LA Plane Theory is blown out of the sky - US missed Chinese Missile

reply to post by SeekThefacts


If you want to send a warning, you do keep your cards hidden, from the PUBLIC.
But so you don't start WWIII, you would want to secretly alert the opposition.

And as I have pointed out before, the problem with the plane
argument is that it does not explain NORAD's lie about what it was. If it were
just a plane or even an off course U.S. missile, NORAD would have just said so!
They KNOW it was a hostile missile launch and were ordered to keep it quiet so
that the public reaction would be minimized and NOT force the US to escalate

Boondocks scenario makes perfect sense. It is the only one I have seen that explains all the known facts.

I will add the following hypothesis to his scenario:

The Chinese are very upset with recent U.S. monetary
decisions (and maybe military actions too) and the tipping point was Bernanke’s
decision to print more money. They needed to make an unmistakable protest.

The Chinese notified the US Government both publicly and
secretly of this fact but secretly added that to show their displeasure they
would conduct a missile test off the US West coast in the near future. They
probably hinted at a location near LA for reasons that will become obvious.

The logical launch platform would have been the
Type 94 submarine, the newest nuclear
powered submarine class which is undergoing testing.

The missile would have been the JL-2 SLBM, capable of carrying a Single
or MIRV; ~10 (max) Nuclear 250 kt /thermo warhead. However, since this missile is just becoming
operational, the missile that was actually launched most likely contained a
dummy/test warhead.

With the Chinese diplomatic/military warning, U.S. forces
would have had sufficient time to get interceptor type missiles ready to launch
from the Pt. Magu Naval Facility, more specifically
the facility at San Nicholas
Island, 60 miles off shore west of LA. Those interceptor missiles would
almost certainly include the Army’s [MIM-194 Patriot ABM system.
Although more esoteric missiles that are being developed for the Ballistic
Missile Defense Organization cannot be excluded.

As the Chinese SSBM moved into position, especially with
a military warning, it is quite likely that it was detected by Navy SOSUS sensors and was even being
tracked by a U.S. Navy SSN attack submarine.

The SLBM missile was probably aimed at or near an area
that China uses to test missiles so that Chinese sensors could be used to
monitor the ‘test’. The Chinese submarine launched the missile, but since the launch
was in international waters, all the U.S. SSN could do was watch and report the
action to U.S. National Command Authorities. The U.S. submarine would most
likely have been warned of the potential missile launch too and told NOT to
take further action.

The ABM system radars on San Nicholas Island would have
picked up the launch almost instantly, and one interceptor missile would have
been launched within a minute. As Boondock suggests,
the interceptor missile apparently caused significant damage to the SLBM, but
not enough to destroy it or knock it wildly off course. At the same time, NORAD’s
Defense Support
Program satellites would have been reporting a missile launch and providing
an IR track, a missile type and launch azimuth within a minute of launch. NORAD’s
PAVE PAWS phased array
radar at Beale AFB, CA
would have received the launch warning and also it’s own detection capabilities would have caused it
to start a RADAR track on the SLBM (and the interceptor missile too for that
matter). It is probable that both the SSN and the facilities at San Nicholas Island
got high resolution video of both missile launches and the attempted intercept.

The missile probably did land in China’s missile test
area or failed and just crashed into the ocean.

So with all US sensor systems confirming that the predicted event just happend, no further military acton was needed.

So NOW US political and military authorities are well
aware of China’s displeasure and their military capacity. But neither China nor
the US want the event to be publicized. That would add little value and if it
happened could provoke an escalation. It is much better for NORAD to take the
heat and say they don’t know what ‘it’ was. Just like NORAD got a lot of blame
after 911.

So only Chinese and U.S. leaders (political and military)
really know what happened. Plus military personnel on the SSN and San Nicholas
Island, and various NORAD sensors,

Plus of course US here on ATS. But
we’re just conspiracy nuts anyway, right?

The only possible flaw I see in this scenario would be
the time for a Chinese SSBN to get into position with a presumably dummy/test
warhead within a few days of Bernanke’s announcement. But it is quite probable
that China and many other countries had private/secret advanced warning by the
U.S. Government as a typical ‘feeler’.

We should probably spend some effort to confirm or deny this scenario.

