Is this 9/11 nonsense going to ever go away? ZERO eveidence but still pushing on!

Originally posted by jfj123
Wow so everything is a conspiracy?

Not only is everything a conspiracy, but remember, it is the Jews that did it. Yes, the Jews are responsible for every bad thing that happens anywhere. Or so some people here seem to think!

Originally posted by VIVAREVOLUCION
Just because you aren't convinced or seen enough available evidence doesn't mean it should be dismissed. If you don't want to believe and agree with more than 100 million americans who feel that there is a lot of inconsistency with the 9/11 commission report then will you believe the 41 U.S. Counter Terrorism and Intelligence Agency Veterans?

Although I don't necessarily agree with that number, lets say it is true.
There is a HUGE difference between a massive, multi-country conspiracy to perpitrate 9/11 on the WORLD and "inconsistency".
You're attempting to suggest we throw the baby out with the bath water.

If Flight 93 did indeed crash instead of "shot down" as "truthers" and 9/11 Conspiracy Theorists say, What is Rumsfield talking about here?

Might I suggest the moron miss spoke ? Do you actually think people don't miss speak in the government? Remember bush and his comments about "nucular" weapons ?

Just look at the location of WTC #7 and answer the question to how it could have fallen demolition style being so far from the towers.

Fire and damage from falling debris.

Now let me ask you this question. WHY, in your mind, did 9/11 occur? what was your conspiracy supposed to accomplish?

Originally posted by aliengenes
Originally posted by jfj123
Would one of your truthers explain something to me?
Since it would take literally thousands and thousands of people to pull off the grandest conspiracy in the history of man, as described by truthers, where are all these people? Out of all these people, not one person has come forward with a guilty conscience? Not one person has misspoke? Not one person has sent an incriminating email? NOTHING ? Each person involved would have a huge amount of paperwork associated with that person and NOTHING ? The government can't do anything without filling out paperwork in triplicate !

edit on 2-10-2010 by jfj123 because: (no reason given)

not true.
first off the government is not affiliated directly with these projects. private sector with military protection.

OK so is this hypothesis part of the "official truther" story?
And the military is part of the government.

these people are life term employees and specially profiled selected

Could you provide evidence to substantiate this claim? What is the selection criteria?

they are not a part of society the way you might understand,

Obviously you do understand so please explain it to me. Thanks.

they live by different sets of rules and practices and do not answer to anyone outside of their secret circles.

Which circles? If they're secret, how do you know about them?

they went in fully briefed, took their oaths of silence, and were turned loose to do what they were hired to do, and proudly live untouchable and silent.

Please provide evidence to support your claim.

they pay no taxes.

You must have some serious inside information to know they pay no taxes ! That detail is very specific. How did you come about this information? Could you post this information? Also since they pay no taxes, how do they purchase goods and services?

they're only known by their encryption.

Another very specific detail. Could you provide evidence that shows this?

paid in cash with no traceable records.

Again, how do you know this? Obviously they don't have bank accounts so how do they purchase homes, cars, etc.. ?

and have no desire to talk to you.....EVER

Again, how do you know? Have you attempted to talk to them? If so, specifically who? Maybe I could get more info if I know ????

they live in a different reality. an alien reality

What are you implying here? That they are aliens? YES or NO.

Thanks.

Originally posted by dereks
Originally posted by jfj123
Wow so everything is a conspiracy?

Not only is everything a conspiracy, but remember, it is the Jews that did it. Yes, the Jews are responsible for every bad thing that happens anywhere. Or so some people here seem to think!

Yeah I've noticed that ! Makes me wonder if rush and beck are posting here !
And I've also noticed that some are now starting to blame.....are you ready??? ALIENS ! Maybe they're jewish aliens?
And have you also noticed that although the "truthers" disbelieve the official reports, they don't have an official story? Their conspiracies are all over the place.
The jews did it
The bush administration did it
It was a military coup
The aliens did it
Lasers melted the support beams
Holographic planes hit the towers
Giant, invisible, flying wombats destroyed the towers
etc....

reply to post by jfj123


And you believe a bunch of cave men pooled this of. Cave men who didn't have the IQ to even TAXI a Cessna.

These cave men probably needed CIA and NSA help just find United States on the map. And probably needed their money and their help to get a passport and permission to enter the US.

These hijacker were labeled as potential terrorists and monitored long before they came to the US. I wonder how they all passed security?

