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Japan declares 'nuclear emergency' after quake

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posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 01:45 PM
reply to post by 1SawSomeThings

They're not dumbing down the people, I'm not sure that is a possibility...

They are feeding them morsels of information in digestable portions at specific intervals because if they gave it to them all at once they would gag and many die from asphixiation...from Tokyo to Chernobyl.

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 01:46 PM
reply to post by sunrisetomorrow2011

Could the Japanese government secretly be working with TEPCO to create nuclear weapons?

I am concerned about the same thing, although I have no proof. I believe they are trying to develop neutron beam weaponry based on using spent fuel to both power and provide the weaponry.

That explains the slip of the tongue mentioning neutron beams (I just don't fully believe it was just a translation error, sorry) as well as the secrecy around the disaster. Japan has an inordinate amount of spent fuel in this plant.


posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 01:51 PM

Originally posted by Kailassa

Originally posted by butcherguy
I am certain that if I was pumping radioactive chlorine into the ocean that takes 300,000 years to disappear, the MSM would make a pretty big deal of it. If a corporation does it, no mention of the story.

Has anyone seen a reference in the MSM to the amounts of radioactive chlorine released and the very long half-life it has? Maybe I missed it.

You're talking about Chlorine-36,......
Even after 600,000 years, it has not disappeared. Each 300,000 years half of the Chlorine-36 that was there at the beginning of that 300,000 years disappears. It's never all gone.

Ah the beauty of Zeno's paradox , but even though it's a HUGE amount of radioactive chlorine it IS FINITIE , but even it if wasn't one can still get a finite sum from the addition of an infinite series, at some point millions of years from now the last radioactive atom of chlorine from this disaster will puff away, but unfortuneately in the mean time :

Winter currents

Summer currents

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 01:52 PM
reply to post by sunrisetomorrow2011

I think it's strange too. If they knew, why didn't they tell everyone? They must have a secret to hide. I think it might have been nuclear weapons.

I don't have any reason to think they were trying to hide anything related to weapons.

I think they just didn't know how to tell the world that this is a giant clusterf--- and they have no idea how to handle it.

Pride, we all have it. It goes before a fall, and if some "supra-national" authority (for lack of a better phrase unfortunately) doesn't do something soon, so will very many people, wildlife, ecosystems, oceanic resources..........................

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 01:55 PM

Originally posted by BKGump
Recipe for disaster:
Heat Uranium dioxide (fuel rods)
Add chlorine gas (from vaporized seawater)
Create Uranyl chloride (yellow rain)
Vent to atmosphere and dump into ocean

So that's what Grandma meant when she said not to eat the yellow snow.

Stay out of the rain and pray God shall send us help.

- the ancient Deus ex Machina cop-out.

I do believe in a god, but a god who helps us help ourselves, not one who interferes via miracles.

The human spirit is a wonderful thing when we become responsible, caring, self motivating adults.
It's a pity fear, laziness and greed prevent so many from getting to that stage.

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 01:55 PM
reply to post by SDoradus

Do you think it will increase another 10% tomorrow? That would put the Ci/gallon at 2.29 ... I bet we see less than that and maybe even a decrease.

Iodine is not very soluble in water, which explains why the I-131 is not increasing... the water is probably already saturated with the stuff. The other elements are probably not saturated, so they would be able to increase in intensity.

So I wouldn't say a 10% increase, but I would expect an increase. Now this brings up another eye-opener: if the I-131 is saturated, meaning the water cannot hold any more of it, where would you think any remaining I-131 is going if not into the water? The air!

Not good. That radioactive cloud over Fukushima is still growing...


posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 01:55 PM
reply to post by mrbillshow

Radiation levels of more than 1,000 millisieverts per hour

Anybody know whether Tepco managed to elaborate and give an exact figure? Could it be 9,800 milliseverts, or 2460? Who knows from this sound-bite? Why didn't the journalists clarify that?

That bit about not wanting to mislead the public was fairly carefully worded too?

