Israel set to make Arabs second class citizens

originally posted by: WilsonWilson
a reply to: r0xor

You can only officially be Jewish if your mother was. Converts don't count.
We had a school here in the UK that refused to allow a boy to start there as only his father was Jewish, even though he as a practising Jew, because his mother was not born Jewish, they don't consider him a Jew.

Well what determines if the Mother was considered born a Jew? Is it if a girl is born in a Jewish practicing family, and grows up to be a female practicing Jew, then has a child and becomes a Mother? Or did her Mother have to be considered born Jewish, is she's to be considered that? What determines what her Mother was, and so on?

If it is purely ethnic and genealogical in nature (to be considered born of a Jewish Mother), does the religion practiced even count when determining this? Does the woman have to be born of a Jewish Mother, practice Judaism, and then become a Mother herself to be considered this?

Would a female ethnic Jew who practiced Christianity, Islam, or something else (or nothing) be considered Jewish in this definition? What about her children if they became practicing Jews? What if their Father was a practicing Jew, their Mother was an ethnic Jew yet practiced another religion, yet they practiced Judaism as their Father? lol

Does anyone know how Transgenderism and Adoption factor into these official Israeli government laws? lol

Sorry for the 20 questions (literally), but I find it fascinating that the Israeli government can pass laws like this and make public statements like this. I'm not even one to bash Israel very often.

originally posted by: infolurker
a reply to: daaskapital

Well,

My give a crap meter on "offending" muslims is at an all time low today.

Show me one place in a Muslim country which tolerates other religions as well as Israel tolerates theirs and then I might care once that miracle happens.


Hippocrates will be Hippocrates.

Ok here's a few. Syria, Malaysia, Bangladesh and Indonesia.

originally posted by: Metallicus

originally posted by: infolurker
a reply to: daaskapital

Well,

My give a crap meter on "offending" muslims is at an all time low today.

Show me one place in a Muslim country which tolerates other religions as well as Israel tolerates theirs and then I might care once that miracle happens.


Hippocrates will be Hippocrates.

Infolurker just won the internet today. Why are we limited to only one star?

No he just won the "I don't do any research" award.

a reply to: Tedgoat

You should REALLY check your facts.

Anyone else thinking 'Zionists' are 'bigots' etc, or that Palestinian's and Arab's are all the good guys in this, needs to watch the following FACTS.

Finally...The rest of the World has turned on Israel already so there's not much to lose...If Israel can claim its Jewish Statehood with boundaries before the World sides with the Palestinians in Statehood, Israel may be ahead of the game...War is going to happen either way...

originally posted by: Xterrain
a reply to: Tedgoat

You should REALLY check your facts.

Anyone else thinking 'Zionists' are 'bigots' etc, or that Palestinian's and Arab's are all the good guys in this, needs to watch the following FACTS.

If you actually knew anything about the history of the Middle East then you would know that video is nothing but Israeli propaganda. That guy did nothing but tell one lie after another.

a reply to: yuppa

I'm Racist?

legitimate claim?

What are you talking about? An age old stupid story that they are the chosen people of the Sun?

I'm not murdering Palestinians on a daily basis just because they are not Jewish? I'm not putting signs up in my shops saying "No Arabs Work Here".

The Israelis are the most Racist and Bigoted self righteous inhuman Fascists on this planet!

And Netanyahu has the cheek to threaten countries that recognize Palestine? Who in the hell does he think he is?

Israel is a Rogue Terrorist State! Created on Fear and Murder!

originally posted by: teamcommander



Kind of surprising someone would bring up this question.

Can anyone tell me which Middle Eastener country has a Christian, Jewish and Muslim members in it's Parliment?
It actually has this as a part of it's constitution.

O K Give up?


Do a little reading on the make up of the parliment of Iran.

Shocker! No?

The Iranian Parliament is allowed ONE Jewish member and 3 Christians out of 290 total members... Nothing to brag about there

Article 64
The number of representatives of the Islamic Parliament of Iran shall be two hundred and seventy, and for every decade since the national referendum of 1368 H. Sh. (1987)it may, in consideration of human, political, geographic and other factors, be increased by a maximum of twenty.
The Zoroastrians and Jews will each elect one representative; Assyrian and Chaldean Christians will jointly elect one representative; and Armenian Christians in the north and the south will each elect one representative.

en.parliran.ir...

