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Originally posted by LightCraft
Originally posted by IkNOwSTuff
"ABORIGINAL police liaison officers who have been stripped of their guns fear
they could become targets for tribal payback attacks.
The liaison officers told the WA Industrial Relations Commission yesterday that
the ban prevented them from intervening in violent community disputes. This made
them highly visible, but defenceless, targets for payback attacks.
One officer said the ban was degrading. It made it seem that a white officer's
life was more important than that of an Aboriginal officer."
Again, I have refuted everything you have said with facts. You're the troll. Grow up you little self absorbed sissy boy.
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed. The writing is somewhat ambiguous but I take it to mean an armed militia exclusively, not an armed citizenry.
2) We need them to defend ourselves against the government Once again the US has the best military in the world, what exactly is an AK or even grenade launcher let alone handgun going to do against an army of tanks, helicopters and drones except make you and your family a target?
3)Its not just the US that has this problem Sorry but yes it is!! Every country has murder, people with mental issues, criminals with guns and gun deaths yet no other country in the world has people going into schools, malls, cinemas etc every few months blasting away at innocent people.
Its part of our culture/ its a tradition
If guns are banned then only criminals will have guns
Then why not ban knives, cars, alcohol etc etc they kill people too!!!
Guns dont kill people, people kill people
I need it to keep my family safe
Guns aren’t the issue, we need to help mental people
Originally posted by IkNOwSTuff
Its a security blanket and a pretty useless one, you think a rapist is going to come up and announce from 20 feet away that he intends to rape you?
Rape is a disgusting crime that in most people generates a primal emotional response and how could anyone be against anything that could prevent rape right?
The truth is most rape victims know the Attacker and have (or should have) no reason to fear them.
If a stranger decides to commit this crime its highly unlikely you will be given a chance to access your gun unless you carry it in your hand fully locked and loaded.
I wonder how many of the guns that are now being used by criminals were purchased by women like yourself who never had reason to use them and are now potentially being used by rapists themselves
Guns are a useless security blanket which is why our militaries and police have them and why politicians are protected by them.
This line of yours about rape makes me furious. Not confronting evil is pure cowardice and no matter of mental gymnastics could ever change it.
This thinking has led to the rise of every two bit dictator in modern history. Its useless to fight against rape because the rapist might win? You can't ever use guns because the bad guy might prevail? Forget fighting evil. Evil will aways win, just give it what ever it wants. Neo-serfdom is full of bizzare inverted logic Having no right to own a weapon and protect yourself is actually "freedom from guns" The stripping down of free speech rights is fast becoming "Freedom from being verbally bullied" Government dominated internet is "Freedom from false information"
You're line about rape is insulting to women and you should be ashamed of yourself for suggesting that women are so inferior they can't grasp the use of weaponry. Forget that you already have insulted 99% of the population by arguing the common folk are just too stupid to have a gun which would be useless anyway, BUT our ELITES in government are so superior that only they can use arms and be protected by them.
No rational person would argue this point. We must act in some way to prevent this from becoming a cultural signature. The sheer number of guns can be a problem when people are not responsible with them. Knowing where they are IS necessary, but banning them would drive them into the black market. Big problem then. I am sure that the architects of the Fast and Furious gun scandal learned that the hard way.
While I do not personally subscribe to this feeling, I can understand why some feel this way. Feeling secure, projecting confidence and practicing situational awareness are the best defense. If having a gun helps one to achieve this, I personally have no issue with this as long as the bearer is stable. We all have our "binky" after all.
Concur. Silly argument really. That logic would have had us banning rocks and sticks and and and ..... I think you get the point.
Here is another point I contend with. There is NOTHING cold and impersonal about killing unless one is a sociopath in which case NOTHING you do will deter him. Been on both sides of this coin and it is incredibly personal either way. Also, I do not think offerring US .gov statistics will convince anyone. The US government has been known to fib. Most people, including some relatives living in that area, say DC is a war zone out on the streets. I will take my sister's word over the .gov's word.
In retrospect, I should probably lump 7, 8 and 9 together as they do have validity when considering the "human" factor and our need for security, even if the security as percieved is an illusion. Essentially, they are truisms which apply whether guns are around or not. It is inconcievable that we consider gun bans to be a panacea for the human condition any more than banning other "weapons" which are mere tools with other uses.