Originally posted by spy66
reply to post by jfj123

 

And you believe a bunch of cave men pooled this of. Cave men who didn't have the IQ to even TAXI a Cessna.

No I believe that 19 men were the "boots on the ground" but they were backed by a multi-billion dollar, world wide terror network known as al queda

These cave men probably needed CIA and NSA help just find United States on the map. And probably needed their money and their help to get a passport and permission to enter the US.

I like the way you lie and make it sound like I'm expecting you to believe ONLY 19 "cavemen" PULLED off 9/11. Whether you believe the "official account" of 9/11 or not, if you've spent any time at all looking into it, you know this is simply not true. So why would you attempt to portray it as true if you know it's not? What is your motivation to lie?

These hijacker were labeled as potential terrorists and monitored long before they came to the US. I wonder how they all passed security?

Really? You wonder ? How about the ongoing incompetence that is the united states government? We had a president who thought it was pronounced NUCULAR ! People can literally walk through our porous southern border. Did you know we have a HUGE illegal alien problem here in the US because we don't have properly protected borders?

Originally posted by jfj123

Originally posted by spy66
reply to post by jfj123

 

And you believe a bunch of cave men pooled this of. Cave men who didn't have the IQ to even TAXI a Cessna.

No I believe that 19 men were the "boots on the ground" but they were backed by a multi-billion dollar, world wide terror network known as al queda

These cave men probably needed CIA and NSA help just find United States on the map. And probably needed their money and their help to get a passport and permission to enter the US.

I like the way you lie and make it sound like I'm expecting you to believe ONLY 19 "cavemen" PULLED off 9/11. Whether you believe the "official account" of 9/11 or not, if you've spent any time at all looking into it, you know this is simply not true. So why would you attempt to portray it as true if you know it's not? What is your motivation to lie?

These hijacker were labeled as potential terrorists and monitored long before they came to the US. I wonder how they all passed security?

Really? You wonder ? How about the ongoing incompetence that is the united states government? We had a president who thought it was pronounced NUCULAR ! People can literally walk through our porous southern border. Did you know we have a HUGE illegal alien problem here in the US because we don't have properly protected borders?

Was not alquaeda a CIA branch for afghanistan?
Dont put us through the IQ test from US presindents please...

reply to post by Juanxlink



ISI and CIA supported the Taliban. The US created Al Qaeda network by importing extremists from Saudi Arabia to fight along side of Taliban. Against the >Russians.

CIA even used Al Qaeda in Yugoslavia in the early and mid 90s.

This multi billion dollar terror network has been financed by ISI, CIA and Saudi Arabia for decades.

reply to post by spy66


You mean the college educated, licensed pilot cavemen? Stupid comments about "cavemen" only illustrate the "corporate " ignorance on the part of the US government that made it so easy for us to be attacked.

reply to post by jfj123


Methinks some people have been watching a little too much Jack Bauer's 24, Alias, and/or james Bond to be coming up with such ideas. I think Hollywood is really twisting the way this world is into something unbelievable. Its as if the govt knows all, is all, and will take anyone it wants out. People should really cut back on fiction and get back to reality.

Originally posted by jfj123
Giant, invisible, flying wombats destroyed the towers etc....

Actually I think it was Jewish drop bears dropping onto the towers that crushed them

- well, there is as much evidence for drop bears as there is for explosives, holographic aircraft, thermite, nuclear weapons, beam weapons etc!

Originally posted by dereks
Originally posted by jfj123
Giant, invisible, flying wombats destroyed the towers etc....

Actually I think it was Jewish drop bears dropping onto the towers that crushed them

- well, there is as much evidence for drop bears as there is for explosives, holographic aircraft, thermite, nuclear weapons, beam weapons etc!

Excellent point !
Now these drop bears??? are they also invisible? Are they at war with the wombats? Maybe that's where the real conspiracy is ! The war between the drop bears and wombats !!!!

There seems to be ZERO intelligent responses to the flaws in the official story? Just curious... is ridicule the only thing you deniers have up your sleeves? Dirty politics only? No real substance? Too hard to debate the melting point of steel, or things like free fall, or pools of molten metal that burn for weeks? 'Three buildings falling straight down into their own footprints' is too much to respond to with any serious intelligence?

Seriously... I beg for an intelligent response... I really do want the Muslim terrorists to be the ones responsible, because the alternatives are really F-ing scary... but so far the only people making any logical or scientific sense are the truthers...

