Parents who smoke should be found unfit to be parents...

Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984

Originally posted by BillMaherFan816
reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984

 

I agree, well said, what a D-bag this person is

This is unfair, the OP is not a D-bag as you call him/her, just someone who maybe didn't think through their position. It is very common that people abandon their ideas of freedom for all when something annoys them. For some people it's smokers, other people it's drug addicts and others hate gay people.

Hatred destroys clarity.

So it's unfair to label the OP a D-bag,but he can label all 1.3 billion of the worlds smokers unfit parents ? really is that what you are saying ?

reply to post by mysterioustranger


Smokers defensive? I thought we were considered offensive.......

reply to post by Travlla


Let's be clear here... Not supporting people who put their addiction to a proven unhealthy substance ahead of the health and welfare of their children is a d-bag? OK, then I'm a d-bag... feel free to toss a couple of packs of Pall Mall unfiltered into your kid's Christmas Stocking... Who am I to say it's wrong? That would be such a d-bag thing to do, after all... I swear, reading this thread is like watching a really pathetic episode of A & E's Intervention ...

This is a post directed at Jaxon. FYI I did not read all the pages of this thread... not going to waste my time.

Here is my opinion. YES parents should NOT smoke around there children. Why someone would smoke in there own house with children also living in it is beyond me. and the simple fact that smoking destroys your house for one... turns the walls yellows makes your clothing go yellow. and makes your ductwork, and A/C, furnace, whatever you have that circulates air DISGUSTING. I know this because I work as an A/C installer.

It is quite obvious that you should not expose your children to ANY kind of smoke, or second hand chemicals, whatever it is, and a dirty house. Children should be raised in a clean and tidy house.

here is my story to keep it short. I do smoke... have for about 6 years off and on. It is a hard addiction to kick, and I have stopped for several months at a time, and have only started again after saying "oh I'll just have one" then BAM right back to half a pack a day. I do have a daughter and I DO NOT smoke in the house, I DO NOT smoke in the vehicle she is ridden in. and I do a damn good job at not exposing here to the smells on my clothes(ie changing clothes before holding her). It is REALLY simple thing to do, and not doing this because your lazy is very selfish to the health of your children.

People I know who's parents smoke in there house while growing up... Well lets just say they are smart, you know the saying the wise man learns from the fools mistake? They made it there goal to NEVER pick up smoking.

Why you created this thread is also beyond me. It is obvious you feel bad for smoking around your kids and probably gave them respiratory problems that will stick with them for the rest of there life. YOU made a mistake and to go and say now that you have quit and that smokers should be considered unfit for parents is totally hypocritical.

reply to post by JaxonRoberts
Pall Malls? Real men smoke Luckies.

reply to post by tempesillest


I commend you on your trying to quit. It also took me many years to do, so I understand how hard it is. I also commend you on not smoking around your child or in the house. But if you read the info on the second link, there are other risk factors of children of smokers that would still apply. The reason I wrote the thread is that I saw a young woman at a bus stop, pushing a stroller with a two year old in it, very pregnant herself, and smoking away like a friggin' chimney. I personally could care less if someone smokes or not. It's you health, and you should be free to do with it whatever you choose. But once you introduce children into the mix, it has to be about them, and not about you. That was the point I was trying to make. As for the title, that is the fault of the membership, as I have found over the past two and half years here, if it ain't got a tabloid title that pisses you off, nobody will read your thread... If I had titled this thread "The dangers of smoking on children", it would have gotten a small handful of replies and died a quick death... Instead, it has shown the true nature of addiction and the length addicts will go to to justify their addiction. Thank you for your level headed reply, and I look forward to seeing your posts in the future...

reply to post by JaxonRoberts


My wife, who is a business major, would like to know how your idea would be funded and if you are planning to take all those deviant children into your home? As there is a shortage on castles in this country, perhaps they should be relocated to Scotland; and don't forget once children reach a certain age DHR requires that they have their own room.

This goes out to the Grandma several pages back who stated that the negative health effects of smoking were all in your head... and the SEVERAL members who agreed with her:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/18df0639aa37.jpg[/atsimg]

That quite simply has to be the lamest and most ignorant supposition I have ever seen put forth on ATS...

The point is that there is not ONE positive benefit of using tobacco... And there is a mountain of detrimental effects, so other than "I don't want to give up my addictive habit for the sake of my children" there is no other valid point to be made by parents who smoke... Stop trying to justify it, and just admit that you lack the will power to do it, even for the sake of your children... That I could respect and understand, having been there myself...

