Americans - You claim your military is the best. Prove It

reply to post by Gwampo


All Einstein did was give intel to Roosevelt. The manhatten project designed the bomb.


and it doesn't matter who invented what if you don't revolutionize it.

Car invention history is kinda complicated but you could narrow it down to Germany for simplicity. But it was Ford who revolutionized it using the assembly line.

The US invented the plane but it was the French who first made a war plane.

The US civil war is considered the first modern war because it was the first to make widespread use of mines, rifles, cannons, railroads and photography.

So if nitpicking a few inventions as being stolen makes you feel better, have at it.

reply to post by daaskapital
[more
The fact we as a nation have kept Israel from being destoryed might tell you something. Point being the rest (and particurerly the nations that surround Israel) of the world seem to feel purty adiment for there hatred for Israel and need to destory it.

When you get past your obvious hatred for the U.S. you might ask someone from one of the Arab nations why they have not gone after Israel yet.

Originally posted by daaskapital

I'm presuming this is the Chinese carrier you are talking about? If so, i never heard of that incident...

The only RAN Carrierier incident I am "anectotically" aware of was in the 1960's that allegedly the RAN Carrier, - now long decomissioned - rammed 2 US Navy ships after an exercise in Sydney harbour. Which then made it at the beer table sound like the Aurries have the best Carrier since it single handedly damaged/sank 2 war ships without firing a shot.
Way to go, Aussies!

Haters going to hate. Players going to play. Why should we be impressed that other countrys are getting a taste of what we've taken advantage for years? Just dipping their feet in frontiers that we perfected? A lot us Americans still have faith in our country and not you or any other propaganda spreading anti-americans will change that. Your words just prove your jealousy. Stop focusing on what Americas doing for your country and worry about what you can do to better yours.

Peace

I'm bout to go practice some American capitalism and buy something I shouldn't.. woot! woot! American arrogance at its best. I'm chanting USA as I type this btw.

reply to post by daaskapital


Lets start with thousands of experienced veterans, large amount of research and development that has been field tested, about 90% of all aircraft carriers and the missiles to go with it. We would first destroy their fleets, control their skies, and than our biggest problem would be holding land., but hopefully we aren't stupid enough to try and hold territory for longer than a month. Also, it is incredibly insulting to state we weren't in the pacific theater of WW2 to defend nation like Australia. My grandpa fought bravely to defend any nation that opposed Japan.

It's obvious from my posts I am a strong supporter of the US Armed Forces (not always how they are used). I don't know if they are, "the best", because as the OP author pointed out, that's rather subjective and complex. Within individual areas, there are probably some other countries that have individual service branches or corps that are better than the US equivilent. I am also not saying we don't have our weaknesses, severe in some areas.

We could sit and compare all sorts of tech, weapons, units, tactics, doctrine, skills, training, etc.
However; I think the US has demonstrated three areas in the past twenty years, where hands down they are "tops".

1. Fully Integrated Joint warfare. This is not only joint between US services, but other nations. Especially in regards to air power. Currently the US can put upwards of 10,000 percision guided weapons on target within a just a few hours time frame.
www.infiniteunknown.net...

Inter operability between services and countries is crucial if you wish to fight a battle with speed. Both speed of action, speed of the campaign, and speed of deterence. This keeps casualties down (both military and civillian), especially in conventional warfare between countries (not insurgencies, which is a whole other animal that the US military has never been big on).

I don't think anyone can claim that, let alone demonstrate joint warfare, especially the amont of force that can be applied at once. Related to this is the next point:

2. Power Projection, Whether it's our 11 Carrier Groups (2 or 3 of which are at sea and another 2 ready to surge), the division rapid response ready brigades in units like the 82nd, 101st, 10th Mountain and 25th Infantry, The 2 or 3 Marine Expeditionanry Units at sea at any moment, The Global Strike Capabilities to hit targets from B-1s, B-2s, and B-52's, The United States can bring combat power, and lots of it, across the entire spectrum of warfare to anywhere on the planet, and usually within 18 to 96 hours (depending on how much you want/need to send). this was started in the 1970's with the RDJTF, which has since been dispanded and eventually became both Central Command, AND the basic learning step to both true joint warfare and power projection.
en.wikipedia.org...


Lot's of countries can power project, say a destroyer squadron, or a single (small) carrier, and Airborne Brigade, etc. But no one, (save for possibly Russia and China, and that's pushing it) can send a fully integrated force of this size, world wide, within this time frame. And all this is only because pont 3).

3. Tranportation and Logistics The US has the largest global military and civillian air transportation capabilites.in the world. The USAF has more then 205 C-17s, 100 C-5, and 55+KC10's for strategic transport. That's not counting several hundred KC135 and C130s for transport. They can also use the Civil Reserve Air Fleet (Civiliian Airliners and Cargo Planes that can be pressed into service). The forces mentioned in point 2 can all be moved and then supplied by the largest air transport fleet in the world. I haven't even touched on sealift yet.
en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...


