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perception8
reply to post by Akragon
I'm new here, but thought I would comment quickly on this issue. I have heard the comments regarding the MMR shots causing Autism. And I don't believe in making statements like "where's the proof" or "I must see it proven 100%" etc. Because sometimes things are difficult to prove 100%. But more often than not, there is evidence that provides reason for concern and caution can be taken. Unfortunately, when gov't and/or corporations are involved, they have many times been caught paying/bribing for their own scientific studies to support their corrupt lying side.
But having said that, I'm not sure I have seen enough evidence that shows the MMR shots are the cause of Autism. It seems to me that the most that could be said is that "it is possible it does", but then that could be said about many things. Something I was forced into researching the last 14 months is electromagnetic fields (EMF) and radio-frequency radiation (RFR), which is emitted from cell phones, cell towers, 'Smart Meters', WiFi, cordless phones, etc. Scientific studies and experts from around the world have been screaming about the biological harm this radiation causes us. The only studies stating that this radiation is not harmful are the ones that were paid for by the communications industry. Many scientists have already exposed the corruption and cover-up by that industry and gov't. There is no doubt that the spike in the levels of this radiation that we are exposed to over the last 10 -15 years is responsible for the dramatic spike in depression, anxiety, ADHD and Autism also over the last 10 - 15 years. We know for a fact that our brains and our hearts operate with electrical impulses. We don't know how or why, but we KNOW that they do. If you flood those electrical impulses with radiation that penetrates your body every second of every day, it only needs to throw the brain impulses off just a little to upset your melatonin, serotonin, dopamine, and other brain chemicals out of balance.
Anyhow, back to Autism. Researchers measured the radiation levels of the bedrooms of women where they slept. And those women that had Autistic children consistently had radiation levels 20.7% higher than those women that did not. This radiation interferes with brain development of the fetus. It also interferes with our brains, hearts, and cells even after birth. Did you know that PRESCHOOLERS are the fastest growing market for antidepressant medicines in the US. What the f@#k do 3 and 4 year old kids have to be depressed about? Who would prescribe these strong chemicals to a baby, and what parent would feed them to their baby??? But it IS happening. And gov't's are rapidly increasing our exposure to this radiation. Do the research, its all online.
Get rid of your cordless phones as they are as bad as a cell phone (which have already been proven to cause brain cancer - by studies and now accepted by the Supreme Court of Italy as causing a business man's brain tumour). Do not use a cell phone unless you must, and even then do hot touch the phone to your head (as per your operating manual states). Hardwire for your internet, no more WiFi. And do anything and everything to get those 'Smart Meters' off of your home. They emit high levels of radiation that is pulsed, which is the worst kind. And a California judge forced the manufacturer to admit that the average Smart Meter pulses radiation 14,000 time per day, and every 1 in 1000 meters pulses radiation 190,000 times per DAY.
Check out:
www.bioiniative.org
www.magdahavas.com...
www.justproveit.net...
www.takebackyourpower.net (must watch documentary)
www.stayonthetruth.com...
Sorry for the long response. And although it seems like I went off topic, I just wanted to point out that there is stronger evidence that shows RFR is either THE cause or one of the factors responsible for the dramatic increase in Autism. I believe 10+ years ago it was 1 in 2000 children born had Autism, and now in the US it is 1 in 50. If 1 in 50 kids were born missing a pinky finger, there would be all sorts of media coverage and gov't review boards set up etc. But 1 in 50 kids born with a brain disability and you hear very little. The cover-up and corruption surrounding this issue is unbelievable. If you knew what I know your head would spin.
OneManArmy
Pardon?
First things first, you ARE anti-vax. 100%.
If we are going to resort to name calling...
You ARE an idiot. 100%.
libel
ˈlʌɪb(ə)l/Submit
noun
1.
LAW
a published false statement that is damaging to a person's reputation; a written defamation.
Pardon?
Here are the facts (question is, will you read them...?)
Measles incidence & mortality in the UK. Look at the sharp decline in incidence after the vaccine was introduced (late 1960's).
UK Measles mortality & incidence
Problems caused by non-vaccination for measles.
Europe
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
USA
www.cdc.gov...
Here's a pretty concise summary.
jdc325.wordpress.com...
Vaccines don't cause autism.
www.jpeds.com...
There's very little data for deaths caused by vaccines as there have been very, very few indeed.
The only ones I've seen have been allergic anaphylactic events which are non-vaccine specific ( you can have an allergic anaphylactic event from virtually any drug and quite a substantial amount of food-stuffs too, strawberries, bee-stings, soy, aspirin etc etc etc).
However, here's a study looking at evidence and causality of vaccine adverse events and a nice little chart for you.
Read the summaries.
healthland.time.com...
www.iom.edu...
www.iom.edu...
Here's a good summary of that nice Dr Wakefield.
www.sciencebasedmedicine.org...
A couple of extras...
