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reply to post by amfirst1
"Yea it piss me off when they call them neo nazi and ish. It's anarchists. Anarchists are people who hate their form of government, so they have to tear it down to recreate a better one."
What?? I'm an Anarchist. I don't hate my "form of Government" I hate Government. If it was Anarchists in Ukraine, they would not tear down the Government to recreate a better one, they would tear down the Government and never allow another Government to form.
So until they reject the USA, EU, Russia or a Ukrainian Government I would have to disagree that it's anarchists.
As Vendetta Kingz song goes "War never changes, Government is dangerous" That's all forms of Government, Leadership, Hierarchy.
edit on 18-3-2014 by paddz420 because: (no reason given)
So you're saying you'd rather the world have no government and no rules
That would be kaos and a far more dangerous world
I suggest the next time you're unhappy protest for change it does work
The world is still developing but going forward and progressing never the less, but im recent days it's 1938 all over again
Russians we're aloud to vote in previous elections
Not Russia speaking Ukrainians but Actual Russian Russia's
Becomes more of a joke the more the facts come out
edit on 17-3-2014 by TritonTaranis because: (no reason given)
reply to post by ElectricUniverse
Welcome to Western style Democracy where everyone gets a vote, citizens, military, illegal aliens, dogs, cats, just everyone. The US trend for allowing the dead to vote did not catch on in Crimea.
I couldn't resist, I had to come back and comment on this thread when I read some of the utter nonsense.
You cannot claim to support the rights and freedoms of people while expressing support for an illegal invasion and occupation of another country.
reply to post by ElectricUniverse
I guess I shouldn't be surprised, the USSR got the most positive press when it was at its worst. I do not know why but, it seems that the more overt the totalitarianism, the more public sympathy is bestowed upon it, completely counterintuitive.
I believe that the Ukrainian people want freedom and liberty (in the American sense) and I am baffled by those who don't.edit on 16-3-2014 by greencmp because: (no reason given)
I also want to point out a few things that the people of Crimea and the supporters of this invasion haven't really considered...
1. Crimea relies heavily on tourism, which has now ended. Within days of the invasion businesses were closing across the entire peninsula, with hotels, restaurants and bars all shutting down and fearful about their future. Most of these will not be opening again, because the increasing international tourism they had been experiencing since 2010 has completely dried up. The majority of tourism to the peninsula was from Ukraine, then a smaller % from Latvia, Belarus and Russia. Russia is now promoting Sochi as the single most vital tourist destination in Russia and their tourism would have diverted there without this invasion. All the other countries of the region have expressed support for Ukraine and are working on further distancing themselves from Russia. Ukrainians will no longer be holidaying in Crimea either. Cruise ships had started docking in Crimea, and they have now stopped and will probably not be returning. The young people employed in these businesses will have little option but to move along the coast to Ukraine for work, further reducing the income of Crimea.
2. Crimea needs an estimated $30bil a year in financial support. Putin is not going to be paying that. People who think he has any interest in financially supporting the people of Crimea as their economy collapses are naive at best. He wants his base, the other Ukrainian bases on Crimea, and the staging platform for further incursion. He doesn't give a rats behind about the economic security of the people living there and we all know this to be true. He doesn't give a damn about the many regions of his own country wallowing in poverty, so why would he care about the people of Crimea?
3. The younger generations are seemingly absent from most of the protests and news reports, why is that? In every other revolution movement the youth have been at the forefront, in Egypt, in Libya, in Kiev, they were on the front lines saying what they wanted. Yet in Crimea and other pro-Russian protests they seem to be 90% over the age of 40. The only news report on this issue I have seen where younger people were represented proportionally or more so (outside of the protests in Kiev) was a video from an E Ukrainian city, where they packed a theater to the rafters to debate the future of Ukraine. It was standing capacity only, and 90% of them were in their teens and 20's, all expressing their desire for an independent Ukraine with closer ties to Europe. This tells me that there is a clear age divide in the wishes of the people, and it means that all the younger people in Crimea will likely be fleeing for Ukraine.
4. Crimea will not be recognized and will not have a voice in the international community. As Russia is also now facing increasing exclusion from international affairs this will only impact the economic troubles the people there will be facing. Imports to the peninsula will have to rely on Russia, and imports to Russia will likely be hit too. Before sanctions were even announced business leaders in Russia were warning of an economic crisis they could clearly see developing.
All we need is a little common sense here. All the evidence suggests to me that the Crimean people , if they genuinely did vote to become part of Russia, have made a terrible mistake. Complete independence with ties to Ukraine after a recognized and internationally agree referendum would have better secured the economic stability of the peninsula. Continued ties to Kiev and the rest of Ukraine would have almost guaranteed them a better quality of life. Joining the Russian Federation instead has done nothing but increase the uncertainty and economic instability of the peninsula.
They have nothing to export, they have increasingly relied on tourism for income, their standing in the region has been all but destroyed. They have made a very bad decision here. If there's anyone other than elderly people and soldiers in Crimea in 20 years, expect to see another internal crisis when the people there rise up against their dictatorial pro-Russian puppet leadership. Their "dream" of becoming a part of Russia is going to become a nightmare, and they'll have no one to blame but themselves. [/quote]
Well it is clear that you have an opinion on the matter, it's just too bad that much of it is incorrect.
First of all. The Ukraine has not had a working economy for a long time. Russia on the other hand is doing very well. They are the largest energy producer in the world. People seem to have this picture of Russia being some poor, almost third world nation. They are in fact, one of the fastest growing economies in the world.
As for your notion of people fleeing Crimea for the Ukraine. That doesn't make much sense either. Why would any Crimean leave a secure, stable region, to go live in a country with no job prospects, very little security and be amongst people who are hostile towards you? there is no logic to that what so ever.edit on 18-3-2014 by Darkmask because: (no reason given)edit on 18-3-2014 by Darkmask because: (no reason given)