I want Immortality

Originally posted by Maxine1969
reply to post by ChaosMagician

 

At the start of this discussion (9 pages ago), the originator made it clear that there was a goal to be achieved or a task to be undertaken which would take more than one average human lifetime to accomplish.

Granted, for immortality to be bestowed upon a "couch potato" who would spend eternity drinking beer and eating pizza seems less than entirely productive

Who is to judge, however, what goal someone may set for themselves? The great artists / scientists / political thinkers / etc., of the past may have achieved more if they had simply had a longer lifespan

yeah... and my post said "for me"... the one you quoted.

and btw, I'm not a freaking coach potato and don't drink alcohol. For all you know my life may be very productive and I just find it incredibly boring.

actually I'm just sad.





oh... and insane.

reply to post by ChaosMagician


My reply regarding a "couch potato" wasn't meant to reference you personally, it was intended as a general observation and I'm sorry if you though I meant it personally.

No one should immortality, never mind a coach potato.

reply to post by Maxine1969


I've done a google search and if anyone is interested in reading the ebook I quoted, it's available at the following links:

thecomputerroombbs.com...
pepzi.se...

reply to post by andy1033


Why do you feel that way? And do you think that longevity (as an alternative to outright immortality) is also not a worthy goal?

reply to post by Maxine1969


Na personally i think the idea is sick, and i would just prefer to live my 1 life and thats it.

Maybe you have had a different life but me.

Maybe we all need to review what "immortality means" ...

absolute never ending physical life?
extreme (by current standards) longevity?

recovering from physical death?

Anyone who subscribes to Alcor (cryogenics) is planning (as I understand it) on being preserved after their body stops functioning - on the assumption that in the future whatever caused them to die can be cured, and their body can be reanimated. Does this qualify as "immortality" ?

I still maintain that anyone who has extreme longevity may yet not be immortal. Live for 200 years, who is to say that you won't drop dead the next day?

Immortality in the sense the ancient Gods were supposed to be immortal - never ending life FOR EVER AND ALWAYS - I guess is a non starter. However Aubrey De Grey's theories about extreme longevity are perhaps worth revisiting? (www.youtube.com...)

Your mind must be pure, your intentions true.

Here is the path, or more the first step:

You are the only one that can kill your. Your are more then physical, yet the "you" cannot exist away from the physical. Your mind is more valuable, let not it slip. You can control yourself, but only if you learn

OK -

this thread has wandered in and out of many areas of thought along the way - I'd really like to see what people feel about just one or two of them if that's possible?

So let's assume [for the sake of argument] that some individual human have at different times lived longer than society would consider 'normal'. [for WHATEVER reason]. Even a lifespan of a couple of centuries will do for our purposes. [I don't want to get bogged down on "true immortality", because while an occasionally long-living organism occurring sounds reasonable, an organic creature which genuinely never ever dies doesn't sound that reasonable].

[lower down the scale, my mother's cat lived many years past what is accepted is a cat's natural lifespan, and in reasonably good health - it dies in the 1970's, so advances in veterinary medicine are unlikely to be a factor in it's longevity, rather, I would attribute it's remarkable longevity to a genetic predisposition]

And as I believe I stated in an earlier response, I certainly do NOT accept that "immortal" = "indestructible". A bullet in a vital organ should kill whoever it hits, mortal or otherwise

I also don't want to get bogged down on the issue of people "becoming" immortal, although I'll acknowledge that state-of-mind does appear to play an important role in the health of the body. Depressed people do seem to be more prone to illness, and a colleague once mentioned that on a trip to a Caribbean hospital he saw that even the seriously ill were likely to be cheerful, getting up and dancing and singing, and generally having some physical energy, while in British hospitals people tend to sit and wallow in their "feel ill", and reinforce their illness in a sort of negative feedback loop.

Anyway - If a human lives much beyond what their peers consider 'normal', then they are going to attract attention. Particularly if they remain in reasonably good health.