"Eight characteristics of anti-vaccinationists:
1. Claiming to be “pro-safe vaccine” while being unrelentingly critical about vaccines
2. The “vaccines don’t work” gambit
3. The “vaccines are dangerous” gambit
4. Preferring anecdotes over science and epidemiology
5. Cherry picking and misrepresenting the evidence
6. The copious use of logical fallacies in arguing
7. Conspiracy mongering
8. Trying to silence criticism, rather than responding to it"
Pardon?
www.iom.edu...
The committee finds that evidence convincingly supports a causal relationship between some vaccines and some adverse events—such as MMR, varicella zoster, influenza, hepatitis B, meningococcal, and tetanus-containing vaccines linked to anaphylaxis. Additionally, evidence favors rejection of five vaccine-adverse event relationships, including MMR vaccine and autism and inactivated influenza vaccine and asthma episodes. However, for the majority of cases (135 vaccine-adverse event pairs), the evidence was inadequate to accept or reject a causal relationship.
Overall, the committee concludes that few health problems are caused by or clearly associated with vaccines.
Thank you sir/madame!!
A round of applause from me.
Rubinstein
That's a sample size of 2 i.e. not statistically significant. Also, how do you know the MMR vaccine didn't reduce their IQ or push them towards a disease in the future?
maryhinge
reply to post by angryhulk
AGREED
my eldest now 12 and twins of 10 had the MMR vaccine and they are alright
edit on 22-11-2013 by Rubinstein because: (no reason given)
boncho
reply to post by OneManArmy
Thank you sir/madame!!
A round of applause from me.
You give this one (plonking of links to studies going around anti-vax circles) a round of applause. Did you happen to read any of them? Or if something is anti-vax you automatically agree with it?
boncho
"My kid has autism and they just got a vaccine!" - and that is handed out as 'evidence' all along the way.
How's it feel to see your argument in the mirror?
OneManArmy
Rubinstein
boncho
It doesn't work that way. If you want to prove your hypothesis right, prove it right. You don't make scientific discovery by claiming someone's work is shoddy, it's just not scientific. You know, the whole "method" part of it all.
If there is any truth to your anti-vax rhetoric, why not simply provide evidence? You realize the anti-vax crowd has been lying to you right? You realize they did studies awhile ago that had terrible conflicts of interest right? You realize they haven't been able to put out any legitimate studies and resort to bending the truth, telling half truths and flat out lies right?
You realize that nearly every anti-vax poster in this thread doesn't post sources right? Neither do the big ones. (you know, the "foundations" and "associations" [the one's soliciting for money]) It's all "Your government is trying to kill you this, and, my baby has autism that", just a giant blob of anecdotal bull snip.
I very much doubt you're interested in the studies, your agenda is to market vaccines and neutralize those who speak out against vaccines. Here are some concerning studies for those who want to learn more:-
Infant mortality rates regressed against number of vaccine doses routinely given: Is there a biochemical or synergistic toxicity?
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
"These findings demonstrate a counter-intuitive relationship: nations that require more vaccine doses tend to have higher infant mortality rates."
Self-Organized Criticality Theory of Autoimmunity
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov.../22014010/related
Conclusions/Significance
Systemic autoimmunity appears to be the inevitable consequence of over-stimulating the host's immune ‘system’ by repeated immunization with antigen, to the levels that surpass system's self-organized criticality.
Association between type 1 diabetes and Hib vaccine
www.bmj.com...
"the potential risk of the vaccine exceeds the potential benefit"
Human papilloma virus vaccine and primary ovarian failure: another facet of the autoimmune/inflammatory syndrome induced by adjuvants.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
Whooping cough and pertussis vaccine: a comparison of risks and benefits in Britain
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
"It is concluded that, in children living in non-deprived circumstances in Britain, the risk of pertussis vaccine during the period 1970-83 exceeded those of whooping cough. In some deprived sectors, the risks from whooping cough might have been marginally higher but there was no evidence that this was associated with any increase in deaths or permanent disabilities."
Regarding the Polio Vaccines which Bill Gates sent to India. According to researchers the vaccines spread a disease more dangerous and twice as deadly as Polio.
Indian J Med Ethics. 2012 Apr-Jun;9(2):114-7.
"…while India has been polio-free for a year, there has been a huge increase in non-polio acute flaccid paralysis (NPAFP). In 2011, there were an extra 47,500 new cases of NPAFP. Clinically indistinguishable from polio paralysis but twice as deadly, the incidence of NPAFP was directly proportional to doses of oral polio received. Though this data was collected within the polio surveillance system, it was not investigated. The principle of primum-non-nocere [First, do no harm] was violated."
Vaccines for preventing influenza in healthy adults
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
"The review showed that reliable evidence on influenza vaccines is thin but there is evidence of widespread manipulation of conclusions and spurious notoriety of the studies. "
Here's a video of the former CDC Chief admitting that vaccines trigger Autism
CDC Chief Admits that Vaccines Trigger Autism
www.youtube.com...
edit on 21-11-2013 by Rubinstein because: (no reason given)
Thank you sir/madame!!
A round of applause from me.
