Florida's urine test for poor people yields results

Originally posted by Makeshift

Originally posted by here4awhile
reply to post by pshea38

 

And if you're willing to do that how about you take entitlement away from people who eat too much red meat? Or drink too much pop? Or...by god...spank their children!!

How bout that?

Those things you mention are all legal. Drugs are not. If you want to collect welfare then you cannot do illegal things. Especially when the govt help can be used to facilitate such illegal activities. Why should any tax payer have to pay for anybody else's illegal drugs?

'If you want to collect welfare then you cannot do illegal things' eh?

Hmmm...seemed to work out fine when at least two US presidents and a UK prince or two, not to mention a current UK prime minister did 'illegal things'. The have all managed to pick up their 'welfare cheques' from the public purse have they not? And lead a large chink of the Western world for a long while...

Mind you, they reckon they 'didn't inhale', so that's fine then.

Ridiculous hypocrisy from the have's towards the have nots..yet again.

Simply put, if you are doing ANY illegal drugs you dont DESERVE one cent from the hardworking tax payers who support those programs....I wish this was going on in every state, they need to make this a national, not just a florida thing....Drug addicts dont deserve anything and no i dont feel bad for them....

Aside from our rights prohibiting unwarranted searches, I guess there's also a question of intent. I mean, these are politicians during a severe recession. The government... all of them, federal, state and local types, are looking for ways to fill the coffers. It's not like there would be any more money in your pocket if the food stamp program was suddenly stopped.

That extra cash would just be rerouted to some other expense account, not refunded to you.

Poor folks are easy victims, too. They can't afford a high priced lawyer to fight their court battles... so it would naturally fall to some organization like the ACLU... and we'd blame them for that as well.

Another thing that is happening is that municipalities across the country are raising the fines and fees for traffic violations. What used to be a $50 fine is now $150. We've seen the return of the old speed trap in some places where you don't actually have to break the law to get cited. You will just pay up at the ticket window at the courthouse so you don't have to take time for a court appearance that won't do you a bit of good anyway.

No matter. My guess is that this law will see at least one instance where someone is kicked off the assistance rolls who didn't really deserve it. They will pull that aforementioned ACLU to the fray and the law will be removed by the state assembly or struck down by a court. Right or wrong, I don't see it going anywhere but out the door.

I'agreed,just because you know how to "study" for the test doesn,t make you fit for the job,but I also do not agree with giving away taxpayer money to a lot of the reciepiants.I'm lower middle class,you know ,the ones on their way to extinction,not highly educated,just a working man with a little more than a lot of the people you think 'liberties'are being violated.Give me a break,I've personally seen many abuse the system,and that"s part of whats wrong with this country today.Why work when it will be handed to you?I've benefited from the system,I was out of work for 9 months,I have kids to feed so I applied for and recieved assistance,would I have thought my liberties where being violated because I was asked to take a drug test? No.It's not any different than any of the wages I recieve,I should be fit for employment!!!

Originally posted by 1SawSomeThings
It's all just part of the incremental prep of the American psyche for more police state domination.

In a few years (or less), you will be piss/blood or hair tested to renew drivers licenses, get insurance, obtain any certifications or licenses, any thing you need from the state to be able to exist.

Searching your bodily fluids without cause or suspicion is the same IMO as searching your home, a violation of the 4th Amendment:

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Place to be searched, one's body, persons or things to be seized: bodily fluids or hair.

All the "well if you aren't doing anything wrong you have nothing to worry about" pollyanna types will be so happy by then.

Bravo!!!...I agree 100%!!

What this essentially amounts to is forfeiting your Constitutional Rights in order to receive public assistance. I am pretty certain should anyone have refused to take the test that their benefits would have been denied or cut off.

This is yet another fine example of how our rights are being eroded at both the State and Federal levels. I do not advocate the use of drugs, but that is only a personal opinion and outlook. A personal opinion and outlook that is protected by the right of free speech (at this point in time) and not dependant upon the social view or morality of it. So it does not matter if people who do drugs are scum sucking bottom dwellers or not. They still have rights as well, and in this case it would appear the vast majority (98%) of law abiding citizens had their rights violated not to mention the humiliation of being "profiled" for being poor. All to save the State $100,000 a year....or the annual wage of perhaps 2-3 blue collar State workers.

As for the Gov. owning a stake in the company....that is just shear and blatant conflict of interest. It would interesting to know if anything is ever to come of this. I surmise it will be brushed under the rug in the name of "the greater good".

In a few years (or less), you will be piss/blood or hair tested to renew drivers licenses, get insurance, obtain any certifications or licenses, any thing you need from the state to be able to exist.

Lets not forget DNA samples, retinal scans, and RF chips. It is already a requirement to have a biometric screening performed in order to receive a visa to visit the UK.

I read the MSM, and ATS every day with filters in place. The myriad of advances and encroachment methods being used to subdue the populace into a Police State is simply mind boggling.....and it is working! Get ready for it Folks!!

