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posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 01:12 PM
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Originally posted by FosterVS

Here's a link, it's not like it is secret info:
www.dreamlandresort.com...

March 22, 1989: First Wednesday night trip to Tikaboo Valley to view disc test.
Observers were Bob Lazar, Tracy Lazar, Gene Huff and John Lear, using Lear's RV. Lear was the only one who saw the elliptical shaped light through a telescope and the total sighting lasted about 7 minutes. (1)

March 29, 1989: Second Wednesday night trip to view test.
Observers were Bob Lazar, Tracy Lazar, Gene Huff and Jim Tagliani. They took a videotape of a moving light with a timestamp of 8:30 PM shown on the tape. (1) (2) (9)

April 5, 1989: Third Wednesday night trip to view test.
Observers were Bob Lazar, Tracy Lazar, her sister, Gene Huff and John Lear. They were discovered by guards and detained and questioned by the Lincoln County Sheriff. (1) (14)




Amazing! Now that wasn't so hard now WAS it? Sheesh!!


(Even though the Tom Mahood musings have been around since the covered wagon days. :lol



Anyway, thanks for popping in to answer that question that seemed such a mystery to certain parties here!

A star for you direct from me just for being able to answer that simple question.



That was just as amazing as the fact that no one was aware that Bob did film the tests out there, hence the need for this thread.

The point I was making, was that even though geriac was oblivious as to who the additional witnesses were, he was nonetheless prepared to call them all liars, without even knowing who they were and what they had to say.

Even your vaunted Tom Mahood states in your link "I think most of Lazar's friends sincerely believe his story and are not involved in any complicity to put it over on the rest of us."

Oh is that right? That must mean all his friends except for the ones who witnessed the tests with him right?



A suggestion to anyone who has any doubt that Lazar's tale is, how can I put this politely.... "fabrications of an intelligent mind" ( and I use the term intelligent loosely...), I suggest you read further:
www.dreamlandresort.com...


I agree completely. Reading much further in many places will help erase much of the disinformation floated out there, and the need for me having to start such obvious threads. Your link is indeed one of the most voluminous and well known (or should be by now sheesh) debunker sites.

Readers will note that Tom makes frequent use of prefacing statements with derogatory pejoratives intended to bias one's opinion before you have even read it, much like Foster's statement above.

Frequent use of cursing is also intended to endear Tom to readers, along with unproven blanket statements such as "Lazar is lying through his teeth!!"

Also note how many 'un- named secret sources' he cannot disclose he assures us are for real and 'have inside knowledge' that 'know for sure Bob is lying'.

Quite disingenuous considering Tom is yet another Johnny come lately who is no position to know for certain either way.


Honest skeptics withOUT an agenda to pursue, freely admit that the case currently can not be -conclusively- be proven either way, but in their opinion the evidence doesn't look good for Bob.

I can agree with the first part, but disagree with their perspective on the second.

--->




posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 01:16 PM
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continued...



Are you one of the 5, A51Watcher?


No.

But I do know who is.

Again... no big secret there if one is up to speed on the evidence.



You seem to have some connection to this incident that you can't or won't disclose.



You must have not read this thread. I'm pretty sure that by this point my connection to this incident is quite clear.



P.S. - "you can't or won't disclose"


I never avoid questions.

I do however answer them in their proper order.


A51




posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 01:33 PM
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reply to post by gariac
 


Does the same 'no school record' mean that your President is also a liar? Or that history can and will be erased at the request of those with sufficient power and something sinister to hide?



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 01:37 PM
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reply to post by ProfessorT
 


All good points I can agree with ProfessorT.

Thanks for posting.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 01:58 PM
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Now, shall we move on to the next item up for debate that remains unanswered?


Any idea on how many occasions they saw what?


The question of how many occasions has been settled.

The question remains of what movements they saw impossible for an advanced military aircraft. (Or a Janet flight for that matter :lol



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 02:06 PM
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reply to post by EarthCitizen07
 


Again... good points I agree with EarthCitizen07. You would think that some should be pretty obvious.

Thanks for posting.


(As for that Pimander character, don't know what he's on about though eh?
)



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 03:27 PM
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reply to post by BadNinja68
 


And yet even more good points I can agree with BadNinja68.


Sorry for the late reply, as you saw I was momentarily distracted by a disinformation attempt.


Thanks for the post.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 03:36 PM
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reply to post by youdidntseeme
 


And further apologies to youdidntseeme. Your posts accurately portray the dilemma faced by any of the public that are up to speed on the evidence, namely that the case currently can not be proven conclusively either way, leaving many on the fence.

Thanks for the post.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 03:45 PM
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Bob Lazar got debunked hard as a fraud already

Lazar is a liar.


www.disclose.tv...



Google Video Link



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 03:54 PM
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reply to post by Ops4Ops
 


Hey Ops4Ops thanks for the kudos. Nice to see there are many members who have not bought the disinformation about this case isn't it?