Xcalibur254
reply to post by Rubinstein
And yet the study that sparked all this anti-bad nonsense only had a sample size of 12. Not to mention horribly flawed methodology. So why does Wakefield get a buy on his shoddy research?
OneManArmy
boncho
"My kid has autism and they just got a vaccine!" - and that is handed out as 'evidence' all along the way.
How's it feel to see your argument in the mirror?
And of course there is no scare mongering is there?
www.abovetopsecret.com...edit on 201311America/Chicago11pm11pmFri, 22 Nov 2013 17:20:34 -06001113 by OneManArmy because: (no reason given)
Rubinstein
Thank you OneManArmy, most pro-vaccine posters like to pretend these studies don't exist, even once you've showed them it doesn't take long until they're again saying "There are no studies which show vaccines can cause any harm". These people are not capable of forming a balanced opinion on the topic of vaccines
One of the best sites to help people form a balanced opinion on the risk/benefit is www.smartvax.com... , they look at the numbers and work out which vaccines are actually worth the risk theoretically for those living in the First World.
boncho
Yet, I earlier posted about Mercola taking out a billboard ad in Times Square and I fail to you see that as scaremongering… Granted the ad simply plugged a foundation and his website, yet we all know he is planning to tell people their kids are gonna get autism from vaccines, and all the while no evidence to support anything.edit on 22-11-2013 by boncho because: (no reason given)
Rubinstein
OneManArmy
Rubinstein
boncho
It doesn't work that way. If you want to prove your hypothesis right, prove it right. You don't make scientific discovery by claiming someone's work is shoddy, it's just not scientific. You know, the whole "method" part of it all.
If there is any truth to your anti-vax rhetoric, why not simply provide evidence? You realize the anti-vax crowd has been lying to you right? You realize they did studies awhile ago that had terrible conflicts of interest right? You realize they haven't been able to put out any legitimate studies and resort to bending the truth, telling half truths and flat out lies right?
You realize that nearly every anti-vax poster in this thread doesn't post sources right? Neither do the big ones. (you know, the "foundations" and "associations" [the one's soliciting for money]) It's all "Your government is trying to kill you this, and, my baby has autism that", just a giant blob of anecdotal bull snip.
I very much doubt you're interested in the studies, your agenda is to market vaccines and neutralize those who speak out against vaccines. Here are some concerning studies for those who want to learn more:-
Infant mortality rates regressed against number of vaccine doses routinely given: Is there a biochemical or synergistic toxicity?
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
"These findings demonstrate a counter-intuitive relationship: nations that require more vaccine doses tend to have higher infant mortality rates."
Self-Organized Criticality Theory of Autoimmunity
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov.../22014010/related
Conclusions/Significance
Systemic autoimmunity appears to be the inevitable consequence of over-stimulating the host's immune ‘system’ by repeated immunization with antigen, to the levels that surpass system's self-organized criticality.
Association between type 1 diabetes and Hib vaccine
www.bmj.com...
"the potential risk of the vaccine exceeds the potential benefit"
Human papilloma virus vaccine and primary ovarian failure: another facet of the autoimmune/inflammatory syndrome induced by adjuvants.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
Whooping cough and pertussis vaccine: a comparison of risks and benefits in Britain
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
"It is concluded that, in children living in non-deprived circumstances in Britain, the risk of pertussis vaccine during the period 1970-83 exceeded those of whooping cough. In some deprived sectors, the risks from whooping cough might have been marginally higher but there was no evidence that this was associated with any increase in deaths or permanent disabilities."
Regarding the Polio Vaccines which Bill Gates sent to India. According to researchers the vaccines spread a disease more dangerous and twice as deadly as Polio.
Indian J Med Ethics. 2012 Apr-Jun;9(2):114-7.
"…while India has been polio-free for a year, there has been a huge increase in non-polio acute flaccid paralysis (NPAFP). In 2011, there were an extra 47,500 new cases of NPAFP. Clinically indistinguishable from polio paralysis but twice as deadly, the incidence of NPAFP was directly proportional to doses of oral polio received. Though this data was collected within the polio surveillance system, it was not investigated. The principle of primum-non-nocere [First, do no harm] was violated."
Vaccines for preventing influenza in healthy adults
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
"The review showed that reliable evidence on influenza vaccines is thin but there is evidence of widespread manipulation of conclusions and spurious notoriety of the studies. "
Here's a video of the former CDC Chief admitting that vaccines trigger Autism
CDC Chief Admits that Vaccines Trigger Autism
www.youtube.com...
edit on 21-11-2013 by Rubinstein because: (no reason given)
Thank you sir/madame!!
A round of applause from me.
Thank you OneManArmy, most pro-vaccine posters like to pretend these studies don't exist, even once you've showed them it doesn't take long until they're again saying "There are no studies which show vaccines can cause any harm". These people are not capable of forming a balanced opinion on the topic of vaccines
One of the best sites to help people form a balanced opinion on the risk/benefit is www.smartvax.com... , they look at the numbers and work out which vaccines are actually worth the risk theoretically for those living in the First World.