Number of victims to unknown virus growing! State of emergency to be imposed in Ukraine?

Originally posted by EDteach
I cannot speak for other regions of the US, but in my area (upper mid-west) we got hit with H1N1 hard about three weeks ago. We are currently in the decline. Vaccinations started a little over a week and 1/2 ago. I don't believe vaccines had any to do with the outbreak as it started prior to the vaccinations. Many children ended up in hospital for a day or two. I know of one case that was taken out of state because he was so severe. There may have been others. I am a teacher and had students that were so sick that they could hardly walk due to lung issues. Every day for three weeks, I heard coughing everywhere and lots of pneumonia cases diagnosed. Funny the doctors would tell patients you have pneumonia etc.. but would not state it had anything to do with the flu. However, in MSM reports they would state that as a generalization. I guess doctors felt a patient might find comfort to think they have pneumonia but not h1n1?? I stayed well despite being surrounded by coughing, sick kids. I believe I owe that to Vitamin D and C!

I am in the Pacific Northwest and we started to peak at about the same time. We were talking today (I work in an ER) that it seems the surge is over, and patients with flu symptoms definately on the decline. (we only had I think one or two deaths in the whole county due to H1N1 in the past couple of months...many more people died due to car accidents, heart attacks, being shot, suicide, diabetes, etc.....)

I would like to ask you this: You mentioned the vaccine came out about a week and a half ago. Our SHOT vaccine was about 2 weeks ago, but the FLU MIST came out about 1.5 to 2 weeks BEFORE. I noticed that our surge happened the week FOLLOWING the Flu Mist. The flu mist has been proven to cause the shedding of LIVE virus in about 50% of those that recieved it for 5-7 days (sometimes longer), with an infection rate of about 2.4%. If several million people got it, that means MILLIONS could have been infected because of it.

Some food for thought.

reply to post by nikiano


Baxter Checkoslovakia

but close enough...

Originally posted by nikiano

Originally posted by seattletruth

Furthermore, the President of Ukraine basically says that virologists think the virus has mutated (without actually saying it), and they think it is due to the 3 forms of influenza that has hit their country (which is unlike most other countries, only being hit by h1n1 at this point).


[edit on 4-11-2009 by seattletruth]

This is really an interesting development, because two days ago, I started watching that video by that physician/nun in Spain, (can't remember her name) and she said that the H1N1 vaccine contained 3 live viruses, if I remember correctly.

And the Baxter batch of vaccines sent to the Ukraine killed all the weasles it was injected into in their final QC check. When they went to test the batch to find out why, it was discovered it was because it contained 3 different live viruses.

Forgive me if I'm remembering this wrong....but I'm pretty sure that's what that doctor said.

Am I remembering this correctly?

So....3 different live viruses in the Ukraine vaccine batch....3 different flu viruses show up in the Ukraine at once (highly unusual?).....seems to me we have another amazing coincidence!

Good analysis-no doubt someone will correct or dispute it.
My Other half in Ukraine tells that people do not take the vaccine because they dont trust it.
I reported that Polish Gov will not buy this Vaccine until it is proven safe.
Hungary too do not buy it-no one has died there they did not take any vaccine-maybe that tells something.
I hjave been very suprised about all these people who wont take it-I thought the Baxter story would not be on their minds-but they All seem to have heard !!
Thats the power of Internet I guess-unless you live in Belarus ......

Originally posted by nikiano
Thought you guys might be interested in hearing this. A few pages back, a few of us were theorizing whether or not vaccinating a region could make an epidemic happen faster, or make a virus mutate faster.

Well, here in Arizona, the H1N1 flu vaccine just became available last week, I think. Before that, we did not have one patient in my hospital as a flu patient, not did I see any orders for anti-virals here in the hospital where I work.

This week, the week after they started the H1N1 vaccinations in my city, we got patients admitted with influenza. Boy....that was fast.

Was it a coincidence that the flu hit my city about a week after the vaccines were started? Was it a coincidence that we got the first patients on antivirals about a week after the vaccinations started? I don't know. I'm sure the WHO and the CDC would say that we got the vaccine "in the knick of time"....right when flu season started...but my gut is telling me that the vaccinations might have kick started the flu season, instead.

Anyway, all of this made me think....anyone know if Asen said if the H1N1 vaccine was given in his area anytime recently?

EDIT TO ADD:

Just to clarify, it is not unusual to have patients admitted to the hospital for flu during flu season. I'm just questioning the timing of the fact that the first patients don't get admitted to my hospital until the vaccinations got underway.

Also, my hospital could also be an abnormality...I don't know what the statistics are in the other hospitals in the area. They may have had flu patients before the vaccinations started.



[edit on 4-11-2009 by nikiano]

[edit on 4-11-2009 by nikiano]

I just posted a reply to someone else explaining this very same thing. I work in an ER in the Pacific Northwest and our surge started less than a week after the Flu Mist was started. That was about three weeks ago...and we now seem to be seeing a decline in patients.