In the current Israeli Knesset there are 12 Arab members out of 120 total or 10% compared to the slightly over 1% representation of Jews/Christians in Iran. In the previous session there were 16 Arab members, so their representation is not is not a fixed number of seats either like in Iran.

Arab members of Knesset

As to the proposed legislation, I haven't seen any specifics as to how exactly it will make Israeli Arabs second class citizens - does anyone have any they can share? Not being facetious here, I'm honestly curious and don't deny it is possible. What I've read talks about "National rights" all while protecting everyone's civil rights. I take National rights to be the Right of Return and who can become a citizen - which is already established and makes this new legislation redundant which I have also read elsewhere. The only new thing I found is this:

In response, Mr. Netanyahu said he was pushing for new legislation to revoke the rights of residents who “participate in terrorism or incitement against the state of Israel,” including the throwing of stones and firebombs. Mainly referring to Palestinian residents of East Jerusalem, he said those who attack Israel, and their families, should not enjoy welfare benefits.

[url=http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/24/world/middleeast/israeli-cabinet-backs-nationality-bill-that-risks-wider-rift-with-arab-minority.html]LINK[/url ]

Since citizenship is related to national rights, I could see that being in the new legislation. Which I have no problem with whatsoever - If was back in the US and someone was trying to injure/kill me with stones or firebombing my house/car I would be shooting back without hesitation. If someone wants to act like that here in Israel I say they deserve to lose their citizenship, and that is getting off easy...

originally posted by: Tedgoat
a reply to: yuppa

I'm Racist?

legitimate claim?

What are you talking about? An age old stupid story that they are the chosen people of the Sun?

I'm not murdering Palestinians on a daily basis just because they are not Jewish? I'm not putting signs up in my shops saying "No Arabs Work Here".

The Israelis are the most Racist and Bigoted self righteous inhuman Fascists on this planet!

And Netanyahu has the cheek to threaten countries that recognize Palestine? Who in the hell does he think he is?

Israel is a Rogue Terrorist State! Created on Fear and Murder!

I said your statements and Attitude SEEMED RACIST. I did not call you a racist though.
ALTHOUGH it seems you are most likely pro palestinian. Your posting history is almost entirely in these type of threads.

You have to understand the Israeli mindset and their LEaderships mindset. BOTH of these mindsets differ on certain points.

CArefully read the new law they are trying to pass. Or get a lawyer to explain it to you.

ANd yes THEY BOTH HAVE LEGITIMATE CLAIMS ON THE LAND. They BOTH HAD RELATIVES LIVING THERE BEFORE THE RE CREATION OF ISRAEL.

Personally though i think we and that includes you should stay out of this and keep our opinions to ourselves. And really a WESTERN POWER renamed JUDEA to THE AREA OF PALESTINIA way back when by the ROMANS. There has never been a OFFICIALLY RECOGNIZED PALESTINIA by the UN and its predecessor.

@BUSTER. OFFICIALLY it has never existed except in ROMAN maps which were outdated when rome fell but the jewish/hebrews never stopped calling it judea.

a reply to: CommandoJoe

From reading your reply I don't think you are grasping my point.
The simple recognition of the rights of others, as citizens of a country, is a large step ahead of what is being proposed in this bill.

To your other piont, I have heard very little about rock or bottle throwing in Israel, except by Israeli settlers at Palesintians.
From what I read and hear the main places where this happens is in the occupied areas which are not yet recognized as part of Israel.

ON second thought, maybe you are making this statement from the Palestinian point of view.

a reply to: Tedgoat

Before the Mandate, what is now called Israel was part of the Ottoman Empire. No-one thought of themselves as Palestinians, whether they were Arab, Christian or Jew. The Arab violence has its roots in the First and Second World Wars. Nazi Germany exploited anti-Semitism as a weapon against British hegemony in the region.



The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem, Haj Amin al-Husseini discussing mutual interests with an actual Nazi.

a reply to: DJW001

Ah history is very telling.

