another reason why i think religious people are being fooled

reply to post by Mykahel


sometimes you love someone who is a vile piece of work its fareley common
so they are the exception to your heavenly paradiseside of the arguement

but lets say that you are a myrmodon you go to heaven
but on earth you had a very close loved one, they were good, morale, kind, giving, the whole shabang or whatever you would call it, but one problem....they didnt believe in god.
they go to hell

can you make a good situation out of that?

also why is it ok for god to judge someone over a basic time period of around 80 years for eternity?
thats just not right dont try to tell me it is because i think most people here would agree it doesnt seem right

reply to post by ashanu90


and if you read what yeshua said, they seem like 2 entirely different
ways of thinking, don't they?

mentioned it before, will mention it again: sometimes it's enki, sometimes it's enlil, and there's always a chance there are other elohim (anunnaki) in there as well. there's more than one. add to that, the words used to describe god, such as lord, were interchangeable for egyptian pharaohs, kings, angels, and the other gods of the divine council.

Your thread title implies that you believe religious people as a generality are being fooled and yet you only speak of Christianity.
Well how is this presenting a well-rounded argument ?

My opinion, for what it's worth, is that the major established religions, including Christianity, are obsolete. Really, people need to be 'getting on' with their spiritual development, but instead are still adhering to millennia old doctrines. If anything, religion has become a distraction, like the materialistic virtues that unfortunately uphold modern society.
Religion has been and continues to be a good and a bad thing. It's how you look at it and choose to react to it. Incredible, seemingly impossible feats have been accomplished in the name of the Divine, and yet unimaginable atrocities continue to be ardently spread about the world in the name of a God.

We could go on until the cows came home about how people are blindingly being fooled into believing something that is so obviously BS.
Yes, there are currently fundamentalists out there torturing and blowing up people and cities, committing crimes that I'm sure I couldn't even imagine in my darkest of nightmares. This is a monumental issue, one that won't be properly addressed in decades to come.

Sure, these religious types might p*ss you off by asking you stupid questions and insisting their beliefs upon you because they clearly have smaller scope on such issues as religion and life itself; that's not the ego talking, it's clearly the way that some people are. You know, how some ask questions like "how do athiests fill the hole inside?" Guaranteed, a majority of the ATS population would get fired up over that one, even non-athiests.
Hell, lets tie pedophilia into the religious debate. Another reason why religion is so sh*tty. Let's not forget all of the sickos who sing their praises on their holy day only to return home to abuse their family as it pleases them and generally treat people like dirt.

Sh*t though. What about all of these people who are genuinely happy, compassionate people, who selflessly give their time and effort and support to anyone and everyone who needs it? But they don't really exist right? Many people forget, understandably due to the evil that they are surrounded by and witness through the media or right in front of them on a daily basis; and these beautiful, passionate people, they're a dying breed, I'll give you that. We see it less and less nowadays. That doesn't mean that it's non-existent. And as long as there is this love and compassion encompassing the souls of 'so-called' religious people, then the problem doesn't lie in the institution itself.
The problem lies in the diverse minds of people. And it's because we're gradually flushing out the good and wholesome with our intolerance and mutual hate and lack of understanding and compassion.

These people who aren't spreading hate and contempt or committing abuse, murder and genocide, they're happy aren't they? Some of them? They believe in something maybe you cannot fathom, but there's happiness there? So what the f*ck are you worried about?? It's an issue of intolerance, and it is YOUR issue.
The bad happens, it's un-ignorable and deplorable, it envelopes and captures the breath of the world every time we catch a glimpse of the news; but the good occurs simultaneously.
Don't forget that. It's just as important, even more so.

reply to post by ashanu90

thats a very strange question to ask

With that as an answer. I rest my case. Soon you will know scripture to be the word of God. There is no denying it looks exactly like the blood of a dead man. The same as there is no denying there is a God. No matter
how intelligent you make yourself sound in doing so. You are completely and absolutly beyond any doubt dead wrong.The things that are coming upon the Earth will cause mens hearts to fail them. All you have to defend yourself is your denial. What does that amount to?

