a practical sense. It doesn't matter what I did yesterday... until I want to repeat what I did yesterday.

You can't repeat an experience from yesterday. You can't repeat an experience. In the physical world you can only reconstruct a setting to create a similar experience. But, who cares?

The OP was sharing an experience. That's it.

She did not apply for or request to be a clinical test subject.

Your argument is weak, and you are trying to reinterpret what I said. I never claimed to be able to repeat and experience, I claimed to be able to repeat actions based on an experience. The experience itself isn't valuable until it is actionable.

I have spoken to the OP, thank you. No need to speak for her.

Lol shillington, I admire your critical sense, but honestly you are taking this too seriously I don't think anyone here claimed that the OP was physically transported on a UFO, it's all in the domain of the subjective experience and as such, subject to personal interpretation and by definition, unprovable. I think most here get this, even the OP


When someone is telling you his last night's dream, do you feel the need to tell him "you know dreams are a construction of your mind, right?". Well "OOBE" (whatever that means) are just that. A journey in the mind. The body stays where it is. Does that means there is an actual soul moving to some other place?

It doesn't matter, as soon as it takes place in the mind, it's automatically subjective.

originally posted by: JUhrman
Lol shillington, I admire your critical sense, but honestly you are taking this too seriously

I don't think anyone here claimed that the OP was physically transported on a UFO, it's all in the domain of the subjective experience and as such, subject to personal interpretation and by definition, unprovable. I think most here get this, even the OP

When someone is telling you his last night's dream, do you feel the need to tell him "you know dreams are a construction of your mind, right?". Well "OOBE" (whatever that means) are just that. A journey in the mind. The body stays where it is. Does that means there is an actual soul moving to some other place?

It doesn't matter, as soon as it takes place in the mind, it's automatically subjective.

Nor am I claiming OP was physically transported on a UFO. So, I'm glad we got that out of the way.

I agree, the experience is 100% subjective. A believer in OBEs and Astral Projection is going to have an "Astral Projection" or "OBE" whereas a nonbeliever is going to have a Lucid Dream. The objective phenomena is the same, but the subjective experiences are different based on belief.

That's the whole point.

If your experience isn't providing outwardly verifiable information, then it's a story. And that's okay, however, when this thread was started, it was in Aliens and UFOs, and as such, I started to ask verifying questions. I've ceased trying to gain information from the OP as it has moved to Gray Area, where critical analysis isn't welcome.

a reply to: AgentShillington

You see, the problem when we are talking about experiences taking place in the mental universe is that science is far from having explained it all. For the moment it's still trying to map cognitive functions and to describe the electrical and chemical reactions taking place in the brain, without even claiming to have the big picture.

So if you don't mind, I think we can all agree it's not YET a big deal what words people use to describe mental and subjective experiences (if they understand it IS subjective), as long as science hasn't come up with the official guidebook to unravel all the mysteries of the mind

Now if we are talking about nuts and bolts ufos and flesh and bones aliens, I agree it's another subject. But if you read the critical works of skeptics ufologists you would see the extraterrestrial hypothesis is far from being the only one, and there are still a lot of things waiting to be explained.

originally posted by: AgentShillington

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: AgentShillington

originally posted by: Annee
Not the point. Once you had the experience it's unprovable.

You can tell me about what you did yesterday, what your experience was, but you can't prove it.

The experience came and went. All you have is hearsay.

You're absolutely right. And that experience that I tell you has no value in a practical sense. It doesn't matter what I did yesterday... until I want to repeat what I did yesterday.

You can't repeat an experience from yesterday. You can't repeat an experience. In the physical world you can only reconstruct a setting to create a similar experience. But, who cares?

The OP was sharing an experience. That's it.

She did not apply for or request to be a clinical test subject.

Your argument is weak, and you are trying to reinterpret what I said. I never claimed to be able to repeat and experience, I claimed to be able to repeat actions based on an experience. The experience itself isn't valuable until it is actionable.

I have spoken to the OP, thank you. No need to speak for her.

What argument? Those are statements.

And I only speak for myself.

Sharing an experience does not require any kind of validation.