Emptiness and Nirvana

Originally posted by Tamahu

In other words, the Indestructible Reality of the Natural State which is the Nature of Mind, is the Inseparability of Alaya and Rigpa which is Self-Perfected simultaneously as both Open Boundless Space (Emptiness) and Pleroma (Fullness).

Shiva-Shakti. Emptiness-Fullness
Out of Shiva arises an Infinite Number of Threads (Amrita Nadi?)which Terminate in the God Light/Shakti which is Only the Reflection of Shiva. Within the Amriat Nadi all the Worlds Appear and Disappear.-Adi Da paraphrased

Does everyone here experience the Fullness?
Can one meditate on Emptiness? I think not. But one can meditate on the Fullness it is very simple and natural. I continually experience this Fullness since Understanding the Teaching of Adi Da.

reply to post by JesusChristSr


Let us hope that this is not the case.


I had earlier thought about addressing the following...:

Originally posted by filosophia
Immediately you will start distancing yourself from others, as your new awakened state sees beyond the simple distinctions between left/right, good/evil duality. You'll have achieved "middle-way" vision, seeing beyond the extremities towards That Supreme Truth.

...and forgot to address it, until now.

Would not ones who see the Indestructible Truth of the Inseparability of Clarity (Compassion) and Emptiness (non-ego) that is the Nature of Mind, do the opposite of distancing themselves from others? Such ones would be impersonal, yet not indifferent.

This is not to criticize anyone for their views. It is just to point out that the true perception of Emptiness is of the cessation of suffering, not the cessation of the physical body.


Let us pray for the Happiness of Filosophia, and All Sentient Beings.

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

I like the sound of this Adi Das character. Please give us more of him, thanks.

One could say The Knee of Listening by Adi Da is the greatest spiritual book ever written,but it is really greater than all the others combined.




Adi Da talks about humor.

reply to post by RRokkyy

This imo, is Adi Da's best speech or sermon



Funny how he's the only guy who can make a Youtube Video saying nothing and everyone's like OMG, that's incredible!

Interesting the way his right eye wanders a bit when he's accessing.. it's like he's looking into his right sided mind from his rational, logical left brained mind, in other words, that's he's formed a new way of thinking, which involves going somewhere else, to a place most people don't access when thinking.

Very interesting, I'll watch more of his videos. Thanks again for bringing him to us.

reply to post by JesusChristSr

You're funny JCSr., in a very twisted dark manner.

Are you just trolling or what..?

I have to warn you that this is an anti-anti-Christ thread, we'll have none of that, it's just not neccessary, or helpful to the cause.

God Bless you anyway.

OTOH, maybe Adi Da and me and everyone is just totally full of $hit! Maybe it's ever MORE mysterious, to the degree that there is nothing we can DO anymore, except have an authentic human experience, and give and recieve love whereever possible, which is always possible, being at cause, and beyond cause, being the first and the last, the alpha and the omega of existence. Love is "the bright", not the manifest form, if you love me you love the bright, and together we'll play with the light, a game of bright lite (remember that, where you stick in the pegs and they light up!). I do not see this room the way it really is, I FEEL it, as it is! I am the room, you see (hmp?), there is no room, and we're not even here having this conversation.
Gasps of Ooo, and ahhh

I'm willing to throw it all away, it's all just the clutter of yeterday's spiritual experience anyway, which rots within a day if not eaten.

Just kidding around. Adi Da is well worth listening to, he's very smart.

In all seriousness, this is the one of his that I like the best



Here's another one!



One more..

Originally posted by Tamahu

Anyhow, to address your question, it is good to study and become familiar with the above terminologies, which are related to the Ain Soph

This is some pretty heavy esoterica here.. According to my own experience, Ain Soph - as abstract concept as it is - is one of the biggest revelations in this stuff. I could almost say it's a "goal", an illumination of some sort. Maybe it's the "seed" of consciousness itself, the "spark" that's located in the Ajna chakra. I think it also carries the elements of Tao, or it is the Tao.

This Sunyata is not empty at all. In fact, it includes everything. It's a paradox. It's actually completely parallel to physical phenomenon, like the suggested Big Bang. This would also support the idea that mans mind is actually a reflection on the physical universe (or is it the other way around?).