Zionist Jews funded and controlled Adolf Hitler before, during and after the Jewish Holocaust.

You'd think that some of the Jews in Israel would realize that the Zionists that they rally behind against the Palestinians were actually the Terrorists that controlled Hitler and the Nazi's that killed their parents and grand parents during the Jewish Holocaust.

Thankfully not all Jews are ignorant of the past as we have seen with their protests in Jerusalem. If the rest of the Jewish population were to wake up to what the Zionists really are then the whole Zionist occupation of Palestine would crumble into dust!

I guess being told by idiots that you are chosen by God is enough to keep them in the dark from the truth!

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: Tedgoat

Before the Mandate, what is now called Israel was part of the Ottoman Empire. No-one thought of themselves as Palestinians, whether they were Arab, Christian or Jew. The Arab violence has its roots in the First and Second World Wars. Nazi Germany exploited anti-Semitism as a weapon against British hegemony in the region.

The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem, Haj Amin al-Husseini discussing mutual interests with an actual Nazi.

Arabs were making deals with the Nazis? In addition to Jews? I guess everyone wanted something from the Nazis.

Text Lehi split from the Irgun militant group in 1940 in order to continue fighting the British during World War II. Lehi initially sought an alliance with Fascist Italy and Nazi Germany, offering to fight alongside them against the British in return for the transfer of all Jews from Nazi-occupied Europe to Palestine.

Text The Irgun (Hebrew: אִרְגּוּן; full title: הָאִרְגּוּן הַצְּבָאִי הַלְּאֻמִּי בְאֶרֶץ יִשְׂרָאֵל Ha-Irgun Ha-Tzvai Ha-Leumi be-Eretz Yisrael, lit. "The National Military Organization in the Land of Israel"), was a Zionist paramilitary group that operated in Mandate Palestine between 1931 and 1948. It was an offshoot of the older and larger Jewish paramilitary organizationHaganah (Hebrew: "Defense", הגנה). When the group broke from the Haganah it became known as the Haganah Bet (Hebrew: literally "Defense 'B' " or "Second Defense", הגנה ב), or alternatively as haHaganah haLeumit (ההגנה הלאומית) or Ha'ma'amad (המעמד‎).[1] Irgun members were absorbed into the Israel Defense Forces at the start of the 1948 Arab–Israeli war.

a reply to: MALBOSIA

Your source makes clear that Stern thought that Hitler intended to "purify" Germany of Jews by deporting them. It would be natural for the Lehi to co-operate with Germany to defeat the British occupation and resettle Europe's Jews to the Mandate territories. Obviously, this was naïve.

a reply to: Tedgoat

Zionist Jews funded and controlled Adolf Hitler before, during and after the Jewish Holocaust.

Jews funded Hitler even after the war was over? What did they do, buy him a ranch in Argentina?

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: Tedgoat

Zionist Jews funded and controlled Adolf Hitler before, during and after the Jewish Holocaust.

Jews funded Hitler even after the war was over? What did they do, buy him a ranch in Argentina?

I din't say Jews. I said Zionist Jews. Big Difference.

They got him out of Germany and over to South America. The other Nazi's that later became the CIA and NASA were taken under Project Paperclip.

Do u honestly believe the age old Propaganda that Hitler died in his bunker?

a reply to: Tedgoat

Do u honestly believe the age old Propaganda that Hitler died in his bunker?

That's what the Russian government said, and as we all know, the Russian government never lies.

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: Tedgoat

Do u honestly believe the age old Propaganda that Hitler died in his bunker?

That's what the Russian government said, and as we all know, the Russian government never lies.

Funny. That's what the US Government said as well!

a reply to: DJW001

No-one thought of themselves as Palestinians, whether they were Arab, Christian or Jew.

Just because it was part of the Empire doesn't men they didn't still call themselves Palestinians. When India was part of the British Empire did they still think of themselves as Indians or Brits?

Nazi Germany exploited anti-Semitism as a weapon against British hegemony in the region.

Just as Theodor Herzl exploited antisemitism to get Jews to move to Palestine. That explains why the Zionist worked with Hitler and committed acts of terrorism against Britain the nation that they made agreements with for the land in Palestine.