meat = shorter life

so i read an article the other day taht cited some study with thousands of men and women conducted over a period of like 25 years that showed a direct relationship between meat consumption and increased mortality rates/shorter life spans.
im not here to argue the validty of said study, im jsut wondering if the amount of people int he study, it think it was liek 50k people and the length of the study (25 years) is long enough to prove once and for all that what many well educated peopel have known for alogn time, that meat will kill you slowly, its legit?
or will meat eaters continue to deny the obvious fact that its poisoning their bodies becasue they jsut like to eat dead animals?

Originally posted by Ong Bak
or will meat eaters continue to deny the obvious fact that its poisoning their bodies becasue they jsut like to eat dead animals?

Except that is not a obvious fact, but just a made up story.

Vegetarians are just poor hunters who hate vegetables.

so 25 years and 50 thousand people involved ina study still arent enough?
how much would it take then?

pagingdrgupta.blogs.cnn.com...
anyway heres the link i dug it up. and it was 130k people and 26 years.
meat eaters died more, do with this what you will.

were all going to die one day and most of us arnt going to see a pention(whatever age it will be by then). so thanks for the warning but im giong to enjoy my meat and die happy nomatter how much quiker it is as a conciquence.

what a lot of nonsense this is, all you need to know is that the teeth in your mouth have evolved to allow us to eat both meat and veg, there are lots of different factors in life that stop us from reaching old age. if you look at vegans and vegetarians you will see that they need to consume extra vitamins and minerals not found in plants to stay healthy, if they dont they dont have a long life, you just have to take things in moderation

Wee Mad

Originally posted by weemadmental
what a lot of nonsense this is, all you need to know is that the teeth in your mouth have evolved to allow us to eat both meat and veg, there are lots of different factors in life that stop us from reaching old age. if you look at vegans and vegetarians you will see that they need to consume extra vitamins and minerals not found in plants to stay healthy, if they dont they dont have a long life, you just have to take things in moderation

Wee Mad

was unaware that teeth evolve.
also, wheres teh study taht shows any of this? seems like your just using your own empircal "evidence" and fact.
and exactly what vitamins and minerals are there in meat that a vegetarian wont be able to get without taking a pill?

reply to post by Ong Bak


While the general statement can be blanketed like that and it is true...

It is inaccurate to base it ONLY on consumption. After all, vegetables are more expensive than meat. Surely wealth is a factor in longer life. Also, where vegetables are grow (climate for a human is VERY unforgiving, and will deter lifespan longevity). I believe genetics and ethnicity also play a MAJOR role. Inuits eat mainly seal and whale blubber. Mongolians eat mainly cattle and goats and bison, etc. Indians (from India) are generally vegetarians and eat a lot of grains. Coastal Europeans eat a LOT of fish, as do the Japanese.

There are a lot of other factors that go into lifespan, not just diet. I'm an ex-vegan, so I've dove as deep as one can into this subject. Not to say that a diet of mainly vegetables is much healthier if that is what your genetics require. But that's not always the case!

I'm trying to follow a Paleodiet personally. Though I still eat WAY more refined carbs than I should. Basically, trace back your ethnicity, and find what the healthiest people in your lineage ate. That's what your genetics require.

Originally posted by danielhanson420
were all going to die one day and most of us arnt going to see a pention(whatever age it will be by then). so thanks for the warning but im giong to enjoy my meat and die happy nomatter how much quiker it is as a conciquence.

this is totally ignorant and self serving.
but at least it makes sense, so you get partiall credit.

Originally posted by Arcane Demesne
reply to post by Ong Bak

 

While the general statement can be blanketed like that and it is true...

It is inaccurate to base it ONLY on consumption. After all, vegetables are more expensive than meat. Surely wealth is a factor in longer life. Also, where vegetables are grow (climate for a human is VERY unforgiving, and will deter lifespan longevity). I believe genetics and ethnicity also play a MAJOR role. Inuits eat mainly seal and whale blubber. Mongolians eat mainly cattle and goats and bison, etc. Indians (from India) are generally vegetarians and eat a lot of grains. Coastal Europeans eat a LOT of fish, as do the Japanese.

