Question to those who say being gay is a choice?

a reply to: Lucid Lunacy

I think it's both actually. Not genetic exactly but biochemical and environmental. They've done studies showing that during development certain chemicals released which determine sexual characteristics and different parts of the brain get altered by other factors including stress on the mother while carrying the baby. At this point we are neither male or female either but at the stage where these certain chemicals start that configuration happening. (That was a crappy overview of what I've read so take it as opinion rather than fact for now.)

But even then they say that just those chemical changes alone don't do it. But that it does play a role. Other factors from the environment and experience play just as much of a role as do the chemical and nature in building you.

a reply to: Agit8dChop

Yep, no doubt in my mind.
Gay is purely a product of our mental state -

Okay. I was getting the impression before you were presenting it as fact, but now it seems you acknowledge it’s just your opinion.

To be honest, I don't see why gay people are so hellbent on making people accept them and their sexuality.

To be honest I don’t even know how to reply to that. If you haven’t heard the arguments for the inequalities in the world concerning LGBT here on ATS a myriad of times, then I imagine my reply would be ignored or forgotten. Just being honest like you were.

Be who you are, do what you want. No one is stopping you

No stopping? That’s not true. Homosexuality is literally illegal in many places in the World. Link.

but forcing people to accept, be happy and agree with your lifestyle is a struggle with no resolution.

I don’t think internet discussion and equal-rights movements qualifies as force. There is resolution. Things are starting to change in regards to the inequalities of LGBT. I’d say a difference is definitely being made, and it wouldn’t have happened if people didn’t voice dissent.

I’m happy we both agree sexual orientation is not a choice.

I am curious how that’s reconciled with your personal belief that it’s purely a mental phenomena however.

a reply to: Agit8dChop

Why accept them, hummm, why accept them....gee that's a hard one.

2015 people.

originally posted by: Agit8dChop

a reply to: Lucid Lunacy

Yep, no doubt in my mind.
Gay is purely a product of our mental state - there's nothing wrong with it, but its not what nature intended for us.
We think we're so smart and so clever because we're more intelligent than other living things. We make things so complex and complicated in our minds we often forget the simple basics of our designs.

Penis meet Vagina
Vagina meet Penis
Once the two have met, you breed babies
Life continues

Its our brains that make us something else, ie gay!

To be honest, I don't see why gay people are so hellbent on making people accept them and their sexuality. Be who you are, do what you want. No one is stopping you, but forcing people to accept, be happy and agree with your lifestyle is a struggle with no resolution.

How would you explain other mammal and animals that have been known to have sex with the same gender ?

a reply to: mOjOm

Definitely. I also think it's likely more complex than attributing it to nature or nurture, and is likely a collection of co-factors. I have no idea. Certainly read arguments, and seen studies, for either or and for both. Only thing I am personally fully confident of is the lack of choice in the matter. Of course by that I mean the underlying attraction and not the physical act.

Even if it were a choice to be attracted to one's own gender (and it isn't), so what? Why should gay people not be able to have true love and happiness?

a reply to: Lucid Lunacy

It's certainly a complex issue without a simple answer. Hell, I couldn't even tell you "why" I like women but I do and have for as long as I remember. But "why" exactly who knows.

I've tried to figure it out too. Like is it perhaps certain characteristics or even mathematical symmetry or shape or something. But even if that was it, why those characteristics and shapes rather than some others of equal symmetry. There always seems to be more "why's" for every one you answer 2 more are waiting.

There has been lots of evidence showing that immune system differences have a lot to do with choosing a compatible partner though which is something we have no control over consciously. We just think we have good "chemistry" with certain people over others but it's actually because there are evolutionary things going on that we don't realize that are more in control of us than we even know.

a reply to: Lucid Lunacy

All things in human psychology are both nature and nurture. The biggest error of all is the assumption that anything is exclusively one or the other. Nature can be stretched quite a bit more than some people think, but at the same, not as much as others think.

originally posted by: raedar
a reply to: Bone75

Pedophilia exists in the straight world as well. The sexual deviance of pedophilia has nothing to do with being gay.

