Dalai Lama Consults Trance Channeled Entities! Rare Video

I believe Buddhism to be a religion, but I chose Philosophy & Metaphysics for this OP out of respect for the Buddhist belief that they practice a philosophy rather than a religion. Regardless: It's certainly Metaphysical!

Cloaked in secrecy for over 400 years, the State Oracle of Tibet has been a strange and mystical aspect of the Tibetan Buddhist tradition. This ancient spirit, which has inhabited a succession of thirteen human mediums, advises the Dalai Lama on matters of public and religious policy. To witness the eerie spectacle of a medium entering a trance state and being possessed by the Oracle is to confront profound questions about the very nature of human consciousness.

With permission from the Dalai Lama that had never been granted before, The Oracle explores the ancient practice of consulting spirits.

The Dalai Lama is interviewed about the subject at length and not only speaks about the trance state of possession, but is actually filmed consulting the channeled entities himself.

I don't use the word "possession" lightly or as my own opinion, but, rather, use the trance channelling monks own words.

This film should also be of interest to those intrigued by the sound/vibration aspects of the Tibetan "Adepts".

In one scene the monk/oracle is surrounded by trumpets and sound. In explanation of what he experiences, the oracle states that the "possession" is preceded by vibrations that start in the feet and then a floating feeling and suddenly the trance state.

The Dalai Lama also makes the intriguing comment that some of these spirits are religious and some are not. I'm not sure because of his accent, but he seems to say that more of the spirits are Muslims and Christians than Buddhist or Hindu!

It will also be noted, that these channelled "Spirits" can be as devastatingly deceptive as all channelled entities seem to be.

At one point, two of the possessed monks seem to fiercely and violently engage each other. It's explained, however, that one of them is actually paying homage to the other!?

And did I mention the ritual murder?

Beautifully shot & nicely narrated, but in some cases, somewhat disturbing, I think you will find the film extremely fascinating.

reply to post by The GUT

Sounds like a good watch GUT, I'll check it. It reminds of the visualization practice known as Tupla and the bringing to life the deity of Yidham in the Tibetan story of how some newer monks seek spiritual guidance. I found the practice a fascinating story.

In Tibet, many young men (and some young women) suffering from a spiritual itch, apprenticed themselves to a single guru rather than follow the traditional monastic route. A few of them who showed real spiritual promise would eventually reach the point where their guru would admit he had nothing more to teach them. If they wanted to go further, they would need a far more advanced guide. To that end, the guru would advise them to meditate on the Yidam and study pictures of it in the sacred scriptures. These showed the creature to have a fearful, almost demonic aspect.
When the student was saturated in Yidam lore, he would typically be advised to find a remote cave and there create a magic circle (known as a kylkhor) using powdered chalk. The purpose of the circle was to encourage the visible appearance of the Yidam.
In order to achieve this, the pupil was instructed to visualise the Yidam within the circle. Over a period of weeks, or months, the pupil had to continue the exercise until a full-scale hallucination resulted and the Yidam appeared. At this point, the pupil would be told he was obviously favoured by the god.
But for his next step, he would have to persuade it to leave the circle.
The process might take several more months, but eventually the pupil would report that the god had stepped out of the kylkhor. He would be congratulated, then told to see if he could manage to get the Yidam to speak to him.
Once this was achieved, the goal-posts were moved again. The pupil was required to receive the Yidam’s blessing, a process that, in Tibet, involved the laying of hands on the pupil’s head.
Once the pupil reported positively on this latest task, the guru would typically tell him he had only one more step to take. He had achieved conversation with and blessing from the Yidam, but it was still confined to the cave. In order to establish the deity as his personal guru, the pupil had to persuade the Yidam to leave its circle and accompany him wherever he went. Off went the pupil to his Himalayan cave again.
With the benefit of our tulpa studies, we might suspect that the pupil was creating a fictional character, albeit one based on scriptural authority. While the appearance of the Yidam is a matter of visualisation, any conversations must require essentially the same creative input as an author writing dialogue.
The gurus who developed the exercise clearly recognised its tulpa aspect as well, for the whole experience was actually a test. If the pupil succeeded in creating a Yidam that would walk and talk with him, his teacher would tell him his studies were ended since he now had the wisest and most powerful teacher possible. But the pupil who accepted this evaluation was deemed to be a failure – and sent off to spend the rest of his life locked into a comforting hallucination.
There were, however, a few pupils who expressed doubts. They might begin to wonder if the Yidam was the god they believed it to be, or an aberration of their own perceptions. Often the guru would feign anger and send them back to the cave to redouble their efforts. But if the doubts persisted, then came the crunch.
“Do you not see the god? Do you not hear the god? Do you not feel the god when he lays his hands upon your head to impart his blessing? Is not the Yidam as real as the mighty Himalayas?” asks the guru.
The pupil agrees that he sees, hears and feels. He agrees that the Yidam seems as real and solid as the Himalayas. And yet he doubts.
At which point the guru springs his trap. The experience of the Yidam is not simply a lesson in tulpa creation. According to the insights of Tibetan spirituality, human perception of the ‘real’ world is fundamentally flawed. Not just its politics and values, not just its preconceptions and ideas, but its very structure is something other than what it appears. The world as we know it – from our friends to ourselves to the mountains above and the valleys below – ismaya, a word imported from India that translates as ‘illusion.’ What happens in the creation of a Yidam proves that absolutely.

