Number of victims to unknown virus growing! State of emergency to be imposed in Ukraine?

reply to post by Hellmutt

I agree. The apparent area of the outbreak was not the worst hit by direct fallout, but as some farmers may have moved or sold off stock from the worst affected areas, so they were taken further west or south, that could have played a part. This would be important in the case of cows, for example.

Frankly I feel the mutation-by-radiation scenario is unlikely but I'm kind of playing devil's advocate here, because it's not out-and-out impossible.

I feel however that there could be a link between Chernobyl and the general health of people in that part of the world, though. That combined with a poorly-functioning and under-funded health system would play a major role in how an epidemic affects the people.

I'm very much hoping there has not been a mutation. Hopefully the full lab analysis from the UK will give us a definitive answer.

Regards,

Mike

Originally posted by westcoast

Originally posted by EDteach
I cannot speak for other regions of the US, but in my area (upper mid-west) we got hit with H1N1 hard about three weeks ago. We are currently in the decline. Vaccinations started a little over a week and 1/2 ago. I don't believe vaccines had any to do with the outbreak as it started prior to the vaccinations. Many children ended up in hospital for a day or two. I know of one case that was taken out of state because he was so severe. There may have been others. I am a teacher and had students that were so sick that they could hardly walk due to lung issues. Every day for three weeks, I heard coughing everywhere and lots of pneumonia cases diagnosed. Funny the doctors would tell patients you have pneumonia etc.. but would not state it had anything to do with the flu. However, in MSM reports they would state that as a generalization. I guess doctors felt a patient might find comfort to think they have pneumonia but not h1n1?? I stayed well despite being surrounded by coughing, sick kids. I believe I owe that to Vitamin D and C!

I am in the Pacific Northwest and we started to peak at about the same time. We were talking today (I work in an ER) that it seems the surge is over, and patients with flu symptoms definately on the decline. (we only had I think one or two deaths in the whole county due to H1N1 in the past couple of months...many more people died due to car accidents, heart attacks, being shot, suicide, diabetes, etc.....)

I would like to ask you this: You mentioned the vaccine came out about a week and a half ago. Our SHOT vaccine was about 2 weeks ago, but the FLU MIST came out about 1.5 to 2 weeks BEFORE. I noticed that our surge happened the week FOLLOWING the Flu Mist. The flu mist has been proven to cause the shedding of LIVE virus in about 50% of those that recieved it for 5-7 days (sometimes longer), with an infection rate of about 2.4%. If several million people got it, that means MILLIONS could have been infected because of it.

Some food for thought.

Where I live, almost two weeks ago, pregnant women and children under 4 received the vaccine. H1N1 was strong at this time. No vaccine prior to this. They had some shipment that had to be destroyed due to them getting too cold. They did have seasonal flu shot early Oct. here. Hope this answers questions.

Originally posted by squiz

In September 2009, senior law enforcement officials, health care professionals and experts from international organizations joined their forces to confront a chilling crisis – the plague had just been unleashed on their countries by unknown evildoers.

Organized by the INTERPOL Bioterrorism Unit, this third edition of the event took place from 29-30 September in Warsaw, Poland. Participants in the workshop numbered 27 from six Central and Eastern European countries (Belarus, Czech Republic, Finland, Poland, Slovakia, Ukraine), as well as 15 participants from international organizations such as Europol, the UN Office for Disarmament Affairs (UNODA), the World Health Organization (WHO), the European Centre for Disease Control, the European Commission (Directorate General for Health and Consumer Affairs and Directorate General for Justice, Freedom and Security), the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe and the Commonwealth of Independent States (CIS).

The exercise was entitled "Black Death". One of the captions at the link reads....

Bacteria used in an aerosol attack could cause cases of pneumonic plague

www.interpol.int...

So more drills I see.... this stinks to high heaven just like the drill on 9/11 and 7/7.

Thanks for that.

WHO Report Pandemic (H1N1) 2009, Ukraine - update 1

Laboratory testing in Ukraine has confirmed pandemic H1N1 influenza virus in samples taken from patients in two of the most affected regions. As the pandemic virus has rapidly become the dominant influenza strain worldwide, it can be assumed that most cases of influenza in Ukraine are caused by the H1N1 virus.

Originally posted by ecoparity
WHO Report Pandemic (H1N1) 2009, Ukraine - update 1

Laboratory testing in Ukraine has confirmed pandemic H1N1 influenza virus in samples taken from patients in two of the most affected regions. As the pandemic virus has rapidly become the dominant influenza strain worldwide, it can be assumed that most cases of influenza in Ukraine are caused by the H1N1 virus.