How would our long-living human deal with this situation?

In today's information-saturated society, everyone leaves "tracks". Taxes, social security, wages records, etc., so what would they do? Does anyone think that the scenario painted in the film "Highlander" makes any sense? [in a nutshell - every few decades hijacking the identity of a child who died soon after being born - hence has left no "tracks" - and leaving this new identity the entirety of your old identity's wealth].

[hijacking a dead child's identity was also the basis of the assassin creating a new identity in "Day of the Jackal"]

This scenario also flags up the depressing issue that our long-living human would have to drop out of sight, and abandon friends and family :-(

If a long-lived human cared to "drop out of sight", it would be far easier for, say, a blue collar worker of "low social status" than (say) an A-List celebrity - reasonable assumption?

To paraphrase Travallian [I provided download links for his ebook earlier in this thread] an admission of being immortal could see someone being deprived of their liberty, and facing anything from brutal interrogation to evisceration in the hope of extracting their "secret" - not an appealing prospect

In summary then - if there are long lived humans who exist in our society and who choose to maintain a "low profile", would we ever identify them if they do not wish to be discovered?

Serious answers please ;-)

reply to post by Maxine1969


I tend to agree with you that extreme longevity in a human (100's or 1000's of years) would be more conceivable than a "true immortal" who simply lives "forever".
I would also tend to assume that such an individual would go to extraordinary lengths to remain anonymous within society and to bring as little attention down on themselves as possible. One can also imagine such an individual having to, out of pure necessity, abandon their "lives" at fairly regular intervals, moving to different locations to start building a new life ... if only for a few decades ... before having to repeat the cycle.
Initially such a life change would be extremely difficult to manage but would become progressively easier with practice and as the centuries roll by ... practice makes perfect !

Do I believe such individuals may exist even now ? Truthfully, I'm not sure ... but some recent ATS member activity has got me thinking.

A few months ago, a member using the name methuselah1937 joined ATS. S/he made just a handful of pretty standard posts ... then disappeared and as far as I know hasn't been back since.

However, there was one post that stood out in it's strangeness. This particular post was made in a thread where the discussion topic was similar to yours, namely extended human longevity / immortality.
In that post, methuselah1937 made reference to 4 individuals (2 male / 2 female) who apparently had committed suicide or gone missing.

Here's the main part of that post:

give you just the smallest bit of "real" info.

A total of 8 extremely long-lived individuals are still alive out of an original group of 12.
1 (male) was murdered in Barcelona, Spain in 1796
1 (female) last known whereabouts Kiev in 1893 - presumed dead
1 (male) committed suicide in Oslo in 1954
1 (female) last known whereabouts Warsaw in 1895 - presumed dead

My understanding was that methuselah1937 had basically implied the real life existence of a number of long-lived individuals ... 12 in total ... minus the 4 dead/missing.

Now of course, we have no end of charlatans here on ATS who continuously come up with far-fetched (dare I say delusional ?) claims in order to gain a moments glory and notoriety. But methuselah1937 didn't fit that particular mold as once the above information was posted, there was nothing further to be heard of methuselah1937 ... so notoriety/fame didn't seem to be a primary motivation.

Then the mystery deepened a few days ago when a new member joined and made a very unusual thread.
This happened on 18 Jan, 2011 and the member called themselves Perpetua Vita.

Again, similar to methuselah1937, this new member made a single post that was extremely unusual, then promptly disappeared and hasn't made a further post since.

Now, it gets even more interesting ...

I just tried to find the thread made by Perpetua Vita using the search function. The thread reference appears in the search but clicking on the thread reference immediately throws up

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/25370008e993.jpg[/atsimg]

So, for some reason, this particular thread has been permanently removed.

Fortunately, the threads OP was so unusual, because it apparently had been written in Latin and specifically addressed to methuselah1937, that I made a copy of the Latin component and so can try to reproduce it.

