Detected by ISS cameras: Multiple UFOs in Low Earth Orbit....

Originally posted by JimOberg

Originally posted by MoreThanTheSum
As this thread has gotten its fair share of debunkers, I feel the need to ask a few questions of them, as I am of the belief that these objects are UFOs. Not necessarily aliens, but UFOs in the traditional sense.

Questions are good, since they focus on answers, and I have a standard set of "99 FAQs" that address many of your general questions on my website, here
www.jamesoberg.com/ufo.html
at the link labeled "99 FAQs on 'Space UFOs'"

Now, before responding to specific questions on THESE videos, please answer -- how can anyone fairly expect a plausible prosaic explanation for a video posted without date, without time, without names of witnesses, and basically without any evidence it's anything but a CGI prank?

That's my question. Answers, please.

You'd make a really good politician, you know that? That's one of my problems with debunkers. Dodging. I already said I'm going with the premise that the video is at least authentic, now, disprove that these are UFO's from -that- standpoint. It's not impossible to fake a video like that, but from my knowledge, these are from the official live feed--or at least snippets of it. As for witnesses, why on earth would you expect to be able to get names of witnesses from inside NASA? Either the white OR black NASA? Seriously? That's just inane. And, in conclusion, I'll offer a reply that I haven't offered anyone since 4th grade: "I asked you first."
EDIT: And as for your website, which I'm reading through now, it's hardly unbiased. The questions and answers are written by him. Nothing wrong with that of course, but he's already coming at this from the status of a harsh debunker, as are you. Your minds are already made up on the subject. I think mine is really the only one that's open.

Originally posted by gortex
Ah back to the ISS ,or the shuttle in the case of the second video .
The only problem I have with these videos is nothing in them either changes direction or slows down , just stuff going in one direction and at a constant speed .

There are approximately 3,000 satellites operating in Earth orbit and an estimated 8,000 man-made objects , why can't the objects in the video be one of those .
Plus I don't think its a good sign when a video starts with " more NASA lies"

I have a problem with that being the case here.


If these are satellites or space junk, how can the formation change?

Originally posted by SaturnFX
I would like to see a video of a UFO..a proper alien (or other) spacecraft zipping around. But, first I must dismiss the unremarkable in order to know when I seen something truly interesting. And this video is of the unremarkable category.

Totally agree, with this add: it could also be something DANGEROUS related to vehicle malfunction that needs rapid diagnosis and response. So quick posting of any 'funny' videos can be helpful. But reposting ten year OLD videos, as the OP did, seems pointless except to tease and show off.

Originally posted by MoreThanTheSum
3) Last video, last object: How would ice particles or space debris remain in a perfect equilateral triangular formation? I'm going off of the premise that the video has -not- been tampered with, and I would like you to at least attempt the same. That explanation is a cop-out, in my opinion. I am willing to be convinced, but simply screaming "fake!" isn't going to do it for me.

I see 3 objects.
I don't see a triangle. Well, I mean, I do if I wanted to pretend there was some sort of invisible matter between them, but I don't. I can see triangles everywhere if I did that...as it only takes 3 points and perspective play.
torwards the end of its flight, you will see its not a perfect triangle anyhow as the bottom moves up.

Yes, now this is where you say its perspective...the craft thingie is turning. No..see, thats when your trying to see patterns where there are none.

So, what are the three objects then? I don't know..but what could it be? well, could be lots of things...and most of those things that it could be are quite natural. such as space junk, ice, etc. Sure, it could be some weird invisible alien megacraft with running lights on its corners visible for some reason, but I doubt it.

As far as it disappearing right at the end, well, I want some authenticity check on the film frankly. I would want to see the actual film on the nasa website that shows the same before I even start contemplating it (odd enough to raise an eyebrow, but not enough credibility to believe what I am seeing is raw footage before I start digging)

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by MoreThanTheSum
3) Last video, last object: How would ice particles or space debris remain in a perfect equilateral triangular formation? I'm going off of the premise that the video has -not- been tampered with, and I would like you to at least attempt the same. That explanation is a cop-out, in my opinion. I am willing to be convinced, but simply screaming "fake!" isn't going to do it for me.

I see 3 objects.
I don't see a triangle. Well, I mean, I do if I wanted to pretend there was some sort of invisible matter between them, but I don't. I can see triangles everywhere if I did that...as it only takes 3 points and perspective play.
torwards the end of its flight, you will see its not a perfect triangle anyhow as the bottom moves up.

Yes, now this is where you say its perspective...the craft thingie is turning. No..see, thats when your trying to see patterns where there are none.

So, what are the three objects then? I don't know..but what could it be? well, could be lots of things...and most of those things that it could be are quite natural. such as space junk, ice, etc. Sure, it could be some weird invisible alien megacraft with running lights on its corners visible for some reason, but I doubt it.