[edit on 28-5-2010 by randyvs]

Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by ashanu90

 

thats a very strange question to ask

With that as an answer. I rest my case. Soon you will know scripture to be the word of God. There is no denying it looks exactly like the blood of a dead man. The same as there is no denying there is a God. No matter
how intelligent you make yourself sound in doing so. You are completely and absolutly beyond any doubt dead wrong.The things that are coming upon the Earth will cause mens hearts to fail them. All you have to defend yourself is your denial. What does that amount to?

[edit on 28-5-2010 by randyvs]

i have no idea what you are talking about
it didnt look like a dead mans blood to me, there was white red and orange in that mix, i would have guessed some kind of wacky oil to tell you the truth but i guess that doesnt matter to you does it?

reply to post by pretty_vacant


yes i am focused on christianity but religion in general is also up for scrutiny.
but why you ask that i focus my attention on christianity? il tell you.
im SUROUNDED BY IT.im an island of complex and rational thought in a sea of awful, suffocating, door to door, roll around on the floor, idiotic mindless spoutings of PRAISE THE LORD! GOD THIS, GOD THAT, HAVE YOU ACCEPTED JESUS?? LOVE GOD(but it also says to fear him? what ever)! BLA BLA BLA BLA BLA, MUSIC IS SATAN!! TV IS SATAN!! ANYTHING WE DONT AGREE WITH IS SATAN!
SATAN??? SAAAAAAAATTTTTAAAAAANNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!!! AHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!! AHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!
you dont even know how badly i want to scream STFU!!!!!!


but anyway sure there are great people out there who also believe in god and i politely disagree with them if you havent realized it the actual problem for me is brainwashed myrmidon zealots. you accuse me of being intolerant, they dont tolerate me and if i want to blog about it my dislike of them and my disagreements then whats the problem? i realize i get carried away but remember this the only thing anyone on ATS can ever do is SAY something. no one will ever DO something so you dont have to worry about pissed athiests like me venting our anger, because were doing it with a keyboard not violence.

so yeah theres my story i hope that answered any questions for you

[edit on 29-5-2010 by ashanu90]

[edit on 29-5-2010 by ashanu90]

Standing in my shoes, I find it hard to believe that even in these times that we live in, there are many people who still don't believe in God. I would think the world would be a real scary place without the comfort of at least knowing him. I have peace in my heart everyday no matter what happens. To me thats worth everything in the world.

Originally posted by prophecywatcher
Standing in my shoes, I find it hard to believe that even in these times that we live in, there are many people who still don't believe in God.

That's funny, because I look at a world full of constant randomness and chaos and marvel that anyone could possibly think this all happened by anything other than chance, and that there is an intelligent entity guiding it all according to some vague, incomprehensible plan.

reply to post by Blue Shift


i couldnt agree waith you more.

whjy does anyone belive in this stuff ive looked through the bible and ive found some ridicoulous beliefs that people have

oh and speaking of benny hin it reminds me of a time when i saw a televangelist on tv he was saying this
"god is telling me that someone watching has a pain in their leg, your healed now"
am i the only one who is reminded of the tv show crossing over with john edwards?

so why do people believe the bible its a book, ive heard it said that "because the prophecies have come true" or "ive met god"

well what if i said taht i met the flying sphagheti monster and i am his prophet? what if i said in the future an airplane will blow up and everyone will be sad then it happens? or that stocks will go down and that happens or i could vaguely describe a new car and then a they make one that was similair to the description?
its the same thing if you ask me

Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by ashanu90

 

thats a very strange question to ask

With that as an answer. I rest my case. Soon you will know scripture to be the word of God. There is no denying it looks exactly like the blood of a dead man. The same as there is no denying there is a God. No matter
how intelligent you make yourself sound in doing so. You are completely and absolutly beyond any doubt dead wrong.The things that are coming upon the Earth will cause mens hearts to fail them. All you have to defend yourself is your denial. What does that amount to?

[edit on 28-5-2010 by randyvs]

And what if that God that you follow unquestionably simply wanted to test us without us knowing the test and instead of rewarding those who follow without thinking critically, they are sent to hell, and those who doubt things and think critically about what they read and what they believe are rewarded eternally?
You can never claim to know exactly what God is thinking, that is pure arrogance.