Originally posted by RRokkyy
Shiva-Shakti. Emptiness-Fullness
Out of Shiva arises an Infinite Number of Threads (Amrita Nadi?)which Terminate in the God Light/Shakti which is Only the Reflection of Shiva. Within the Amriat Nadi all the Worlds Appear and Disappear.-Adi Da paraphrased

Amrita Nadi

Introduction to Kabbalah

The wife of Brahma is called Sarasvati. The wife of Vishnu is called Lakshmi. The wife of Shiva is Parvati. Sarasvati, Lakshmi, and Parvati are Sanskrit names for three feminine aspects of divinity. In synthesis, they are Shakti. Shakti is the feminine power or that feminine energy hidden in the matter.

This feminine aspect of god is not talked about in many religious books because it is something that you discover when you work with Daath, the mystery of Alchemy.

There are many Kabbalists who say that the mysterious Sephirah Daath is the union of Binah and Chokmah. This theory is wrong, and we will explain why shortly.

The union of the female and male aspects of God (whether called Shiva-Shakti or Abba and Ama) is precisely the mysterious Sephirah of Daath. Knowledge. This is the of mystery of Adam and Eve.

The Kabbalistic name of the feminine aspect of God is Shekinah (שכינה). Shekinah is the Divine Mother that is represented in Hinduism with the names Saravati, Parvati, and Lakshmi. The femininity of God is hidden in these three Sephiroth.

In Gnosticism, when we talk about the feminine aspect of divinity, we say that she has wisdom, love, and power. These three aspects of the Divine Mother manifest when she displays her power, which is creation.

Does everyone here experience the Fullness?
Can one meditate on Emptiness? I think not. But one can meditate on the Fullness it is very simple and natural. I continually experience this Fullness since Understanding the Teaching of Adi Da.

Many of the teachings of those like Adi Da, Sai Baba, Osho, Prabhupada, Chogyam Trungpa, Ken Wilber, U.G. Krishnamurti, Surya Das, Deepak Chopra, Ram Dass, etc., are very questionable.


If one really wants to study the Divine Wisdom of the East, study the teachings of Swami Sivananda, Swami Vivekananda, Paramahansa Yogananda, Jiddu Krishnamurti, H.P. Blavatsky, Samael Aun Weor, and also the following Zen Adepts, Lamas, Tulkus, and Rinpoches:


Buddhism

Originally posted by Tryptych
This is some pretty heavy esoterica here.. According to my own experience, Ain Soph - as abstract concept as it is - is one of the biggest revelations in this stuff. I could almost say it's a "goal", an illumination of some sort. Maybe it's the "seed" of consciousness itself, the "spark" that's located in the Ajna chakra. I think it also carries the elements of Tao, or it is the Tao.

"The Tao Path leads to final liberation; this is the Path of the Gnostic Initiates.

"What the tenebrous adepts of the Dagdugpa clan teach is fatality, the shadow of the Tao Path, the antithesis of the Tao Path."

- Samael Aun Weor

The Key to this statement is found within the Dharmodaya, also known as the "Seal of Solomon" or the "Star of David":

Ajna Chakra (Sanskrit)

The Pituitary Chakra that is connected to the Pituitary Gland of the physical body. It is recognized in the astral body as a lotus with two petals. A developed Ajna Chakra enables Clairvoyance. Also called the agni or agniya (fiery) chakra.

AIN (Hebrew אין)

The first aspect of the primordial Absolute or Emptiness.

"AIN is the same as SAT in Sanskrit, in other words, the Unmanifested Absolute." - Samael Aun Weor, Tarot and Kabbalah

"The Thirteenth Aeon, which is beyond the Twelve Gates, is Ain, Sat, the Unmanifested One. Knocking on the Thirteenth Gate is equivalent to entering the bosom of the Cosmic Common Eternal Father, whose Hebraic name is Ælohim." - Samael Aun Weor, The Pistis Sophia Unveiled

Adhi-Buddha

"The Thirteenth Aeon is Ain, Sat, the Seity. Beyond the Thirteenth Aeon is the Cosmic Common Eternal Father, and Adhi-Buddha, who is the Buddha of our individual Buddha. Adhi-Buddha is the Father of our Father, but He never comes into manifestation, because He is the Unknowable Divinity. Only at the end of the Mahamanvantara, after having integrated ourselves with our Father who is in secret, do we then integrate ourselves with Adhi-Buddha. This integration with Adhi-Buddha is performed in the Mahapralaya, in the Cosmic Night and within the bosom of the Absolute Abstract Space." - The Pistis Sophia Unveiled

Ain Soph (Hebrew אין סוף) Alternatively Ein Sof or Ayn Sof.