[edit on 4-11-2009 by westcoast]

quote;


Baxter Checkoslovakia


Aint it now Czech Republic ?

Originally posted by seattletruth
Eco, I have come to the conclusion that you will not entertain the idea that this has mutated until CNN tells you it has.

Their own president is basically SAYING it has mutated, he thinks it may have mutated before it even GOT to Ukraine, analysts from this country are saying it probably mutated. The clusters of hemorrhagic symptoms can only be explained by a mutation.

But no, it was the nuclear plant that blew up 23 years ago and magically only dusted the people in major urban areas across the whole country, and skipping all the areas in between. That's whats causing the clusters of hemorrhagic symptoms... Right.

That theory fits perfectly with the "1000s of mini H-bombs that use cold fusion" blew up the twin towers scenario.

The release of the analysis by the WHO confirmed by a couple of other virologist will settle the issue for me but I just posted not even 2 hours ago that I do think the virus mutated. Sorry, I see you figured that out now.

What anyone thinks isn't what matters, what matters is the type of mutation and what it means for lethality for all of us. I don't trust the WHO to tell the truth if the news is bad though, it would have an immediate effect on the economies which is all they really care about. That's why I want to see what Niman and a few other researchers say about the genetic profile if / when it comes out.


The reason why is that I've been wondering if the WHO tried to hide a mutation what would they use for a reason? That's when I thought about the Chernobyl health effects.

Really though there won't be a reason given. If they go that route Mexico City was never explained either. Either that or we've reached the point where the pandemic is supposed to become "real" (in the sense of the media in the West not under reporting it and the WHO not hiding the
severity).

If the conspiracies surrounding martial law and plans to use the pandemic are real they have to go "live" sometime. I've been wondering when that day would finally come if there was indeed anything to it all.

[edit on 5-11-2009 by ecoparity]

Originally posted by westcoast


I just posted a reply to someone else explaining this very same thing. I work in an ER in the Pacific Northwest and our surge started less than a week after the Flu Mist was started. That was about three weeks ago...and we now seem to be seeing a decline in patients.


[edit on 4-11-2009 by westcoast]

So, I'm not the only one who noticed it!

Thanks for telling me. Happy to know I'm not imagining things!


[edit on 4-11-2009 by nikiano]

Is it truly a decline in patients?

Or is it in response to the doctors in the media telling everyone to stay home unless you're REALLY REALLY sick...?

HOw many people will die because they don't think they're REALLY REALLY sick?

reply to post by Hellmutt



Ok thanks for clarifying.

Originally posted by juniperberry
Is it truly a decline in patients?

Or is it in response to the doctors in the media telling everyone to stay home unless you're REALLY REALLY sick...?

HOw many people will die because they don't think they're REALLY REALLY sick?

If we do have a mutation it won't just be at work in Ukraine, it will be global by now. The "big news" we've seen in the Ukraine didn't just happen, the uptick in cases began a month plus ago.

Pandemics are sneaky. When they finally reach the tipping point in viral load the outbreaks come out of everywhere all at once even though people have been in bad shape for weeks. This is why Mexico just kind of erupted one weekend when a couple of thousand people all hit the ERs at once.

Once the media reported what was going on the other few thousand people showed up in a panic who were even slightly ill or imagined they were.

Hysteria really happens when it comes to issues of health. You announce a deadly virus is around and everyone starts feeling sick.

I hope and pray there's no increased lethality. My gut says there is but I want it to be not true very, very badly. I'm afraid things will go sideways immediately after the announcement and after that the conspiracies I don't subscribe to become something to worry about. Why can't this one be a 1976 type pandemic?

been following this thread since page 1....

Asen- best of luck to you, i hope you safely get back to india and its just a bad head cold you have. Will be checking back to make sure you made it home OK.

to the people in Ukraine...stay safe! love to you all!

From BrestOnline, Belarussian news source brestonline.com...

4 November 2009
Quarantine imposed at schools, hospitals in Vitsyebsk region’s cities

A quarantine has been imposed at schools and hospitals in major cities of the Vitsyebsk region, Vitsyebsk, Orsha, Polatsk and Navapolatsk, to prevent the spread of acute respiratory diseases.

Against the background of high swine flu fears in Minsk, there are few passers-by in Vitsyebsk who wear face masks. Only pharmacy and store assistants use the masks.

Most pharmacies in the city have sold out not only antiviral drugs but also ascorbic acid. Pharmacists promise that shelves would soon be restocked.

Iryna Druzhynina, deputy director general of the Vitsyebsk branch of the state-owned Farmatsyya drug company that runs a network of pharmacies, said that the sale of face masks had grown tenfold, but the scramble was “artificial.”