My problem is with the all the blood spilled in the name of Relativism, in the name of greed, in the name of jealousy, in the name of love, in the name of national pride, in the name of science, in the name of ego......

.....are we seeing a pattern here yet????

I wish people who argue against Christianity would be able to come with more substance, with more flavor, with more creativity.

Oh well, I'll just stay bored re-reading the same posts with the same insubstantial argumentational tactics that are basically straw houses

Originally posted by dominicus
My problem is with the all the blood spilled in the name of Relativism, in the name of greed, in the name of jealousy, in the name of love, in the name of national pride, in the name of science, in the name of ego......

.....are we seeing a pattern here yet????

I wish people who argue against Christianity would be able to come with more substance, with more flavor, with more creativity.

Oh well, I'll just stay bored re-reading the same posts with the same insubstantial argumentational tactics that are basically straw houses

How are we supposed to argue against Christianity? There's nothing to argue with, you can believe it on faith, or you can not believe it, that's pretty much it, and since you can't out argue faith, you can't argue with Christianity.
But I'd love to see the numbers compared to those killed in the name of god to those killed..in the name of...science?
Give me your evidence for Christianity and i'll try my best though.
That means evidence of the existance of the Christian God.

[edit on 28-5-2010 by hippomchippo]

reply to post by hippomchippo

How are we supposed to argue against Christianity? There's nothing to argue with, you can believe it on faith, or you can not believe it, that's pretty much it, and since you can't out argue faith, you can't argue with Christianity.
But I'd love to see the numbers compared to those killed in the name of god to those killed..in the name of...science?
Give me your evidence for Christianity and i'll try my best though.
That means evidence of the existance of the Christian God.

First things first,
Unlike most Christians, who are still new to the path and still need to operate by faith and trust, the weathered Christians who have been in it for decades and have delved the fathomless depths of the walk with God ...they will tell you that there is a state beyond Faith and Belief. This a state where you begin to experience God.

For the evidence of God, it would require a person top take up the Christian walk in the degree of being a Spiritual Scientist. You would have to test it for yourself whether it is true or not.

It works like this: At first, and only for a little while, you take Christianity on Faith/Belief. Soon after, what begins to happen is a transformation and real definite experiences of God, spiritual realms, the after life and so on.

At this rate, belief and faith are thrown out the window because one who is experiencing God, doesn't need faith or belief since they are experiencing the truth of the existence of God first hand.

I'm not talking about some Old Guy on a cloud with a beard. I'm talking about the destruction of your ego, additional faculties that make logic and reason look like kindergarteners in the face of transcendence.
_______________
You will never understand nor will you be happy with any correct answers using the mind (concepts, ideas, constructs, logic, reason) when the existence of God is experienced beyond the mind in higher faculties within you ....which in most are still deactivated.

We are talking about a reality, a being, an existence beyond thought. It is simply a matter if tuning into the right frequency the way you would on a radio station, to experience that radio channel. The Bible is a method that slowly breaks down the programming of this world (ego, lust, greed, jealousy, separation, etc) and brings you into a spiritual experience and reality where none of the worldly ways of programming can effect you.

Eventually you reach a point of transcending all the B.S. and you are like a rock, unaffected by the everyday B.S.
_______________
My point being, I was once an atheist and thought Christianity to be a bunch of Santa-Claus, hobbitts, and other childhood fantasies until I examined it closer and direct God experiences were revealed to me.

Having been once and Atheist, and also once a Christian ....I can tell you that Atheism was like having blindfolds on to the realities of inifinity and eternity. I feel free now, free from the system, I laugh at death and welcome it with open arms, I have no fears, and all my senses and health improved ten fold since all the experiences started.

Since being a Christian it is the first time in life that I feel alive, every freakin breath of air is amazing!!!!!! It wasn't like this as an Atheist and I would take a bullet before I ever professed Atheism just for the sake of the directly revealed divine experiences that I can never deny.
___________
Death's in the name of science you say??? Ok .....atomic bomb + war = ??? Inventing diseases and chemical weapons, the chemicals that are in foods like Benzene, the artificial sweetners that give people cancer, the chemicals in plastics that are bad for us.

You see??? Its relative. You can say many have Killed in the name of Xtianity and many have done awesome things and helped in the name of Xtainity.