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 04:10 PM
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Originally posted by Cito

Bob Lazar got debunked hard as a fraud already


Merely opinion on your part. Many debunkers have indeed worked hard to debunk him, none have succeeded.



Lazar is a liar.


Mere opinion on your part.

The 'proof' you provide is a pretty weak attempt by Stanton, refusing to go into detail, hurling vague generalities which most anyone can see the holes in his 'concerns' as having alternate explanations.

Sheesh even Foster's dreamlandresort link does a better job than that weak clip.


Edit to add: That's about as useful as someone buying a tank of gas and driving out to the warning signs, looking around and saying "Gee no Flying Saucers here, Bob must have been lying!"

It would be nice if you debunkers could state your position you believe valid by yourself, and support it yourself, instead of linking to some debunker website, or some video.

I am not debating some http addy, I am debating you and your knowledge, or lack thereof.





edit on 22-1-2012 by A51Watcher because: another A-D-D case lol



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 05:03 PM
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reply to post by InsideYourMind
 


Hey InsideYourMind, thanks for the post pointing out even more common sense perspectives.

I can't believe how many I got behind on while dealing with disinformation attempts.


I am starting to change my opinion on how rampant member ignorance is around here thanks to you and the others.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 05:11 PM
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reply to post by A51Watcher
 


The debate is long over. You lost. Now all that is left is pontificating.

It would be nice if Bob Lazar spent 1% the effort you spent to defend his story. But alas, Lazar, provided he is still alive, just faded away into obscurity.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 05:41 PM
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Originally posted by gariac
reply to post by A51Watcher
 


The debate is long over. You lost. Now all that is left is pontificating.

It would be nice if Bob Lazar spent 1% the effort you spent to defend his story. But alas, Lazar, provided he is still alive, just faded away into obscurity.


I don't think Lazar wants to prove anything, frankly he doesn't care if you belive him or not. Faded is what he wants.



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 06:01 PM
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Originally posted by gariac
reply to post by A51Watcher
 

The debate is long over. You lost. Now all that is left is pontificating. It would be nice if Bob Lazar spent 1% the effort you spent to defend his story. But alas, Lazar, provided he is still alive, just faded away into obscurity.


Bob is apparently alive and doing quite well, right here:
www.unitednuclear.com...

It's hard to find any link there to ol' Bob, however there is a Youtube video if you click on his Hydrogen Fuel Systems link.

Great idea, except where to get that pesky hydrogen.... well, there's water, and electricity, and the electricity comes from.... DOH. Oh wait, there's those solar panels. So how many panels and how long to crack water to fill those pretty tanks.... DOH.

And ol' Bob shows up as the contact on the records for that domain:
UNITED NUCLEAR
9607 PRICE RD.
LAINGSBURG, MI 48848
Administrative Contact: (704527-DRSS)
Lazar, Bob sales@unitednuclear.com
9607 Price Rd.
Laingsburg MI 48848 US
517-651-5635

It still amazes me that the whole Lazar issue is even discussed, never mind debated. It should have been laid to rest long ago in the ample manure that ol' Bob dropped...



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 08:46 PM
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reply to post by Pr0t0
 


The fact President Obama hasn't released his college records doesn't mean they don't exist. Another big hint is you don't get to be the editor of Harvard Law Review without going to Harvard. It is a student run organization.
www.harvardlawreview.org...

Anything else you need debunked?



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 08:50 PM
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reply to post by FosterVS
 


Let me get this straight. Are you implying everything you read on the internet isn't true!!!!

paranormalutopia.com...

Damn, that means Bob's badge could be a fake too. Oh, I must search youtube for more truthier truth!



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 09:04 PM
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Originally posted by A51Watcher
How about you Cosmic911?

You seem to be one of the few honest skeptics able to debate in a intelligent and adult manner, and are 'equipped' to do so.

Care to take up any of the 'concerns' raised so far?


If not, if no one (of merit) objects, we will move on to some more (apparently) unknown facts about this case.



edit on 4-1-2012 by A51Watcher because: the usual


I haven't looked at this thread in awhile...just looking at it again tonight. I hate to say it but everyone has good ideas on what's going on. I know that's a horrible stance to take but right now my brain is turned off...bedtime soon lol



posted on Jan, 22 2012 @ 09:23 PM
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Originally posted by A51Watcher
Amazing! Now that wasn't so hard now WAS it? Sheesh!!

(Even though the Tom Mahood musings have been around since the covered wagon days. :lol


And Tom did such a good job spanking Bob's ass, no one else has needed to muse any further.


Anyway, thanks for popping in to answer that question that seemed such a mystery to certain parties here!
A star for you direct from me just for being able to answer that simple question.


I am a regular here, I don't just "pop in". Keep your star, I don't need it. Anyone with the patience to read through all the drivel could have answered the question.


That was just as amazing as the fact that no one was aware that Bob did film the tests out there, hence the need for this thread. The point I was making, was that even though geriac was oblivious as to who the additional witnesses were, he was nonetheless prepared to call them all liars, without even knowing who they were and what they had to say.


