Christianity, Satans Greatest Deception

reply to post by Dookzor


You are welcome. I have very strong views, but these views were gained through lots of both detached self-reflection and much social interaction. I often worry that since my views are strong, that I will immediately rub someone the wrong way, so I try view hard to thread that needle. It is good to see that you don't see me as a douche. But I would rather seek truth and be called a douche than be fashionable and called enlightened.

reply to post by TarzanBeta


LOL, gotta love fundamentalist Christians contradicting themselves and their religion constantly and then leaving, convinced that they still have the moral highground.

A failing religion and people wonder why.

Edit - Just thought I'd link a previous post by TB to further showcase his hypocrisy.

www.belowtopsecret.com...

Nice one mate.

[edit on 26-11-2009 by Dookzor]

From what I know, the bible wasn't written by just one person. It was written under the authority of a group of people, those holding the highest rank in the Church. Don't forget that back in those days the Church was not like that of which we know today. Those contributing to the bible did it with the intention of controlling the people by the means of fear. If a person did something contrary to what the bible stated, they would damned to hell.
I don't believe that Satan created Christianity as a means to deceive people. I believe that the bible in fact was originally created as a guide for people for spiritual guidance. I believe that along the line greedy & corrupt individuals are to blame for certain misrepresentations in the bible.
Is Christianity truly Satan's deception? No one can really say. That is why we as individuals have to truly distinguish right from wrong. If you read or hear about something that doesn't look, sound, or feel right, then 99% probability its not, at least to you. Trust your gut instinct.

some people who dont believe the bible to be literal say that satan is the ego, if that is right, then it makes perfect sense

Theoretically anything is possible...

But I disagree with your argument. Christianity has many different denominations where some of the most key beliefs differ. There are parts of the religion that are as a whole very positive and life-affirming. There are parts that are negative, violent and threatening. The trouble is that the Bible has been edited and translated lots of times, with different people in power at different times throughout the last ~2000 years.

Why don't you say the Koran is inspired by the Devil? Someone had to write that too? I guess it is easy to pick on the Bible because Christians are too tolerant and kind, they won't behead you.

If anything, without sounding like a racist, politically incorrect, insane, judgemental, islamaphobe-sharia-phobe, I would say the Koran fits more into the Devil's scheme of devices to counteract human progress, freedom of thought, anti-Christian faith, anti-Jewish and illogical justice, and the idol to follow in his way of life of this supposedly superior person.

I would rather have as an idol Jesus and the disciples than the prophet Muhammad as my idol regardless if one or the other is fiction. If the Bible is fiction but outsmarts fact then you have a problem.

Anyway, look at other faiths too, what if they are about the devil trying to give the wrong message.

Like Bo' Selector says' 'before you do the time, think about the time'.

Originally posted by iamcamouflage
How can you be sure that the Bible was not inspired by Satan? How can you know that the Pagan religion was not the one true religion and then Satan came to earth as Jesus, inspired man to write the Bible to convince humanity to worship a false prophet?

Try not to use the Bible as a reference because, if the Bible was inspired by Satan then it could not be used as a source to prove that Satan did not inspire it.

Is it unreasonable to believe that Christianity is the devils greatest deception? And how could you know whether it was or not? If Satan is able to deceive, how can you know that you are not being deceived into believing and worshiping a religion that is actually inspired by Satan?

Good questions, but the Bible is still prophetic, satan is not omniscient. However, you have raised an interesting point. The NIV and most modern translations ARE satan's perversions of the Bible.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


What is wrong with the NIV of the Bible? I don't see it being evil or corrupt in anyway way, not read it all but what is missing from it or added?

Originally posted by iamcamouflage
How can you be sure that the Bible was not inspired by Satan? How can you know that the Pagan religion was not the one true religion and then Satan came to earth as Jesus, inspired man to write the Bible to convince humanity to worship a false prophet?

Try not to use the Bible as a reference because, if the Bible was inspired by Satan then it could not be used as a source to prove that Satan did not inspire it.

Is it unreasonable to believe that Christianity is the devils greatest deception? And how could you know whether it was or not? If Satan is able to deceive, how can you know that you are not being deceived into believing and worshiping a religion that is actually inspired by Satan?

are you in the 6th grade or something? YOur entire premise is flawed by your obvious lack of education and your obvious want to spout assumption based on perhaps something you heard or saw on youtube.

The bible is a compilation of writings by men that took more than 1000 years to put together into a coalesced and comprehensive work.