I find the way these briefings are given is generally very skillfully handled and the guy here was no exeption. I may not like what I hear but you have to hand it to them, they generally manage to pull off all of these "interviews" and "press briefings" in a way that gets the headlines/coverage they wanted, and seem to keep the discussion framed around the usually vague (under scrutiny) information that they do give rather than the contextual details and surrounding data that they don't, IMO.

Perhaps something is changing with Edano's criticism of the million milliseverts mishap though?

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 01:55 PM

Originally posted by OneisOne


I went searching for a transcript of the press conference and could not find one. I did find a LA Times article referencing it. You can read that article here.

The quote from that article that struck me was

"The question is, what is a reasonable interval to give people information?" said Dr. Robert Peter Gale, an American physician and expert on radiation who consulted on the 1986 nuclear disaster in Chernobyl and is now advising Japan's government. "Instead of just releasing each data point you get, sometimes it's better to base things on an average of readings over a period of time."

Yes because governments always tell the truth....

About Dr. Robert Peter Gale from The Foreign Correspondents' Club of Japan's website.

Dr. Robert Peter Gale, Update on His Trip To Fukushima Two weeks after a magnitude 9.0 earthquake triggered a huge tsunami that severely damaged a Japanese nuclear power plant, the situation is still not under control. And fears of radiation exposure and food and water safety are now coming to the forefront.

Dr. Robert Peter Gale, a specialist of medical relief efforts for the Chernobyl and Tokaimura nuclear accidents, who spoke at the FCCJ upon his recent arrival to Japan, has kindly agreed to come to the Club again following a research trip to the Fukushima area to share his observations and analysis of the situation. One of the world's top specialists on cancer immunology and radiation, Dr. Gale was asked by the government of the previous Soviet Union to coordinate medical relief efforts for victims of the Chernobyl accident. In 1999 he was asked by the government of Japan to help treat victims of the nuclear criticality accident in Tokaimura NPP.

Dr. Gale was born in New York City in 1945. In 1976 he received a Ph.D. in microbiology and immunology from UCLA following doctoral work focusing on cancer immunology (with John Fahey). From 1973-1993, h e was on the faculty of the UCLA School of Medicine in the Department of Medicine, Division of Hematology & Oncology where he focused on the molecular biology, immunology and the treatment of leukemia. He also developed the bone marrow transplant program supported by the NIH. At UCLA, he was active in the Department of Psychology, where he and his colleagues studied interactions between stress, immunity and cancer.

Just the averages?


Because we're all knuckle-dragging uneducated savages who can't even figure out how to wipe our own backsides.

Breath, just breath.

Oh wait, that migt not be too healthy for much longer...

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 01:58 PM
reply to post by monica86

Is there a technical reason for it? is it normal to leave such a long time lapse for such an important measurement?

Measuring elemental radiation is much more difficult than measuring the total radiation. They have to perform a qualitative and quantitative analysis, which takes time. Adding in the fact that any labs geared to provide such an analysis are probably overloaded, I wouldn't read much else into the time lapse.


posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 01:59 PM
reply to post by jadedANDcynical

I'm happy to know I'm not the only one that had a negative reaction to the "ivory tower' attitude! In all honesty it made me nauseous when I read that.

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 01:59 PM

Originally posted by 1SawSomeThings
reply to post by burntheships

Yes number 3 has been/is the one to be most concerned about. Who can watch this video from the second day of the disaster and not see what was coming:

The height and color of the cloud, looking more like a 10 Kt nuke than a hydrogen explosion, with a brown color. And sending very large pieces of steel/concrete 1 km up. Are there those in Govt. and Exec. management who are too dumb to NOT let it be thought that it was a reactor breech at that very moment??? Not likely. They knew.

Now it slowly unfolds for the rest of us to suck up over the long run. Hmm.... Who'da thunk it???

But they are very aware of the process of dumbing down the people through govt liars/MSM liars and denial of meaningful education to the masses. It will continue and get worse.
edit on 28-3-2011 by 1SawSomeThings because: (no reason given)

Great post...
Further more the flash at the beginning of the explosion was not present in the other hydrogen explosions.