She stressed that people could make masks themselves, adding that the working hours of state-run pharmacies in Vitsyebsk had been extended until 11 p.m. //BelaPAN

Source: Naviny.by

4 November 2009
Minsk's Hospital No. 3 said to be packed with patients with acute respiratory disease, pneumonia

Minsk's Hospital No. 3 is overcrowded with patients with acute respiratory disease and pneumonia, prominent human rights defender Ales Byalyatski, who is being treated in the hospital for pneumonia, told BelaPAN.

According to Mr. Byalyatski, he overheard doctors say that there were three times more such patients than usual.

"The hospital is like in wartime," he said. "We have six patients in each of the nine wards. Seventeen more people are lying in beds in the corridor, that is, there is no room for them in the wards. Men and women, old and young people are lying in the corridor together. The gastroenterology unit is now occupied by flu patients."

Mr. Byalyatski himself stayed two days in the corridor until a bed in a ward became vacant.

Nevertheless, there is no shortage of medications, he said.

Mr. Byalyatski is vice president of the International Human Rights Federation.

Much has been said about the political angles that supposedly compliment whats going on.
Theres two things that remain true irrespective of what we think

1.There are some quite serious concerns about health of the people right now.

2.There are concerns about the Health of Ukraines financial state.

heres the IMFs take on things;


www.bloomberg.com...


Strange theres no mention of Timishenko asking Moscow for Money...nor Putin telling the EU that Ukraine has gold reserves cit could use to pay for November Gas bill...

[edit on 5-11-2009 by martin3030]

Romanian Times
www.romaniantimes.at...

Hospitals under quarantine to prevent spread of swine flu

All Romanian hospitals were under quarantine in order to prevent the spread of swine flu, health authorities announced today (Mon).

A total of 128 new cases of swine flu have been registered in the last 72 hours, bringing the total number to 555, with no fatalities.

Health Ministry Secretary of State Adrian Streinu-Cercel said the measure to place all hospitals under quarantine translated into fewer patient visits and fewer medical staff.

The ministry will start distributing anti-viral medicines to the infections diseases units at county hospitals and assign 6.4 million lei (27 million lei) to hospitals in areas hit by the new flu for the purchase of surgical masks and disinfectant.

Streinu-Cercel also said Romania had 400,000 doses of anti-viral medicine and would soon purchase another 1,375,000 doses.

He added the ministry had scrapped plans to buy one million doses of swine-flu vaccine from foreign producers because they would have been ready only in the first quarter of 2010.

Romania will begin a vaccination campaign against swine flu on November 26/27 using vaccine produced by the Cantacuzino Institute.

The first 1.3 million doses will be given to medical staff and high school and university students in the eastern city of Iasi and capital city Bucharest.

Other doses of vaccine will be given to border police staff deployed mainly along Romania's border with Ukraine.

[edit on 5-11-2009 by ahemot]

E-mail from Eyewitness in Romania:
www.stevequayle.com...

P.S. I will not cite the content of this letter in this forum to avoid personal attacks against me. See yourself.

Originally posted by JJay55
It's funny because there are so many skeptics out there and some of them will probably survive. I will personally hunt them down.

This was the funniest thing I've read in awhile. Thank you. I needed that.
second line.
third line.

Good info ahemot-and interesting too.Do you know if the people will be prepared to have the Vaccine ?

reply to post by CoolMemberOfATS


CoolMemberofATS, if the 12 Monkeys theory turns out to be correct, I will start a thread here on ATS about you and the theory before I die of a lab engineered mutated flu.

Originally posted by ecoparity
Why can't this one be a 1976 type pandemic?

Well, the Armed Institute of Pathology hadn't sequenced the genome for the virus until 1997, and hadn't resurrected the live virus from an exhumed obese Inuit woman until 1998, that's my guess...

The 1976 virus was truly derived from swine... This one was DESIGNED to mutate, thats why it has the extra bird flu proteins.

From that their presidential address today, it seems like now all virologists are gonna be saying "OHH yeahhh well of course it was gonna mutate"... As if this type of thing happens all the time.. This is the reason for all the social conditioning in movies like Outbreak, where we all think "oh yeah viruses mutate on their own every day".

In reality the 1918, H1N1 only mutated because of the highly vaccinated soldiers being stuck up in ships for months, together. These are man made conditions for mutation... And if THIS version of swine flu is magically expected to mutate, they must have made it so that it would mutate.. Or, my theory is that they just "plant" the next stage of release, which is more deadly, then can CLAIM that it mutated..

The beauty of influenza as a bioweapon is PERFECT deniability. Nobody even knows that it was a weapon. They all just think its a mutation..

To me, "fake mutations" being planted seems more likely, because real mutations would be completely uncontrollable to TPTB... And as we all know, the elite investor-class care more about CONTROL than money. They stand to profit from great disasters, but ONLY if they are in control of the disaster...
The market crash benefited the people who planned it, because they were in control.

But these are just theories... I am waiting for more FACTS

[edit on 5-11-2009 by seattletruth]