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Can China Invade Taiwan?

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posted on Sep, 15 2004 @ 03:36 PM
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Update,

In 2012, there will be no F-14As, so scratch that. They will have been subsequently replaced by the F/A-18F, so it'll be 36 F/A-18C Hornets and 13 F/A-18Fs vs. an unknown number of Chinese fighters.

Here's the current U.S. Navy order-of-battle:

U.S.S. Kitty Hawk (CV-63)
Carrier Air Wing 5 (CVW-5)
VFA-27 “Royal Maces” 12 - F/A-18C Hornet
VFA-102 “Diamondbacks” 13 - F/A-18F Super Hornet
VFA-192 “Golden Dragons” 12 - F/A-18C Hornet
VFA-195 “Dambusters” 12 - F/A-18C Hornet
VAQ-136 “Gauntlets” 4 - EA-6B Prowler
VAW-115 “Liberty Bells” 4 - E-2C Hawkeye
VS-21 “Fighting Redtails” 8 - S-3B Viking
HS-14 “Chargers” 4 - SH-60F Oceanhawk
VRC-30 “Providers” Det. 5 1 - C-2 Greyhound
U.S.S. Vincennes CG
U.S.S. Chancellorsville CG
U.S.S. Cowpens CG
U.S.S. Cushing DD
U.S.S. Curtis Wilbur DDG
U.S.S. John S. McCain DDG
U.S.S. Vandegrift FFG
U.S.S. Gary FFG
U.S.S. Bremerton SSN

I'll post the rest later.




posted on Sep, 15 2004 @ 03:49 PM
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Originally posted by sweatmonicaIdo
devilwasp,

Transportation for British forces? And exactly what kind of infantry?

In fact, give me a list of all British infantry forces, whether it be Army infantry, Royal Marines, Commandos, etc., and say yes or no to each.

Also, would they bring carriers? I mean it'd be nice to see the British Sea Harriers fighting alongside the Marine Corps AV-8B Harrier IIs!


it would be the 3 comando's brigade's 45 company .they would take ethier 42 or 40 comando with them mabye both.and they would take the CLR (comando logistic regiment). they'd go in HMS ocean ,cause its the marines taxi(like the whole navy or thats what the booties think).

probably a small task force. mabye 1 carrier ,though not sure, they'd send like most of the surface fleet if they sent one. if so you could exspect to see harriers up there with the US's. would be interesting to see a combined USMC+RMC beach assault.

the army may send troops but i dont know ,yeah probably. dont know much about army. (not my area) most cambat units like argyll's ,royal green jackets,welsh gaurds.etc.



posted on Sep, 15 2004 @ 06:14 PM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
it would be the 3 comando's brigade's 45 company .they would take ethier 42 or 40 comando with them mabye both.and they would take the CLR (comando logistic regiment). they'd go in HMS ocean ,cause its the marines taxi(like the whole navy or thats what the booties think).

probably a small task force. mabye 1 carrier ,though not sure, they'd send like most of the surface fleet if they sent one. if so you could exspect to see harriers up there with the US's. would be interesting to see a combined USMC+RMC beach assault.

the army may send troops but i dont know ,yeah probably. dont know much about army. (not my area) most cambat units like argyll's ,royal green jackets,welsh gaurds.etc.


Give me an order-of-battle of actual British forces that would be appropriate and realistic for this kind of scenario. I don't know British forces very well.

Would it be realistic if they brought along the Lostprophets for entertainment?



posted on Sep, 15 2004 @ 06:22 PM
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Originally posted by sweatmonicaIdo
Update,
Here's the current U.S. Navy order-of-battle:

U.S.S. Kitty Hawk (CV-63)


You do relize that the Kitty hawk is slated to be decommisioned in 2008 right?

And the USS Vincennes is gone in 2005? The Vincennes is a baseline 1 Tico cruiser. The USS Valley Forge of the same baseline has already gone (you remeber my post about selling it to Taiwan?) and the USS Thomas S. Gates will go in 2006. Better to use one of the baseline 2,3,4 Ticos as most will be in service beyond 2020




The de-comissioning of USS America made room in the active fleet for the newly comissioned CVN-74 USS John C.Stennis. USS Kitty Hawk is slated for replacement by the as yet un-named CVN-77 in 2008.
www.globalsecurity.org...



posted on Sep, 15 2004 @ 06:33 PM
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Originally posted by sweatmonicaIdo


Give me an order-of-battle of actual British forces that would be appropriate and realistic for this kind of scenario. I don't know British forces very well.