I totally get that you deniers/skeptics have zero respect for truthers, but just for 5 minutes can we put the insults aside, just so you can have the chance to really put this argument to bed?

Thank you...

Originally posted by spiritualzombie
'Three buildings falling straight down into their own footprints' is too much to respond to with any serious intelligence?[

As WTC 1 & 2 did not fall down into their own footprint.... that is just another truther lie, why claim that they did? What do you think damaged the other WTC buildings if WTC 1 & 2 fell down in their own footprints? This is why the truth movement is getting nowhere, they have to post lies like this!

but so far the only people making any logical or scientific sense are the truthers

So tonnes of silent explosives being installed so no one noticed the man months of work involved makes sense? mini nuclear weapons make sense? Holographic airplanes make sense? Missile firing pod carrying aircraft make sense? Beam weapons make sense? nanoo nanoo thermite makes sense - that no one saw anyone installing?

Originally posted by spiritualzombie
There seems to be ZERO intelligent responses to the flaws in the official story? Just curious... is ridicule the only thing you deniers have up your sleeves? Dirty politics only? No real substance? Too hard to debate the melting point of steel

We don't need to debate the melting point of steel within the context of structural failures of WTC 1 & 2, only the temps at which the beams loose strength.

or things like free fall

The buildings didn't fall at free fall speed. This can be confirmed simply by watching any youtube video of the buildings falling.

'Three buildings falling straight down into their own footprints' is too much to respond to with any serious intelligence?

They didn't fall into their own footprints but close. Wouldn't it be a bad idea to have 3 buildings fall so it looked like controlled demolition? If they were blown up, why not have them fall sideways and create even more damage and death ?

Seriously... I beg for an intelligent response... I really do want the Muslim terrorists to be the ones responsible,

They were.

because the alternatives are really F-ing scary... but so far the only people making any logical or scientific sense are the truthers...

Actually the truthers avoid actual science but use opinion, supposition and psuedo-science to help support their opinions.

I totally get that you deniers/skeptics have zero respect for truthers, but just for 5 minutes can we put the insults aside, just so you can have the chance to really put this argument to bed?

It will never be put to bed because the truthers don't want to put it to bed. No matter what evidence is presented to them, the refuse to believe it. Their response is to make up some kind of new super secret technology or by simply refusing to listen because, "they know what they saw", etc...

Every argument brought up in this thread by the truthers has been debunked over and over in other threads using SCIENCE. That's why skeptics really don't want to go down that same path again here. They refused to listen in every other thread so why would they listen here?

Originally posted by dereks

Originally posted by spiritualzombie
'Three buildings falling straight down into their own footprints' is too much to respond to with any serious intelligence?[

As WTC 1 & 2 did not fall down into their own footprint.... that is just another truther lie, why claim that they did? What do you think damaged the other WTC buildings if WTC 1 & 2 fell down in their own footprints? This is why the truth movement is getting nowhere, they have to post lies like this!

but so far the only people making any logical or scientific sense are the truthers

So tonnes of silent explosives being installed so no one noticed the man months of work involved makes sense? mini nuclear weapons make sense? Holographic airplanes make sense? Missile firing pod carrying aircraft make sense? Beam weapons make sense? nanoo nanoo thermite makes sense - that no one saw anyone installing?

Mini nukes, holographic planes?? What is this? The Bigfoot/Elvis debunker strategy??

Let's focus on the official story... Explain WTC7 collapse. Please...

Now if you want to talk about Nano Thermite... I would like to know why was that found in the rubble? Wouldn't you?

WTC1 & 2 certainly did collapse straight down... what videos have you seen that show them tipping to one side? I'd love to see the footage... seriously... if you have footage that shows the towers falling in any direction other than straight down, please share it.

We're all on the same side here... We all are extremely saddened by the events of 9/11. We're all angry at the people responsible and want to see justice served... I'm just not seeing any evidence to support the official story.

Again, I ask the skeptics to PLEASE present intelligent reason to believe these towers could fall the way they did in as short amount of time as they did and also explain why there were pools of molten metal underneath the wreckage for weeks after the event.

Still waiting, thank you...

Originally posted by jfj123
We don't need to debate the melting point of steel within the context of structural failures of WTC 1 & 2, only the temps at which the beams loose strength.