Was it Bob, or one of the Fab Five that filmed the "event(s)"? Regardless - Bob filmed what "he claimed" were tests. I am with gariac on this topic, I believe it was either a Janet flight or a military jet flight. Hell, it could have been mil flares, and the funky movements caused by the common gusty winds in the area. I had the awning almost ripped off my holiday trailer parked in Rachel on one trip to the range. You have been there... haven't you?


Even your vaunted Tom Mahood states in your link "I think most of Lazar's friends sincerely believe his story and are not involved in any complicity to put it over on the rest of us." Oh is that right? That must mean all his friends except for the ones who witnessed the tests with him right?


Again, it almost reads like you were there, one of the Fab Five.



A suggestion to anyone who has any doubt that Lazar's tale is, how can I put this politely.... "fabrications of an intelligent mind" ( and I use the term intelligent loosely...), I suggest you read further:
www.dreamlandresort.com...

I agree completely. Reading much further in many places will help erase much of the disinformation floated out there, and the need for me having to start such obvious threads. Your link is indeed one of the most voluminous and well known (or should be by now sheesh) debunker sites.

Readers will note that Tom makes frequent use of prefacing statements with derogatory pejoratives intended to bias one's opinion before you have even read it, much like Foster's statement above.

Frequent use of cursing is also intended to endear Tom to readers, along with unproven blanket statements such as "Lazar is lying through his teeth!!"


Yes, being coldly factual would probably have served Tom better, instead of expressing his outrage at this fraud and his cohorts. For example - I always enjoy reading posts by Shadowhawk, spanking some poor poster here, and elsewhere, with the pure facts.


Also note how many 'un-named secret sources' he cannot disclose he assures us are for real and 'have inside knowledge' that 'know for sure Bob is lying'. Quite disingenuous considering Tom is yet another Johnny come lately who is no position to know for certain either way. Honest skeptics withOUT an agenda to pursue, freely admit that the case currently can not be -conclusively- be proven either way, but in their opinion the evidence doesn't look good for Bob. I can agree with the first part, but disagree with their perspective on the second --->



Are you one of the 5, A51Watcher?
No. But I do know who is. Again... no big secret there if one is up to speed on the evidence.


Bob Lazar, Tracy Lazar, Tracy Lazar's sister, Gene Huff, John Lear, Jim Tagliani - oops wait... that's six!

Who of these six would be qualified to make any kind of determination what it was they were seeing?
- Jim Tagliani - "a friend of ours who was then trying to get clearance to work as an electronics technician at the stealth fighter base on the Tonopah Test Range" - might explain where Lazar got the "S-4" location from.
- Gene Huff - real estate appraiser
- John Lear - pilot and known loon

Who is "Tumbleweed Films"? Is that yours? Here's a tip - make the text overlays over your video legible, not some whacky font in italics.
"Forget the rumors and disinformation about AREA 51, here is an actual video log of the U.S. Government's test flight program of recovered Alien Craft viewed from Public Land - Part 1" - oh wow, can you get any more presumptuous than that?

I think I see where this is headed. Someone thinks enough time has passed, but the Lazar name hasn't quite faded from the public consciousness - maybe it's time to spam together a "documentary" of sorts, see if it can't be farmed around, looking for a buyer...
edit on 22-1-2012 by FosterVS because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 23 2012 @ 02:09 AM
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Originally posted by FosterVS

I am a regular here, I don't just "pop in".


Your post indicates quite the opposite.



Keep your star, I don't need it. Anyone with the patience to read through all the drivel could have answered the question.


oooooh! Touchy touchy aren't we?


Complete dismissal of the entire thread without reading it. How convenient.

I take back the star.



I am with gariac on this topic


How sad for you. Identifying with him on anything is clearly not a smart move at this

point.



I believe it was either a Janet flight or a military jet flight. Hell, it could have been

mil flares, and the funky movements caused by the common gusty winds in the area.


'mil flares' now??


'funky movements' caused by winds??


(military flares... yeah, THAT's the ticket! MIL-itary flares!... sure!... THAT's what it

was!
... on little teeny weeny remote control... uh... HELICOPTERS! Yeah.. that's it!)


'funky movements' caused by winds??


I thought you were with geriac on this one, the 'funky movements' being caused by camera wobble. You two have a huddle and then get back to us.

Even flares suspended from mini RC helicopters don't fit the bill for what was seen, sorry.

But thanks for demonstrating that you are not sure which of the above 3 it might have been.

Why not sure? Simple - because you were not there.

Also conveniantly ignored is the slow motion evidence which does does not conform to any of your fab 3.

And the people that WERE actually there say nothing of the kind.


I will however take those as on- topic for the current question at hand.

I will note for the record your 'guess' on the fab 3, as being the postition of the debunker side, since you are the only debunker posting so far that displays the ability to put 2 cogent thoughts together and relate them in a coherent sentence to the point raised by the member addressing them. Another star for you!


--->





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