Same goes for science. You can say science has saved lives due to discoveries and has also killed lives due to discoveries.

[edit on 28-5-2010 by dominicus]

[edit on 28-5-2010 by dominicus]

Originally posted by dominicus
reply to post by hippomchippo

 

How are we supposed to argue against Christianity? There's nothing to argue with, you can believe it on faith, or you can not believe it, that's pretty much it, and since you can't out argue faith, you can't argue with Christianity.
But I'd love to see the numbers compared to those killed in the name of god to those killed..in the name of...science?
Give me your evidence for Christianity and i'll try my best though.
That means evidence of the existance of the Christian God.

First things first,
Unlike most Christians, who are still new to the path and still need to operate by faith and trust, the weathered Christians who have been in it for decades and have delved the fathomless depths of the walk with God ...they will tell you that there is a state beyond Faith and Belief. This a state where you begin to experience God.

For the evidence of God, it would require a person top take up the Christian walk in the degree of being a Spiritual Scientist. You would have to test it for yourself whether it is true or not.

It works like this: At first, and only for a little while, you take Christianity on Faith/Belief. Soon after, what begins to happen is a transformation and real definite experiences of God, spiritual realms, the after life and so on.

At this rate, belief and faith are thrown out the window because one who is experiencing God, doesn't need faith or belief since they are experiencing the truth of the existence of God first hand.

I'm not talking about some Old Guy on a cloud with a beard. I'm talking about the destruction of your ego, additional faculties that make logic and reason look like kindergarteners in the face of transcendence.
_______________
You will never understand nor will you be happy with any correct answers using the mind (concepts, ideas, constructs, logic, reason) when the existence of God is experienced beyond the mind in higher faculties within you ....which in most are still deactivated.

We are talking about a reality, a being, an existence beyond thought. It is simply a matter if tuning into the right frequency the way you would on a radio station, to experience that radio channel. The Bible is a method that slowly breaks down the programming of this world (ego, lust, greed, jealousy, separation, etc) and brings you into a spiritual experience and reality where none of the worldly ways of programming can effect you.

Eventually you reach a point of transcending all the B.S. and you are like a rock, unaffected by the everyday B.S.
_______________
My point being, I was once an atheist and thought Christianity to be a bunch of Santa-Claus, hobbitts, and other childhood fantasies until I examined it closer and direct God experiences were revealed to me.

Having been once and Atheist, and also once a Christian ....I can tell you that Atheism was like having blindfolds on to the realities of inifinity and eternity. I feel free now, free from the system, I laugh at death and welcome it with open arms, I have no fears, and all my senses and health improved ten fold since all the experiences started.

Since being a Christian it is the first time in life that I feel alive, every freakin breath of air is amazing!!!!!! It wasn't like this as an Atheist and I would take a bullet before I ever professed Atheism just for the sake of the directly revealed divine experiences that I can never deny.
___________
Death's in the name of science you say??? Ok .....atomic bomb + war = ??? Inventing diseases and chemical weapons, the chemicals that are in foods like Benzene, the artificial sweetners that give people cancer, the chemicals in plastics that are bad for us.

You see??? Its relative. You can say many have Killed in the name of Xtianity and many have done awesome things and helped in the name of Xtainity.

Same goes for science. You can say science has saved lives due to discoveries and has also killed lives due to discoveries.

[edit on 28-5-2010 by dominicus]

[edit on 28-5-2010 by dominicus]

Science saves lives directly, People claim that religion saves their lives when their lives were never in danger, you could also claim faith healing but thats quite dubious no? Yes people use science for evil, but science is used for so much good in the world that to compare it to religious good is sorry but just ridiculous.
Penicillin is alot more useful than a belief in Jesus to me.