"AIN SOPH is the second aspect (of the Absolute); it is where a certain manifestation already exists... A divine Ray exists within the human being. That Ray wants to return back into its own Star that has always smiled upon it. The Star that guides our interior is a super divine Atom from the Abstract Absolute Space. The Kabbalistic name of that Atom is the sacred Ain Soph." - Samael Aun Weor, Tarot and Kabbalah

Ain Soph Aur

(Hebrew) The third aspect of the primordial Absolute or Emptiness.

"Each Universe in infinite space possesses its own central Sun, and the addition of all of those Spiritual Suns constitutes the AIN SOPH AUR, the Protocosmos, the Solar Absolute." - Tarot and Kabbalah

Adam Kadmon

(Hebrew) This term has many applications, including the first manifestation of the Abstract Space; The Archetypal Man; Humanity; The Heavenly Man, not fallen into sin.

“The body of Adam Kadmon is formed by the Sephiroth." - Tarot and Kabbalah, ch. XXXII

Ain Soph Paranishpanna

"We must make a specific differentiation between the Ain Soph and the Ain Soph Paranishpanna: In the Ain Soph, interior Self-realization does not exist, but in the Ain Soph Paranishpanna, interior Self-realization does exist." - Tarot and Kabbalah

See also:

Parikalita (Parakalpita), Paratantra, and Parinispanna (Paranishpanna).

Originally posted by Tamahu
If one really wants to study the Divine Wisdom of the East, study the teachings of ........

So John Lennon met Prabhupada, the founder of the Hare Krishna movement,and he asks him some questions but doesnt get any clear answers,
finally Phabhupada says to Lennon, "You have to read it in the original Klingon."(Sanskrit actually).

To which Lennon,in his dry sarcastic voice says,
"So that's it, we have to read it in Sanskrit."

There are endless descriptions of spirituality,and endless
disciplines,often nasty.

Adi Da simplified it all into two words and a little insight.

But there is no evidence that there is anything that actually works. (Adi Da s' teaching does easily produce the first level of Enlightenment and Intense experiences for many.)
No guru,no teaching and no method seems able to break the
Ego. For a rare few individuals it just seems to happen to them,with or without their consent even.
They just lose their minds.

Originally posted by Tamahu

"When the Great Kabir Jesus was asked about the Truth by Pilate he remained silent, and when the Sakyamuni Buddha, Gautama, the Prince Siddhartha, was asked the same question, he turned his back and walked away.

"The Truth is the unknown from moment to moment, from instant to instant. That which is called Truth comes to us only with the death of the ego."

- Samael Aun Weor

"Therefore, no one can recognize the truth, because no one has ever known it.

"Let us not talk about the truth. It is better to talk about Alchemy.

"The "I" can die only by transmuting desire into Wisdom and Love.

"The Truth comes to us only when the "I" dies."

- Samael Aun Weor, The Fundamental Notions of Endocrinology and Criminology (which Samael stated "This book is a Codex of Scientific Ethics for all the Rosicrucian Gnostics, Yogis, Occultists, Spiritualists, etc.")

Mummies come back to life! Samael Aun Weor Television Appearance Part01

People want to talk about the 'death of the ego' when there is no such true things while in this body and mind complex.

There can be a mature ego....but to say that the I of you 'knows' something....is ego. One can have a perspective that is not from the 'self' individual perspective but is more from looking at things from a 'all or whole' perspefctive...but there is still ego.

You cant 'rid' of ego (self) but you can mature and humble self.

Originally posted by filosophia

Emptiness is the natural state of existence.

emptiness is the material state of existence. This does not deny an Eternal. The nirvana sutra includes the Buddha saying multiple times about how the Self is eternal. Everything in metaphysics must be taken from a two tier perspective, that is the higher and the lower. Anything having a negative connotation to it is in reference to the lower material reality whereas anything with a positive connotation to it is in the higher realm.

Higher: Self, Purity, Truth
Lower: Materiality, death, destruction, decay.

reply to post by LeoVirgo


The feeling of a separate "I", which we call ego-consciousness, is directly related to the strength of ignorance, greed, and hatred. The deepest meaning of ignorance is the believing in, identifying with and clinging to the ego, which as we have seen, is nothing but an illusive mental phenomenon. But because of this strong clinging to ego-consciousness, attachment/desire, anger/hatred arise and repeatedly gain strength.