The talk of Chernobyl blasting into the jet stream and Fukishima being low altitude I just don't get. The plume goes out of camera range in both the close and long shot. Just how many miles away would you have to be to get the whole shot.

I'm sure there are ballistics experts who could shed some light on this. It certainly is not like the MOAB

or FOAB explosions.

There must have bee great heat over an extended time period to force so much fine debris so high.

The explosion was more like something in between the nuclear rifle and the atomic cannon...

If some one can work out how tall the reactor buildings are or the cranes. Then we can estimate the minimum visible height of the plume...

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 02:01 PM

Originally posted by 1SawSomeThings
reply to post by burntheships

Yes number 3 has been/is the one to be most concerned about. Who can watch this video from the second day

Yes, I have believed that from the day of the explosion in # 3, especially after I found information from
Nuclear Expert John Large that stated as much.

Nuclear expert John Large today questioned Fukushima'­s '4' status, telling The First Post: "We're not getting the informatio­n out of the government but I would say this is a significan­t nuclear event. You don't blow the top off a building and say it's not."

Japanese Cabinet Secretary Yukio Edano said today that there was the possibilit­y of an explosion at the No 3 reactor but he was confident the steel containing vessel around the core of the reactor would withstand the blast – as it did when No 1 reactor blew up on Saturday.
Large said he found this hard to believe.

The "jellyfish­" shape of Saturday's explosion and the decision to vent the reactor's secondary containmen­t – releasing radioactiv­e vapour and necessitat­ing the evacuation of local people – all suggest fuel rods had melted and leaked from the primary containmen­t.”

This news report from the 22nd states that U.S Regulators stated that 3 of the reactors had suffered damage to the cores. U.S. Regulators

Its been weeks now...I can only assume that the cover -up is for the Nuclear Reg Industry, Big Corporations,
and the current Administrations complicit actions sicken me.
edit on 28-3-2011 by burntheships because: (no reason given)

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 02:02 PM
reply to post by Vitchilo

Body Containing High Levels of Radiation Found near Fukushima Plant

Being 5 km away, I highly doubt this was a worker... more likely a poor soul who was suddenly exposed to high radiation levels, and who was probably in poor health anyway.

As much as I hate to say it, I believe this kind of thing will escalate as time goes on. There is so much radiation in transit right now, and no one knows when or where it will exceed tolerable levels.

I hope they can give this poor soul a decent burial at least, if only for the sake of family and friends.


posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 02:07 PM
reply to post by TheRedneck

Yet, when they re-sampled the stuff, the measured it in two hours....

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 02:08 PM
reply to post by Kailassa

It might be possible to remove it but the cost would be astronomic.
seawater contains measurable amounts of uranium ions, and can be separated out of it using platinum catalysts or more recently carbon nano-tubials , If the carbon nano-tubes prove feasible they should be "tunable" ( made to catch) the chlorine , but then again chlorine is much more soluble than uranium ...

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 02:08 PM
Man, I've been watching the latest footage from NHK, that 3rd reactor is almost levelled to the ground. It collapses more everyday. I also belive that 3rd reator blew completely with the 1st explosion. God knows the condition of the remaining reactors. Latest footage shows 1, 2,3, and four are still smoking some kind of reaction.
edit on 28-3-2011 by MoonandStar because: (no reason given)

edit on 28-3-2011 by MoonandStar because: Spelling coreected, ipad typing is not good...

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 02:10 PM
I mentioned it earlier on this thread but I think it needs to be reiterated. The same condition that affords the Japanese people an orderly conduct in this kind of crisis is the same condition that encourages a disproportionent trust in authority figures, the tendancy to cover up weaknesses in nuclear powerplants to protect ones company (family) and an unwillingness to ask for and/or accept help and assistance from outsiders.

Japan is a zenophobic society. Toss in an inordinate supply of superiority syndrome and one has exactly the incomprehensible situation we see unfolding before our eyes.

