Just saw Prometheus, Indoctrination?

reply to post by Phage


Definitely recycled for the most part. Threat comes from outer space. Threat waves shameful finger at humans. Threat threatens to destroy humans. Humans redeem themselves at last minute.

However the definition of original concept gets pretty murky. The whole concept has been discussed at length with no right answer. I thought that Prometheus brought unoriginal ideas together in an original fashion quite nicely.

For those who poo-pooed the movie, name a good sci-fi movie from the past 10yrs (and not Pocahontas, I mean Avatar). You need to lower your expectations. It was a good sci-fi flick. Well made, well acted, and well executed. The days of really awesome earth shattering sci-fi are behind us. I saw a preview of the new Total Recall today. Made me feel old and betrayed. I can't believe that movie is only, what, 25 yrs old and that are remaking it? No more The Day The Earth Stood Still, Forbidden Planet, or Planet of the Apes. Sorry ATS'ers.

Maybe Aliens should come down and wipe us out. The Earth with no more good Sci-Fi is a sad place to live in.

Interesting twist, the makers come to kill their creation. I didn't see it coming. Thought the movie was okay, nothing great, nothing terrible. Not a block buster by any means. Food for thought, sure.

Overall, I guess I was disappointed. But I still enjoyed it. I was totally confused during the introduction. I had no idea that was Earth and the particular engineer was "seeding" the earth with his/their DNA. I can't help but wonder, "Wouldn't a species so technically and scientifically advanced have a better way to introduce their DNA into a world than to commit genetic-suicide??? I admit it was dramatic, but I still find it weird.

I enjoyed the character of David, as his agenda seemed to be the most consistent agenda of the Aliens franchise. The xenomorph seems to be the only alien species the human species has come into contact with in the "Alien-franchise World." So, again, I have to wonder, how does the Predator species fit into all of it? At what point are the Engineers aware that the Predator species alien have been visiting Earth? Is this perhaps why they only made one attempt at destroying the human species?

I was pleasantly/unpleasantly surprised to learn the "Engineers" wanted to decimate the human species. This was probably the best part of the film. The question: Why did they want to kill us? They obviously kept us "around" long enough to evolve from "whatever" to human. Long enough for us to be able to draw pictures of us worshiping them on cave walls. Of course, this does explain why the last engineer decapitated David immediately upon "waking up."

Additionally, maybe I'm wrong but I'm assuming it was the mating of the Engineers and the face-suckers that evolved into the upright-walking xenomorphs that we've come to love and fear (at the end of the movie)? Or was it the introduction of the humans and the face-suckers that evolved into the xenomorphs that Ripley will battle in the future. I think the latter of the two. I don't know for sure.

As I appreciate consistency, I was happy to see the shape of the engineer's ship to make the design of the ship from Alien on planet LV-426. I also enjoyed that they introduced the Zeta Reticuli system, as this was the star system the Hill's implicated in their alien abduction of 1961. Also, the reason for its possibility of life is because its within the "Goldilocks's Zone" of the star, although they don't come out and use those exact words.

And finally, I really don't understand why Dr. Shaw would want to visit the Engineer's planet, instead of heading back to Earth. I understand her curiosity, but really? Wouldn't they just kill her? Go back home silly girl and report your findings! And given the all the time from the beginnings of Earth's Engineer's-Engineered humans, why didn't they return to Earth and kills us humans in another way? Obviously their genetically-engineered xenomorphs didn't work but are you telling me they didn't have the technology to destroy us in another way? I'm not buying it. Also, why the giant, idolized human head? It's almost as if they were worshiping us?

So now I've gone crossed-eyed with all the possibilities and questions that I normally have during "prequels" and the paradoxes they create. Do I love the back-stories, yes! Do I hate the questions, the changes and the inconsistencies they create, hell yes!

And finally, very difficult to do, I thought the make-up artists did a fantastic job at the geriatric make-up job on Guy Pierce. Geriatric make-up jobs can be the most difficult to make appear realistic. Additionally, Noomi Repace looked completely different than she did in Dragon Tattoo. Nothing wrong with a little weight gain ladies! lol

I really liked when they re-animated the Engineer's head...but then blew it up. That was cool.