I think if anyone wants to argue religion, or religious texts, then perhaps they should at least give some study time to them as opposed to nodding their heads while zeitgeist rambles on about some other fantastical supposition.

low grade, no star, no flag.

Originally posted by djusdjus

are you in the 6th grade or something? YOur entire premise is flawed by your obvious lack of education and your obvious want to spout assumption based on perhaps something you heard or saw on youtube.

low grade, no star, no flag.

Yet another belittling post directed at someone who asked an honest, completely un-hostile question.

Another "Christian" who's forgotten what the religion is supposed to stand for?

Do we not like to discuss possibilities here or something?

reply to post by iamcamouflage


How can you be sure, that you who doubt in God, is not inspired by satan ?

How do you know, that all those non believers here on ATS is not doing satans work, trying to decrease all the believers, trying to "prove" that God does not exist ?


How do you know, that you who argue, are not false prophets ?

Isnt it strange, that even though believers gives your proof after proof, telling you to go out there and see for your self, see that NONE of you at least try to get up the chair and go out to the "real" world, not is doing satans job.

How do you know that you dont do what satan wants, when you just sit here, and thread after thread whinning up about all those believers ?

As I see it, there is no christians on ATS who is starting threads that all the non belivers should turn to God / Christianity.

But I see a lot of threads started by non belivers, trying to condamn christianity / religion / God.

How do you know, that all you non belivers arent in fact doing satans work ?





[edit on 26-11-2009 by AUM68]

[edit on 26-11-2009 by AUM68]

Originally posted by Dookzor

Originally posted by djusdjus

are you in the 6th grade or something? YOur entire premise is flawed by your obvious lack of education and your obvious want to spout assumption based on perhaps something you heard or saw on youtube.

low grade, no star, no flag.

Yet another belittling post directed at someone who asked an honest, completely un-hostile question.

Another "Christian" who's forgotten what the religion is supposed to stand for?

Do we not like to discuss possibilities here or something?

another assumptive individual throwing out empty hats to be filled with cards.

The question wasn't taken as hostile, it was taken as ignorant and uneducated and was responded to as such because it is.

Also, who said I'm Christian? Did my stance that you should educate yourself on a subject before going ahead and stepping into making irrational and unfounded statements about it lead you to believe that I am Christian?

this is your assumption, not unlike the OP who made an erroneous and assumptive premise and suggestion.

We can discuss possibilities, but why not also teach calculus to monkeys? How far will that take us do you think?

[edit on 26-11-2009 by djusdjus]

I did not read this whole thread, I must admit I am in a bit of a hurry I need to make dinner. But to the op, I have thought the same thing as you and was brought up in a very religious family. I am no longer attached to any religion, just wanted to make that clear...I dot have any concrete answers for you either.

What I do have though, is an interesting piece of reading material. I still feel it's a valid thought. This is not meant to offend anyone.

An Argument for Satan.

First, allow me to establish my own religious beliefs: I am an Agnostic with few solid thoughts on anything spiritual. However, I do have anti-thoughts, which can only be described as my refusing to join religions. I do not believe in a humanoid God. I do not believe that a man named Jesus died for my sins. Most importantly, I do not believe in Hell.

Barring all of that, I present to you my thoughts on the Judeo-Christian-Muslim Satan, focusing most strongly on the general Christian perspective. Assuming that Christians are correct when they believe that God wrote, or massively influenced the writing of, the Bible, then we must consider the possibility that he is lying to us. The Bible itself has many contradictions, especially between the Old and New Testaments. One must turn the other cheek while simultaneously taking an eye for an eye; one must love one’s neighbor while not suffering a witch to live. But perhaps I am missing some crucial element and being stumped by hypocrisy.

Returning to the idea of a mendacious God, we should look at his probable motives: power, fame, and glory. Of course God would tell people that he was the one who created us and would claim that the only way to be happy is to worship him. Naturally he would tell us that he gave us free will, but that we should take the narrow path and pretty much avoid using our brains. The expression comes to mind "do as I say, not as I do" when he tells us that wrath is a deadly sin and "wrath of God" is a common phrase derived from Old Testament events, including, but definitely not limited to, the Flood. From the expectations hoisted upon us to attend church so that we may worship him so that we may enter Heaven where we can worship him more, it seems clear that he is arrogant and a bit childish. Though the Bible doesn’t discuss in great detail the entity that is Satan, most Christians are believe that Satan was cast from Heaven when he refused to worship God as superior. The rest of the angels worshipped him without thought, but Satan pondered it and thought it a waste of time and energy.

