why is fish not considered a meat?
do you eat fish?
meat = shorter life, page 2
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reply posted on 8-9-2010 @ 05:04 PM by Son of Will
reply to post by GallopingFish
Again, you are not reading the actual study. The study was done on RURAL CHINESE FARMERS in the outskirts of China. They aren't health fanatics. Their meat and dairy is actually organic, healthier than 90% of American meat and dairy.
Yet the study still showed a strong link between increased meat & dairy intake, and an increase in cancers and chronic diseases, whereas vegetable and fruit intake was associated with a decrease in those ailments.
Seriously, at least read about The China Study. Keep in mind that there has never been a peer-reviewed study that has refuted any aspect of this study. It's legitimate science, but it threatens the majority of the American diet, so people shrug it off as either a poorly conducted study (it isn't), or they just ignore it entirely and say "I'll eat what I want!" (fair enough).
But it's real, and undeniable to those with intellectual honesty.
Originally posted by GallopingFish
There a alot of different reasons. I bet you the oldest person will be a meat eater...
Vege eaters care alot more about what, when and how much they eat compared the old "give me a burger" NOM NOM NOM regular person.
Logically the meat eaters should be Fatter because they are more careless with their diet, therefore Heart attacks and strokes etc.
In the long run though the ones who eat meat in the correct portions will outlive vege eaters though. Vege eaters to me in my opinion always look weaker in body (not fat) just pale and unfit and lacking strength.
Again, you are not reading the actual study. The study was done on RURAL CHINESE FARMERS in the outskirts of China. They aren't health fanatics. Their meat and dairy is actually organic, healthier than 90% of American meat and dairy.
Yet the study still showed a strong link between increased meat & dairy intake, and an increase in cancers and chronic diseases, whereas vegetable and fruit intake was associated with a decrease in those ailments.
Seriously, at least read about The China Study. Keep in mind that there has never been a peer-reviewed study that has refuted any aspect of this study. It's legitimate science, but it threatens the majority of the American diet, so people shrug it off as either a poorly conducted study (it isn't), or they just ignore it entirely and say "I'll eat what I want!" (fair enough).
But it's real, and undeniable to those with intellectual honesty.
edit on 8-9-2010 by Son of Will because: clarification
reply posted on 8-9-2010 @ 05:08 PM by slinger
reply to post by Ong Bak
My uncle lived on a farm,as did my great grand father. Every day at 4:30AM their wife's got up cooked breakfast,
their was bacon,ham,eggs,potatoes,coffee,juice,And a lot more that ain't good for you! same went for lunch,and dinner,no meal did not have meat and I mean real red artery clogging meat!
Q HOW THE HELL DID ALL MY FAMILY LIVE TO OVER 80 YEARS OLD WITH ALL THAT BAD FOOD?
A THEY DID NOT SIT ON THEIR ASSES ALL DAY PLAYING VIDEO GAMES!
My uncle lived on a farm,as did my great grand father. Every day at 4:30AM their wife's got up cooked breakfast,
their was bacon,ham,eggs,potatoes,coffee,juice,And a lot more that ain't good for you! same went for lunch,and dinner,no meal did not have meat and I mean real red artery clogging meat!
Q HOW THE HELL DID ALL MY FAMILY LIVE TO OVER 80 YEARS OLD WITH ALL THAT BAD FOOD?
A THEY DID NOT SIT ON THEIR ASSES ALL DAY PLAYING VIDEO GAMES!
reply posted on 8-9-2010 @ 05:15 PM by Son of Will
reply to post by slinger
What makes you think they couldn't have lived to over 90, or 100, or 110, if they had been eating a vegan diet with the same busy lifestyle?
Get outta here with that defunct logic.
What makes you think they couldn't have lived to over 90, or 100, or 110, if they had been eating a vegan diet with the same busy lifestyle?
Get outta here with that defunct logic.
reply posted on 8-9-2010 @ 05:19 PM by Son of Will
Originally posted by susp3kt
It really depends on the type of meat one consumes.
Lean meat that has been trimmed of fat does not raise total cholesterol or LDL cholesterol levels in the body. Lean red meat that have been trimmed of fat is low in saturated fat. A number of studies have shown cholesterol reductions when people include lean red meat in a low saturated fat diet.
I would surmise that it depends on the way it is cooked as well.
Of course fried fatty meats should be avoided. Not by me though...I'm def a carnivore.Mmm mmm!
edit on 8-9-2010 by susp3kt because: Correction
No, the study the OP is talking about - And you can see the book of it here- is quite clear that all meats, even healthy organic meats, will cause long-term health ailments.
reply posted on 8-9-2010 @ 05:30 PM by GallopingFish
reply to post by Son of Will
Woops my bad! Cheers Son of Will.
I still will stand by my meat eating ways.
I still think there is more to it than that... meat is not the enemy to immortality
Woops my bad! Cheers Son of Will.