www.newdawnmagazine.com...
Is the Yidham real grasshopper?

Man the Tibetans are the masters of mediation and have delved into spiritual matters so deeply and for so long that I truly marvel at many of their beliefs and practices, and the explicit details. The Tibetan Book Of The Dead is an example of paradigm shattering philosophies. So yes, I think I will find this vid to be fascinating and unique. Thanks

Peace,
spec

reply to post by The GUT


I read in some ex-buddhist testimonies that sometimes demons appear to those who meditate often, but then the buddhist ignores them and continues and then the spirits of other buddhist appears. I believe that buddhist literature instructs one to continue ignoring these scary things and that they are only illusions keeping you from enlightenment.

Now what I wonder is if these respected buddhist spirits are really just the same demons in disguise.

I don't want to sound like the proverbial' freak for the day' on ats, but that sounded very much like what happened to me, several weeks ago. Scared the sheet out of my family.

The vibration in my chest, which started with my feet and hands, made me feel like I would vibrate apart/disappear (including dizziness profound) from the centre of my chest first, if I didn't hold onto something man made, eg, a plastic water bottle, my cigarettes etc. and yes there was conversation... 4 days it lasted on and off

I will definitely be watching this...

Thanks very much Op
a

Interesting video OP.

I myself was hospitalized for two weeks after experiencing psychosis and thinking i was possessed with some form of saviors spirit. It was a really profound experience and as one of the talkers mentioned in the video it is hard to say where my consciousness went during my psychosis. All i can say for sure is that although i was aware of being in my body i had moments of feeling intoxicated almost drunk like.. but also i remember experiencing profound visions and a deep interconnectedness to all life. It is hard to say if these people are actually channeling spirits or if their self hypnosis is a disillusion form of psychosis. Whatever it is.. i find it strange that we are able to phase in and out of different states of consciousness and for what reason is anyone's guess..

Really enjoyed it Gut - Have read many books on Tibet. I think Science re Parallel Universes - Quantum Physics and the world of the Formless are getting ever closer.

reply to post by speculativeoptimist
Thanks for stopping by, spec, glad it caught your attention. I loved the moral of the Yidam, I would've been one of those that failed to grasp the pebble from the masters hand on that one.

Originally posted by quedup
Really enjoyed it Gut - Have read many books on Tibet. I think Science re Parallel Universes - Quantum Physics and the world of the Formless are getting ever closer.

I'm glad you enjoyed it and I think you're right, quedup: The veil separating these "worlds" is dissolving as science and spirituality are inching ever closer towards agreement and mutual acknowledgement.

I am enjoying this. I remember being so frightened as a child when I was told that a woman who was speaking in tongues was possessed by a spirit. This is such a common stream in so many religions.

Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by The GUT

 

I read in some ex-buddhist testimonies that sometimes demons appear to those who meditate often, but then the buddhist ignores them and continues and then the spirits of other buddhist appears. I believe that buddhist literature instructs one to continue ignoring these scary things and that they are only illusions keeping you from enlightenment.

Now what I wonder is if these respected buddhist spirits are really just the same demons in disguise.

I know I wouldn't want to open my body up to that. Those gentle, delicate, and peaceful looking Tibetans were transformed into maelstroms of rather intimidating force.

At one point, near the end, when the Dalai Lama was consulting the Oracles, I could swear he was even a little afraid.

The Oracles accuracy percentage is also of concern: Either these possessions are psychosomatic--which I don't think they are--or the spirit world is a dangerous place to tread.

Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by The GUT

 

I read in some ex-buddhist testimonies that sometimes demons appear to those who meditate often, but then the buddhist ignores them and continues and then the spirits of other buddhist appears. I believe that buddhist literature instructs one to continue ignoring these scary things and that they are only illusions keeping you from enlightenment.

Now what I wonder is if these respected buddhist spirits are really just the same demons in disguise.