As far as it disappearing right at the end, well, I want some authenticity check on the film frankly. I would want to see the actual film on the nasa website that shows the same before I even start contemplating it (odd enough to raise an eyebrow, but not enough credibility to believe what I am seeing is raw footage before I start digging)

Now wait, you're putting words in my mouth. I never said it was a single triangular craft. If anything, I'd -like- to believe it's a formation of some sort. However, now that I see that last object chopped into a frame-by-frame .gif, there is some changing going on there. And, admittedly, it's not triangular, and it could be illusory. I'll give you that. However, at least from what I'm watching, the bottom two points in the "triangle" seem to remain equidistant from each other. Ice particles usually can't do that; the odds are astronomical, as they are close to the camera, small, and moving in three dimensions.

Originally posted by MoreThanTheSum

Originally posted by JimOberg

Originally posted by MoreThanTheSum
As this thread has gotten its fair share of debunkers, I feel the need to ask a few questions of them, as I am of the belief that these objects are UFOs. Not necessarily aliens, but UFOs in the traditional sense.

Questions are good, since they focus on answers, and I have a standard set of "99 FAQs" that address many of your general questions on my website, here
www.jamesoberg.com/ufo.html
at the link labeled "99 FAQs on 'Space UFOs'"

Now, before responding to specific questions on THESE videos, please answer -- how can anyone fairly expect a plausible prosaic explanation for a video posted without date, without time, without names of witnesses, and basically without any evidence it's anything but a CGI prank?

That's my question. Answers, please.

You'd make a really good politician, you know that? That's one of my problems with debunkers. Dodging. I already said I'm going with the premise that the video is at least authentic, now, disprove that these are UFO's from -that- standpoint. It's not impossible to fake a video like that, but from my knowledge, these are from the official live feed--or at least snippets of it. As for witnesses, why on earth would you expect to be able to get names of witnesses from inside NASA? Either the white OR black NASA? Seriously? That's just inane. And, in conclusion, I'll offer a reply that I haven't offered anyone since 4th grade: "I asked you first."

"SuperSigma", if you haven't looked over my "99 FAQ's", you're dodging. I try to explain the general ways that normal spaceflight can create scenes exactly such as these, without recourse to extraordinary stimuli.

As to you asking "in general" first, I had answered even before you asked - -see "99 FAQs..."

As for witnesses, who the heck do you think is aboard the space shuttle, station, or in mission control -- illegal aliens with fake documents? Every NASA-related 'space UFO' video has specific people involved -- people in orbit, people in Houston -- whose names can be determined. Every one -- as long as the poser of the challenge is honest enough to provide the date/time of the event.

Are you seriously suggesting that we don't NEED to know the surrounding activity, illumination, thrusting, and other day-to-day ordinary spaceflight activities, to fully evaluate a scene? That seems to me a formula for eternal pointless speculation.

How about us both working together on some answers?

But 'dodging'.... I don't think that word means what you think it means. So far as I can tell i'm the ONLY guy hereabouts who meets real 'space ufo' events/videos dead-on with real investigation.

Originally posted by FlySolo

Originally posted by gortex
Ah back to the ISS ,or the shuttle in the case of the second video .
The only problem I have with these videos is nothing in them either changes direction or slows down , just stuff going in one direction and at a constant speed .

There are approximately 3,000 satellites operating in Earth orbit and an estimated 8,000 man-made objects , why can't the objects in the video be one of those .
Plus I don't think its a good sign when a video starts with " more NASA lies"

I have a problem with that being the case here.

If these are satellites or space junk, how can the formation change?

They can't. and they aren't.
Watch the video again...they are all moving in a straight steady line. they are just not moving all in the same direction.
The bottom appears to be moving up the whole time since it enters frame...mix that with the front thing moving down slightly, and its actually quite a normal transition of perspective.
mix with that some potential curvature of the earth or whatnot, etc...but you don't even need to take that into much consideration if you simply follow the objects from beginning to end....ignore the first second to last second and focus in on a single dot at a time..you will see no big sweeping unnatural moves.

You think its a formation change, because you want to see a formation in the first place.

Originally posted by Mr_skepticc
I have to say that 2nd video really does make me wonder. If the video hasn't been tampered with in any way, well I would really like to know what those could be. I'm gonna go with top secret jets, or some type of flying military deal we just don't know about.

Looks like you finally may be coming 'round. Except one major thing. If these are ours, then everything you believe to be true can be thrown out the window now.

reply to post by SaturnFX


Ba. Baloney. That's a changing formation.