So in summary, putting aside, military size, technology, even combat experience and performance, the US can "there firstist with the mostest". Sustained Power Projection, no one can do that like the US.

reply to post by daaskapital


I wasn't going to get involved with this post, but for what it is worth here is my contribution.

US Military is fearsome. However, for it to be so it has to depend on the co-operation of other countries who allow the US to maintain bases in different locations around the globe. Here are two examples of what the British alllow:-

en.wikipedia.org...

en.wikipedia.org...

Without this co-operation then the US is not so mighty.

reply to post by alldaylong


I would agree, especially diego garcia. THey certainly make the logistics much easier.

reply to post by Turkenstein


well its hardly suprising when you know you can't go blow for blow with the other guy so you need to find a way to make the other side drag their combat into a slower gear that wears them down like in vietnam/afghanistan where every soldier returning home in a coffin is a point for the other side

Originally posted by mainidh
Sometimes I wonder about your DAAS.If this is not bait and hate then I dunno what is.
?

I think he is a aussie (possibly immigrant) from down under peeved about few postings a week or two ago when the presence of American Marines in Australia was being discussed Definitely a 'kelly'

Australia? Isn't that where Hitler was born? And we all know the USA beat Hitler with 0 help. So we win.

U

S

A

Simple answer to this, No country has the best military. The United States has a great military, but not the best by any means. If there was a country that could annihilate another without being harmed we would no by now, but one doesn't exist. If the United States was this powerful, no country on earth would stand up against it, but once again that isn't the case. So far there have only been two civilizations with total domination and that was Rome and France(Napolean). Since then there has not been any. The United States nor any country as of now could go to war with every country on earth and win as it would not be possible. So, the answer is no country is the mightiest...period.

Originally posted by TWISTEDWORDS
Simple answer to this, No country has the best military. The United States has a great military, but not the best by any means. If there was a country that could annihilate another without being harmed we would no by now, but one doesn't exist. If the United States was this powerful, no country on earth would stand up against it, but once again that isn't the case. So far there have only been two civilizations with total domination and that was Rome and France(Napolean). Since then there has not been any. The United States nor any country as of now could go to war with every country on earth and win as it would not be possible. So, the answer is no country is the mightiest...period.

If you think France (Through Napoleon) had total domination then you are greatly mis-informed. You need to re-read up history:-

en.wikipedia.org...

Originally posted by Numbers33four

So what do you have in mind to prove who is best? A plane crashing contest? We give up. You win.

I laughed so hard at this that I think I pulled a muscle

I'd give you a thousand stars if I could

Originally posted by daaskapital
Prove to me why the USA has the strongest Military. They were halted in Korea, defeated in Vietnam, lost the Iraq war, and are losing the Afghanistan war.

I would take issue with your claims. The only time the Americans have been "defeated" in the conventional sense of the term has been Vietnam. This was not because of lack of military might. It was because of politics at home. The Tet Offensive, for example, was a clear military victory for the Americans though the MSM spun it as a defeat. The Americans did not "lose" the Iraq War though they may very well lose Afghanistan, once again, because of politics. If you want to say, "Well, politics is part of the equation," then I would agree with you. When you stuff civilian control of the military into the mix, anything can happen. But if you are talking strictly military expertise and might, the US wins hands down. Australia is 24th, right above Canada. If the American military was allowed to fight unrestricted, nothing could stop it. But there's always civilians who say, "You must stop because you might offend someone."

Of course, political agendas are different. Australia has no global responsibilities to speak of. Here's a list of Australian deployments. If the Americans ensure the Strait of Hormuz stays open, Australia doesn't have to. As a result, Australia doesn't have 20 aircraft carriers. (CVNs plus LHD/As) It has none. Besides, an American CVN stops by every few months to say "Hi" and the sailors are always well treated. Australia only has to defend itself, but America is "expected" to be at the beck and call of any western country that says "Help." Australia has just over 100,000 active military, including the reserves. The US has 3 million.

Here's a site that ranks the world's militaries for your viewing pleasure. Insofar as it is accurate you can compare countries against each other. The US is not first in all categories, but that begs the question of technical superiority. Russia has more tanks, but most of then are rusting in boneyards. Besides, who needs tanks? You have to get them to a battlefield, and where might that be? Look at the charts for yourself.

The other issue is being battle-tested. The American military gets used (I'm not claiming this is a good thing.) It's been at war for years. Its gear and weapons systems have endured combat conditions. Its troops are battle hardened. It's one thing to sink a tramp steamer with a missile and declare that a success. It's quite another to shoot at something that is actively defending itself and shooting back. What other militaries have been actively used as extensively as America's? None in recent history.

I don't know what prompts you to be so critical, but your claim is without merit. This is proof. If that's not good enough for you, I really don't care to endlessly argue the point back and forth.