If the Bible is anything to go by, God is obviously a wrathful beast, destroying entire cities when their occupants did not worship him. It must be taken into consideration that casting Satan from Heaven was a selfish and juvenile action. Now whenever something "evil" happens, blame is thrust upon the name of Satan. It seems to me that God uses Satan as a scapegoat -- what dictator doesn’t have one? We have never had a Word of Satan in which he could defend himself; we go only by the Word of God, which seems a rather one-sided fight. How can we glean any truth from such a biased account? Let us take into consideration the assumption that God is omnipotent, omniscient, and "has a plan" for us all.

The Garden of Eden is an excellent first argument against all three points. First, he made Adam. That was all fine and dandy, but Adam needed a friend. So, according to ancient Hebrew legend, God made Lilith. There is some speculation as to whether or not she existed, but let us first explore the possibility that she was indeed the first woman created. Lilith refused to play second fiddle to Adam simply because he was a male, so God cast her out of the Garden and she wound up marrying Satan. Surely God, being omnipotent and omniscient, must have known this would happen.

Furthermore, he had a plan for her. Based on the fact that the Bible is highly misogynistic, she was probably created as an example to future generations of women not to use their intellect or even think of considering themselves equal to men. Women’s rights, anyone? If Satan married Lilith, who clearly had a good head on her shoulders, we can assume that Satan is not sexist nor does he believe in suppressing women. As a woman in the twenty-first century, it is easy to see this as a winning quality. This aside, the second human made is generally agreed to be Eve. Eve and Adam got along well and enjoyed living in the Garden, except that they were not allowed to eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. Again, the mighty and omnipotent God must have created that tree and known what it did. He forbade them to eat of it, but being so omniscient he surely knew what would happen.
Christians often claim that it was Satan that tempted Eve to eat that fruit, which would only go towards Satan wanting humans to use their brains and God being a proponent of stupidity and ignorance, but it seems to me it was God that was the snake, because his plan could only go forward if Adam and Eve ate the fruit. God knew what they had done and punished them both marvelously, again making an example of women by punishing them with birthing pains—every single one of them, all because of his coercion of Eve. To make his story that it was Satan that was the Tempter, he punished all snakes as well, forcing them to travel on their bellies. How this would punish Satan as is good as anyone’s guess, but that is the logic of the omniscient God we have all come to praise so highly.

Today, anything that goes wrong or deviates from the teachings of the Bible is accredited to Satan. This would mean that Satan, too, is omnipotent. It seems more likely that, based on Revelations as well as the Flood, God wreaks havoc so that he may gain more followers, demonstrated in the expression "there are no Atheists in foxholes." In Revelations, it was God who opened the seals and the angels who blew the trumpets that caused disaster on Earth. It is God who is the grand tester and trickster. In the Bible, who suffers? Followers of God. God rapes St. Mary, putting her at risk of being stoned to death. People say that she was only too happy to bear the Son of God, but what choice did she really have? If she had said to Gabriel "no thank you, please take this fetus away," she would have been sent to Hell, in all probability. If God asks you to do something, you had better do it, or he will punish you with eternal damnation, whatever that may entail. Jesus, sent to save our souls, was crucified by God’s will. Why would the torture of his son be the only way human souls could be saved? If God is omnipotent, why would he decide on this method of redemption? And if you’re one of those Christians sitting there right now reading this thinking "we crucified him by our sins," then think again. Every time I sinned, I did not drive a nail through some dead man’s wrist. If I did, then God rigged it to be that way, and that makes him sadistic.

Continue below.

[edit on 06/10/2009 by jinx880101]

reply to post by djusdjus


You might try reading my post, I didn't call you a Christian, I asked if you were. Please note the question mark.

Also, the point in my post was just to point out the immaturity of your previous post. I wasn't agreeing or disagreeing with the subject matter, just the way in which you chose to convey your opinion.

Long words do not equate to a mature opinion.

reply to post by jinx880101


An Argument for Satan- Continued...

That brings us to the question of Heaven versus Hell. Has Satan ever told the general population what Hell is really like? Only living people have, or God told them, I suppose. Based on God’s treatment of humans, I suspect that Satan is much gentler. Hell is probably full of the intelligent masses that refused to accept God blindly. Satan is not likely to ask for eternal worship and self-deprivation like God does. Hell is probably very comfortable if Satan is as powerful as everyone claims.

Most likely, everyone engages in intelligent conversation and watches the world go on its merry way. Heaven, on the other hand, is probably like church—deathly dull, chalk-full of mindless worship, and the occasional extreme agony just for the sake of "saving" people so that they too can go to Heaven and do the same thing. One never hears from Satan except in Hollywood pictures or the more apocalyptic-focused priests.