Its been said that during Siddhartha's final push for enlightenment he was confronted by the daughters of Mara, demons who appeared as beautiful young women...so yeah man, you wonder rightly.

I believe the daughters represented the worldly lusts.

reply to post by AussieAmandaC
Ahoy Matey. Interesting experience you had and that whole vibration experience seems to be attached to the "real thing" in reports and literature.

The Astral travelers also mention body vibration before the disconnection of body and consciousness.

Had you, prior to your experience, been involved in anything that we might term "shamanistic" practices?

Glad you got your balance back.

Originally posted by Oxygenation
Interesting video OP.

I myself was hospitalized for two weeks after experiencing psychosis and thinking i was possessed with some form of saviors spirit. It was a really profound experience and as one of the talkers mentioned in the video it is hard to say where my consciousness went during my psychosis. All i can say for sure is that although i was aware of being in my body i had moments of feeling intoxicated almost drunk like.. but also i remember experiencing profound visions and a deep interconnectedness to all life. It is hard to say if these people are actually channeling spirits or if their self hypnosis is a disillusion form of psychosis. Whatever it is.. i find it strange that we are able to phase in and out of different states of consciousness and for what reason is anyone's guess..

Thanks for sharing both your experience and your lucid thinking on the subject. I found the following book a little hard to muddle through, though fascinating: The Varieties of Religious Experience by William James.

Having had my own experience of a sudden two-way communication that answered my questions quicker than my MIND could utter them--that's fast--and blasted me with pure love and rapture as well as a wisdom far beyond mine...I'm not so dismissive of other folks experience as I once might have been.

Mine was in a Christian context, and I'm a believer, but I also recognize the universality of some experiences as does William James in the aforementioned book. Peace.

Originally posted by The GUT
I think you will find the film extremely fascinating.

thats an understatement. I just watched the whole thing. awesome.
you are right .... the last 10 minutes got creepy.
All that hissssssssing during when the spirits took over ...
Doesn't seem like anything positive ..
Im' surprised by this, I didn't know about buddhist oracles and the spirits taking over like this.

Originally posted by The GUT
At one point, near the end, when the Dalai Lama was consulting the Oracles, I could swear he was even a little afraid.

THAT is when I got creeped out. Up until then I thought it was interesting, but I could handle it. But then when they had a close up of that young woman ... and they showed her and the Dali Lama ... and her eyes and the hissss'n etc etc ... I swear I felt something not good show up here while watching it.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by The GUT
At one point, near the end, when the Dalai Lama was consulting the Oracles, I could swear he was even a little afraid.

THAT is when I got creeped out. Up until then I thought it was interesting, but I could handle it. But then when they had a close up of that young woman ... and they showed her and the Dali Lama ... and her eyes and the hissss'n etc etc ... I swear I felt something not good show up here while watching it.

I was effected also, I wonder if anything good can come from things that frighten even the enlightened. I just assure myself that powerful and good spirits protect me.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by The GUT
At one point, near the end, when the Dalai Lama was consulting the Oracles, I could swear he was even a little afraid.

THAT is when I got creeped out. Up until then I thought it was interesting, but I could handle it. But then when they had a close up of that young woman ... and they showed her and the Dali Lama ... and her eyes and the hissss'n etc etc ... I swear I felt something not good show up here while watching it.

I wonder if he was more afraid of it jumping ON him...or IN him.

Originally posted by AussieAmandaC
I don't want to sound like the proverbial' freak for the day' on ats, but that sounded very much like what happened to me, several weeks ago. Scared the sheet out of my family.

The vibration in my chest, which started with my feet and hands, made me feel like I would vibrate apart/disappear (including dizziness profound) from the centre of my chest first, if I didn't hold onto something man made, eg, a plastic water bottle, my cigarettes etc. and yes there was conversation... 4 days it lasted on and off

I will definitely be watching this...

Thanks very much Op
a

There are those who would tell you to get your heart checked. There are those who will say these Oracles are just schizophrenics. Science does not really appear to have an answer. I have been "zapped" by things, glad to know I am not the only nut.

That was incredible. Thank you Gut for bringing this to our attention.
Some great questions being asked here - what is consciousness and what are it's limitations/aspects? The interdependent model suggests that it may flow through and around us like air, something we can share without realizing.
Looking at the headdresses brought a question to mind: are what we see in ancient carvings of what have been described as "war helmets" actually ceremonial headdresses? What is their function? It's not for show as they wear in them in private ceremonies. Do they somehow facilitate the process of mediums/oracles? Are they gateways to allow consciousness to flow from and into ourselves? This film has me wondering.