Just wow.

Like it or not they are both abnormal sexual orientations. One just isn't socially acceptable, thankfully.

originally posted by: LoveSolMoonDeath
a reply to: Agit8dChop

Why accept them, hummm, why accept them....gee that's a hard one.

2015 people.

and that means what? People have to accept something just because people say the year??
Its a free world to be gay, its a free world to not accept that. I don't really care, be gay, don't be gay just be happy.. but accept not everyone agrees with your lifestyle - and they don't have to. When you force people to acknowledge your version of sexuality you just create more barriers.

Some people are still butchered because of their religious beliefs, its wrong, I get that. but that's life its been happening since the start of religion and will happen long after we have left this planet.

a reply to: LoopyLou

For everyone argument saying homosexuality in animals means its natural has an argument that homosexuality in animals is an anomaly and rare, not a common day thing

www.conservapedia.com...

As others say, rape and cannibalism happens in mother nature, should that influence the way we are as humans as well?

a reply to: Agit8dChop

Why are you ignoring my question?

a reply to: Lucid Lunacy

Depends what you mean by mental?

Chemical reactions in the brain stimulating certain feelings i wouldn't class as mental.
But that doesn't mean you were born gay either.

And your right, change is being made, big change. Acceptance of homosexuality in society has taken leaps and bounds, which is great. Gay marriage is slowing coming to fruition, which is excellent. But in a free and open world people are within their rights to be against it, to believe it is a sin and to not want to watch to gay lovers making out on the street. - welcome to society.

now, if you really want a debate, while I am all for gay marriage, I am totally against gay adoption.

a reply to: Deaf Alien

sorry, i didn't really take it seriously.

a person or animal having both male and female sex organs or other sexual characteristics, either abnormally

abnormally doesn't count.

its like being born with 2 heads.

a reply to: Agit8dChop

ROFLMAO!!! You actually used that site as your source? A Far-Right Conservative Christian site?

As others say, rape and cannibalism happens in mother nature, should that influence the way we are as humans as well?

That's a myth.

a reply to: Agit8dChop

Honey you said this:

Being gay is not our natural design, we were born with sexual organs for a reason.

Hermaphrodites are born naturally.

abnormal != unnatural

a reply to: Deaf Alien

cant say, ive never used that site in my life and didnt know it existed until 5 minutes ago.

if you like i can go and find another dozens sites with the same message?

Hermaphrodites are born naturally.

just because your born, doesn't mean your natural.
a hermaphrodite is a genetic mistake/fluke. it is not natural.

there is a difference, honey!

I think comparing homosexuality with paedophilia is pretty outrageous. Paedos are attracted to people who are not sexually mature, nor physically mature. That's why it's an abhorrent abnormality. They seek sex with those who are neither physically nor mentally ready to have sex; and they seek them FOR THAT PURPOSE It is about power and control.

To compare that to an alternative sexuality from the norm is outrageous. The only thing different about homosexuality is the direction the attraction is headed.

As far as the penis and vagina being naturally made for each other, well, yes, of course they are. But, it has also been an awful long time since the human species has been at risk of extinction based on not being able to procreate enough. I'm no scientician, but I think the reason that homosexuality wasn't 'evolved out' of us is because it's not a trait that is harmful to the advancement of the species as we have existed for a many years now. There's little chance we'll run out of men and women making babies together, so these types of genetic differences just stuck around.

a reply to: Agit8dChop

I guess that homosexuality is a genetic mistake? Something that is unnatural?

What if I was to tell you that homosexuality is natural because it helps with the population control?

a reply to: Agit8dChop

How is it not natural when it has been a fluke/mistake that has been repeated many many times in our history? It's not standard; doesn't mean not natural.