And lastly, I love the fact that (probably) the least educated guy on board, the pilot, realizes this is a biological weapon's research facility that got "out of control" and failed, and its time to get the hell out of there! lol. I was sad to see Vickers die because I think she was the most pragmatic character, besides the pilot.

And what was with the flute on the bridge? Kinda rudimentary, huh? Weird.

In Prometheus, Dr. Shaw would have given birth vaginally to the alien. The scientists made such a big deal out of the queen xenomorph being able to deliver vaginally instead of laying eggs in Alien Resurrection. I realize this is comparing apples to oranges, but still thought it was worth bringing up.

And now I've gone crossed-eyed!

reply to post by Cosmic911


I think some of those plot holes could be filled in with another watch of the movie and maybe watching Alien and Aliens again, being that Alien and Aliens are the only ones with back story to the Xeno's.

I thought the reason for her trying to go back to the Engineers home world was obvious. Two reasons really. To out bad a** Ripley and to leave the door open for a sequel. I think Scott learned long ago not to shut doors in potentially lucrative movie franchises.

Originally posted by b3l13v3
Eh, I give the movie a 5/10.

Alien blew the movie to smithereens.

In my opinion, it was a director who bit off more than he could chew. This movie was nothing special, and while it may take roots with many of the conspiracies about our origination, I doubt it was trying to tell anyone anything.

Ridley Scott directed Alien and he also directed Prometheus.

He can definitely chew what he bit off, but a lot of people don't think it was worth eating in the first place

Originally posted by NoRemorse762
reply to post by Cosmic911

 

I think some of those plot holes could be filled in with another watch of the movie and maybe watching Alien and Aliens again, being that Alien and Aliens are the only ones with back story to the Xeno's.

I thought the reason for her trying to go back to the Engineers home world was obvious. Two reasons really. To out bad a** Ripley and to leave the door open for a sequel. I think Scott learned long ago not to shut doors in potentially lucrative movie franchises.

I did just recently watch the entire Alien franchise movies. And yes, Alien and Aliens was as close to Prometheus as its going to get. Dr. Shaw is never going out bad a** Ripley...that's not going to happen, especially since she has been cloned with xeno DNA.

And while the reason for Shaw wanting to go to the Engineer's planet is obvious its also futile and stupid. Are they going to make an exception for her in despite of having dedicated manpower and resources on a planet distant than their own, devoted to biologically creating an entire new species to wipe out the entire human race light years and light years away? Again, I'm not buying it. I don't think it was well-planned out.

I think in the movie industry we learn time and time again to leave alone a good thing. Its very difficult to recapture success multiple times. Look at the mess George Lucas made with his prequels...the third movie might have been the only good thing to come out of his prequels.

I got the sense that a second movie may be in the pipeline that will elucidate the connection between the engineers' engineering and the rise of the Alien species

I wish that Ridley Scott had produced an epic three hour volume that covered all this ground, perhaps discarding an hour of the existing film, and taken us from that bizarre precursor squid species through to the Alien species over a number of years

Whether Prometheus constitutes indoctrination, implying that the writers or producers or Scott himself has insider information, is hard to say but certainly I believe there now exists a doctrine around the alien conception of humanity and perhaps Scott simply wishes to capitalise on that meme

reply to post by Cosmic911

Alien 3 was such a boring title. I always thought it should have been called Still More Aliens.

Alien...Aliens...

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by Cosmic911

 

Alien 3 was such a boring title. I always thought it should have been called Still More Aliens.

Alien...Aliens...

Ha ha...that's great Phage. You're right. Sometimes it's just better to leave things alone.

reply to post by NoRemorse762


Eh.. I think it's more likely that writers dig around places like this (ATS) and when they see a popular underground idea/philosophy they use that as a spring board for ideas. I write and originally came her for that reason, to get ideas and bounce ideas off of others. I even kicked around the whole annunakki/ancient alien idea for a story, but decided it was being done to death. I have a friend from film school that is still working on a movie based on those ideas.