Originally posted by daaskapital

Originally posted by Numbers33four
Dude, I understand you being upset about the US not helping out when your only carrier stalled out off the coast of Iran. We wanted to send some nuke techs over to help you out but since that carrier runs on diesel no dice. Sorry bout that.

I'm presuming this is the Chinese carrier you are talking about? If so, i never heard of that incident...

So what do you have in mind to prove who is best? A plane crashing contest? We give up. You win.

What do i have in mind? Nothing. No military can be proven to be "the best in the world." Maybe the last great army was the British Army back when they were colonising other countries. Since then,there hasn't been any real great military power. How would one measure military power of an era? The size? No, size does not equal effectiveness. Combined strength? One needs resources and effective training for strength, and every notable country has resources. About the training...not so much.

I just want proof as to why the American military is the greatest in the world. i expect that not many peole will provide proof as there aren't many supporting the idea other than American propaganda.

So you want proof where you say it can't be proven... What a troll thread. Enjoy your snack.

Well the Iraq war was an American victory, the Iraq occupation is what failed for the exact same reasons that the occupation of Vietnam failed, Massively unpopular at home, against a guerrilla force raised and trained in the terrain of the battlefields, able to blend in with the civilian populations, and so dedicated to the cause that death is a means to an end for them. As it stands America's military is the standing defense force for most of the western world, we make up most of the troops that make up the U.N. security forces and the majority of NATO peacekeeping missions, Our Navy Patrols the world Securing NATO military dominance and economic assets. We have created a Nuclear Defense Shield and installed them in various positions across the globe.

Counter-interrogative What Makes you so sure we Aren't the most powerful Military in recorded history?

I think theres alot of good soldiers in all countries.

The Burkhas(if I spelled the right?)are quite famous for bravery and have never been taken prisoner.
We can go all the way to the Viet kong to the French foreign legion to the Navy seals and all branches of military.

Russia does have some great scientist and produce some deadly weapons of war.

Its well known,and they know as well, they have serious problems with their soldiers,(from drug addicts to drunks),they are not the soldiers of WW2/Stalingrad.
Massive corruption with the officers and the higher ups and especially the goverment.

The death rate out weighs the birth rate,(because of the no-hope economy there)
Ask this question in 40-50 years from now, they wont have an army,just nukes and buttons.

Dont get me wrong,they are still a threat to tiny countries around them.
They have nukes,thats there power.
And by no means I want to go to war with them nor do I feel more powerfull than them.

I remember the feared Presidential guards in Iraq,they sure threw there guns down when they seen the shadow of our soldiers coming in.
The Chinese military was even amazed/shocked.(they watch and study)

Alot of it comes to to many things on who's the most powerfull or the best.
Really comes down to it who is ever left alive in the end.

Obvious other nations(unlike you),dont want to find out,do they?
LOL

As for China,they are not our friend nor an enemy.
They have alot of problems also,they live in a glass house as well.
Theres to sets of people there, and its really sad.

They worry about India also.

Can I ask what you seen of other militaries to ? this on your thread?

Im sure Iran would say there the best also.
They have good snipers,,showed on there last election some years back.

I suppose in order to prove it, some fool will have to step into the ring I guess?

Lets hope not,and lets hope to avoid wars,but there always bad apples around and wishfull thinking is good. but must be on guard.

I added a photo,,guess we may not be the most powerfull after seeing this!
A new protype I assume, of a death ray or plasma blaster ,and they cry about Harp?

Originally posted by Itisburgers
Well the Iraq war was an American victory, the Iraq occupation is what failed for the exact same reasons that the occupation of Vietnam failed, Massively unpopular at home, against a guerrilla force raised and trained in the terrain of the battlefields, able to blend in with the civilian populations, and so dedicated to the cause that death is a means to an end for them. As it stands America's military is the standing defense force for most of the western world, we make up most of the troops that make up the U.N. security forces and the majority of NATO peacekeeping missions, Our Navy Patrols the world Securing NATO military dominance and economic assets. We have created a Nuclear Defense Shield and installed them in various positions across the globe.

Counter-interrogative What Makes you so sure we Aren't the most powerful Military in recorded history?

What makes me think the US isn't the most powerful military in recorded history is this:-

en.wikipedia.org...

Our military is the best because we alone spent something like 40% of the entire world's military budget. With this being said, we're not exactly in our most prosperous state and so going to war is a big no-no. We simply don't have the money to fight a war overseas. Military superiority has little to do with the logistics of the situation; having the best trained troops and most expensive equipment is only so good as you can manage to move it and maintain it. Sending troops overseas is very expensive because they need to be supplied with food, ammunition, and equipment. If a nation doesn't have the money to sustain a war, it can't go to war regardless of it's army.

Perhaps this is why there are rumors of ww3 being fought with nukes; it might turn into another hiroshima situation in which we decide to use nuclear weapons because they are more cost efficient than sending our troops over there to fight and die.