Free Health Care is Awesome!!!

reply to post by die_another_day


That was sad, but you will notice that she was in a hospital gown so I will assume that she was already a patient. She collapsed in a corner and the other people in the waiting room ignored her. as soon as it was noticed the hospital staff were there and working on her. I don't see how a government run healthcare system could possibly have changed one thing that happened in the video. Show me a video of a hospital throwing dying people out onto the street because they are unable to pay and I will retract my prior post. Failing that use some common sense and not just react to a gut emotional response.

reply to post by JohnnyCanuck


I'll tell you what, I will agree to nationalized healthcare if they take the monies already being used in the "oversea adventures" and use it for that purpose instead. But you and I both know that isn't the plan being considered.

But here is the thing nobody really gets, they will never pass a healthcare bill in the USA because if they did they would lose a campaign talking point. Politicaly speaking not passing a socialized healthcare bill is a win win for liberals. Not passing it allows them to keep it as a talking point in campaigns and allows them to blame the consevative politicians for it's failure. It will be torpedoed again and again to help boost up the left vs right illusion they have kept people divided with for so long.

Johnny, I'm glad you have no resentments or regrets about your chosen form of healthcare. Love to our Candadian brothers

Originally posted by OverSword
they will never pass a healthcare bill in the USA because if they did they would lose a campaign talking point.
Johnny, I'm glad you have no resentments or regrets about your chosen form of healthcare. Love to our Candadian brothers

I suspect you are right...and it appears to be proven so as we speak. You don't see us Canadians here going 'nyah-nyah'. The OP expressed his amazement that what we take for granted as a right in this country is debatable in the US.

I wish you all well...I like the US and I like Americans. I just don't like it when we are held up as a failed system in order to placate your entirely reasonable demands for universal health care. Question those people and their motives...you don't need to be on a conspiracy site to figure that one out.

Our way ain't perfect, but none of us would swap you. What does that tell you?

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck

Originally posted by OverSword
they will never pass a healthcare bill in the USA because if they did they would lose a campaign talking point.
Johnny, I'm glad you have no resentments or regrets about your chosen form of healthcare. Love to our Candadian brothers

I suspect you are right...and it appears to be proven so as we speak. You don't see us Canadians here going 'nyah-nyah'. The OP expressed his amazement that what we take for granted as a right in this country is debatable in the US.

I wish you all well...I like the US and I like Americans. I just don't like it when we are held up as a failed system in order to placate your entirely reasonable demands for universal health care. Question those people and their motives...you don't need to be on a conspiracy site to figure that one out.

Our way ain't perfect, but none of us would swap you. What does that tell you?

Buddy, I don't understand why you are like so many that demand a health care system has to be govt run. You know the waste of govt, you know the cost, and you don't care. Govt is not the solution to all problems, nor should it be. And I am not saying Canada sucks or anything like that. I like Canada quite a bit. I am just saying that I know the reports out of Canada as to the FISCAL problems your govt tun health care system is having. The same thing is going on in the UK also. I want there to be health care reform in the US, but not a govt program that will further balloon govt deficits, create another entitlement program, and reduce the quality of care. But yes reform is needed, just not the sort that Canada has. Nothing wrong with that, we are two different countries and yes the people in the countries are different as well, as evidenced here.

I love the NHS, im getting surgery next week from them for my shoulder. all free, then i think im getting my flat feet corrected too hopefuly. I would hate to know how much that would cost me if i was on private healthcare

Originally posted by superdebz
I love the NHS, im getting surgery next week from them for my shoulder. all free, then i think im getting my flat feet corrected too hopefuly. I would hate to know how much that would cost me if i was on private healthcare

Again, not free. You and those around you have bee paying in the form of high taxes your whole life.....

Yep have to agree free health car is the balls! I don't care we pay higher taxes!

[edit on 15-12-2009 by MOTT the HOOPLE]

Originally posted by MOTT the HOOPLE
Yep have to agree free health car is the balls!