God puts himself everywhere, writing an entire book about how powerful and important he is. If a human being did this, he would be called a dictator or self-absorbed psychopath and would be massively disliked, but it’s okay for God, as he is God, and "faith" is the answer. Satan has either been murdered by God millennia ago, or is just chilling down in Hell, enjoying the company of intelligent individuals over a delicious, indulgent desert.

www.religioustolerance.org...

That's all.

[edit on 06/10/2009 by jinx880101]

Originally posted by iamcamouflage
How can you be sure that the Bible was not inspired by Satan? How can you know that the Pagan religion was not the one true religion and then Satan came to earth as Jesus, inspired man to write the Bible to convince humanity to worship a false prophet?

Try not to use the Bible as a reference because, if the Bible was inspired by Satan then it could not be used as a source to prove that Satan did not inspire it.

Is it unreasonable to believe that Christianity is the devils greatest deception? And how could you know whether it was or not? If Satan is able to deceive, how can you know that you are not being deceived into believing and worshiping a religion that is actually inspired by Satan?

Firstly, the bible warned us of false prophets and people like you who will ttry to test the faith of Christians to get them to question their faith. secondly, If Jesus were evil......why would he compile a book on how to be good and moral and how to save yourself from all manner of evil in the world? Third, When Jesus did speak of "things to come"..............they came and the world is playing out just as he said it would. His prophesies are 100% acurate so far, and the last ones are coming to pass as we speak.

reply to post by jinx880101


...pfff - God didnt write the bible...

Originally posted by iamcamouflage

Originally posted by dusty1
reply to post by iamcamouflage

 

I'm glad you got the Billy Madison referrence. I thought it was funny and meant no insult to you personally. You are an unbeliever, and you are goading believers into a debate about the Bible, without allowing them to use the Bible. That is why I used the quote.

I wasnt trying to goad them into debate. I was merely asking to use logic and critical thinking to advance the discussion. It seems that whenever it is asked of Christians to prove something, they delve into circular logic, using the Bible to prove the Bible. This is not logical and gets us no further and answers nothing.

Religion is not based on logic and never was. It is based on faith. A believer can no more understand why some people can't find it in their hearts and/or minds to believe in something that can't be seen, then a non-believer can understand why some people do believe.

What does it matter? I have been seeing more and more of these attempts as of late on every blog site I am part of. And oddly enough its usually a non-believer wanting to either prove there is no God, or mock believers for their 'blind faith'. If my neighbor wants to believe that he is Batman, and run around talking in a gravel voice while wearing a Halloween costume then that is his rite! But the minute he assumes I am the Joker and beats the crap out of me then he has crossed the line. The point being is that believers and non-believers should agree to disagree and leave each other the hell alone. Because like it or not either side has the rite to believe or not. But if non-believers have been taught morals and values as they often claim...respect the rites of others and leave them the hell alone! Dont mock them. Afterall, they have not tried to crucify you for NOT BELIEVING...so count your blessings.

[edit on 26-11-2009 by ch1ldofthe70s]

The bible was written by God because look at how one sided it is. There are always 2 sides to every story and the bible is certainly skewed to put God in the best light.

In my opinion God acts like a little spoiled brat. "Do what I SAY or else..."
It wouldn't be so bad if God said "Ok follow me or not it's your choice, if you decide not too that's fine you have free will so i'll just blip you out of existence."

Instead he pouts like a little girl. "Well..well...since you won't follow me i'm gonna make you suffer forever because I can and let's see how you like that mister!"

Whatever...take your holy attitude and stuff it. Maybe satan decided to actually think for himself and rebelled against God not unlike the americans did against the british way back when.

Yeah sure God has the power to do whatever he wants but as the old saying goes....I'd rather die on my feet than serve on my knees.

It would be really interesting to get the other side of the story of what happened up there with the angels than just the one version of it....might not be all you've been led to believe.

reply to post by iamcamouflage


If we are to reference Satan and his capabilities of deception; than how is it that we say that Satan is what he is? Satan (the word) specifically originating from Latin originally was conceived on the basis of what the Bible depicted Lucifer a fallen angel taken command by God deceive for a limit of 3,000 years before he is retaken and cast away from this world.

Satan is the least problem to our wrong doings and deceptions; our hearts and minds are stronger than Satan; who's job was only in aiding sin but not totally responsible it for every evil sin committed; since it said in the Bible that even profit sinned from their heart knowing the wrong things, therefore they deceived them self.



[edit on 11/26/2009 by krystalice]