Mosque to go up near New York's ground zero

Originally posted by ProUSA

Originally posted by SpectreDC

Originally posted by ProUSA
reply to post by v3_exceed

 

Fair enough, you don't approve of my diction, I can live with that.

But if you hate Muslims, you are racist to Afghanistan, Algeria, Azerbaijan, Comoros, Djibouti, Egypt, Iran, Iraq, Kuwait, Libya, Maldives, Mali, Mauritania, Morocco, Niger, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Senegal, Somalia, Syria, Tunisia, Turkey, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Western Sahara, and Yemen.

So, use whatever words you want. We all know what it means in the end.

Well, you can't be racist towards a country. Being racist means you hate a race. I can agree with the sentiment that the R word is thrown around far too often when you can just call them bigots.

Those countries all are roughly the same race, so I think that it's applicable to be racist against those countries. I see your point; it's hard to be racist against states like the USA because there is so many different races mixed in the same country. However, in places like I listed previously, where the countries contain the same race (mostly), I believe it's acceptable to use the term racists when it comes to them.

But, to each is his own. At least you understand what I'm trying to say.

Racists, bigots, whatever. The word doesn't matter. In the end you can just call them idiots and move on because in the end, that's all they are. They're idiots.

[edit on 7-5-2010 by A TRUE AMERICAN]

Originally posted by muzzleflash


Nice way to pick and choose to fit your opinions.

"Slay them wherever you find them...Idolatry is worse than carnage...Fight against them until idolatry is no more and God's religion reigns supreme." (Surah 2:190-)
"Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it." (Surah 2:216)
"Believers, take neither Jews nor Christians for your friends." (Surah 5:51)

"Make war on them until idolatry shall cease and God's religion shall reign supreme." (Surah 8:36-)
"Fight against such as those to whom the Scriptures were given...until they pay tribute out of hand and are utterly subdued." (Surah 9:27-)

"If you do not fight, He will punish you sternly, and replace you by other men." (Surah 9:37-)

"Believers, make war on the infidels who dwell around you. Deal firmly with them." (Surah 9:121-)

Seriously we could list tons of stuff. It's like Leviticus in the Bible.

But you were clearly quoting the Qur'an trying to make it look all peaceful and pretty. But there is another side to the story...

Just saying. lol.

Or you could try actually reading the CONTEXT of every single one of those verses... As in, the verses preceding, and after. And you will know that NONE of these verses are talking about anything other than self defense from warring tribes.


Of course you wouldn't know that because you've never read the entire Quran, and just get your quotes from anti-Islamic websites.


Deny ignorance

reply to post by v3_exceed


Cambodia is less than 2% Muslim, which is why I didn't list it.

And what would you like me to describe those people as in order for you to allow me the term racist? Brown people? Muslims? Oh no, wait, you didn't like that either

Quit perpetuating a stupid argument on rhetoric, you know EXACTLY what I'm trying to say, and aren't contributing at all to the topic by arguing with me about the specifics of being racist.

Originally posted by DrMattMaddix
Where are the Muslim humanitarian organizations...??

Here you go:

In addition to the organizations just listed, other Muslim organizations in the United States serve more specific needs. For example, some organizations focus almost exclusively on charity work. As a response to a crackdown on Muslim charity organizations working overseas such as the Holy Land Foundation, more Muslims have begun to focus their charity efforts within the United States.

* Inner-City Muslim Action Network (IMAN) is one of the leading Muslim charity organizations in the United States. According to the Inner-City Muslim Action Network, IMAN seeks "to utilize the tremendous possibilities and opportunities that are present in the community to build a dynamic and vibrant alternative to the difficult conditions of inner city life." IMAN sees understanding Islam as part of a larger process to empower individuals and communities to work for the betterment of humanity.[83]
* Islamic Relief USA is the American branch of Islamic Relief Worldwide, an international relief and development organization. Their stated goal is "to alleviate the suffering, hunger, illiteracy and diseases worldwide without regard to color, race or creed." They focus of development projects; emergency relief projects, such as providing aid to victims of Hurricane Katrina; orphans projects; and seasonal projects, such as food distributions during the month of Ramadan. They provide aid internationally and in the United States.

en.wikipedia.org...