Ok, it was a missle, the US failed to stop a missle hit.

Where did it land?????

Originally posted by c3hamby
Ok, it was a missle, the US failed to stop a missle hit.

Where did it land?????

IF it was a missile, it probably landed in a very uninhabited section of the Pacific Ocean.

We test missiles. Whether it is for readiness testing or testing a new guidance system, we test them.

IF one was launched it was probably aimed at a place where it would do little harm. Some here postulate that it was a Chinese missile, which, at this point is nothing but conjecture. But, IF it was a Chinese 'show of force', they probably would have informed us some minutes before the launch, and the missile would have been aimed at a spot in the ocean... just to avoid WWIII.

I might add, if the Chinese did such a thing, it was VERY risky. They would have to rely on our military to have good communications and nothing happening in the chain of command to screw things up.
Obamas at the top of that chain of command, so as I said.... very risky.

reply to post by c3hamby


It didn't land...
This is what I have gotten from this thread...

As one poster wrote "The "glactics" stopped it mid flight" no really I am serious! This will be the headline of the later mentioned TV special.
China fired it at a pre-determined location
This is my favorite "I dont know" But in the next breath will tell us all of the things he does know!

My Theory is this... The govt. has a new think tank... This think tank is tasked with exciting the tin foil hats.
They sit around giggling and laughing about the next "hoax" they are going to pull off.

Heck.. all they have to do is let 50 shiney ballons go and the entire web will go nuts..

Soon they will do an ABC special showing all of these delusional theories, discrediting all of the REAL conspiracies...

Boon... You do know that wind currents change at different altitudes right? I am no photo expert... But I do not think that a Govt. coverup would have been so easily detectable.

If you look in the sky... You will notice the different layers of clouds moving at different speeds. heck, I have seen clouds at different altitudes moving in different directions.

Originally posted by butcherguy
IF it was a missile, it probably landed in a very uninhabited section of the Pacific Ocean.

you have a very valid point
that I would agree with.

however

the party launching this missile (assumed Chinese)
may NOT have had control over it after it got pelted
by the Patriot.

OR

the missile may have had a ruptured booster
pack that stopped working thus causing it
to fall short of the intended target.

If the Chinese were smart, then I would ASSUME
they aimed it over water for the duration of the flight
time just in case that scenario did happen, the remains
of the damaged missile would not be found or do
any damage on land.

Originally posted by Resurrectio
But I do not think that a Govt. coverup would have been so easily detectable.

why not?
lots of people saw through
9/11

it was detected rather early
and this one within a week

I will admit that I have not read this entire thread, I got kind of filled up with the other two related threads.

So if someone mentioned this, I apologize.

What if it was a missile? Maybe it was just our military testing an SLBM boost-phase detect and destroy ABM system. There are some islands with military rocket launch facilities nearby.

I know it is a reach, but that really is all there has been on any of these threads, a lot of conjecture.

Originally posted by butcherguy
I know it is a reach, but that really is all there has been on any of these threads, a lot of conjecture.

photographic evidence of you
running a red light is valid
evidence in a court of law,
so why is it considered
conjecture here?

dash cam footage on a trooper's
car is evidence .....

photographic evidence holds
up in any court. Lots of people in
prison were put there due to video
tape and camera pics from robberies
but photos are considered conjecture here?

It's evidence bro

reply to post by boondock-saint


I am confused with this "photoshop job" you speak of.. What exactly is the difference between your and the photoshopped one?

The original video/pictures seems to match the new ones.. What is photoshopped in or out?

All of these assumptions.. You are calling everyone's facts - faked or misconstrued. All you have offered here is assumptions and theory.. with not one ounce of proof.. I am disapointed that people are buying into this garbage.

Here is how the pattern is developing.

1)You make an assumption or a complete leap of logic.

2) Someone disputes that with proof and facts.

3) You say they are wrong.. without providing facts to back up your claim.

4) Rinse and repeat.

Op.. good work at hoaxing ATS... Thats what you have done here.. You have led the easily manipulated down a road of delusion and paranoia.

reply to post by boondock-saint
When I watched the original video, I was convinced that I was seeing an SLBM launch. I saw a Trident missile launch during an exercise while I was in the US Navy.

