Could you tell me what the ups and downs mean??

Are the ups the bad and the downs the good reactions to changes?

Well the Timewave Zero graph didn't correlate at all to what happened on 9-11. So there is proof that it is somewhat bogus.

I'm not sure I understand about this timewave. It's supposed to show us when certain *novel* events take place?

If that's the case, then maybe what happened in July of 1942 was novel, but not newsworthy; not something that entered the consciousness of Mankind. For example, someone discovered something, but that discovery didn't bear fruit for some time afterwards.

Just to take an example, the idea of nuclear fission used as a weapon must have occurred to someone long before it ever took place. So, that might be where the "novelty" began, even though the actual use of fission as a weapon only took place in August of 1945.

I suppose that October 26, 2009 might have some sort of newsworthy event. Perhaps Iran will test a nuclear weapon. Perhaps their nuclear sites will be attacked. Maybe it's something completely unrelated to any known news items of today. The problem I see is, there are newsworthy events on many days. How will we determine whether October 26th is just a busy news day, or whether something truly unique and noteworthy happened? What would distinguish ordinary news from something special? In fact, what does "special" mean, when considering the timewave?

I think, given this understanding (which I admit might be wrong), I wouldn't consider something about Iran as "special". We can see something in the works already. I would say that it would have to be something unexpected, something that a person wouldn't ordinarily see coming. Example: China wants to become the 51st US state. That's so bizarre, that if it happened on 10/26, I'd say timewave rocks.

Whatever the case, I think it would be important to determine now what would constitute a "novel" event, rather than seeing what happens then and trying to retrofit it into the "prediction".

I recall that the web-bot was supposedly predicting an earthquake for a certain date. The earthquake never happened, but the Madoff debacle happened. This was considered a "hit". But seriously, that's lame. Any day is likely to have news; you can fit anything into a "prediction" after the fact.

TWZ is supposedly a mathematical conversion of the King Wen Arrangement of the I CHING hexagrams.

It is a mathematical object in the form of a graph that has resonances which can be actions of a NOVEL character as opposed to HABIT.One age's NOVELTY becomes a building block as HAABIT upon which further NOVELTY may be built in an ever faster accumulation of NOVELTY.

Also,a 'dip' in the wave indicates ''CONNECTEDNESS" as opposed to ISOLATION,according the the Man,Terrence.

We chattering can have resonance with past events when we learn from past mistakes and act with that in mind as a whole one mind.In my opinion.

Oh yeah one more thing is that we may have unleashed something far greater than the killing of untold numbers of civillians on that horrible day.One theory has been put forth that we caused destruction in an alternate universe bu this nuclear act here.Thererby ushering in the modern age of UFO sightings.I seem to recall this was a Terrence rant.

Originally posted by Stargate2012
Well the Timewave Zero graph didn't correlate at all to what happened on 9-11. So there is proof that it is somewhat bogus.

Yes this argument has always crossed my mind when interpreting the graph. Timewave does in fact peak at 9-11 but on every version (Kelly, Watkins etc.) besides the default Sheliak. Sheliak appears to be a downward trend, while the others have a sudden bump on the date.

Here is a summary of the different versions.

the Kelly version is the original set used by Terrence Mckenna it was created by Royce Kelley and Leon Taylor in 1974 as McKenna was developing the theory
the Watkins version is based on a criticism of Novelty theory by Matthew Watkins in which he designed a formula capturing the I-Ching transformation.
the Sheliak version is based on a revision from physicist John Sheliak, this version is the one which McKenna himself was the most mathematically sound
In addition to the King Wen sequence the Huang-Ti sequence and Ben Franklin’s magic square have also been converted into novelty number sets.

If we use the Kelly version (the one used by Mckenna) you wield a result for 9-11.

The problem is, it is hard to interpret the effect of different data sets and it is still something that comes under debate.


Now onto the topic.