You're telling me to suspend belief for a little bit and then God will show himself to me, well, I tried that for the major part of my life, but I couldn't believe anymore, it was just like one day something snapped in my mind and I stopped visiting church, but I still believed in God, then a little later, I questioned even that, Why did I believe in God? Then I realized the only reason I did was because of the religion and that I had no real reason to believe in God, and so I became an atheist, so please understand, I've thought about this quite a bit and used to be a Christian.

reply to post by dominicus


dominicus you are describing a system of what i call self indoctrination,
1. your scared of death and you entertain the idea of god and angels and whatnot because eternal life after death sounds great.
2. you start to believe god exists and you trick yourself to believe in everything the bible says and you decorate your house with crosses and images of jesus
3.you become so incredibley obssessive with the thoughts of god and angels and avoiding sin, that a thought that doesnt involve any of those things rarely occurs
4. you become delusional you begin to hallucinate you see god and angels
maybe god or his angels talk to you
5.you are now a fullfledged brainwashed zealot myrmidon

sorry to come off harsh

reply to post by hippomchippo

And what if that God that you follow unquestionably simply wanted to test us without us

You do a good job of making me sound, as though I am fully righteous.
Believe me I know I'm not. I will be lucky to get passed the pearly gates.
I also realise that no matter what explanation you use to explain existence.
They can all be made to sound hokey. I think one thing we should at least be able to move passed. Is that competition of trying to render the opposing view as more lame .

reply to post by ashanu90


it's interesting that you should mention decorating the house with crosses. (are you reading my posts?)

the place of the cross or place of the crossing, is the name of enlil's city of nibru in ancient sumer. it was the "mirrored on earth" spot of the crossing of jupiter across the celestial meridian, which was mirrored at nibru.

what do you see hanging around this guy's neck?
www.thelivingmoon.com...

this is ALOT older than you think it is.

reply to post by ashanu90

dominicus you are describing a system of what i call self indoctrination,
1. your scared of death and you entertain the idea of god and angels and whatnot because eternal life after death sounds great.
2. you start to believe god exists and you trick yourself to believe in everything the bible says and you decorate your house with crosses and images of jesus
3.you become so incredibley obssessive with the thoughts of god and angels and avoiding sin, that a thought that doesnt involve any of those things rarely occurs
4. you become delusional you begin to hallucinate you see god and angels
maybe god or his angels talk to you
5.you are now a fullfledged brainwashed zealot myrmidon

It is important to see the folly in your argument. The same can be said about yourself in thay:

Ashanu90 you are describing a system of what i call self indoctrination,
1. your scared of the existence of God and you entertain the idea of no God and no afterlife and whatnot because no God sounds great.
2. you start to believe god doesn't exist and you trick yourself to believe in everything the Atheism says and you decorate your house with literature on Atheism
3.you become so incredibley obssessive with the thoughts of No god and no angels and the non-existence of sin, that a thought that doesnt involve any of those things rarely occurs
4. you become delusional you begin to hallucinate that there is no God
maybe nothingness talks to you
5.you are now a fullfledged brainwashed atheist zealot myrmidon

Please do come with something more substantial
________________________________________
In reply to Hippomchippo

Science saves lives directly, People claim that religion saves their lives when their lives were never in danger, you could also claim faith healing but thats quite dubious no? Yes people use science for evil, but science is used for so much good in the world that to compare it to religious good is sorry but just ridiculous.
Penicillin is alot more useful than a belief in Jesus to me.

You're telling me to suspend belief for a little bit and then God will show himself to me, well, I tried that for the major part of my life, but I couldn't believe anymore, it was just like one day something snapped in my mind and I stopped visiting church, but I still believed in God, then a little later, I questioned even that, Why did I believe in God? Then I realized the only reason I did was because of the religion and that I had no real reason to believe in God, and so I became an atheist, so please understand, I've thought about this quite a bit and used to be a Christian.

I agree science saves lives. Science also created the atomic bomb which was dropped on hiroshima and nagasaki. Is science responsible for the deaths of all these Japanese or are people? Ask yourself this.

Science gave us the ability to drill for oil and no we have the huge disaster in the gulf. Is science responsible for this mess or people.

The answer is people.

I'm not telling you to suspend belief ...I'm saying that you are uniquely structured and because of that your approach to God will be entirely different than others'. Have you tried meditation, have you tried going within, have you tried investigating the origin of thoughts, emotions, etc. You might be better suited for Advaita Vedanta or Mystical Christianity, or something else. That's my point.

Plus, many ex-Christians are ex because they failed to penetrate the depths and experiences of the truth within Xtianity. Without giving it your all, meditation, and some hard-core inquiry ...it could be said that many ex-Christains simply window shopped.