Sounds like Orwelian "double-speak" to me. OK, influenza cases are caused by the H1N1 virus. What about other cases, which are not influenza?

reply to post by Unplugged


I mentioned this in my post, too, but I forgot about 7/7. Good catch.

reply to post by ecoparity


That's two days old with outdated figures. And not that the WHO are wrong, but that's quite the assumption for them to make, isn't it? “As the pandemic virus has rapidly become the dominant influenza strain worldwide, it can be assumed that most cases of influenza in Ukraine are caused by the H1N1 virus?”

Seven people had died of the A/H1N1 flu pandemic in Belarus, the country's Health Ministry said on Thursday.

"Over the past two weeks, 19 people died of acute pneumonia in Belarus. Among them, seven were confirmed as having the A/H1N1 flu virus," the RIA Novosti news agency quoted Valentina Kachan, Minsk's chief sanitary official, as saying.
...
Up to Tuesday, the death toll of the A/H1N1 flu had risen to 14in Russia, and the number of confirmed cases totaled 3,122, said a Russian deputy health minister.

news.xinhuanet.com...

Originally posted by ahemot
Officials: Swine flu confirmed in Iowa cat:
news.yahoo.com...

Maybe someone would comment on that information?

Holy cow....looks like it has jumped species again.

Let's hope this was an isolated case and it doesn't do it again and get into the feral cat population. Otherwise we are gonna have one big mess on our hands.

Haven't read all of this monster, but I understand there some argument about pneumonic plague.

Of course it is important, but either way we'll find out. Both scenarios are horrific.

H1N1 variety was also that of the Spanish flu and attacked the healthy often leaving them with blood soaked lungs. As we are hearing.

There are reports of three flu's. Not sure if that's been mentioned. However still inconclusive I think.

Pneumonic plague is from Yersinia pestis, this can be aerolized for a biological attack.

Either way you'd have similar if not identical "preparedness plans."

And if it's genocide, why be picky? You may have several weapons at play to add to the confusion in treating the infected. War is always, always about deceit.

[edit on 5-11-2009 by squiz]

reply to post by nikiano


What makes you think humans infecting a cat is somehow going raise the rate on the millions of humans, wild birds and hogs infecting each other?

I want to see this math and where you read cat to human transmission.


[edit on 5-11-2009 by Regenmacher]

Originally posted by Regenmacher
reply to post by nikiano

 

What makes you think humans infecting a cat is somehow going raise the rate on the millions of humans, wild birds and hogs infecting each other?

I want to see this math...

No math required. Just the realization that cats come into contact with humans these days a lot more than hogs do.

Scenario:
Human infects cat. Cat goes out at night and plays with other cats in neighborhood. There are MANY stray/feral cats in the US...all over. Infected cat #1 infects other cats (stray) #2, 3 and 4. Infected stray cats 2,3 and 4 go on to infect other cats in the neighborhood region. They infect other domestic cats at night....bring the virus back to humans (if it now jumps species quite easily).

Plus, think of all the stray cats that get fed by humans. I just gave one stray cat some water a few weeks ago, after he scampered into my house when I left the door open for a few minutes!

Most city-dwelling humans these days have more chance of coming into contact with a stray cat than they do a stray pig or a stray duck....no math required for that one.

Originally posted by nikiano

Most city-dwelling humans these days have more chance of coming into contact with a stray cat than they do a stray pig or a stray duck....no math required for that one.

Wrong, you get an F-: There is no evidence that swine flu can be passed from cats or dogs to people.

Maybe you should get checked for flu...lol







[edit on 5-11-2009 by Regenmacher]

Originally posted by Regenmacher


Wrong, you get an F-: There is no evidence that swine flu can be passed from pets to people.

Well, duh. (insert sarcasm). But as it said in the article in yahoo, there was also no evidence that swine flu could be passed from people to pets...until now. But it just happened! Therefore, since we just saw it get transmitted from people to pets for the first time, we could also assume that it could also become transferable from pets to people. In my opinion, YOU get an F- for failing to see the simple logic in that.


edit to add:

Ok, fine.... I'll amend my earlier statement and say:

Gee, if it happens again, and the virus also becomes easily transferrable between people and pets, then we are in trouble.




[edit on 5-11-2009 by nikiano]

[edit on 5-11-2009 by nikiano]

Originally posted by ahemot
People on the streets in Kyiv talk that "swine flu" is being sprayed over Ukraine by NATO planes.
glavnoe.ua...

Comment: such rumours are of course totally meaningless and absurd. However, as I warned in one of my previous posts, Ukrainians may quickly turn against West, if western countries will not respond to this epidemic. Or maybe someone wants another Pakistan in the middle of Europe?