There are a lot of other factors that go into lifespan, not just diet. I'm an ex-vegan, so I've dove as deep as one can into this subject. Not to say that a diet of mainly vegetables is much healthier if that is what your genetics require. But that's not always the case!

I'm trying to follow a Paleodiet personally. Though I still eat WAY more refined carbs than I should. Basically, trace back your ethnicity, and find what the healthiest people in your lineage ate. That's what your genetics require.

the study took into account other factors such as lifestyle and whatnot.
it still stated the same conlcusion, that more meat = more dead.
and it was not soem backwater animal welfare group conducting teh study. itwas published in teh annals of internal medicine and was overseen by medical professionals.

reply to post by Ong Bak


Yeah, you're referring to The China Study. It's one of the most underrated, and underreported stories of the 20th century. I've read the book several times now, and all the critical reviews - I can definitely say that it is 100% legitimate!

I urge everybody to try going 1 month without eating any meat or dairy. Yes that means ice cream and cheese and milk and yogurt etc. But when you think about it, do you really want to be eating foods derived from the breast milk of a dirty cow that's been (in most cases) injected with potent genetically-engineered hormones which make them sick and cause their livers to expand to almost twice their original size (not good). So then they are pumped full of antibiotics to counter the sickening effects from these GMO hormones. The result is milk that is in some cases up to 20% puss and bacterial discharge.

However I must stress that the study above did NOT include any hormone-laden meats or milk. It was all free-range in the remote provinces of China, where dietary practices and lifestyle have gone almost entirely unchanged for many generations. This means that even organic meat and dairy will still lead to increased chances of a wide range of cancers and chronic illnesses.

It really changed my life, to be honest... I have been ridden with so many physiological problems my entire life, and ever since I went vegan 3 years ago, they've ALL cleared up entirely. Even my thinking seems more clear. My metabolism is now very high, and I couldn't get fat if I tried. My body odor is noticeably lower, my libido has never been better, acid reflux is a distant memory (meat and dairy acidify your blood pH, veggies and fruits tend to make it more alkaline - a health benefit with lots of documentation behind it), IBS = gone, appetite increased, skin complexion is better, and I never ever get sick. Besides the others I've forgotten to list, there's one other that I won't mention here =)

so that's a personal anecdote, for what it's worth. I should note that at the same time I became vegan, I also went cold turkey on drinking soda and all products containing high fructose corn syrup. But I never consumed very much of either of those so the physiological changes I think are mostly attributable to going vegan.

"meat = shorter life"

Yes, especially for the one being eaten.

I've seen very long-term studies of vegetarian Seventh Day Adventists showing they have a significantly longer life-span than the rest of society.

For most people, eating more vegetables and less meat will result in better health and more energy. However many will not reduce their meat intake because they've been brainwashed into believing dead bodies contain some sort of magic ingredients which can't be obtained elsewhere.

The research conducted with apes and another one with some worms concluded that periodical hunger improves health and life expectancy...

Those eating alot constantly eat themselves to early death. It is not meat that kills, but too much of fatty food. Vegetarians may lead generally healthier lifestyle than some carnivores amongst us humans.

-v

Please read Jorge Cruise's boom "The Belly Fat Diet" (carb swap diet) It not only teaches you how to eat right to lose weight, and be healthy, but he explains how in reality, the carbohydrate excesses cause obesity and illnesses. Meat, cheeses, whole eggs, and butter are good for us, we were designed to live off of them, its the excesses of starchy carbs and sugar, that creates heart disease. Check it out. In a nutshell, no more than 20 grams of starchy carbs per meal, no more than 120 grams of carbs in a given day. No more than 15 grams of sugar per day. You can eat any type of meat or animal by product, and vegetables smothered in butter. I eat like this all the time now and feel great. I lost all my excess belly fat and have more energy. occasionally I "reset" my bodies appetite and metabolism by dropping the carbs down to 25 grams PER DAY!