Don't know a bloody thing about UK stats. However, most .gov stats are suspect every where in the world. Call me paranoid, but I have been lied to by government entirely too many times to trust them unconditionally.
Can't speak to this. Never been there. With relatives living around Atlanta, I do believe that area to be highly dangerous according to them. The fact that Kennesaw is in close proximity with such a low crime rate is quite remarkable but hardly a poster child for gun ownership.
Don't own one presently. Haven't for 31yrs since I left law enforcement. But, I have NO intention of permitting anyone to take away my right to choose. As stated previously, subjectivity must be guarded against, or at least recognized in a debate. You are highly intelligent and motivated, but you must realize that the American way and your way are vastly different. And the reasons for said difference IS an essential element in deciding such a volatile and divisive issue. Warm Regards Oh, yea, almost forgot (giving the Vulcan hand sign), live long and prosper.
Originally posted by MegaMind
The bill of rights are limits on government.
We ARE NOT granted these rights THEY ARE our rights as sovereign people. By our very existence these rights belong to us. Free people came together to form government. FREE PEOPLE!
"... shall not be infringed"
I own a gun because it is my right as a person, a human being, to own a gun for self preservation and defense.
YOU might be a SUBJECT to the SOVEREIGN that sits on a throne but WE are not.
So if you let your government take away your right then that's your problem ...
but "we the people" here in America aren't gonna let that happen any time soon ...
so get over it!
edit on 18-12-2012 by MegaMind because: (no reason given)edit on 18-12-2012 by MegaMind because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by Mikeyy
You know it's really getting aggrivating that yet again, another person from ANOTHER country is telling Americans how to live their lives.
Europe obviously doesnt value personal freedoms AT ALL. It's pretty damn sad. and The brits worst of all need to shut it, They are used to be slaves of the Monarch, and their empire has commited some of the worst attrocities man kind has ever seen. They are used to being controlled, be it the crown or the prime minister who bends to the crown, its all the same. You my freind need to find your freedom.
YOU have infringed on our individual rights in the 18th century and OUR ancestors responded by slaughtering your ancestors to earn us these rights.
As weak as you are, you are in no position to take my rights away again.
Be gone with you Red Coat.
Originally posted by MegaMind
Governments in the past century have killed hundreds of millions of people. They are the most dangerous entities in existence. We don't live in a perfect world - if we did there would be no need of government or guns. Our guns are the last check on unrestrained governmental power, tyranny. In all despotic regimes of the past gun confiscation was the first step in total domination.
You say that Americans with their shotguns, rifles and handguns are no match for the military - I agree. But how much worse off would we be without them should our government turn completely to despotism. At least there would be some resistance, something to give the would-be dictator pause.
Just think how vulnerable an unarmed nation would be. What motives would a government have in disarming its people? Would a government that distrusted its own people and so worked to disarm them be trustworthy itself?
I don't think so ...
Definition of MILITIA
1 a : a part of the organized armed forces of a country liable to call only in emergency
b : a body of citizens organized for military service
2: the whole body of able-bodied male citizens declared by law as being subject to call to military service
Originally posted by spock51
The Constitution of the US is not perfect, but I am not aware of one better and damn few its equal.
Originally posted by Grimpachi
Wow this thread is still going . All the points made by the OP have been pretty much destroyed so why are people still debating. The arguments the OP made were weak and full of holes. The OP wouldn’t directly address many peoples responses instead the OP would deflect from the topic. I didn’t expect much from someone who lives in a sheltered society but I thought he/she would have better debating skills than what I have seen. Maybe the OP will take an opportunity at some point in his/her life to see America firsthand at that point he/she will realize just how foolish the OP is with what he/she wrote.
I'm sorry can you please point out to me where the expiration date is? Last time I checked there wasn't one. In the United States we have guns and are allowed to according to our governing documents, if you don't like it either move, or don't come here, problem solved. There are lots of countries that feel the same way as you and their societies are already setup to accommodate people who share your line of thinking. But as others have said until the governments worldwide decide to stop killing and using firearms then I will hold onto mine as well, just in case.