Putin Defies Western Warning, Will Send "Aid Convoy" To East Ukraine

originally posted by: GargIndia
The humane actions of Russia to help people deprived of basic necessities is being scoffed at by the West and the puppet Kiev.

If Kiev is so concerned, why it is not doing what Russia has offered to do.

Who are people living in Donetsk or Lugansk? Are they Russians or Ukrainians? Who is responsible for these people.

Only fools can miss the facts so clearly laid on the table.

They did in the areas they retook from the rebels but as a general rule you dont send supplies into areas you dont control thats just stupid.

originally posted by: Bassago
a reply to: DJW001

I'll not argue the point with you anymore other than to say you suggested the civilians flee through the "humanitarian" corridors allowed by the Ukraine army and militias. I showed you that that was now extremely dangerous and that the Ukraine forces were rocket attacking civilians and murdering them in the streets and their homes. You said something and I responded to your statement.

I get it though, Russia is the total bad guy, separatists are evil and Putin is the devil. That's fine with me. Can I get a set of those rose colored glasses? No, never mind.

I get it your blowing things way out of proportion again. Simple Russia sent troops to see if they could start a revolution worked in Crimea failed miserably in eastern Ukraine. Partly because instead of Russian troops he sent Chechen s bad move they arent nice. Now whats happening in places like slovyansk now that the Russians are gone people are reporting mass graves and well alot of finger pointing. But thats to be expected its going to take months to straighten out the mess the Russian "volunteers" caused. Now heres an interesting article you might want to read and also CNN and Reuters has done several interviews with locals you might want to track them down as well.

www.csmonitor.com...

Having watched some of the misery people in East Ukraine are living through, I am glad Putin's aid is heading their way because they jolly well need it. It will take years for the mess to be cleared up and people able to live in East Ukraine peacefully again. We seem to have a glut of horrible wars breaking out.

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien
International reporters following the convoy say the convoy goes to Rostov and after that towards Lugansk.

That would mean through Separatists hold area and against Kiev wishes.

nos.nl... S%20Teletekst%29

The only reason to do that is to cause trouble.

It looked like Kiev was going to hold them for a week, it might just be a big fat finger to that.

Kiev/US is provoking Russia all the time.

I did not see that can you show me where they said that?

"No humanitarian convoy of Putin will be allowed to go to the Kharkiv region", warned Avakov. "This is official."

www.volkskrant.nl...

I can't read that, but the quote does not say what you claimed. No convoy from PUTIN is allowed .. nor should it be. An international agency should do it. If Putin is doing it himself it's because he is trying to intentionally cause major problems.

I read it somewhere yesterday (don`t no where anymore), but this proves Kiev isn`t allowing it to go through anyways, so Russia seems to have said, "We just got through Separatist hold area now."

As I said why is PUTIN sending stuff and not allowing international aid organizations to do it? Putin clearly is trying to cause trouble.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien
International reporters following the convoy say the convoy goes to Rostov and after that towards Lugansk.

That would mean through Separatists hold area and against Kiev wishes.

nos.nl... S%20Teletekst%29

The only reason to do that is to cause trouble.

It looked like Kiev was going to hold them for a week, it might just be a big fat finger to that.

Kiev/US is provoking Russia all the time.

I did not see that can you show me where they said that?

"No humanitarian convoy of Putin will be allowed to go to the Kharkiv region", warned Avakov. "This is official."

www.volkskrant.nl...

I can't read that, but the quote does not say what you claimed. No convoy from PUTIN is allowed .. nor should it be. An international agency should do it. If Putin is doing it himself it's because he is trying to intentionally cause major problems.

I read it somewhere yesterday (don`t no where anymore), but this proves Kiev isn`t allowing it to go through anyways, so Russia seems to have said, "We just got through Separatist hold area now."

As I said why is PUTIN sending stuff and not allowing international aid organizations to do it? Putin clearly is trying to cause trouble.

It was first agreed with Kiev they would take it and deliver it to the Eastern Ukrainians, but they "changed" their minds.

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien
International reporters following the convoy say the convoy goes to Rostov and after that towards Lugansk.

That would mean through Separatists hold area and against Kiev wishes.

nos.nl... S%20Teletekst%29

The only reason to do that is to cause trouble.

It looked like Kiev was going to hold them for a week, it might just be a big fat finger to that.

Kiev/US is provoking Russia all the time.

I did not see that can you show me where they said that?

"No humanitarian convoy of Putin will be allowed to go to the Kharkiv region", warned Avakov. "This is official."

www.volkskrant.nl...

I can't read that, but the quote does not say what you claimed. No convoy from PUTIN is allowed .. nor should it be. An international agency should do it. If Putin is doing it himself it's because he is trying to intentionally cause major problems.

I read it somewhere yesterday (don`t no where anymore), but this proves Kiev isn`t allowing it to go through anyways, so Russia seems to have said, "We just got through Separatist hold area now."