Would it be realistic if they brought along the Lostprophets for entertainment?

lol
well we'd arrive with the US task force and move in to support your navy wi ours. especially your sub nets, since we trained to do it for NATO.
our marines would go in and support yuor marines or move onto military beach/cosatal defenses ,if we were attacking, but if we werent we'ed just set up a defense force on the island.
the marines/navy would arive first,RAF second,army last.
this ok?



posted on Sep, 15 2004 @ 06:37 PM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
[well we'd arrive with the US task force and move in to support your navy wi ours. especially your sub nets, since we trained to do it for NATO.
our marines would go in and support yuor marines or move onto military beach/cosatal defenses ,


Lets face facts, the US and UK combined do make up one of the more formidable battle forces in history. I for one would want a few of your subs trolling around the pacific. As I said before I saw a special ont he Perisher courses your sub drivers go through. Really seperates the men from the boys on that one.



posted on Sep, 15 2004 @ 06:40 PM
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Originally posted by FredT


Lets face facts, the US and UK combined do make up one of the more formidable battle forces in history. I for one would want a few of your subs trolling around the pacific. As I said before I saw a special ont he Perisher courses your sub drivers go through. Really seperates the men from the boys on that one.


thats prob cause the fact the two haave worked toghether for the last 50-60 years.
yeah the perisher is scary ,dont know you'v failed untill the boats alongside to take you home, and no chance of a resit.so is the australian diesel sub course.



posted on Sep, 15 2004 @ 06:45 PM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
yeah the perisher is scary ,dont know you'v failed untill the boats alongside to take you home, and no chance of a resit.so is the australian diesel sub course.


Yeah the special said they are done in the sub service if they fai. The leave and can never come back.



posted on Sep, 15 2004 @ 06:46 PM
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Originally posted by FredT
You do relize that the Kitty hawk is slated to be decommisioned in 2008 right?

And the USS Vincennes is gone in 2005? The Vincennes is a baseline 1 Tico cruiser. The USS Valley Forge of the same baseline has already gone (you remeber my post about selling it to Taiwan?) and the USS Thomas S. Gates will go in 2006. Better to use one of the baseline 2,3,4 Ticos as most will be in service beyond 2020


Remember the backstory? There will be a war going on outside of the Spratlys, one so big that the U.S. military will have to delay their standard cycle.

I'm trying to show how well the U.S. can handle a one big war and a small war on the side at the same time.



posted on Sep, 15 2004 @ 06:47 PM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
lol
well we'd arrive with the US task force and move in to support your navy wi ours. especially your sub nets, since we trained to do it for NATO.
our marines would go in and support yuor marines or move onto military beach/cosatal defenses ,if we were attacking, but if we werent we'ed just set up a defense force on the island.
the marines/navy would arive first,RAF second,army last.
this ok?


Can you give me an actual order-of-battle?



posted on Sep, 15 2004 @ 06:50 PM
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in order of battle do you mean which military units would arrive first or order of battle once we met up with american troops or order of battle once we hit the beaches or planning up to hitting the beaches?



posted on Sep, 15 2004 @ 08:15 PM
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Sweatmonica in 2012 there might not be any F-14 but there will be F-35's so it will be the same number of jets now about 80-85 per carrier JSF's F/A-18 Super hornets and F/A-18 hornets. And the Us will have a new carrier in 2009 the George H.W. Bush CVNX 77. not to mention by 2012 the US navy will have the DDX destroyers



posted on Sep, 15 2004 @ 09:18 PM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
in order of battle do you mean which military units would arrive first or order of battle once we met up with american troops or order of battle once we hit the beaches or planning up to hitting the beaches?


An Order-of-Battle, at least in American terms, is an outline of all the availiable military forces in a theater or a situation.

For example, it could list which service, which army, then which corps, then which division, brigade, etc. It's really just a detailed list on what forces are availiable for battle.



posted on Sep, 16 2004 @ 04:21 PM
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the first to be there would be the army battalion and 212 bell flight from the army air core there already in Brunei.
after them the nearest military ship would be there aka the destroyer/frigate in the south china sea which would be
now order of the attack force arriveing there would be RN task force comprising of 6 type 45 destroyers ,2 CVF carriers,mabye the FCS firgate to replace the type 23's and 22's and two albion class ships.


after this force is there close behind it the army will move in, the 16 air assault brigade would arrive first with probably the para to be moved there by, would you guess it, air. also the 7th armoured,the 51st infantry,102nd logistic brigade,20th armoured ,1 mechinized brigade,one of ethier the 12th,16th or the 47th artilery airdefense force, the 19th,26th or the 40th artillery close support regiments,also the royal comando gunners,the 39th artillery regiment, the 5th and 32nd intelegence regiment, the 1 army air core regmient,the 23rd,38th,33rd and 42nd REME core and last but very not least army medical core. (this may be inacurate ,im not an exspert on the army.)


the RAF,1 squadron,31 squadron,54squadron,617 sqdrn,25th ,8,43,17,19 squadrons. the 41st,numbr 10 ,99 sqrdns. 7th,18th,78th,230th sqrdns. 201 sqrdn,202 sqrdon. phew thats it ,i think.

that ok?



posted on Sep, 16 2004 @ 05:03 PM
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That has EVERYTHING I need, devilwasp!