Originally posted by SpectreDC


I know, if it was Christian or Jewish or Scientologists or Satanists it'd be ok, but because it's the religion of sand peoples it's evil!

/sarcasm

Race card.

Originally posted by SpectreDC
Hah, such stupid people

Attacking the person rather than the argument/subject.

Originally posted by Good Intentions
reply to post by DrMattMaddix

 

The wrong term was used...that doens't effect the message. Far too often I see the "Hah! You used the wrong term, see how undeducated you are!"

Agreed. A person's point is not necessarily denigrated by their terminology as context clues can indicate they meant something else.

Originally posted by ProUSA
reply to post by Good Intentions

 

Thank you. And for the record, I responded clarifying what I meant; which was that it's being racist by association.

Race card again.

Originally posted by SpectreDC

Does it have numerous passages that, just like the Quran, demand for the killing of heretics, non-believers, etc? Yes.

True, but how often do these Christians Preach such words? Or do they condemn it with all kinds of excuses? Why aren't Muslims condemning those passages in the Qur'an as horrific and unacceptable? Instead I can bring up 1000 videos of them actively PREACHING IT.

Originally posted by BeastMaster2012
i am willing to bet that white people have killed more than any other race.

I am also willing to bet that the Catholics have killed more than any other religion, due to invading new places and the crusades.

You will lose this bet friend. Let's Research Chinese history for once since everyone ignores their culture so often. Mao for one. The Golden Horde (Khans) for another. Looks like Asians are winning this "contest"...

BTW, Race Card again lol.

Originally posted by SpectreDC
"Deny ignorance, unless ignorance supports your worldview or argument"

Double edged sword. Careful with that one.

I don't have a problem with it but what's the motivation behind building a Mosque that close to Ground Zero? You think they'd have some respect for the massacred but...eh, whatever. Let them build it and see what happens when they do. I assure you some New Yorkers won't have it..

[edit on 7-5-2010 by GorehoundLarry]

Originally posted by ProUSA

Originally posted by SpectreDC

Originally posted by Agent_USA_Supporter

Originally posted by ProUSA
I also love how a big argument for the anti-Muslims is what it says in the Koran. All I have to say to that is: are you serious? The Bible has killed just as many people as any other religion, have you heard of the crusades?

Do all "Christians" follow the Bible word for word? No. Do all Muslims follow the Koran word for word? No.

I have plenty of Muslim friends, many of them being MUCH smarter than half the people on this website--and they are some of the nicest and good-hearted people I've met.

This is comparable to how the USA treated African Americans back before the Civil War. It's mind boggling. Thank goodness most people I've talked to have nothing against Muslims; I swear this board is filled with some of the most extreme individuals ever.

The Bible has killed just as many people as any other religion, have you heard of the crusades?

The Crusaders weren't using the bible you.


I find it very sad you believe that the bible killed so many can you provide proof for your nonsense dumb cliam?



[edit on 7-5-2010 by Agent_USA_Supporter]

No, they weren't using the bible to kill people. That would mean that bible had a spikes covering it or some crazy nonsense like that.

Does it have numerous passages that, just like the Quran, demand for the killing of heretics, non-believers, etc? Yes. Which is principally what the crusades was about. And beckoning the name of God and Jesus Christ to justify the crusades.

But again, recognizing that fact would dismantle you're bigotry for what it is; idiotic nonsense. So that's okay. Keep living in your delusion, ignoring facts and such. Ignorance is bliss after all.

you think i am been Ignorant? i think your the one whos been Ignorant.


Tell me then why are muslims fighting in the name of Allah??
or in the name of Muhammad?


or maybe you could tell me then why did Muhammad mary to a 9 year old girl?