As I said why is PUTIN sending stuff and not allowing international aid organizations to do it? Putin clearly is trying to cause trouble.

It was first agreed with Kiev they would take it and deliver it to the Eastern Ukrainians, but they "changed" their minds.

As I said, source it. I have no idea if you are right or wrong, but the last thing you claimed turned out to be completely different when your source was shown.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien
International reporters following the convoy say the convoy goes to Rostov and after that towards Lugansk.

That would mean through Separatists hold area and against Kiev wishes.

nos.nl... S%20Teletekst%29

The only reason to do that is to cause trouble.

It looked like Kiev was going to hold them for a week, it might just be a big fat finger to that.

Kiev/US is provoking Russia all the time.

I did not see that can you show me where they said that?

"No humanitarian convoy of Putin will be allowed to go to the Kharkiv region", warned Avakov. "This is official."

www.volkskrant.nl...

I can't read that, but the quote does not say what you claimed. No convoy from PUTIN is allowed .. nor should it be. An international agency should do it. If Putin is doing it himself it's because he is trying to intentionally cause major problems.

I read it somewhere yesterday (don`t no where anymore), but this proves Kiev isn`t allowing it to go through anyways, so Russia seems to have said, "We just got through Separatist hold area now."

As I said why is PUTIN sending stuff and not allowing international aid organizations to do it? Putin clearly is trying to cause trouble.

It was first agreed with Kiev they would take it and deliver it to the Eastern Ukrainians, but they "changed" their minds.

As I said, source it. I have no idea if you are right or wrong, but the last thing you claimed turned out to be completely different when your source was shown.

"No humanitarian convoy of Putin is admitted to the Kharkiv region," warned Avakov.

"Ukraine Tuesday said it would allow the convoy to go ahead under certain conditions. Which was confirmed by Prime Minister Arseniy Jatsenjoek on Wednesday."

www.telegraaf.nl...

a reply to: BornAgainAlien

Your source says they will allow it. They just want to make sure it's aid not weapons, what is wrong with that?

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: BornAgainAlien

Your source says they will allow it. They just want to make sure it's aid not weapons, what is wrong with that?

No, they said they would allow it Tuesday (confirmed even Wednesday), but revoked it Wednesday.

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: BornAgainAlien

Your source says they will allow it. They just want to make sure it's aid not weapons, what is wrong with that?

No, they said they would allow it Tuesday (confirmed even Wednesday), but revoked it Wednesday.

Why can't you post English sources? I am searching for my own.

Here is Putin caught red handed lying about the "aid" shipment.

Russia said its aid shipment has been coordinated with the Red Cross, but the agency said Moscow hadn't provided enough information about what was in it, and that talks were continuing.

Lying and breaking agreements.

Russia appears intent on not abiding by an earlier tentative agreement to deliver the aid to a Ukraine government-controlled crossing in the Kharkiv region, where it could be inspected by the Red Cross. Instead, the trucks would most likely cross into Ukraine in the Luhansk region, where much of the border is rebel-controlled.

Exactly what I said happened is what happened. Ukraine agreed to the AID, as long as an international agency was doing it. Russia agreed and said the Red Cross would. Putin then did not follow through and is sending the convoy WITHOUT the Red Cross being involved, and is intentionally causing trouble.
online.wsj.com...

So, here it is again. Two days ago Ukrainian government passed a law that army, national guard or police can use firearms against people they think are separatists without warning and questions. And today they restarted a campaign for the people to anonymously report people they think could be separatists or people, they think support separatists. So, if you want someone killed, you just make a call and say, that you suspect the person of supporting separatists and he's gone.

In other words: Ukrainian government gave a license to kill everyone who doesn't agree with them without even questioning them. And people still think that there's no genocide going on in Ukraine. In the best case this is just a harsh dictatorship.

Source is pro-Ukrainian media: source

P.S.: Refugees of the right age, who escaped fighting and death will be send back into the zone to fight instead of the Ukrainian army or face jail time. . So, if you come from the pro-Russia territory of the country and don't want to die and run, Ukrainian government will make sure that you die.

This is the government you support. I'm not saying that Russia is a good guy, but comparing with Ukrainian government, Russian government is full of angels.

originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: GargIndia
The humane actions of Russia to help people deprived of basic necessities is being scoffed at by the West and the puppet Kiev.

If Kiev is so concerned, why it is not doing what Russia has offered to do.

Who are people living in Donetsk or Lugansk? Are they Russians or Ukrainians? Who is responsible for these people.

Only fools can miss the facts so clearly laid on the table.

They did in the areas they retook from the rebels but as a general rule you dont send supplies into areas you dont control thats just stupid.

What do you mean by "do not control". What is the definition of "control" here.

Why would you starve your own citizens to death? Remember people do have political choices in a democracy. Difference in political opinion does not mean stoppage of food and medicines to an area.

I can understand stoppage of weapons, but how about stoppage of food items?

I can see the devil in your heart. You need to reflect. Your words are words of Satan.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: BornAgainAlien

Your source says they will allow it. They just want to make sure it's aid not weapons, what is wrong with that?