Thanks!

And to all, you will see some great battles, but don't be disappointed in the outcome. Yes, some of you will be disappointed, I am only trying to be as authentic as possible.



posted on Sep, 16 2004 @ 05:10 PM
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uhh oops i umm sorta left out the marines......whoops. heh
heres the marines thing if you want.
45 ,42,40 comando and the logistic core would come in with the army/task force.
the SAS and SBS units will be there faster than the auroura, the SBS and SAS troops will probably be based off HMS ocean ,if still there, or the CVF's



posted on Sep, 16 2004 @ 05:15 PM
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devilwasp,

Is that size force appropriate for a Spratly Islands situation, tho? Seems pretty big.

For example, artillery is almost useless because the islands are so small. Warships would serve better.

Also, give me a full list of ships that would be sent. Real names, etc.



posted on Sep, 16 2004 @ 06:19 PM
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Originally posted by sweatmonicaIdo
devilwasp,

Is that size force appropriate for a Spratly Islands situation, tho? Seems pretty big.

For example, artillery is almost useless because the islands are so small. Warships would serve better.

Also, give me a full list of ships that would be sent. Real names, etc.

i meant for like makeing a counter attack ,if one is made. cause if not then count out most of the british army.
the surface ship names ,i aint got any for the FCS ships althoough they dont reach full serivce in 2013 but i think that theyll be earlier, i didnt add sub fleets.
HMS dauntless,HMS dareing,HMSdiamond,HMS duncan , HMS ,dragon ,HMS defender.
no anmes on the carriers as yet.
the bay ships will be HMS largs bay, HMS lyme bay, HMS mounts bay and HMS cardigan bay.
the subs in service now are

trafalger class

Trafalgar S107
Turbulent S87
Tireless S88
Torbay S90
Trenchant S91
Talent S92
Triumph S93
most of these will be updated.
Swiftsure Class

Sovereign S108
Superb S109
Sceptre S104
Spartan
most of these will be updarted as well.

the new ones in service (although i aint seen them are
HMS Astute ,HMS ambush (interesting name),HMS Artful (this one should be finished by the end of this year.
another 3 more boats are being planned.



posted on Sep, 16 2004 @ 08:08 PM
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came across a government site, saying the usa's army size as of now is only around 500,000-a big part of that is being used as of now, [i always thought it was closer to 1million tho
]

either way, IF China gets a way to ship some of its 2.5 million man army to taiwan-how is there anyway our ground forces can counter that??

Currently, there are 499,000 active duty Army troops, backed up by 700,000 National Guard and Army reservists. That's a third less than when the U.S. fought its last big war in the Persian Gulf, in 1991;
130,000 Army troops are in Iraq. Pentagon officials had hoped to reduce that number, but the ongoing insurgency prevented it; 9,000 Army troops are in Afghanistan; 3,000 help keep the peace in Bosnia, as do 37,000 in South Korea.

(pbs.org) well, if we enact those national guards, we got 1.2 million men, hmm but we'd never get all those men there, since the troops stationed in Europe and such. what are we to do?



posted on Sep, 16 2004 @ 08:43 PM
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Originally posted by imAMERICAN
came across a government site, saying the usa's army size as of now is only around 500,000-a big part of that is being used as of now, [i always thought it was closer to 1million tho
]

either way, IF China gets a way to ship some of its 2.5 million man army to taiwan-how is there anyway our ground forces can counter that??

Currently, there are 499,000 active duty Army troops, backed up by 700,000 National Guard and Army reservists. That's a third less than when the U.S. fought its last big war in the Persian Gulf, in 1991;
130,000 Army troops are in Iraq. Pentagon officials had hoped to reduce that number, but the ongoing insurgency prevented it; 9,000 Army troops are in Afghanistan; 3,000 help keep the peace in Bosnia, as do 37,000 in South Korea.

(pbs.org) well, if we enact those national guards, we got 1.2 million men, hmm but we'd never get all those men there, since the troops stationed in Europe and such. what are we to do?


That's why air power and sea power is so vital. But even our aircraft are extremely vulnerable to Chinese fighters and air defense.

Our warships maybe the only force capable of being most effective.



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