I find sad and Ignorant your using claims against christianity that they used the name in the jesus, i find funny you dont mention anything about the ottoman empire and its great islam crusader against eupore?


I guess you don't want to know how many died under the hands of the ottoman.

Tell me also then why arent we allowed to build a chruch in any middle east countries?



[edit on 7-5-2010 by Agent_USA_Supporter]

Originally posted by RizeorDie
reply to post by Wondering302

 

but that doesnt matter because 911 was done by the government and not muslims. so muslims had nothing to do with the attacks, its ok, let them build a mosque.

on the other hand they should arrest bush for crimes on humanity..

I could say that's just a conspiracy theory but that'd probably derail this thread more than it already is.

However, I do agree with Bush being charged for crimes against humanity due to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Instead I can bring up 1000 videos of them actively PREACHING IT.

Once again Muzzleflash I must congratulate you being able to cherry pick which of my posts and comments you'll quote, completely neglecting to think that perhaps it isn't a good idea to do so considering what you're ignoring DEBUNKS EVERY POINT YOU TRY TO MAKE WHEN RESPONDING TO ME.

You know, like when I had to google for someone about Muslims against extremism in which I believe 745,000 links popped up on google, including youtube videos?

But hey, a small amount of people do what you say they do.

It's okay though, this just means whenever I would typically defend Christianity and any religion for any actions committed in that religions name as people manipulating other people to do something when there are ulterior motives involved, I'll just be like "THE WBC ARE EVIL AND SINCE I DONT SEE CHRISTIANS PARADING ON THE STREETS AGAINST THE WBC, ALL CHRISTIANS ARE GUILTY!"

Hindsight. Get some. And while getting some, look in the next aisle for some intelligence.

Then again, you're the person who thinks anyone who laughs at the thread that says "pedobear on 4chan is the universal symbol for pedofiles" is a pedophile or a rapist. So I can understand.

[edit on 7-5-2010 by SpectreDC]

Originally posted by Dr Conspire

Correct me if Iam wrong but building a mosque ,church and a synagogue on the S11 site may be the best solution.

A symbolic three temple thing might appease everyone,

A new Holy Centre of the Earth?

This is my favorite post.
You are actually giving us a really good open minded solution.

You win! I'm going with what you said.

Originally posted by SpectreDC

Originally posted by DrMattMaddix



Where are the Muslim humanitarian organizations...??

Jeez, I didn't know so many people on ATS were handicapped. I mean, google isn't hard to use.

Golly whiz! Use it yourself, if it is so easy to find instances of events that never existed, never happened.

Then you might gain some credibility instead of looking like the person that cannot answer a straightforward question put to him.

Originally posted by muzzleflash

Originally posted by Dr Conspire

Correct me if Iam wrong but building a mosque ,church and a synagogue on the S11 site may be the best solution.

A symbolic three temple thing might appease everyone,

A new Holy Centre of the Earth?

This is my favorite post.
You are actually giving us a really good open minded solution.

You win! I'm going with what you said.

I would agree, that is a good idea.

That way everyone is happy... except for the Scientologists...

Originally posted by ProUSA

I don't mind people disagreeing with me on a website. I disagree with half the things you say on this board, but I "friended" you because I believe you make valid points--even when it's on something I don't agree with.

Thanks!

Like I said earlier, I don't necessarily believe/agree with the side I take in this debate.

I was simply playing devils advocate because I saw a wide open space to do so. And I just felt like it would be a fun topic today, I don't know why. I usually avoid these types of debates.

Often times I take the other side of the debate, it really depends on which side I felt like was the under dog I suppose.

reply to post by Agent_USA_Supporter


I DARE you to quote me where I've said "Islam hasn't done anything evil but Christianity has."

I have always stood by the idea that the religious zealots, whether Christian, Jewish, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, ANYTHING, when they do things in the name of a religion the religion isn't to blame. It's the people invoking the religious zeal in these individuals, quoting holy scripture, and manipulating these people in the name of their religion, and more often than naught it's done so for ulterior motives.

