Military chaplain: Soldier's rape 'must have been God's will'

reply to post by bogomil


I suppose if Jesus died for our Sins then we should make that death worthwhile and commit very grave sins. Which God must already know. So I sit here writing blasphemy happy in the knowledge I am carrying out God's good works. I just farted with the satisfaction of a man saved knowing that it was the will of God.

If I go out and start shooting religious people, I can take comfort that they will be happy in the knowledge I am carrying out Gods will and this has all been decided in advance by their sky fairy God.

There is an old english proverb "Never trust a man of ONE book" it is a warning about religious people.

Originally posted by Equinox99
reply to post by DimensionalDetective

 

How credible is the source? As someone else stated the quote came from an Atheist web-site so how come you can use Atheist web-sites but Christian web-sites are always not quotable?

Second thing is there are two ways the chaplain could have handled it:

1) Blame God, which is what usually happens when we don't want to take the blame.
2) Blame her for being with a bunch of guys who haven't had sex for well over a year. This would possibly lead to trust issues with men which will always haunt her.

Like I said, 2 ways to handle it. Let me ask you this how would you handle the situation in their shoes?

Third, many people claim eradicate religion and you get world peace. No! eradicate religion and you get a Stalin like country. Unless you guys can show how eliminating religion can bring about world peace than I don't think anyone should even mention it.

We could at least 'eradicate', i.e. stop THIS kind of religion from having public functions (what consenting adults do privately is their business).

Would you, in a vein of religious acceptance, recommend that anyone taking the racist part of OT seriously and literally should work as counselour for afro-americans?

(As to your rhetorical dividing the world in the 'white' part inside the christian epistemological bubble and the christian-critical/non-believing part being outside in one 'black' lump (Stalin), that's sad and reflects on your willingness to propaganda-statements as it has nothing to do with observable reality. Quite the contrary).

reply to post by Wolfcub


In all fairness, it must be remembered, that not all christians ascribe to pre-destination doctrine. Such non-predestination christians will then have problems with free will instead.

Some dissenting christians end up killing each other, while still blessing soldiers on both sides and giving 'good' (but different) advices to rape-victims. So rape-victims must search out spiritual advisers fitting to how they expect to be helped:

a/ It's 'god's will

b/ It's your own will, but intrinsically being a sinner you're paying on the cosmic debt anyway.

reply to post by bogomil


Not like I understand. All I know is that God's will is everything. Plus your statement is in poor English so I have no idea what you are saying.


From a purely scientific perspective, if God exists outside of time, than everything is his will, but we still have free will. Because the characters is a book have free will even though the author writes it.

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by bogomil

 

Not like I understand. All I know is that God's will is everything. Plus your statement is in poor English so I have no idea what you are saying.


From a purely scientific perspective, if God exists outside of time, than everything is his will, but we still have free will. Because the characters is a book have free will even though the author writes it.

You wrote:

["Not like I understand. All I know is that God's will is everything."]

There's a semantic distinction between 'knowing' and 'having faith in'.

Quote: ["Plus your statement is in poor English so I have no idea what you are saying."]

I forgot an 's' in my former post. It should have been: "....into each otherS' hair..." I apologize for making things difficult for you to understand.

Quote: [" From a purely scientific perspective, if God exists outside of time,....."]

There is no scientific perspective on 'things outside of time'. How could there be? Besides there are still the unsolved postulates of 'an existing god' and IF he exists at a specific conceptualized level. Some 'ifs' to sort out.

Quote: ["......than everything is his will,"]

May I in a friendly way point out, that your spelling seems to be as bad as mine. Next time don't play condescending games.

As to the actual content of this: IF there is a 'god', IF he exists outside of time, how does that lead to 'everything is his will'? Free will is a concept accepted by many religionists.

Quote: ["than everything is his will, but we still have free will."]

This also deserves some explanation, if you care to give one.

Quote: ["Because the characters is a book have free will even though the author writes it."]

Do you mean "the characters IN a book etc?". Explain please. Are you talking about fictive, allegorical or real characters? Is the author only describing a frame they can move in (if they are or have been real) or is he supplying the characters with fixed motives and actions?

reply to post by bogomil


There very much so is a scientific view of things outside of time. It's what is speculated as the 4th dimension. We have attempted to create shapes within this dimension within our own. Something outside of time has all possibilities of its existence existing at the same time. Some would argue it is something like quantum entanglement with yourself.

Yes. Characters in a book. They have free will. Even though the author writes their will.

Is there a difference?

Who cares about spelling. I can point out a flaw even if I have it.

reply to post by Gorman91


If everything is gods will, then how is it 'your' free will? How can a character in a book have free will? Surely it is written, prescripted. An actor can't turn up on set and ignore the director and script, it won't fit with all the timing and other actors.
A leaf on a tree may believe it has free will, but does that make it true?

reply to post by Itisnowagain


Yes, it has free will because that's what matters to it. Weather God has written that down or not is irrelevant, considering mankind is it's own. God, not being of our mentality, is not equatable to it.

reply to post by Gorman91


Just because the leaf thinks it matters whether it has free will or not, does not make it have free will. Free will is an illusion, you may think you have a choice but what decides the choice you eventually make? Learned responses, learned behavior, like a ball rolling. Or gods will.
Either way where is the 'you', that has the choice.