Originally posted by jhn7537
Simply put, if you are doing ANY illegal drugs you dont DESERVE one cent from the hardworking tax payers who support those programs....I wish this was going on in every state, they need to make this a national, not just a florida thing....Drug addicts dont deserve anything and no i dont feel bad for them....

Again, you assume they never paid any taxes.

Check this out. You'll see it's not always the case.

Originally posted by jhn7537
Simply put, if you are doing ANY illegal drugs you dont DESERVE one cent from the hardworking tax payers who support those programs....I wish this was going on in every state, they need to make this a national, not just a florida thing....Drug addicts dont deserve anything and no i dont feel bad for them....

Because everyone knows that everything that the government deems 'illegal' is terrible.
Drug user ≠ Drug addict.

Also, let's make the politicians take drug tests, what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

Originally posted by RedGod

Originally posted by jhn7537
Simply put, if you are doing ANY illegal drugs you dont DESERVE one cent from the hardworking tax payers who support those programs....I wish this was going on in every state, they need to make this a national, not just a florida thing....Drug addicts dont deserve anything and no i dont feel bad for them....

Again, you assume they never paid any taxes.

Check this out. You'll see it's not always the case.

Grat! I have paid taxes for 30 years. I assume you have no objection to me taking a few years off and feeding at the public teat for that time? Why should I miss out on all the freebies?

reply to post by relpobre000


At least the politicians are educated people who want to work, most welfare recipients are worthless, lazy, drug addicts...I dont care to support ANY of them.....I'm SICK of lazy people, if you cant make it work in America than you have some serious problems....This is the land of opportunity, make something of yourself, stop being a worthless leech on society...Welfare recipients literally do NOTHING for this country, but bleed us dry...

Originally posted by jhn7537
reply to post by relpobre000

 

At least the politicians are educated people who want to work, most welfare recipients are worthless, lazy, drug addicts...I dont care to support ANY of them.....I'm SICK of lazy people, if you cant make it work in America than you have some serious problems....This is the land of opportunity, make something of yourself, stop being a worthless leech on society...Welfare recipients literally do NOTHING for this country, but bleed us dry...

No, the politicians don't want to work, that's why they're politicians.

Other than that I have nothing to say to you. Given the gross generalizations in this quote, I assume that you live in a terribly small world with your eyes shut and your fingers in your ears.

Good day.

I'm 100% behind drug testing for state benifits. I have to get drug tested to earn a living, so why should people getting support that my tax dollars pay, be treated differently?

Make it illegal for an employer to drug test the employees, no drug testing in the military, no drug testing of probation/parol subject, and then I will say it's unfair to drug test people getting state aid.

Edited to add: No one is forced to take state aid. This is not like the government randomly selecting people to be drug tested. You sign up to be in the system, to get benifits, and with that you give more information to the government then a normal person. Did you know that if you want food stamps they want your finantial information? GASP! If someone wants aid and chooses not to use the state, they should find it in thier community, like local churches.... how it used to be.

reply to post by relpobre000


Why should I care to support welfare recipients??? Why am I working my tail off for them? I'm here on this planet to look out for myself, I came from nothing, I paid my own way through college working multiple jobs and I made it work, these people who take welfare can do what i did, its not impossible....

what i wonder is what these people will do, that dont get welfare anymore. Crime, when survival instinct kicks in is my first bet. They need to survive after all. This leads to prison and a heavy burden on society, not least all the tax money required to imprison them, which ends up far more expensive then just giving them their welfare cheque.

Originally posted by relpobre000
Also, let's make the politicians take drug tests, what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

LMAO!!! You KNOW that would never happen.

Drug test to secure a federal job? CHECK

Drug test to secure financial assistance? CHECK

Drug test to secure a job overseeing a country? WTF?!? No way, man. No friggin way.

And that is what they say. The boss doesn't have to do anything, nice coc aine habit... but the employees, well...

I'm for a safe work environment. Some illicit drugs have no impact on performance. Sure, I wouldn't trust a stoner like myself to drive a rig across the interstates, but I would not have any problem with a doctor who used green, or a graphic designer, or a receptionist. You'd probably be surprised at how many people use green responsibly, to their advantage, or just a bit once or twice.

Actually, for all you "all drugs are bad" people, what's your addiction? Everyone has an addiction. Some spread it out thin across an array, some focus it on specific things. Money, food, shoes, pokemon, Elvis memorabilia, make-up, make-up sex, sex in general, even more "general" sex, beer, poker, lighters, matches, fire, water, pills, cleanliness, vanity, marbles, stamps, gold, things with dolphins on them, coffee, creamer, doughnuts, driving fast, working on cars, electronics, writing your name on everything you own, post-its...

I say, screw it... let's test everyone! Medicare... gotta pee in this. SS... gotta pee in this. Diabetics have access to a LOT of needles... What about all the people milking the VA for "meds"? Oh, those aren't druggies... those are American War Veterans! Don't talk bad about vets, boy...