Furthermore considering I'm one of the loudest proponents for the Armenian genocide to actively be recognized around the world, I DOUBLE dare you finding ANYTHING I've said that would substantiate what you're trying to apply to my name.

Your ability to infer is rather misguiding my friend.

[edit on 7-5-2010 by SpectreDC]

why ? to prove just how much we will be made fun od-pushed in our buttons-rub it in, and the thing is theres no way we would dare try to stop it:we might hurt someones feelings'
Muslims have every right do have a mosqe anywhaere, but out of respect, and the down right weirdness od it should they look elsewhere!!thats like lets say my cousin murdered a house house load of your family members, now why woul I want to build a house right next door when there are ?open lots around the corner

Originally posted by mishigas

Originally posted by SpectreDC

Originally posted by DrMattMaddix



Where are the Muslim humanitarian organizations...??

Jeez, I didn't know so many people on ATS were handicapped. I mean, google isn't hard to use.

Golly whiz! Use it yourself, if it is so easy to find instances of events that never existed, never happened.

Then you might gain some credibility instead of looking like the person that cannot answer a straightforward question put to him.

Why should I do someone else research when they're debating?

Furthermore considering the short time I've been here and the number of compliments I've received from respected members and staff, I find my credibility SLIIIIIGHTLY better than yours.

Originally posted by A TRUE AMERICAN
This is a total disgrace!!! It's a slap in the face to all of America!!! If they build it, it's saying they beat us and they are laughing at us... I was 2 blocks from the WTC as the first plane hit. I lost neighbors because of this cowardly attack carried out by muslim cowards.

You should change your name from True American to Dumb Ass American then it would coincide perfectly with your utter ignorance.

New York City is a melting pot.....there are cathedrals, synagogues, tabernacles, etc....just as there are approximately 90 mosques and 600,000 to 800,000 muslims in the 5 boroughs.

They were there prior to 9/11 and have continued since. Stop equating the entire Muslim religion to the terrorism of 9/11. Instead, maybe you should look at your so called heroes and find the true culprits.

Just because you were allegedly there on 9/11 doesn't make your assertion any more credible. To be honest, I think you just threw that in there to add sensationalism to your hatred.

I mean you do know that American Muslims also died on 9/11 too right? Or that there were Muslim firefighters and Muslim police officers who sacrificed their lives that day to save others.

Stop listening to Sean Hannity and wake the F up!

Originally posted by SpectreDC
reply to post by Agent_USA_Supporter

 

I DARE you to quote me where I've said "Islam hasn't done anything evil but Christianity has."

I have always stood by the idea that the religious zealots, whether Christian, Jewish, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, ANYTHING, when they do things in the name of a religion the religion isn't to blame. It's the people invoking the religious zeal in these individuals, quoting holy scripture, and manipulating these people in the name of their religion, and more often than naught it's done so for ulterior motives.

Furthermore considering I'm one of the loudest proponents for the Armenian genocide to actively be recognized around the world, I DOUBLE dare you finding ANYTHING I've said that would substantiate what you're trying to apply to my name.

Your ability to infer is rather misguiding my friend.

[edit on 7-5-2010 by SpectreDC]

Sorry then, btw america will never recognize the Armenian genocide for example america has a double standard case in these manners.


I dont want to talk about the bosnia one or otherwise i will be attacked by muslims here on the forums for my different view point on it.

Originally posted by SpectreDC


Racists, bigots, whatever. The word doesn't matter. In the end you can just call them idiots and move on because in the end, that's all they are. They're idiots.

Attacking the posters rather than the argument.

Come on SpectreDC, I know you got some good points to make.

Lets make them.

Calling people names is sort of like admitting defeat, and I don't wanna see you go down like that. And there is no fun in debating someone who just responds by saying mean things

This is suppose to be a fun debate, lets play nice now!