Salve, methuselah1937 !


1 (female) last known whereabouts Kiev in 1893 - presumed dead


Nuntiaremus tibi nec respondeas.

Roma - 1913 Anno Domini
Napoli - 1929 Anno Domini


Vita aeterna !

Another member translated the Latin into English as follows:

Salve, methuselah1937 !
(Greeting, methuselah1937 !)


1 (female) last known whereabouts Kiev in 1893 - presumed dead


Nuntiaremus tibi nec respondeas.
(For your information and no need to reply/respond.)

Roma - 1913 Anno Domini
(Rome - 1913 A.D.)
Napoli - 1929 Anno Domini
Naples - 1929 A.D.


Vita aeterna !
(Eternal life !)


Admittedly, the 1913 and 1929 dates I had to rely on memory but I'm certain I'm not off by more than a year or so for both of them.

But is this information, directed to methuselah1937, a notification that the female who allegedly disappeared in Kiev in 1893, had been spotted 20 years later in Rome, then a further 16 years later in Naples ? If so, is she deliberately in hiding/seclusion and trying to avoid the other members of the group ?

So, do we have circumstantial evidence of the existence of a small group of long-lived humans ... or is the above to be treated as nothing more than an attempt at scammery ?

I've not been on ATS for long, but browsing the threads it's fascinating to note just how many people do seem to post unsubstantiated claims merely for attention.

What empty lives these scam merchants must lead!

So - a suggestion a group of 12 (is that a Biblical reference maybe?) long-lived humans, one speaking Latin. As yet, I would leave these posts in an "open" file - neither scam nor circumstantial evidence. We should perhaps assume that it's all scam (Occam's razor and similar principles). But there's nothing to really tip the balance (yet) in my opinion. Only more questions.

One of the most intriguing being this - if this is a "signal" from a long-lived human, why is the signal being sent via an ATS discussion thread?

I came to ATS because the members appear to be open minded, and willing to explore extraordinary possibilities, and so I won't discard the possibility that these posts are genuine. But I won't be accepting them at face value either).

Further issues regarding extended longevity ("Immortality")

Browsing through discussion threads here on ATS many people have alluded to a "technique" by which an extended lifespan may be achieved, although it's usually wrapped up in religious, spiritual, martial arts, or NLP terms

For the sake of argument - can we please assume that such a technique exists.

If this was the case, what would be the consequences of this technique being made freely and openly available to all of the human race? While many people might wish to put off the act of physically dying, would it be beneficial to simply extend everyone's lifespan? My comments earlier in the thread about a "couch potato" weren't received very well, but I think the point is valid. Would EVERYONE be contributing useful members of society if they had a vastly increased lifespan? (I suspect the answer is "no").

Who would choose which people were "deserving" to receive the secret to increasing their lifespan? Would a politician, political leader or scientist be at the front of the queue? And perhaps "they" would not think (say) a cab driver was worthy of being a recipient of the technique, but I'm sure that the cab-driver's family and friends would think otherwise!

Thoughts anyone?

Originally posted by Maxine1969

One of the most intriguing being this - if this is a "signal" from a long-lived human, why is the signal being sent via an ATS discussion thread?

When you stop to think about it, what better way to pass clandestine messages such as that then on a conspiracy website where all manner of "weird beliefs" are presented for general consumption.
It's almost like being surrounded by "camouflage" and in my opinion a perfect way to communicate openly without attracting an overt amount of attention to oneself. After all, the majority reading it would say to themselves ... "oh, yeah - that's interesting" and then promptly forget about it when the next major conspiracy item makes page 1.

I know how to get immortality or at least I know the theory of what you would have to do to get it.

The most fundamental thing about energy is that nothing else exists, I'm going to repeat that, The most fundamental thing about energy is that nothing else exists!!!

Everything is ultimately energy and all energy is in a state of motion, vibration!