Originally posted by weemadmental
what a lot of nonsense this is, all you need to know is that the teeth in your mouth have evolved to allow us to eat both meat and veg, there are lots of different factors in life that stop us from reaching old age. if you look at vegans and vegetarians you will see that they need to consume extra vitamins and minerals not found in plants to stay healthy, if they dont they dont have a long life, you just have to take things in moderation

Wee Mad

That's not very logical when you think about it. You're assuming that evolution is perfect. It isn't. Evolution drives species to procreate. For humans, they become sexually active in the first 1/5 of their lifespan, roughly. Meat is rich in resources and can be very nutritious for a growing individual. When humans were still evolving hundreds of thousands of years ago, we didn't have farms mass-producing vegetables - we had to get nutrients where we could find them.

The problem is, eating meat and dairy has been linked to long-term diseases, like cancer and chronic illnesses. Evolution wouldn't affect these, because it merely is concerned with getting the species to procreate. Hence, evolution is not perfect.

That's why we get cancer at all. Because we didn't evolve perfectly. Remember the appendix? That *used* to have a function, but it doesn't anymore. By your logic, since we still have incisors to cut meat, we shouldn't ever get cancer, and we shouldn't have appendices. But we do.

You can't just look at the human body, and from that alone, determine what is and isn't going to be healthy in the long-term. Only epidemiological studies which span several decades, like the one I cited above, can begin to answer the question of what is truly healthy for a human being on the long term. There's been a few studies which claim to refute it, but these are laughable when you look at the data they are citing - usually a few dozen people over a couple months.

edit to add - yes, taking extra vitamins like B12 can be beneficial, although the science behind that is not clear. The author himself does NOT take any supplements whatsoever and is as healthy as a racehorse especially for his age. So I think again, you're relying on anecdotal myth, opposed to scientific fact. Logic and reason are meaningless when you have an incorrect initial set of data. For some reason people are unable to look objectively at the situation and do honest thinking, when their steak&cheese sandwiches are implicated as being unhealthy.

Originally posted by Ong Bak
so i read an article the other day taht cited some study with thousands of men and women conducted over a period of like 25 years that showed a direct relationship between meat consumption and increased mortality rates/shorter life spans.
im not here to argue the validty of said study, im jsut wondering if the amount of people int he study, it think it was liek 50k people and the length of the study (25 years) is long enough to prove once and for all that what many well educated peopel have known for alogn time, that meat will kill you slowly, its legit?
or will meat eaters continue to deny the obvious fact that its poisoning their bodies becasue they jsut like to eat dead animals?

Forgive my assumption, but based upon your last sentence, I'm reckoning that you're a vegetarian, probably a vegan. Feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

I read an article that stated that some Australian scientists have linked vegetarianism with reduced brain size. (No kidding). I think one study is just about as valid as the other. Oh right... You're not arguing the validity of the study; (just using the [apparently obviously valid] study in an attempt to pass off an opinion as fact.)

Although... Looking at your spelling, grammar,("educated peopel" Oh, C'mon) and debate tactics (One does not say 'I'm not arguing the validity of the study', and then go on in the next breath supporting it's validity and expect to be taken seriously), does cause me to wonder about those Australians and their study. Maybe they're both right.

Either that, or you're scarfing a cheeseburger right now, trying to make vegetarians look bad.

reply to post by Ong Bak


I don't think game meat is bad. I think a lot of what has to do with life spans is lack of exercise and eating grocery store meat from Monsanto grain fed animals that have also been filled with antibiotics and steroids.

Natural meat is your friend, not farm meat.

you lick all the tree moss you want. im sticking to chicken, stakes, and turkeys. good stuff!

Mastication is good,meat tastes good ,eating a burger makes you feel good,feeling good makes you live longer.

reply to post by redhorse


My IQ score has increased since I went vegan. By roughly 5-10 points. I won't say what it is, but I assure you, I'm no slouch. And you're wrong about the original study, it is the most impressive epidemiological study on nutrition ever conducted in history. Try taking a look at it sometime, especially before commenting in a thread about it.

ETA - Geeze, seems like the ATS motto got thrown into the dumpster for this thread. I wish people would be a bit more intelligent when it comes to such an important subject. You all care about the future, the NWO, maintaining personal and national sovereignty, but when it comes to your very own bodies, you ignore sound science?