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 02:13 PM
Dear Tepco

Regarding your three 20-30 year old workers, who managed to get a little radiation on their feet whilst standing in contaminated water for two hours. I am very happy that you are telling us that they are all OK and ready to be released from hospital. For a moment I was really worried as NHK World reported that their exposure was up to 3,000 millisieverts, and I thought that doses over 2,000 millisieverts were strong enough to kill! Your men were really lucky to escape with nothing more than some harmless red spots.

You may want to consider your training policies because I think your workers would like to know if the puddles have radiation in them - maybe then they wouldn't stand in them for so long? Also, don't forget to remind them that Fukushima is experiencing multiple meltdowns, and that the dosimeter alarm must not be ignored in such circumstances.

Finally, how about a nice interview with your employees? It would be great to see how well these three Fukushima 50 heroes are doing since they've now left hospital.

Thanks for listening and good luck with the clean-up!

NHK Source

Tepco workers not warned of radiation risk

Tepco acknowledged on Saturday it had been aware that the pool of water in question at the No. 3 reactor's turbine building could contain a high concentration of radioactive materials.

Hirota Koyama, deputy chief of Tepco's Fukushima office, said: "If a system of information sharing (about the radiation exposure risks) had been properly in place, the accident might have been averted at the No. 3 reactor. We deeply regret that it wasn't."


posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 02:14 PM
reply to post by MoonandStar

Thanks for that info...Number 3 is nearly gone, if possible can you find a link to a picture or video?


Okay apologies if this was posted, if so I missed it.

NISA says Number 3 likely is breached.

NISA says Fukushima-1 No. 3 reactor may be damaged
Tokyo (Platts)--25Mar2011/752 am EDT/1152 GMT

Japan's Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency said Friday that the government now does not rule out the possibility that Tokyo Electric Power Company's Fukushima-1 No 3 reactor container may be damaged, after it detected higher radiation levels than normal inside the reactor building.

A NISA official said the government was looking at whether the No. 3 reactor container or pipelines inside the reactor building have been damaged after three workers were exposed to high radiation late Thursday.

NISA has measured the radiation inside the No. 3 building at 400 millisieverts/hour, the official said. Radiation detected in water inside the reactor building where the workers were exposed was measured at 10,000 times the usual level, he added.

edit on 28-3-2011 by burntheships because: (no reason given)

posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 02:15 PM
reply to post by cripmeister

There's no such thing as a partial meltdown yet that's what happened at TMI. Confusing to say the least.

Good question, and it deserves an answer:

I used the term 'partial meltdown' to indicate a partial state change. Consider a glass of ice water... initially, the ice cubes are all nice and square and even. As time goes on and they absorb heat, they begin to shrink and deform as some areas melt faster than others. Finally, all the ice will be melted and indistinguishable from the original water.

In a nuclear plant reactor core, something similar happens. The fuel rods do not suddenly change from solid intact rods to a pool of goo... they first begin to soften as they approach the melting point of the materials (uranium dioxide) in them, then begin to lose their shape as they transition from a solid intact rod into a pure liquid. If, during that transition phase, enough cooling is provided when they are undergoing this transition to keep them from fully melting, then the result is deformed rods instead of liquefied rods. Deformed rods are not in as close contact with each other as liquid would be in a pool, but they are in closer contact than if they were intact. Hence my use of the term 'partial meltdown' to indicate that, yes, there has been some deformation due to melting, but no, it is not as much as if the rods had fully melted.

At TMI, as I understand it, the rods began to melt but did not fully melt into a pool of liquid; they deformed as the material softened. Thus, they did output more of a chain reaction than if they were perfectly intact, but not as much as if they were liquefied. Cooling was maintained in that case since the reactor itself was apparently not damaged and could hold water, and they simply kept the rods below melting temperature until they could burn themselves out.

In Fukushima, the reactors are damaged. They cannot hold water to keep the rods cool, and that means that, while there was an initial period during which my use of the term 'partial meltdown' could be applied, it progressed into a full meltdown due to the lack of being able to continue the cooling.

I hope that clears things up.


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