I don't care we pay higher taxes!

...and not just for All the Young Dudes, either!!

reply to post by JohnnyCanuck

I just don't like it when we are held up as a failed system in order to placate your entirely reasonable demands for universal health care. Question those people and their motives...you don't need to be on a conspiracy site to figure that one out.

Canada is much better off with their health care, possibly due to a better management of your national budget, as well as far fewer crooks and lobbyists than we have that haunt the halls of our Congress.
Just tonight, our elected crooks voted against re-importation of drugs from countries like Canada. The Pharmaceutical companies, not content with buying enough votes, threatened Canada, if they exported drugs to the US:

Drug makers like Pfizer say they would reduce their shipments of drugs to distributors in Canada and other countries that re-export to the United States. ''We are not going to supply drugs to diverters, in Canada or elsewhere,'' said Hank McKinnell, chairman and chief executive of Pfizer.

swampland.blogs.time.com...

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck

Originally posted by MOTT the HOOPLE
Yep have to agree free health car is the balls!

I don't care we pay higher taxes!

...and not just for All the Young Dudes, either!!

Out of curiosity, how much would you say is too much in taxes for you to pay? Where would you draw the line and say enough is enough? Are if they took everything, but provided everything, would that be ok with you?

reply to post by stereovoyaged


Actually there is no federal law that says you get any time off, not even your day in the hospital having the kid.

Of course you will pay higher taxes. But its better to pay little higher taxes when you are healthy and then have almost free healthcare when you need it, than having to suddenly pay huge amounts when you are sick. Its not about free healthcare, of course its not free. Its about when and how you pay for it. And private insurance obviously doesnt cut it, so I see nothing wrong with government alternative. More competition for private companies never hurts.

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus

Canada is much better off with their health care, possibly due to a better management of your national budget, as well as far fewer crooks and lobbyists than we have that haunt the halls of our Congress.
Just tonight, our elected crooks voted against re-importation of drugs from countries like Canada.

Console yourself that America is not alone in being blessed with a festering orgy of crooked politicians and corporate scum...you just have proportionally more of them due to your larger population. This Brave New World in Washington...both houses and the White House...could have changed the way things work but it's really business as usual.

In our parliamentary system, we can have minority governments whereby the ruling party does so in cooperation with opposition or an election is called. That is the environment in which our health system and social safety nets were born. Today, Her Majesty's Loyal Opposition are gutless wimps, afraid they'll trigger an election and hand Steve the whole cookie jar.

Which is all to say that it took guts to introduce the system in the first place...guts that don't exist in Parliament today.

There is one concern that I never see mentioned, an example of that concern is from an article I read online last April or May. A woman in Montreal was tazed and jailed when she wised off to a cop who was writing her a ticket for not holding the hand railing on an escalator. The crime was based on the fact that if you hurt yourself from falling due to the fact you weren't holding onto the rail you may have to go to the doctor, which costs public money.
I see this as very dangerous to freedom when you can be ticketed for doing something which has a remote possibility of causing you injury. The potential for that kind of law or regulation to be severly abused by authorities is great.
Another point which can be fairly made is that part of the reason Canda can afford to spend tax dollars on healthcare is because the military budget is so small, partially because they live nextdoor to the USA and know that we would not tolerate another country taking hostile action against them.

Originally posted by johnny2127

Originally posted by superdebz
I love the NHS, im getting surgery next week from them for my shoulder. all free, then i think im getting my flat feet corrected too hopefuly. I would hate to know how much that would cost me if i was on private healthcare

Again, not free. You and those around you have bee paying in the form of high taxes your whole life.....

and compared to how much i would have to pay, Id much happier pay the taxes thank you

Originally posted by OverSword
... A woman in Montreal was tazed and jailed when she wised off to a cop who was writing her a ticket for not holding the hand railing on an escalator. The crime was based on the fact that if you hurt yourself from falling due to the fact you weren't holding onto the rail you may have to go to the doctor, which costs public money.