I still will stand by my meat eating ways
. I still think there is more to it than that... meat is not the enemy to immortality
reply posted on 8-9-2010 @ 05:47 PM by loner007
reply to post by GallopingFish
LOL omg what a total misconception you have of vegetarians. There is nothing in meat that the human body cannot get elsewhere. the only vitamin that Vegans cannot get is Vit b12 however vegetarians can easily get that through dairy products like milk cheese eggs. Thats a fact. It is also a fact that cooked meat causes cancer. Also you want to see what a vegetarian can do in terms of body building? heres a Link
LOL omg what a total misconception you have of vegetarians. There is nothing in meat that the human body cannot get elsewhere. the only vitamin that Vegans cannot get is Vit b12 however vegetarians can easily get that through dairy products like milk cheese eggs. Thats a fact. It is also a fact that cooked meat causes cancer. Also you want to see what a vegetarian can do in terms of body building? heres a Link
reply posted on 8-9-2010 @ 06:21 PM by kimish
reply to post by loner007
That guy is also most likely supplementing with protein that have the amino acid make ups that you can only get through meats or protein powders which are more expensive in the long haul than eating meats. He may be a vegetarian but he most likely is spending a whole hell of a lot of money on protein supplements to get the amino acids his brain and rest of body needs when he could just eat meat. It is true that cooking meat can attribute to cancer but the longer you cook the meat the greater chance you have of getting carcinogens. In other words, don't over cook your meat and you'll be fine. Also, moderation, as with just about everything in life, is key. Become educated on how to prepare your meats, when and how often to eat them and you will out live a vegan... Period. As I stated before, meats have amino acid make ups and different meats have different ratios of amino acids that you simply can't get from a fruit and veggie diet. Their are certain amino acids that are crucial for brain function and the functioning of your endocrine system that you simply can't get without eating meat and fish. Also, the right meats and fish have good fatty acids in them that can help lower cholesterol and keep hormone levels stabilized which is crucial for overall health and development. I could go on and on but I digress.
My brother was a strict vegan and read just every book and studies on the subject and I constantly get on him about how important it is to incorporate some meats and fish into the diet. Guess what, he now eats meat '
' and is much healthier now. Mind you, he only eats about 2-4
meals a week containing meat or fish which I think is just about right for his body type in terms of moderation. Just my .02
That guy is also most likely supplementing with protein that have the amino acid make ups that you can only get through meats or protein powders which are more expensive in the long haul than eating meats. He may be a vegetarian but he most likely is spending a whole hell of a lot of money on protein supplements to get the amino acids his brain and rest of body needs when he could just eat meat. It is true that cooking meat can attribute to cancer but the longer you cook the meat the greater chance you have of getting carcinogens. In other words, don't over cook your meat and you'll be fine. Also, moderation, as with just about everything in life, is key. Become educated on how to prepare your meats, when and how often to eat them and you will out live a vegan... Period. As I stated before, meats have amino acid make ups and different meats have different ratios of amino acids that you simply can't get from a fruit and veggie diet. Their are certain amino acids that are crucial for brain function and the functioning of your endocrine system that you simply can't get without eating meat and fish. Also, the right meats and fish have good fatty acids in them that can help lower cholesterol and keep hormone levels stabilized which is crucial for overall health and development. I could go on and on but I digress.
My brother was a strict vegan and read just every book and studies on the subject and I constantly get on him about how important it is to incorporate some meats and fish into the diet. Guess what, he now eats meat '
' and is much healthier now. Mind you, he only eats about 2-4
meals a week containing meat or fish which I think is just about right for his body type in terms of moderation. Just my .02reply posted on 8-9-2010 @ 06:57 PM by loner007
reply to post by kimish
YOu are so wrong about the amino acids oh so wrong. Also you are wrong with your surminsing of that body builders diet. If you taken care to read his site and pressed the word diet I think it would have made it clearer.
Plant sources of protein are gaining in popularity. Such sources include dried beans (black, kidney, northern, red, and white beans), peas, soy, nuts, and seeds. Yes these plant sources may lack one or more of the essential amino acids however when combined with whole grains such as rice, or by eating nuts or seeds with legumes , all the amino acids can be obtained.
Also theres what you call super foods all are plant based and gives you everything the body needs with the exception of 2 Vit B12 and Vit D both are found in dairy products. This is the only reason Vegans need to take supplements or eat fortified foods. Some super foods include agave barleygrass and the best superfood of all is Wheatgrass which contains all of the
B complex family, Vitamin A, C, E and K and there are 90 out of 102 of the essential minerals and trace minerals to be found in wheatgrass.
YOu are so wrong about the amino acids oh so wrong. Also you are wrong with your surminsing of that body builders diet. If you taken care to read his site and pressed the word diet I think it would have made it clearer.