Originally posted by MoreThanTheSum
[ I never said it was a single triangular craft. If anything, I'd -like- to believe it's a formation of some sort. However, now that I see that last object chopped into a frame-by-frame .gif, there is some changing going on there. And, admittedly, it's not triangular, and it could be illusory. I'll give you that. However, at least from what I'm watching, the bottom two points in the "triangle" seem to remain equidistant from each other. Ice particles usually can't do that; the odds are astronomical, as they are close to the camera, small, and moving in three dimensions.

Well, I take it then that you'd be surprised to learn that the Pentagon flies 'triple satellite formations' in orbit?

satobs.org...

Originally posted by JimOberg

Originally posted by MoreThanTheSum

Originally posted by JimOberg

Originally posted by MoreThanTheSum
As this thread has gotten its fair share of debunkers, I feel the need to ask a few questions of them, as I am of the belief that these objects are UFOs. Not necessarily aliens, but UFOs in the traditional sense.

Questions are good, since they focus on answers, and I have a standard set of "99 FAQs" that address many of your general questions on my website, here
www.jamesoberg.com/ufo.html
at the link labeled "99 FAQs on 'Space UFOs'"

Now, before responding to specific questions on THESE videos, please answer -- how can anyone fairly expect a plausible prosaic explanation for a video posted without date, without time, without names of witnesses, and basically without any evidence it's anything but a CGI prank?

That's my question. Answers, please.

You'd make a really good politician, you know that? That's one of my problems with debunkers. Dodging. I already said I'm going with the premise that the video is at least authentic, now, disprove that these are UFO's from -that- standpoint. It's not impossible to fake a video like that, but from my knowledge, these are from the official live feed--or at least snippets of it. As for witnesses, why on earth would you expect to be able to get names of witnesses from inside NASA? Either the white OR black NASA? Seriously? That's just inane. And, in conclusion, I'll offer a reply that I haven't offered anyone since 4th grade: "I asked you first."

"SuperSigma", if you haven't looked over my "99 FAQ's", you're dodging. I try to explain the general ways that normal spaceflight can create scenes exactly such as these, without recourse to extraordinary stimuli.

As to you asking "in general" first, I had answered even before you asked - -see "99 FAQs..."

As for witnesses, who the heck do you think is aboard the space shuttle, station, or in mission control -- illegal aliens with fake documents? Every NASA-related 'space UFO' video has specific people involved -- people in orbit, people in Hiouston -- whose names can be determined. Every one -- as long as the poser of the challenge is hionest enough to provide the date/time of the event.

Are you seriously suggesting that we don't NEED to know the surrounding activity, illumination, thrusting, and other day-to-day ordinary spaceflight activities, to fully evaluate a scene? That seems to me a formula for eternal pointless speculation.

How about us both working together on some answers?

But 'dodging'.... I don't think that word means what you think it means. So far as I can tell i'm the ONLY guy hereabouts who meets real 'space ufo' events/videos dead-on with real investigation.

Who's SuperSigma? However, to reply to your post, I've read through these types of sites before, and I was reading through this one as I was formulating a reply to you. I didn't feel it necessary to read all 99 Q&A's because I already knew what they were going to be, basically. Only this site is much more insulting, essentially calling all believers stupid, starry-eyed, and gullible, for starters. That's going to turn me off right there. Simply because I believe that 1) there is an extraterrestrial presence here on earth, 2) that presence -may- have interacted with world governments, and 3) said governments are attempting to keep it a secret, because they are more concerned about their own self-interests than what's actually good for the people, does not make me a tinfoil-hat-wearing crazy nutcase. As a matter of fact, if you're on this forum, you could practically take #3 as an axiom. I haven't heard of one actual governmental organization that really, truly, acts in the people's best interest. They act to bigger themselves and keep the power they have. And as for NASA, my point was: what kind of response do you think you're going to get if you -ask- for astronaut witnesses? I didn't say they were aliens, don't speak for me. I'm saying do you think NASA's going to just give you names? Hundreds of people, pictures, files, etc. have disappeared into that abyss, and they protect their own. Most likely, you're going to be laughed out of the office for even asking, as they've been trained to believe that there is no such thing as UFOs. Anywhere. Which, in my opinion, is a mathematical impossibility.

EDIT: @JimOberg: Yes, I would be surprised, because I was of the impression that satellites could not be flown close together for risk of collision, and obvious damage to multi-billion dollar craft. If that's the case, that is indeed interesting, however, the angle of their travel does not seem to easily lend itself to LEO craft--and don't the ISS and Space Shuttle fly lower than most satellites anyway?

Originally posted by FlySolo
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

Ba. Baloney. That's a changing formation.

Maybe they are morphing into a transformer then if you can decide what your seeing verses simply observe what is presented.