Pools of molten metal dictate that we must indeed discuss the melting point of steel. How did the beams lose their strength consistently down the height of the building? And they all lost strength in equal fashion? Does this really make sense to you?

The buildings didn't fall at free fall speed. This can be confirmed simply by watching any youtube video of the buildings falling.

WTC7 was absolutely free-fall speed. WTC1&2 fell consistent with a top-down demolition technique.

They didn't fall into their own footprints but close. Wouldn't it be a bad idea to have 3 buildings fall so it looked like controlled demolition? If they were blown up, why not have them fall sideways and create even more damage and death ?

Are you admitting here in your second sentence that the collapse do indeed resemble demolition style collapse? I agree, very bad idea... but like you point out... it was a messy footprint collpase, wasn't it... not totally perfect...

Actually the truthers avoid actual science but use opinion, supposition and psuedo-science to help support their opinions.

On the contrary most truthers will tell you they resisted these theories for years out of respect for those who died... it's the science and logic that was inescapable to the critical thinker.

It will never be put to bed because the truthers don't want to put it to bed. No matter what evidence is presented to them, the refuse to believe it. Their response is to make up some kind of new super secret technology or by simply refusing to listen because, "they know what they saw", etc...

Every argument brought up in this thread by the truthers has been debunked over and over in other threads using SCIENCE.

Give me one scientific argument that supports the way those buildings fell and accounts for the small footprints and even falls. Give me one scientific argument that supports the way WTC7 collapsed. Give me one scientific argument that explains the pools of molten metal.

Sill waiting... Thank you...

Originally posted by spiritualzombie

WTC1 & 2 certainly did collapse straight down... what videos have you seen that show them tipping to one side? I'd love to see the footage... seriously... if you have footage that shows the towers falling in any direction other than straight down, please share it.

Well they didn't fall STRAIGHT DOWN but lets say they did. So what? What exactly does that prove?
Just curious.

Originally posted by jfj123

Originally posted by spiritualzombie

WTC1 & 2 certainly did collapse straight down... what videos have you seen that show them tipping to one side? I'd love to see the footage... seriously... if you have footage that shows the towers falling in any direction other than straight down, please share it.

Well they didn't fall STRAIGHT DOWN but lets say they did. So what? What exactly does that prove?
Just curious.

Again, you say they didn't fall straight down... please show me video that shows them tipping in any direction other than straight down. The collapse is consistent with top down demolition.

To answer your question of why this matters... What is the probability that you can hit a building with a plane, and hit it so perfectly that it doesn't collapse in pieces or fall toward the corner that took the most direct hit, but instead fall straight down within 90 minutes. What are the chances of that?

Originally posted by spiritualzombie
Originally posted by jfj123
We don't need to debate the melting point of steel within the context of structural failures of WTC 1 & 2, only the temps at which the beams loose strength.

Pools of molten metal dictate that we must indeed discuss the melting point of steel.

Not at all actually. You see not all metals melt at the same temperature. Although steel is a metal, not all metals are steel. But again, why does it matter that molten METAL was found?

How did the beams lose their strength consistently down the height of the building?

Weight transfer.

And they all lost strength in equal fashion? Does this really make sense to you?

Yes.

The buildings didn't fall at free fall speed. This can be confirmed simply by watching any youtube video of the buildings falling.

WTC7 was absolutely free-fall speed. WTC1&2 fell consistent with a top-down demolition technique.

Buildings are typically imploded from the bottom up.

They didn't fall into their own footprints but close. Wouldn't it be a bad idea to have 3 buildings fall so it looked like controlled demolition? If they were blown up, why not have them fall sideways and create even more damage and death ?

Are you admitting here in your second sentence that the collapse do indeed resemble demolition style collapse?

I agree it does to the average untrained eye. That is part of the problem.

I agree, very bad idea... but like you point out... it was a messy footprint collpase, wasn't it... no totally perfect...

You're missing the point. Why would they want to make it fall even close to it's own footprint? What would be the advantage? There is a huge disadvantage that you've pointed out by your beliefs.

Give me one scientific argument that supports the way those buildings fell and accounts for the small footprints and even falls. Give me one scientific argument that supports the way WTC7 collapsed. Give me one scientific argument that explains the pools of molten metal.

Sill waiting... Thank you...

Big plane damaged a lot of support structures. Fires further weakened those structures. Collapse.
I could spend hours and hours posting source after source but you won't believe me. It is what it is.