Plant sources of protein are gaining in popularity. Such sources include dried beans (black, kidney, northern, red, and white beans), peas, soy, nuts, and seeds. Yes these plant sources may lack one or more of the essential amino acids however when combined with whole grains such as rice, or by eating nuts or seeds with legumes , all the amino acids can be obtained.
Also theres what you call super foods all are plant based and gives you everything the body needs with the exception of 2 Vit B12 and Vit D both are found in dairy products. This is the only reason Vegans need to take supplements or eat fortified foods. Some super foods include agave barleygrass and the best superfood of all is Wheatgrass which contains all of the
B complex family, Vitamin A, C, E and K and there are 90 out of 102 of the essential minerals and trace minerals to be found in wheatgrass.
reply posted on 8-9-2010 @ 07:16 PM by kimish
reply to post by loner007
I'm sorry as I should have been more specific. Meats and fish have amino acid ratios that you can't find in the plant kingdom. Ratios being the key word. Certain amino acids work synergistically with one another. I'm into bodybuilding... I know my fair share about this stuff because I'm somewhat ocd about it but I do appreciate your input but just because certain foods are gaining popularity doensn't really hold much weight in this discussion, remember that the theory that the earth was flat gained much popularity or the atkins diet gained popularity and we all know what went down with those two examples '' . The fruits and veggies have the minerals and vitamins that are crucial as well for they work synergistically with proteins,
many of which you cannot obtain enough of from meat alone, but that is why it is important to incorporate moderate levels of meats into the diet.
Are you also aware that many plants contain phytoestrogens? That's not to manly if you ask me. Phytoestrogens can cause feminization in males, and I for one do not want that but suit yourself. Granted many meats are injected with hormones, both male and female I don't believe they are linked to feminization, if anything they contribute to early sexual development. So, like I stated before, if you are educated on what you eat you can limit greatly the amount of meats grown with the aid of hormones.
Off the topic just a little bit, check this out... www.runtheplanet.com...
I'm sorry as I should have been more specific. Meats and fish have amino acid ratios that you can't find in the plant kingdom. Ratios being the key word. Certain amino acids work synergistically with one another. I'm into bodybuilding... I know my fair share about this stuff because I'm somewhat ocd about it but I do appreciate your input but just because certain foods are gaining popularity doensn't really hold much weight in this discussion, remember that the theory that the earth was flat gained much popularity or the atkins diet gained popularity and we all know what went down with those two examples '
' . The fruits and veggies have the minerals and vitamins that are crucial as well for they work synergistically with proteins,
many of which you cannot obtain enough of from meat alone, but that is why it is important to incorporate moderate levels of meats into the diet. Are you also aware that many plants contain phytoestrogens? That's not to manly if you ask me. Phytoestrogens can cause feminization in males, and I for one do not want that but suit yourself. Granted many meats are injected with hormones, both male and female I don't believe they are linked to feminization, if anything they contribute to early sexual development. So, like I stated before, if you are educated on what you eat you can limit greatly the amount of meats grown with the aid of hormones.
Off the topic just a little bit, check this out... www.runtheplanet.com...
edit on 8-9-2010 by kimish because: edited to add extra words to make more sense.
reply posted on 8-9-2010 @ 07:22 PM by DevolutionEvolvd
*sigh* Here we go again....
If the OP is referring to the China Project....try again. The actual data suggest that PLANT proteins correlated higher with cancer than did animal protein and that wheat consumption was the best predictor of heart disease and myocardial infarction. And let's not forget...it's Epidemiology, it doesn't prove anything.
The China Study....is a book. A book that should be burned. The author, T. Colin Campbell, is a fraud and a liar. www.abovetopsecret.com...
That is all.
P.S.: Cooked meat has NEVER been proven to cause cancer. Jesus Christ, where do you guys get this stuff?
If the OP is referring to the China Project....try again. The actual data suggest that PLANT proteins correlated higher with cancer than did animal protein and that wheat consumption was the best predictor of heart disease and myocardial infarction. And let's not forget...it's Epidemiology, it doesn't prove anything.
The China Study....is a book. A book that should be burned. The author, T. Colin Campbell, is a fraud and a liar. www.abovetopsecret.com...
That is all.
P.S.: Cooked meat has NEVER been proven to cause cancer. Jesus Christ, where do you guys get this stuff?
reply posted on 8-9-2010 @ 07:27 PM by slinger
Originally posted by Son of Will
reply to post by slinger
What makes you think they couldn't have lived to over 90, or 100, or 110, if they had been eating a vegan diet with the same busy lifestyle?
Get outta here with that defunct logic.
Too mean to live that long
No the point is no matter what you eat if you don't move you will not live to be old! exercise is the best thing
for a body, And still how many times you hear of that guy dead at 40 top of his health never smoked,ate right jogged,worked out and heart popped, out
of the blue hes dead? maybe he was to healthy? And to die that young with out having a big juicy T-Bone what a waste.
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