Originally posted by sonofliberty1776
Grat! I have paid taxes for 30 years. I assume you have no objection to me taking a few years off and feeding at the public teat for that time? Why should I miss out on all the freebies?

Sure, if you meet the requirements then be my guest. Of course, here in FL, in order to qualify for unemployment compensation you can't have quit your job, or have been terminated for less than favorable reasons (negligence, poor performance, theft, etc.). Pretty much, it has to have been a medical need, non-renewal of contracting work, downsizing, or closure of business.

Now, of course, there's still ways to manipulate the system. But just because they exist, doesn't mean everyone is using them. Just because I was on public assistance, doesn't mean I'm a lazy scumbag who didn't want to work. Just because I smoked a little pot at night so I could sleep doesn't mean I sat on my couch all day in my underwear smoking joint after joint and letting my son stick his fingers in the sockets.

Originally posted by here4awhile

Originally posted by pshea38
Next let's take all welfare entitlements from those who drink alcohol and/or
smoke tobacco.
Fair is only fair.

And if you're willing to do that how about you take entitlement away from people who eat too much red meat? Or drink too much pop? Or...by god...spank their children!!

How bout that?

edit on 28-8-2011 by here4awhile because: (no reason given)

edit to add: I failed to see the sarcasm here...I have thus thoroughly facepalmed myself...thx

edit on 28-8-2011 by here4awhile because: facepalm

Your comparisons are down right stupid. The amount of chemicals not to mention the millions that day yearly from smoking is terrible how is even legal?

alcohol should be a privilege. Just hate hearing then news about some drunken dumb-ass kills family.

This program seems to fly in the face of supposed small govt. republicans. Just goes to show repub's and dem's both want a big govt. the only difference is what part's of your lives they want to control.

reply to post by stillsearchin

Why I think mandatory drug testing for welfare is a waste of money

The welfare recipients that are being tested are actually low wage earners (yes this testing is only for folks already working), so they were probably drug tested by their employer (even McDonalds / Wal-Mart drug tests) ...so why do we need to waste tax dollars on this again ? The low fail % I think bears this out.

As for someone unable to work due to say severe MS, or Severe Mental illness, who are more likely to have substance abuse issues, are we saying they should starve if they do drugs? Employers drug test (other than to receive government subsidies) to ensure employee's are able to ensure recreational activities do not impact their ability to perform their jobs. We hardly need to test that in these circumstances.

Originally posted by fbipeeperjr
I'm 100% behind drug testing for state benifits. I have to get drug tested to earn a living, so why should people getting support that my tax dollars pay, be treated differently?

Make it illegal for an employer to drug test the employees, no drug testing in the military, no drug testing of probation/parol subject, and then I will say it's unfair to drug test people getting state aid.

I would say this is a gross exaggeration to some extent. Personally I feel drug testing in the work place is also a violation of the Fourth Amendment. Drug testing in the work place should be illegal. What is done off "company time" is no ones business.

Let us call this "Drug testing 1.0". Since everyone is willing to give up their Constitutional Rights in order to NOT be fired, or to have the "right" to get a job ... this has taken root and is now common place and "accepted by all". I don't do drugs but when I had to take a test as well as ongoing tests...I was infuriated at the implication and infringement that it created.

Now the gate has been opened and precedence set, Enter "Drug testing 2.0". Again look how it bear similar resemblance to gaining and retaining employment... they kinda have everyone by the boo boo now don't they!!

Once the erosion of liberty has been established and accepted by the people, that opens the gates allows the next step to be taken. I wonder what "Drug testing 3.0" could be in the future?

As far as doing away with drug testing for a our military... once you join the military you are Federal Government property. You don't have the exact same rights as a citizen. If you don't believe me, try to exercise your First Amendment right of free speech against the Commander and Chief and see what happens or perhaps your opinion if the war you may or may not be fighting is just or legal....you will probably pay for it.

Concerning convicted criminals... well they broke the law, got caught, and must pay the price. If part of that price is a drug test, then they brought them upon themselves.

Originally posted by Makeshift

Originally posted by here4awhile
reply to post by pshea38

 

And if you're willing to do that how about you take entitlement away from people who eat too much red meat? Or drink too much pop? Or...by god...spank their children!!

How bout that?

Those things you mention are all legal. Drugs are not. If you want to collect welfare then you cannot do illegal things. Especially when the govt help can be used to facilitate such illegal activities. Why should any tax payer have to pay for anybody else's illegal drugs?

For the simple reason that a lot of unemployed people are in nervous breakdown , sad anxious or stressed , you know im sure pretty that a lot of people doesnt take drug for fun there is most of the time a reason behind it , maybe a crappy life ahead or to ease the pain. Same goes for smoking and drinking too.
Welfare is here to help ease the pain as well , im pretty sure the day you will be kicked out of your job like a # not understanding why and why did they do that to you after the time you invested your life in this company you will probably think differently...
Usualy people that spit on welfare recipient are people that never knew unemployement , sometime retired people that lived in another era where job were easy to find and you could keep it for life.

this society is sick , ill and what you witness is only the result of it a product of it.