[edit on 5-11-2009 by ahemot]

Its absurd that people can think Nato would do this-I wonder where such rumours are likely to have originated from ?
My thoughts are that it begins with M and ends in W.

Not related to the Ukranian situation but I think it is still on topic.

As it concerns Europe's west side here in Portugal the news have been fairly quiet about the H1N1situation but this recent article caught my attention. I think there are interesting numbers and an overlapping time table.

Source - "O Público" (I translated the parts I found most relevant - I can do a full translation if requested)

"Just as predicted the A-H1N1 epidemic is starting at schools", says the specialist in public health of the DGS, Mário Carreira. Infectious centers on 60 schools - 53 more than the previous week - were accounted for by the Health Ministry. Over 2378 people were further observed at Health Services, "at this point half of them are children and teenagers with ages ranging up to 20 years of age."

[...]

During the week between 19-25 of October only 7 schools had been afected, a number that has now risen to 60 schools between the 26th of October and the 1st of November.

[...]

"We are entering an epidemic stage", Mário Carreira points out. Even though the Health Ministry no longerdistinguishes between the several flu virus, Mário Carreira explains that the great majority of flus are caused by the H1N1 virus since, "there is currently no record of any circulation of seasonal flu".

[...]

António Diniz, pneumologist at the Hospital Center Lisbon North [...], considers: "We are yet to enter the flu season and already have cases and search for medical care at peak levels." The doctor and consultant for the DGS for the A-H1N1 says, "It is important to remain calm to remain calm", but further states, "this is not a normal flu. [...] I am not used to having people between the ages of 30 and 40 commited with the flu."

The latest statistics claim Portugal currently has only 4994 confirmed cases of H1N1 (population of 10,707,924). As a side note it is also a country that enjoys a heavy flux of Eastern European immigration.

Cheers.

Hi guys,

Someone mentioned a couple of pages ago, that Baxter may have labs or other premises in neighbouring countries to Ukraine?

It was already confirmed, early in the thread, that Baxter have premises in Kiev, 250 miles away from this outbreak. Here's their address and phone number!

Baxter Ukraine
29 Beresnyakovskaya st
02098 Kiev
Phone: +38 044 4962410

They are also listed on Baxter BioTherapeutics website.
Link to Baxter Biotherapeutics website

Incidentally, one of the products listed on another page at that website, is a treatment for Guillain-Barré Syndrome. This is one of the many known side-effects of Immunisations containing mercury/squalene.
Link to Baxters web page showing Guillain-Barre Syndrome therapy.

G

reply to post by nikiano


Yes, people have spread flu to cats before and cats isolate it. So it's not a two way street and logic is based on historical facts, so the cats should be the ones that are worrying.

[edit on 5-11-2009 by Regenmacher]

Originally posted by Regenmacher
reply to post by nikiano

 

Yes, people have spread flu to cats before as in h5n1 and cats isolate it. So it's not a two way street and logic is based on historical facts.


[edit on 5-11-2009 by Regenmacher]

You know, you could have kindly pointed that out to me by saying "Hey, nikiano, in the past, people have transmitted the flu to cats, but the cats have never been shown to transmit the flu back to people."

And I could have said, "Really, Rainman? Thanks for pointing that out to me, I did not know that before. I appreciate you teaching me that."

But no, you had to go and be confrontational about it and say: "Wrong! F-!!" And then of course, I get sarcastic with you, and then if we're not careful we have a war of words.

If I didn't know better, I'd think that maybe you were trying to provoke a fight with me to get me kicked off and get this thread shut down, so all this talk of pneumonic plague and biological warfare and false flags and tainted vaccine could be squashed right now, despite all the warnings about personal attacks and keeping things civil.

So, all I'll say is:

Gee, thanks Rainman for pointing out that very interesting fact about cats. You taught me something I never knew before! I really appreciate your kindness in pointing that out. Let's hope the virus doesn't go against history and mutate even more so it becomes easily transferrable back to humans. Have a nice day!




[edit on 5-11-2009 by nikiano]

reply to post by Cadbury


It's all we have until report 2, hopefully the definitive volume on mutation.

Your second question is one of those weird issues I'd like a better answer for as well. The virologist claim H1N1 has displaced all other seasonal flu by being better able to infect hosts and all that stuff.

Then they say 99 percent of all influenza in E Europe is H1N1. OK. Doesn't that mean 1 percent might be another type? Then they say, no - all influenza in E Europe is H1N1.

And we all say

Does that 1 percent just not count in virology land? Maybe virology math has no zero - I don't get it either and they won't explain it. I think it's some kind of inside joke lab geek thing.

Maybe the 1 percent just doesn't matter when talking about a pandemic?


[edit on 5-11-2009 by ecoparity]