The ego needs activity in order to exist. Like and dislike, attachment, aversion, greed and hatred are the main overt activities of the ego. The more desire and aversion we have the more alive we feel, the more real and concrete the ego seems. In reality, the ego depends on desire, its life-blood is desire. The ego and desire are like the two sides of a coin — one cannot exist without the other. The ego is projected desire, and desire is projected ego. It is like pedalling a bicycle: if we go on pedalling, the bicycle goes on moving; but if we stop pedalling the bicycle will start slowing down and eventually collapse. The more we go on generating desire the ego seems very real. When desiring stops the ego then appears as an illusion.

This is why desire cannot be satisfied. If we stop desire (and this means aversion also) then our sense of self starts getting weaker, it starts to dissolve. Actually, the objects we desire, like or dislike are not really that important. They are merely scapegoats or excuses for the activity of the ego, to prevent ego-death. Any object will do. Though to keep from appearing foolish, superficial or unwise the ego comes up with all kinds of good-sounding reasons and justifications for why it needs to acquire something or get away from something else.

That is why people in the West, especially in America, have yard- or garage-sales. They have attics, closets, and garages full of things they don't use any longer, and not because it is necessarily worn out or broken. Some of it — clothing, toys, gadgets, tools, etc. were probably used very little or perhaps never. These people need to empty out their closets and attics in order to make room for more. Much of it, including the shopping trips, are simply more activities, more life-saving ruses of the ego. And even getting upset, irritated, and angry at others for seeming trivial things is often only more excited energy to make the ego seem more alive.

However, at the same time it entails and generates a lot of suffering. So we can see the direct connection between ignorance, desire and the ego.
This is why it is so difficult for the average person, who does not meditate, to quieten their mind and experience total rest. We are called human beings, but a better term would be "human doings". Even in sleep the body will toss and turn and the mind goes on dreaming. The hardest thing for the average person to do is to sit still, not move the body at all, close the eyes, and do not go to sleep or get lost in daydreaming. After a few minutes they would become increasingly restless, wanting to do something. They cannot simply enjoy just being.

This is because the ego-self would feel uncomfortable, strange, useless and either go to sleep or start dissolving. The latter is in fact what happens during deep concentrated meditation. That is why many people shy away from or do not want to meditate. Many who do meditate, cannot go into deep meditation for very long. The ego shrinks away from the deep silence (even unconsciously) because it feels like death -ego death.

Ego or "I" consciousness arises as a resistance to the flow of impermanence coming through the senses. Resistance manifests as attraction or aversion to sense stimuli, including our thoughts, memories, and emotions etc. When attraction and aversion subside resistance also subsides and along with it the strength of ego awareness subsides. This can be directly observed during meditation.

Desire is also directly related to the past and future. When we see, hear, smell taste, touch, and think, the mind unconsciously brings in our past memories of attraction and aversion and reactions to the present sense stimulation, and then it projects these into the future with the subsequent thoughts, emotions, and reactions in the next moments (or microseconds). So the conditioned mind is always moving between the past and future, and this movement activity creates the illusion of time. It also creates the illusion of "I" consciousness. Both time and the ego are simultaneously created through the deepest inner activity of the mind, generated by ignorance and desire.

The practice of mindfulness or vipassana meditation is essentially a practice of keeping the attention in the present moment, being aware of whatever the body and mind is doing in the present moment. We try not to let the mind get carried away with attraction or aversion or allow it to remain lost in thought. We tune the attention on the flow of impermanence as it arises and passes away through the six senses. We try to watch and let go of resistance to discomfort or pain, to open up and relax more and more into the present.

When we can rest the mind (consciousness) more and more in the Present, then the past and future, desire and the ego all start dissolving. And with this suffering also vanishes. This is direct experience of the Dhamma, of the Four Noble Truths.

www.maithri.com...

Originally posted by LifeIsEnergy


The practice of mindfulness or vipassana meditation is essentially a practice of keeping the attention in the present moment, being aware of whatever the body and mind is doing in the present moment. We try not to let the mind get carried away with attraction or aversion or allow it to remain lost in thought. We tune the attention on the flow of impermanence as it arises and passes away through the six senses. We try to watch and let go of resistance to discomfort or pain, to open up and relax more and more into the present.

There is no We or I to meditate. There is No One to be Mindfull.
There is No One to Watch. There is No One to Keep the Attention in the Present Moment.
That is Not the Great Knowledge.
That is Ignorance.

Radical Knowledge is Understanding the Ego is always Seeking and the Spontaneous Divine Letting Go of Seeking.
Seeking Desirelessness is still Seeking.
God is NoSeeking in the Divine Heart.
First Understand Seeking
Then Observe Oneself Seeking
Then Fall into NoSeeking.