No, they said they would allow it Tuesday (confirmed even Wednesday), but revoked it Wednesday.

Why can't you post English sources? I am searching for my own.

Here is Putin caught red handed lying about the "aid" shipment.

Russia said its aid shipment has been coordinated with the Red Cross, but the agency said Moscow hadn't provided enough information about what was in it, and that talks were continuing.

Lying and breaking agreements.

Russia appears intent on not abiding by an earlier tentative agreement to deliver the aid to a Ukraine government-controlled crossing in the Kharkiv region, where it could be inspected by the Red Cross. Instead, the trucks would most likely cross into Ukraine in the Luhansk region, where much of the border is rebel-controlled.

Exactly what I said happened is what happened. Ukraine agreed to the AID, as long as an international agency was doing it. Russia agreed and said the Red Cross would. Putin then did not follow through and is sending the convoy WITHOUT the Red Cross being involved, and is intentionally causing trouble.
online.wsj.com...

First you ask for sources for proof, and I gave them to you...

It seems Dutch media is being less biased "now" so they are willing to give that information (they had a lot of complaints after all the MH17-crash crap they spewed out), the Dutch media sources I gave you are legit...but it`s difficult for you to spin them, isn`t it ?

a reply to: BornAgainAlien

I only read English. The sources you provided were not in English. I stated as much. I don't know why it's difficult to comprehend.

Maybe you don't like the fact I posted where Putin is caught in proven lies, and even the Red Cross is unwilling to sign off on the "aid convoy". Must suck for you.

originally posted by: GargIndia

originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: GargIndia
The humane actions of Russia to help people deprived of basic necessities is being scoffed at by the West and the puppet Kiev.

If Kiev is so concerned, why it is not doing what Russia has offered to do.

Who are people living in Donetsk or Lugansk? Are they Russians or Ukrainians? Who is responsible for these people.

Only fools can miss the facts so clearly laid on the table.

They did in the areas they retook from the rebels but as a general rule you dont send supplies into areas you dont control thats just stupid.

What do you mean by "do not control". What is the definition of "control" here.

Why would you starve your own citizens to death? Remember people do have political choices in a democracy. Difference in political opinion does not mean stoppage of food and medicines to an area.

I can understand stoppage of weapons, but how about stoppage of food items?

I can see the devil in your heart. You need to reflect. Your words are words of Satan.

Based on testimony from citizens in areas retaken the rebels are stealing food etc...

So any aid going in, without the proper controls, is likely to end up in Rebel hands, making the conflict drag out longer, and end with more civilian casualties. Aid is good, but you need proper controls. Even then it may backfire.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: BornAgainAlien

I only read English. The sources you provided were not in English. I stated as much. I don't know why it's difficult to comprehend.

It doesn`t matter, you asked for sources and I gave them to you...I know Google translate is bad for Dutch, but that doesn`t mean the information or the sources are bad, they are just as legit as if they were in English!

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

Based on testimony from citizens in areas retaken the rebels are stealing food etc...

Can you provide source for you claim? From what I saw on the internet, the situation is quite different.

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: BornAgainAlien

I only read English. The sources you provided were not in English. I stated as much. I don't know why it's difficult to comprehend.

It doesn`t matter, you asked for sources and I gave them to you...I know Google translate is bad for Dutch, but that doesn`t mean the information or the sources are bad, they are just as legit as if they were in English!

I can't translate so I cant read it. That means I can't verify and see what the source is saying. One line is meaningless, that's why people ask for sources. Either way I found a source, it's English, and I quoted from it. I proved what I thought was going on, was going on. You don't want to touch it because Putin is clearly causing trouble. The Red cross have flat out said that they are willing to be involved, but Putin won't give them basic information they asked for, and Putin is lying when he says they are involved.

I think something is about to happen, just in from RT.

Putin: Russians need to mobilize, but have no confrontation with wider world
rt.com...
Breaking news.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: BornAgainAlien

I only read English. The sources you provided were not in English. I stated as much. I don't know why it's difficult to comprehend.

It doesn`t matter, you asked for sources and I gave them to you...I know Google translate is bad for Dutch, but that doesn`t mean the information or the sources are bad, they are just as legit as if they were in English!

I can't translate so I cant read it. That means I can't verify and see what the source is saying. One line is meaningless, that's why people ask for sources. Either way I found a source, it's English, and I quoted from it. I proved what I thought was going on, was going on. You don't want to touch it because Putin is clearly causing trouble. The Red cross have flat out said that they are willing to be involved, but Putin won't give them basic information they asked for, and Putin is lying when he says they are involved.

Never heard of translate.google.com.../en/ ?

You`re coming with an English source because it suits your needs, the Dutch news sources have different reporting on what`s going on, what do want to know, stuff that suits your anti-Putin view or stuff about really is going on ?

I would say, knock yourself out with reading with what suits needs, but don`t expect that information from me.