I think a lot of people here look into it too much. You are giving hollywood WAY too much credit. Hollywood is all money and no brains. They remake movie after movie and any new movies are based on other material. Even guys putting out "original" material like Scott are getting their ideas from somewhere. I think it is most likely they took their idea from places like ATS because it is a good idea and it is potentially a very popular idea.

I liked Prometheus (I am a huuuge Alien and Ridley Scott fan - as you can see by my avatar), but it wasn't really what I expected. Not bad, but somehow, I can't put my finger on it, it wasn't what I was expecting. I even have a ten foot tall standee in my garage from the theatre haha. It was a decent movie though.

reply to post by quantumfluctuation


Yeah.. the space jockeys (engineers) will have engineered the xeno's (aliens) as a bio weapon to wipe out populations etc. I am pretty sure thats the story.

The movie was a little weird, it made the life cycle for aliens even more confusing.

reply to post by GogoVicMorrow

I think a lot of people here look into it too much. You are giving hollywood WAY too much credit. Hollywood is all money and no brains.

I think you're exactly right here. It happens all the time in television with any number of series. I think of BSG (battle star galactica) being my most recent. The fans are so dedicated to the show and know the entire mythos inside and out. And what happens? Season after season new writers are introduced into the show, they aren't as indoctrinated or familiar with the lore or characters or story as the fans. It happened in the last season of BSG. How many episodes went nowhere? They ran out of material. They had no vision. They wasted episode after episode. Roger Moore had no idea where it would end. And then the writers explained everything with a God-theory. No explanation. Just faith. Well, it kinda worked because God is magical, but it didn't fill any holes and pissed off a lot of viewers. The truth is, as fans, I think we're more committed sometimes than the writers.

if you read the aliens vs predator books it makes a bit more sense as they are all in the same universe ....pretty sure the humans didnt invent the alien speices as according to the books the yaujata race(thats what the preadators are called) is responsable for them as they seed worlds so they can hunt them for sport but are supposed to stay away from human worlds and are supposed to get special permission to hunt us

I just saw a trailer today for the new "Ice Age" movie, and this line introducing the movie made me sit up and take notice:

"The End of the World is just the tip of the iceberg"

If you believe in the supposed story about good/bad alien races helping us/helping the elites now, and if you believe the rumors about the chemtrails real reason - nano technology for all us for for mind control (there are devices to neutralize it/remove it) - then this line makes sense.

I have recently watched Avengers and MIB III and many lines stood out as appropo for our times if some of the rumors are true - if I can get ahold of the scripts maybe I'll start a thread.

Originally posted by raivo
couldn't give a damn any of those characters or their fate.

that's epic failure. if you're not invested, it all falls apart and you start noticing dialogue and set problems

too bad, I was pumped for this

At times during Prometheus I felt as though they were moving along too fast and could have slowed down a bit. They could have made the story more rich if they did. I think the relationship between Theron and Fassbenders characters could have been better explained or deeper, as well as their individual characters. Dr. Shaw was pretty bad ass. She had surgery and was running around in the space of 30 min while only letting out a whimper here and there. They could have explained the Engineers bio-mechanical culture a little better.

All in all it was a good movie that I thought could have been three hours long. Or.... Maybe I just felt sort of unfulfilled by the movie and am thinking than an extra hour could fill the void in my heart for the Alien saga, but that I think is impossible.

It definately seems that the idea of aliens creating us (humans) is trying to be spread, whether this is because of TPTB or it is simply for entertainment purposes, shows like Ancient Aliens air on the History channel almost 24/7, which does make it seem like we are trying to be lead to suspect that something is up....

they are trying to convince us that they are aliens and not fallen angels

That doesn't take much convincing for anyone with a brain.

I can see aliens and God on the same plate.No big deal if we were created by aliens to me.

The problem with the "Alien" franchise is that "the Company" never experiences remorse for what they do. There is always a secret agenda to bring back one of the xenomorphs for experimentation. There is never that moment in any of the films when the ones responsible have their moment of regret. There is always the conspiracy to undermine the expendable crew and bring back one of the aliens. It really pisses ya off!