This is possible because NoSeeking in the Heart, (God)
is already the natural condition. The Ego is the Unnatural
Condition.

reply to post by LifeIsEnergy


Ah, wow! Did you write this? I went to the link and didn't find any article copied.

That's really awesome!

It's somewhat similar to that which the Bhagavad Gita talks about, same thing. The knower of the field is beyond the play and the weaving of maya through the interplay of the "gunas", Tamas Rajas and Sattva, or inertia, activity, and selfless service. It alone, remains unmoved, fully embracing, fully accepting, and with perfect understanding - the watcher, the no-self self who can be either funny, or serious, or both, unharmed by the apparent suffering behind the apparent veil of tears (lifted?).

They say - Krishna, Ghandi (who used the Gita as his personal manual), that since action is required for the maintenance of the body, on a day to day basis, that the only way to effectively "renounce and enjoy", particularly wihtin the context of our modern world, is to renounce all attachment to an OUTCOME or the FRUITS of our labours (giving them all to God), while at the same time, aiming for one thing (singleness of purpose) with the highest degree of awareness possible. Desire may then be harnessed, like a bit in the mouth, forever pleased with ALL outcomes, which then manifest as an anticipated surprise (recieved with joy) happy, and satisfeid, at the mere prospect of inspired action and creativity, or of rest from activity, or in selfless service. In this way real and authentic desire - as a fount of inspiration born of Bhakti (loving devotional service) is like a star player that we've had benched for no reason on the sidelines! There is always one desire as a catalyst to action, and that desire is love, happiness, and joy of the everlasting kind which only observes and creates, always vital and aware in every action, every circumstance, and at every moment.

Wouldn't that be something, to discover that this is our natural state of mind, and that none of it represents an imposition on the mind..?!

And then everything else dissolves, and we who dissolve in turn dissolve the ego of the world, in whatever way however big or small, however fast or slowly.

That's alchemy.


"Honour the Lord with the first fruits of thine increase, and thy barns will fill with plenty and thy presses will burst forth with new wine!"
~ Proverbs

reply to post by TedHodgson


Awakening your Kundalini before you are ready can be a very dangerous thing to do, it can open up experiences which your mind and blody are simply not ready for..........

KRISHNAMURTI
www.katinkahesselink.net...

PAUL BRUNTON
"Once aroused, it must either ascend and reach liberty at the top or it must fall straight down to the bottom. So he who seeks to play with this fiery but dangerous power will either reach Nirvana or lose himself in the dark depths of hell. If a man seeks to arouse kundalini before he has rid himself of hate, he will only become the victim of his own hatreds when he does raise it from its sleeping state. He would do better to begin by self-purification in every way if he is to end in safety and with success."

reply to post by Uncle Gravity


Yeah, indeed, AAMOF "Kundalini sickness" has been discussed here many times. I've said this many times earlier: Kundalini is awakened by yoga. If done incorrectly, it can lead to some type of neurological imbalance. The body heats up, sweats, anxious disorders etc.. so it's important to at least follow the instructions provided by a capable teacher.

I think the main thing is grounding, calming down and meditating before doing yoga. It can lead into permanent bliss, an ecstatic state triggered only by thinking in a certain way; or rather - not thinking. One of the best advices I've heard came from Castaneda: In one of his books, Don Juan said that one should stop his/her "internal dialogue". To me, that means that one should not think with words, but rather through abstractions. That way, your conscious mind is more aware and capable of receiving more.

He talked about "heightened awareness", to me, that means basically the same state that you receive when meditating and doing yoga.

reply to post by LifeIsEnergy


I agree that desires are connected directly to being a 'I'. Which is why I asked the OP 'where desires come from' when they said that after death we can fulfill all of our desires.

I think we can perceive things from a 'whole or all' perspective by silencing the mind and abandoning all preconceived thoughts or feelings about what we 'think' we know but I still think there is always ego while in the body complex. Ego does not have to be bad attributes like hate, greed, ect....there can be a mature ego that learns to cherish all things in life, bad and good, having no regrets because the self see's that all things were needed and had purpose for growth in to some body.

I think there is still desires, even when one stops living for the desires for 'self/I'....their desires then evolve for the 'all' of life, for a prime way of 'being' in the 'all'.

To be is to express....and one way or another....one can not be without expressing themselves....even if their expression is to sit in silence...its still a 'ex-press-ion' of their 'be-ing'. We can find the mind set of 'just be-ing' but that in itself is still a 'expression of the self'.

But over all I think most of what you said was nicely written.