*** ATTENTION ***

ABSOLUTELY YOUR FINAL WARNING !!!

STOP THE NAME CALLING AND UNCIVIL POST>

POST ON TOPIC

YOU WILL BE POST BANNED !!!

reply to post by JaxonRoberts


BS; what would you say the rate of Parkinson's disease among smokers vs. non-smokers? You should do real research instead of repeating someone else's talking points. And you run an advice column? LOL!!!

Originally posted by JaxonRoberts
reply to post by Travlla

 

Let's be clear here... Not supporting people who put their addiction to a proven unhealthy substance ahead of the health and welfare of their children is a d-bag? OK, then I'm a d-bag... feel free to toss a couple of packs of Pall Mall unfiltered into your kid's Christmas Stocking... Who am I to say it's wrong? That would be such a d-bag thing to do, after all... I swear, reading this thread is like watching a really pathetic episode of A & E's Intervention ...

I was pointing out the hypocrisy of it being allegedly unfair to label the OP a d-bag but it's fine to label all smokers unfit parents, is that clear enough for you? Some people have an issue with smokers i get that,but to label all smokers unfit parents is plain stupid and wrong,
I do not smoke in the house ever,or in the car when my kids are in it (smoking in cars with people aged under 18 is illegal in my state,but i never smoked in the car with the kids anyway so it wasn't a problem for me)
If i want a smoke i go outside,if the kids are in the backyard i go out the front,when i visit my mum(never a smoker) she tells me it's ok to smoke in her house,i don't i go outside,i do everything i can to avoid non smokers having to breath having to breath in my smoke,even if that means not lighting up,

Call me a fool because i smoke and know the risk's,no worries at all,
Call me an idiot because i spend $35 a week on smokes,no worries at all,
BUT call me an unfit parent because i smoke away from my kids and non smokers and i will bite back ok,

Originally posted by Travlla
So it's unfair to label the OP a D-bag,but he can label all 1.3 billion of the worlds smokers unfit parents ? really is that what you are saying ?

No it isn't and my post clearly reflects that is not what i was saying, i think you need to step back and calm down because i already disagreed strongly with the OP. So you're basically attacking a person who is on the side of smoking parents.

I'll say it again, the OP has taken a far too extreme stance on this issue.

To call someone a d-bag because they call smokers an unfit parent is wrong because they have just gone a bit far with their view doesn't make them such a thing. Likewise it was wrong of the OP to call people unfit parents just because they smoke.

Is my position now clear enough for you? Or do you want to recklessly throw around further insults?

Originally posted by Rastus3663
reply to post by JaxonRoberts

 

BS; what would you say the rate of Parkinson's disease among smokers vs. non-smokers? You should do real research instead of repeating someone else's talking points. And you run an advice column? LOL!!!

You are quite correct that smokers are less likely to get parkinsons and the mechanism isn't fully understood. However this is a numbers game and you need to weigh the odds. Smokers are more likely to get cancer (of all types), high blood pressure, heart disease, stroke, emphesemia, erectile dysfunction (men only obviously) and a host of others.

So while it appears to help prevent parkinsons the other illnesses it increases rather tip the scales in favour of the non smoker.

Wow, I've avoided this thread but I see it's quite interesting. I don't smoke and never have smoked, I wouldn't dare try. Everybody in my family smokes who isn't under 18 I believe I'm the only one who doesn't, as crazy and deranged as my family is they don't influence me by their actions. They barely influence me at all actually. I believe it's about how you raise your children's state of mind, and i'm not talking about smarts, because even some of the smartest people are in jail, criminal masterminds if you will. I believe it's about how strict you are, and what you will or will not accept in your household. Usually those morals taught to the children will stick with them through life. Don't just punish them, punish them and throughly talk to them over and over again, no matter how tired you get. I remember my step-father always saying, "I'm tired of talking to you!" and of course he'd talk to me anyway, then beat me lol. It pays off. I've never been to jail and I've never smoked. Yea.. I've done my share of bad things but in the end I'm better than a lot of people morally and ethically.

I've come to understand that smoking is a personal preference. It's dangerous and it kills people everyday, yea there are other dangerous gases being emitted on Earth, but don't used that as your back up to make it seem harmless, your basically saying, "This planet is Effed up anyway, this little cigarette ain't doing no harm." That's pathetic. The gases from cars and all that other stuff you also CHOOSE to use, just like a cigarette. You let it happen, you want it to happen. I have nothing against smokers (To each their own), but admit the fact that it's messing up you and the people around you, it's adding to the dangers that you are so used to using. It's just as bad as everything else.

Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984

Originally posted by Travlla
So it's unfair to label the OP a D-bag,but he can label all 1.3 billion of the worlds smokers unfit parents ? really is that what you are saying ?

No it isn't and my post clearly reflects that is not what i was saying, i think you need to step back and calm down because i already disagreed strongly with the OP. So you're basically attacking a person who is on the side of smoking parents.

I'll say it again, the OP has taken a far too extreme stance on this issue.

I am in agreement with you. This person should have been reigned in last night for the blatantly offensive comments he was making and it wasn't just limited to this thread. Thanks to the mods for deleting his post.

reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984


The point is that he incorrectly claimed that there was not one positive use for tobacco; not only was he wrong, he has unwittingly expanded his tirade against smoking tobacco to deploring the use of it all together. Tobacco has other uses such as obtaining nicotine sulfate for use in insecticides and nicotine tartrate, which is used in some medicines. Personally, I'll consider quitting when I'm no longer in danger of being shot or running over an IED.

Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984

Originally posted by Travlla
So it's unfair to label the OP a D-bag,but he can label all 1.3 billion of the worlds smokers unfit parents ? really is that what you are saying ?

No it isn't and my post clearly reflects that is not what i was saying, i think you need to step back and calm down because i already disagreed strongly with the OP. So you're basically attacking a person who is on the side of smoking parents.

I'll say it again, the OP has taken a far too extreme stance on this issue.

T,o call someone a d-bag because they call smokers an unfit parent is wrong because they have just gone a bit far with their view doesn't make them such a thing. Likewise it was wrong of the OP to call people unfit parents just because they smoke.

Is my position now clear enough for you? Or do you want to recklessly throw around further insults?

edit on 22-2-2011 by ImaginaryReality1984 because: (no reason given)

Fair enough,i have read the 500 odd post here over a couple of days so I'm sorry i didn't recall tour post/s defending smokers,taken on it's own the post i was replying to could be seen as defending the OP's allegations,but going by this post and others i have reread in this thread i see my the error in my post,i never said the OP was a d-bag either,the worst i have said in this thread is "judgemental fools" which i think is a few rungs down from accusing someone of being an unfit parent,i do not want to recklessly throw around insults,no i don't and i don't believe i have in this thread,

Originally posted by Rastus3663
reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984

 

The point is that he incorrectly claimed that there was not one positive use for tobacco; not only was he wrong, he has unwittingly expanded his tirade against smoking tobacco to deploring the use of it all together. Tobacco has other uses such as obtaining nicotine sulfate for use in insecticides and nicotine tartrate, which is used in some medicines. Personally, I'll consider quitting when I'm no longer in danger of being shot or running over an IED.

I think it's fair to say he was using tobacco in the context of this thread to mean smoking so it's unfair of you to expand his point out to uses of the plant that don't involve smoking. So i'll just skip over much of what you posted.

However you are correct and the person you were responding to is wrong that smoking has no beneficial use. Smoking or more specifically nicotine does appear to protect the brain against parkinsons disease. However that benefit is drastically outweighed by the damage smoking causes to all other systems of the body. Indeed if nicotine is the chemical which protects the brain then a patch would be as effective as smoking it without the downside of consuming tons of tar along with the thousands of damaging chemicals in modern cigarettes.

Even so it was very wrong of the OP to label parents unfit just because they smoke, it makes no sense. If the parents were smoking in the house he might have a point as childrens lungs are especially vulnerable, but if they smoke away from their children then they are being responsible and so it's fine by me.

reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984


You are assuming that statistics are consistent across the board for all races. Native americans smoke more than any other racial group in America and we have the lowest percentage of cancer:

...conducted by M.C. Mahoney, et al., of the New York State Department of Health, using data from Native Americans in upstate New York, during the time period 1980-86. It is published in the Int J Epidemiology, June, 1989, 18 (2) 403-412. The authors came to the same conclusion as Samet, et al. They stated that the principal causes of death among the Native Americans were TB, diabetes, pneumonia and cirrhosis. However, "fewer than expected malignant deaths occurred among both Native males and females [and]... A deficit of deaths was observed for colon and lung cancer deaths among Native males and for colon and breast cancer deaths among Native Females...".

reply to post by The Sword

Originally posted by The Sword
reply to post by monkeykillingmonkey

 

They really don't give a crap how much the smell or the smoke bothers others as long as they get their fix.

It's commonplace in alcoholics and drug addicts as well.

You know what's funny is agree with you 100 % yet we are arguing different points

And the cancer analogy is extreme but one I find fitting. This is getting off topic however.