Its called "the rhythm of life" and as long as this vibration is pulsing through your body you will be alive. One gets old and dies because this rhythm/ energetic vibration usually decreases with age.

If you want to be immortal you must keep this vibration in your body, bathing every cell. You must not eat or drink anything which contains the rhythm of death. As long as you keep this vibration strong in your body you will live.

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by happygolucky
reply to post by _damon

 

Immortality awaits...

Though the key word in there is waits...they have a few things to iron out (crystallization of cells for one), but it will happen IMO.

Was about to suggest that, ya...

Ultimately OPs, your only real possibility of attaining some sort of longevity will be getting frozen when you die and pray that we invent a nano-assembler before we end up destroying ourselves

Do a search on Engines Of Creation. a free online book (slightly dated now) that discusses this tech. A good fiction book to read if your not wanting to know the science is called "The First Immortal".

As far as wishing for vampires or whatnot...stop dreaming. Immortality is promised to nobody and simply put, there is not a single case of anything alive being immortal...why would you think anyone has the info?

nope...save your money and sign up with alcor is the only real potential you got for a maybe senario...assume it wont work, but like buying a scratch off ticket, you may get lucky.

Your statement "Immortality is promised to nobody and simply put, there is not a single case of anything alive being immortal" is blatently false. If you bother to read the news you would have heard about the Immortal Jellyfish. en.wikipedia.org...

To the OP:

Even though you're young arrogant and foolish I have a soft spot for your vigour. If only fools rush in where Angels fear to tread then we should all be a little more foolish if we want to get anywhere.

There have been examples of people who've lived expanded lifetimes. The 256 year old Chinese man being one example. www.environmentalgraffiti.com...

Alchemists who attained to the state known as the Philosophers stone were also apparently granted extended lives and the ability to leave and re-enter incarnation at will. As another poster said so eloquently "If consiousness is continuous then rebuilding a physical form isn't a big problem". The interesting thing is that in almost every report of this the Alchemist first lost their hair and teeth, their skin started shedding and they spent 3 days in an death like condition. When they awoke they would be radiant, their hair, teeth and nails would all grow back perfectly.

I spent some time looking into this when I was younger and I tend believe now that it is this conscious continuation that is the key to immortality if indeed there is one.

The problem with physical immortality as I see it is this:

A person whose lived 20 years feels like time moves slowly. As you age your perception of time speeds up. Days, months and years speed by at incredible speeds. This process will only advance as you progress through more experiences and eventually you'll reach a state where a million years to you will flash by in an instant. You'll be in a world out of time, stuck at this level of evolution while the world around you has progressed beyond. Not that you'll be able to observe it because of the effect I've just mentioned.

Conscious immortality combined with willed incarnation may be your best bet.

The paradoxical thing is, is that you must not be afraid of total death without any prospect of an afterlife, and at the same time you must not be suicidal. The reason why people are afraid of death, is because their mind cannot comprehend it. If do define yourself as your mind, then when the mind ceases to be, it creates a deep fear. You must learn to let go and be yourself as independent of your mind.

reply to post by _damon


you are immortal (snip). just in this life the 'vehicle' your in is a human body. but yea, dude (you are) immortal and hell is actually being alive, in a prison on earth.

Civility and Decorum are required - Please review this link

reply to post by _damon

Hi damon, i too seek Immortality so that i may learn as much as i can in more than one lifetime. I have read about this creature that is immortal, it is real, it's a jellyfish by the name of Turritopsis nutricula, and when it gets too old it reverts back to its infant state, i sugest you look at it. Also have you ever considered building an electronic replica of your brain, one method of doing this is a team of scientists freezing your brain, scanning it cellular layer by cellular layer, and replicating your nural structure.This results in a much faster brain, the only problem is creating artificial neurons and synapses. Use Wikipidia. hope this helps. if you are able to track down a solid sorce of immortality, please tell me.