Its a glow snake wiggling around space.


no...there is no formation...if these objects were viewed a minute earler, they would more than likely be very far apart...your just getting a few seconds and thinking that before the cameras caught it, it was in the same shape as the first second it came into view.

Originally posted by LittleBlackEagle
nice vid OP, most debunkers are gonna debunk as it's their job, they know little else.

Job? Know little else? Gimme a break. This is nothing but space junk/satellites and not esoteric intergalactic alien UFOs!! Get real and please stop living in a world of make-believe and self delusion!

Also please read my signature.

Originally posted by JimOberg

Originally posted by MoreThanTheSum
[ I never said it was a single triangular craft. If anything, I'd -like- to believe it's a formation of some sort. However, now that I see that last object chopped into a frame-by-frame .gif, there is some changing going on there. And, admittedly, it's not triangular, and it could be illusory. I'll give you that. However, at least from what I'm watching, the bottom two points in the "triangle" seem to remain equidistant from each other. Ice particles usually can't do that; the odds are astronomical, as they are close to the camera, small, and moving in three dimensions.

Well, I take it then that you'd be surprised to learn that the Pentagon flies 'triple satellite formations' in orbit?

satobs.org...

Now that is interesting. Seems like a good explanation, but what makes me question this is it "disappearing" behind the earth...wouldn't that make these satellites huge? (or perhaps just the overexposure is amping up their size)

Originally posted by MoreThanTheSum
And as for NASA, my point was: what kind of response do you think you're going to get if you -ask- for astronaut witnesses? I didn't say they were aliens, don't speak for me. I'm saying do you think NASA's going to just give you names? Hundreds of people, pictures, files, etc. have disappeared into that abyss, and they protect their own. Most likely, you're going to be laughed out of the office for even asking, as they've been trained to believe that there is no such thing as UFOs. Anywhere. Which, in my opinion, is a mathematical impossibility.

Why do you even bother to discuss 'evidence', then -- if you already know for sure all the answers?

I'm baffled by your implication that NASA wouldn't tell ther public the names of flight crews and ground crews at specific times of possible incidents. Those staffs are on public record.

As for what's "most likely", I'll tell you what happens when I want to speak to an astronaut about current or historical cases. I call them, or email them, or otherwise contact them, or somebody I know who knows them, and we talk about it. I've known and worked with astronauts for forty years. Ditto flight control specialists -- I was one. You can see the pictures of me with these colleagues and friends over the years, on my website.

You seem to have woven a fantasy excuse for not doing deep research and for automatically disregarding the results of anybody else's deep research, if it conflicts with the conclusions you've already reached.

If you disagree with my research results, please criticize them with specifics, not just a plea that you're incapable of believing contrary assessments.

What about the objects moving around and forming a pattern in space on shuttle mission STS-80? What that space junk also?

If you are not familiar with the footage, here it is:

Narrated video recorded on shuttle mission STS-80.

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by FlySolo
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

Ba. Baloney. That's a changing formation.

Maybe they are morphing into a transformer then if you can decide what your seeing verses simply observe what is presented.

Its a glow snake wiggling around space.


no...there is no formation...if these objects were viewed a minute earler, they would more than likely be very far apart...your just getting a few seconds and thinking that before the cameras caught it, it was in the same shape as the first second it came into view.

What? Now you're putting words into my mouth. Well, your assuming thoughts in my head. A minute before they came into view is irrelevant. The last few seconds is what counts. In order for them to be an illusion of perspective, then all three dots would need to be connected and rotate on their axis.


Which would actually only disprove "space junk" anyway

First video, second clip: looks like what amounts to "matte lines" around the UFO. Pretty clearly CGI on that one, at least. The others...who knows?

/TOA

Originally posted by TheFlash
What about the objects moving around and forming a pattern in space on shuttle mission STS-80? What that space junk also?

If you are not familiar with the footage, here it is:

Narrated video recorded on shuttle mission STS-80.

Flash, thanks for bringing this case up.

How would a going-in naive interested party search out any real investigations of this case that suggested prosaic explanations?

How would they search out what the alleged direct eyewitnesses -- the STS-80 astronauts -- think about the UFO fleet interpretation?

Can search engines be our friend, and provide insight, or our foe, and provide only multi-retold rumor?

Here's the deal. We have all the video's of every type, every color, and every model of possible crafts. They could be anything. With today's technology it's going to take a living, or dead non-human, non-animal or species of known earth dweller's to 100% prove that life from other than earth is visiting earth.

I don't believe if we even had a video showing a real 100% alien spacecraft flying or landed. that 90% of the people including myself would believe it! There's just been too many great hoax's.

I need a body, just like in a murder. Don't give me the case of some have been convicted without the body. That doesn't play with this situation. We got to have the body or it just isn't real.