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Originally posted by IAMIAM
Here is how I discuss things.
Suppose we are discussing an apple sitting on a table between us. I say to you I see a bright red shiny apple. If you then come back and say that I am being silly there is no way I could possibly see a bright red shiny apple, I have learned nothing about your point of view. I then say surely it is a bright red shiny apple, it is the shade of a fire engine. If you then retort, impossible! that is non-sense and what does a fire engine have to do with this, you are being ridiculous! I still have not learned what your point of view is, and I am growing weary of the conversations because there is absolutely no way you can crawl inside my head and tell me what I see. Attempting to do so IS ridiculous.
Now, if I say I see a bright red shiny apple, and you reply well I see a bright green apple, now I have learned your perspective, and you have learned mine. The conversation can progress. Well from my view the red apple looks like it may be a Washington apple, to which you could reply well that is interesting, but to me it appears to be a Granny Smith. Neither of us is wrong, and we have learned something about each others point of view.
You see, when we do nothing but put people on a constant defensive about how they see things, we learn nothing of the person, why they have the view they have, or even show the decency of allowing them to develop their views through mutually valued exchange.
I am not here to justify my views to anyone.
I prefer to share my views and learn from others their view.
When someone gets domineering and wishes to exalt their view as THE correct one to have, then I withdraw because no one can crawl inside my head and tell me what I see. I cannot do this to anyone else either.
So back to the subject at hand, I agree with you that the Chaplain should not have said such a thing to a rape victim. It is callous and uncaring and contradictory to the religious teachings of all the worlds religions. A man of the cloth is supposed to be a healer and should have focused on caring for the emotional and spiritual well being of the victim.
Why do you think that he was in the wrong?
Your Brotheredit on 19-2-2011 by IAMIAM because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by Jinglelord
Whoa whoa whoa!
It just occurred to me I'm probably wrong in several places, am saying things completely wrong, and the point I was originally trying to make got completely lost in my petty little back and forth. I was trying to invoke hostility and I succeeded, I feel bad and I apologize.
The problem is I was trying to convey a viewpoint I only partially agree with and debating for the sake of debate.
The one and only point I am trying to convey here is that I feel it is possible the Chaplain is getting a bum rap and what he said has been misinterpreted. So what do I do? I start spouting without being clear and trying to use emotionally driven arguments I am not skilled enough to pull off.
I'll try to remain more focussed in the future.
The one and only point I am trying to convey here is that I feel it is possible the Chaplain is getting a bum rap and what he said has been misinterpreted.
Originally posted by Tayesin
reply to post by Sinnthia
You do not see it.
You still ADD words to what I say... do you get that?
You ADD words to mine.. it Changes the meanings I intend... and then You argue against those Perceptions.. YOUR Perceptions.. not mine.. not what I said.
Do you see that yet?
All your arguing so far in this thread has been a case of You doing the same thing to most posters.... mincing the words so it apppears to fit your Belief about the poster's rely.
Time to put the brain in neutral.. stop thinking you are right.. and just read with Open Eyes...Because You are Missing the Points completely.
Your emotional response (A Reaction) is Blinding You. Stoping you from seeing the Simplicity on offer.
I do hope you are able one day to Perceive without having to Twist it to Fit Your Beliefs.
Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by MikeboydUS
I can't begin to imagine all of the intracacies of operating a system as big as the Earth, but I do know from just running small operations and projects that what you perceive is almost never the whole story, and things that make no sense in a narrow viewpoint, make perfect sense on a broader scale.
Originally posted by leaualorin
GOD AND RAPE...
Originally posted by Jinglelord
Okay, so I believe this was mentioned before but I will say it one more time. All Christians and Jews believe in the old testament God and of course only Christians believe in the New Testament God. So lets look at the old Testament for a moment. There are a few but I will focus on one. The Book of Job.
Familiar with it? No? Essentially God allows Satan to kill all of Jobs kids and give him terrible boils and whatever else to test his faith.
Your telling me if God can will a man's children to be killed and given physical calamities to test his piousness this same God can't will for a woman to be raped in the eyes of a Chaplain?
Are you people for real?
The argument isn't about Christianity or Judaism which I will assume this Chaplain was one of the two, the argument is whether this is in line with how a holy man is expected to believe. Which it clearly is.
Originally posted by Marulo
reply to post by sara123123
Lets see those statistics. I have never even heard of an organized atheist group. That just sounds stupid.
Something tells me you don't have the stats or they are just asinine.