We could start a whole new thread based upon Quebec cops...and I'm sure my Quebecois cousins wouldn't argue the point.

Another point which can be fairly made is that part of the reason Canada can afford to spend tax dollars on healthcare is because the military budget is so small, partially because they live nextdoor to the USA and know that we would not tolerate another country taking hostile action against them.

We appear to be pulling our weight in A-stan...which was never more than a sop to the States (and Big Oil) in a post-911 environment. We also have a tradition as peacekeepers, not aggressors. More to the point is that we are not giving the military a blank cheque...so yes, our finances are in better shape, thank you. Like I said in an earlier post...how come there is always enough money to kill foreigners, but never enough to heal Americans? That's the question you need to ask your reps.

Originally posted by johnny2127
Out of curiosity, how much would you say is too much in taxes for you to pay? Where would you draw the line and say enough is enough? Are if they took everything, but provided everything, would that be ok with you?

For me it depends on income. Here is my peronsal breakdown.

£0 to 5000 0%
£5,000 to 20,000 18%
£20,000 to 40,000 35%
£40,000 to infinitum 45%

With this level of tax, if managed correctly you can provide a health system for a country. The UK does it with far fewer bands of tax then i have proposed. The bands i propose i think make the system fairer as i think the very rich are taxed a little to much. Even so you have to remember that the UK has had a public system for 50 years or more and has yet to fail under the strain that many americans think will occur.

It really seems that the americans on the board think any public healthcare system will fail within one or two years and leave the country with horrible debt. All i can say is that many countries have great models that you can implement that would not only give you better healthcare but actually save you money in the long term.

Again as i have stated many times in this thread. Why is it that the socialised healthcare systems seem to cost less per capita and yet provide better outcomes? Is it possibly because socialised medicine has no profit influence whereas a private company wants to throw anyone they can off of their policies and make their money by refusing treatment?

[edit on 16-12-2009 by ImaginaryReality1984]

Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984
Why is it that the socialised healthcare systems seem to cost less per capita and yet provide better outcomes? Is it possibly because socialised medicine has no profit influence whereas a private company wants to throw anyone they can off of their policies and make their money by refusing treatment?

Hey, hey! What kind of Pinko rhetoric is that? Next thing you know it the Godless Commies will be on our doorsteps and after our womenfolk, too!

(Oh, and don't forget to include that corporate profit on all services rendered...say 30%?... that go straight to Wall Street.)

Originally posted by superdebz

Originally posted by johnny2127

Originally posted by superdebz


and compared to how much i would have to pay, Id much happier pay the taxes thank you

agreed! people always want to talk about how our health care in canada and the UK and that isnt free because we pay taxes...but do you know how much i honestly have taken from my paychecks per year? that i dont get back? maybe $1000 bucks. ($500 check twice a month, approx $50 taken off = $100 per month, and i get some of that back during returns) and not all of that is government tax that would contribute to health care. some of that is contributions to canada pension etc. there are some people in the US that pay hundreds of dollars per *month* for private insurance. its just crazy to me...i'd rather pay the $1000 bucks a year in my taxes than have to pay tens of thousands of dollars for a surgery if i ever heaven forbid needed one.

[edit on 17-12-2009 by devilishlyangelic23]

[edit on 17-12-2009 by devilishlyangelic23]

Yesterday, in the US Senate, the only honest member of the Senate (because he actually admits that he is a Socialist party member), Bernie Sanders introduced an amendment to set up a single payer system. When Rep,. Sen Coburn demanded that the 767 pages be read out loud, after several hours of reading, the Dems forced Sanders to withdraw his amendment, so as to rush along passage of the bill. It shows that the Dems are not really serious about a public option. If by some means, it had passed, they would have been wetting their pants, and shaking in their boots. They are all owned by the drug and insurance companies.