I really haven't seen any hard evidence that has convinced me either way, plane or missile.

reply to post by boondock-saint


1st of all - Nobody is arguing that the photos exist..

Conjecture- you are theorizing what is visible in the pics.. the Interpretation is left to the viewer.

Assumptions. You are assuming that what you see in the pics are facts.. Then you are passing them off as proof of what you are saying.

Plenty of people have given evidence. How man y missiles have you seen that don't have a plume of smoke behind them? This one just seems to stop ommiting smoke all of a sudden? Where did it come from? Why was there no airspace warning? because it wasn't a missile!

I understand this is a conspiracy site but Jesus christ. In this thread, there is a great post with evidence suggesting its a plane.

www.smartplanet.com...

This is the proof you all crave so much. Have a pleasant night.

reply to post by jexmo


Jexno... Your logic and "proof" are not welcome here. We have jumped off the cliff of sanity and landed right in a quagmire of fantasy and conjecture! All of these same points have been shot down already, by those that find no excitment in the plain FACTS! ( punn intended)

I will bet the farm that the fantasy folks wont even read past the headline of that link.

BTW .. good info.. Did anyone notice all of the "credible" people in that article, that concure it was a plane?

I wonder if they balance out the biggoted generals opinion?

reply to post by Starling


I have asked you details.. I have asked you for your pics..

No response on either.

No self respecting ATS member would have witnessed a Missile launch, and only rivaled by a anti missile explosion without getting a picture.



If you could upload these pics I would greatly appreciate it.

I am excited to see the patriot shreding the ICBM and throwing it off course. I wonder if the people on 902 that left that contrail were freaked out by this incident.

I have seen a lot of contrails from jets because I am near an airport and watch them as they come and go at different altitudes. When a jet plane gives off a contrail it "can" spread out if the air is in motion. But it will be skyward and not from the ground up. A missile however will have two things with it's contrail. The first is a ground to shy trail that is wider at the bottom and comes to a point at the top. The second is that it will have a curve. While jets "can " have a curve, they are horizontal and not ground to sky. I suggest watching missile launches, especially the ICBM type to grasp what you are seeing.

What I believe is that the Chinese, in a show of bravado chose to send a sub into a US naval exercise and launch a missile away from US territory to show that they can also launch towards US territory. The US made a vain attempt to intercept and destroy it, hence the second smaller contrail seen and ending at the bright spot and cloud formation.

Two theories:

1. The US knew of the sub and let it go about what it wanted to do in order to not give up it's sensitive tracking capabilities, and to test one of it's defense missiles on a Chinese rocket.

2. The US is in a whole lot of trouble for it's failure to know about the sub or the missile launch.

for the planers
stop giving me pics of plumes that the source
or origin of where the plume comes from is
obscured.

Show me how it blends in gradually from
the sky far in the background

not how it just shoots up out of a mtn.

show me the source !!!! like this

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/8a00475c4225.jpg[/atsimg]

now show me in the video footage pic
of where the plume starts. It sure as hell
ain't way out in the ocean and among the clouds.
It's next to the surface.
surface = missile

You're all assuming that the Chinese are idiots.

Originally posted by die_another_day
You're all assuming that the Chinese are idiots.

I don't think they are at all.
2nd

Originally posted by die_another_day
You're all assuming that the Chinese are idiots.

Why is that???
Nice signature

reply to post by boondock-saint


Boon,

We have come up with a few more errors on your part.. My "boon error file" (really should rename it "assumption file") is getting heafty!

1) assuming a lot (as usual) You just cant stop with all of the assumptions. Do you plan on backing 1 of these with proof?
2) ICBM/IRBMs launched from subs can not be CONTROLLED once fired. Umbilical detachment and the missile is on its own.
3) Patriot missiles are not ship based. So we did not hit (or not) the Chicom missile with a Patriot and they could not have corrected its course if hit by anything else.

Credit - John


Your pics you just posted are laughable.. When have any of us "planers" tried to cover up the orgin.. Any fool can see that the contrail is going down to the horizon.. or at least thats what I thought. I dont know if you have heard of Christopher Columbus.. He proved the earth was round..many many years ago. - your welcome

Are you just digging up ghost arguments now?