Heres another example:

What is this? Is this Sharia law?

I bet if this happend in a Muslim country they would be screaming to high heaven--SHARIA LAW

This IS WESTERN CHRISTIAN LAW

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by bogomil

 

There very much so is a scientific view of things outside of time. It's what is speculated as the 4th dimension. We have attempted to create shapes within this dimension within our own. Something outside of time has all possibilities of its existence existing at the same time. Some would argue it is something like quantum entanglement with yourself.

Yes. Characters in a book. They have free will. Even though the author writes their will.

Is there a difference?

Who cares about spelling. I can point out a flaw even if I have it.

This is terrible news to me. I have a solid 4 year scientific education behind me, and they NEVER once told me about YOUR kind of science. I have wasted 4 years on nothing, and been cheated, scammed, mislead and made a fool of. I think you ought to inform the whole scientific community about your revolutionary version of science, so they can correct their version and adapt it to yours.

I took up this point, because it relates to your 'validation' of 'quantum entanglement', which '"some would argue" leads to your theological speculations on 'free will'.

Usually I'm not keen on endless source-qouting, but in this case it would be interesting to know, who these 'some' are, what their informed and competent conclusions on 'quantum entaglement' is and how this leads to 'free will'.

It's not that this general direction is without its merits, there's actually a whole world of philosophical, metaphysical and theological perspectives on it, but even from my own misguided scientific position, I can see the need of introducing some quality concerning the premises used.

In any case, this is just a small digression from my original attitude. The present topic and its implications is a question for down-to-earth pragmatism, not what some alleged 'god' allegedly have arranged things to be.

And if I may point out, the general christian position on this has already demonstrated its confusion on the topic. You can't even agree on the parameters or outcoming answers between the many christian interpretations.

Quote: ["Who cares about spelling. I can point out a flaw even if I have it."]

Certainly. And if such a pointing out of a flaw has any relevance apart from debate-tactics, it's even commendable.

reply to post by Itisnowagain


You're not God, and therefore it is a choice because you're not writing the story.

reply to post by bogomil


Yes. You did waste your time. here, this should set you straight on modern science:

Read away

www.wikipedia.org...

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by bogomil

 

Yes. You did waste your time. here, this should set you straight on modern science:

Read away

www.wikipedia.org...

Thanks for informing me of the existence of wikipedia in general (that I knew it already, casts no blame on you).

But couldn't you be a bit more specific and relate to the present topic. I have no intentions of reading the whole of wikipedia as part of the scientific re-education you apparently find necessary on my part.

reply to post by DimensionalDetective

The most universal bull# excuse of them all is that it was "God's will". The sad part is, a lot of people are stupid enough to believe it.

Another example of the "God's will" excuse being used is the witch hunts. Women were murdered, children, even a dog in Salem were murdered in the name of religion. Wait a minuite, I thought religion was all about peace and love?

*face palm*

reply to post by bogomil


en.wikipedia.org...

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by bogomil

 

en.wikipedia.org...

Thanks for the new link you provided, leading to respectable, familiar mainstream material based on standard logic and scientific procedure.

Unfortunately it doesn't relate to my question(s) to you and it doesn't relate to your own claims, especially not concerning an alleged 'god' and the alleged will of this 'god'.

Maybe you'll take it upon yourself to create such a 'grand unifying theory' between standard science/logic/its-outside-spacetime-implications and theology/religion, thus filling out the present information/knowledge-gap (after all you made some claims in that direction, so you must be motivated).

There's no need to keep me informed of your progress. When you get the Nobel prize in physics for this outstanding feat, I'll know you have succeeded.

reply to post by DimensionalDetective


What an absolute crock of #!

I can't remember whether it was Jon Stewart or Bill Maher that ran a segment addressing these "God did it" nut jobs. It was about a guy that went to file an insurance claim for some damage to his home but was denied coverage because the insurance company determined that the damages were caused by "an act of God." The guy explained to the insurance company that if we accept the premiss that God does indeed exist, then isn't everything "an act of God?" If so, are there any claims that the insurance company would actually cover? I think not.

I guess that all of the child abuse tolerated by the Catholic Church over the years was also "God's Will."

S&F, DD, as usual, you deserve it.

A "chaplain" said this ? And all this time I thought "God's" will was that little boys should be raped by priests !???

Maybe he needs to go back and re-learn what is actually condoned by the "church" and accepted as god's will .

WOW, this thread has seriously pissed me off & the military and its lack of support for rape victims. Good find though. How can a ''Man Of God'' be so ignorant and call this god's will? So if she shot the rapist & the chaplain, is that also 'God's will?
It would seem that the chaplain and rapist are in need of a bit of ''Rehabilitation'' preferably with a Giant razor sharp Dildo.