We must remember that this system is based on fractals, not only because it is incorporated mathematically but one could see the nature of the graph take a similar form in the universe. So a thematic event could take place many times without being restricted to its respective cycles. This has sort of been a recent theory as earlier we had been looking up certain dates, what happened on that date previous cycle, and what happens in the present. Sure enough it works (almost). I am still speculating whether it is just our ability to relate events based on facts. I think we are becoming very good at this. Maybe it is the internet as Mckenna said, we could just be evolving.

As far as the date goes, someone mentioned "The day Iran is attacked by Israel" This day could be related to that, but I for some reason think it will happen much earlier. I think we will experience a mini-WW2 scenario as time is condensed. (This could be a technological phenomena where wars are fought with tactic). As the 26th resonates to a period where WW2 was progressing, a war in our time could be as well.

Finally I would like to point out that Timewave Zero takes novelty to a very personal level. Who here had experience a great deal in their life on the 22nd this month? I did, not only was it the procession into my star sign (Libra), I underwent a huge conscious shift of my own. This period lasted until te morning of the 26th. Interestingly enough, both dates were that of the dust storms here in Sydney

By the way KSPigpen, you have to U2U Evasius about this thread as never checks this forum but his own

Great thread, it's always good to see someone making an effort to use the graphs and find future events

[edit on 28-9-2009 by JRSB]

Actually take that back, looking at the graph, a major drop started to happen a few weeks after 9-11. Right around the time when went to war with Afghanistan. I think it was probably at that point of time when we really knew things were becoming different. So novelty really started coming into effect big time a few weeks after 9-11 after people have digested what really happened and the consequences. Perhaps maybe then, something could happen a few weeks before Oct. 25th of this year?

Originally posted by chiron613
I'm not sure I understand about this timewave. It's supposed to show us when certain *novel* events take place?

I may be way off base, here, but my interpretation is not that is denotes any 'events' but instead the novelty OF those events...or even novelty that is in no way related to specific happenings...the novelty theory works on an 'average' of novelty in the universe. for some the day will be nothing special, of others, the day will be novel.

If that's the case, then maybe what happened in July of 1942 was novel, but not newsworthy; not something that entered the consciousness of Mankind. For example, someone discovered something, but that discovery didn't bear fruit for some time afterwards.

Just to take an example, the idea of nuclear fission used as a weapon must have occurred to someone long before it ever took place. So, that might be where the "novelty" began, even though the actual use of fission as a weapon only took place in August of 1945.

You make a very interesting point, one for which I really have no answer. I think this is an important part of the process. Indeed, fission as a weapon had been discussed clear back in 1939, but the 'fruits' of that weren't really realized until 45.

part of my problem is a lack of understanding. It's all just an attempt to make some sense out of it.

I suppose that October 26, 2009 might have some sort of newsworthy event. Perhaps Iran will test a nuclear weapon. Perhaps their nuclear sites will be attacked. Maybe it's something completely unrelated to any known news items of today. The problem I see is, there are newsworthy events on many days. How will we determine whether October 26th is just a busy news day, or whether something truly unique and noteworthy happened? What would distinguish ordinary news from something special? In fact, what does "special" mean, when considering the timewave?

I think the idea of novelty would imply that it's not really something we have grown accustomed to. War happens every day. Now, war with Iran, would be a big event, not so much if the US was involved, as we are great at starting wars. But again, WWII was already going on in 1942, yet novelty was elevated dramatically on July 14th, so that would tell me that it was something other than the war that everyone had already grown accustomed to.

I'm also guilty of looking at this whole thing with my American eyes. A tendency exists for me to try and force anything to apply to the United States. I admit my bias on that, and so have reached out to you folks, who may not be from here, to provide events that you may think were novel for the given period.

I think, given this understanding (which I admit might be wrong), I wouldn't consider something about Iran as "special". We can see something in the works already. I would say that it would have to be something unexpected, something that a person wouldn't ordinarily see coming. Example: China wants to become the 51st US state. That's so bizarre, that if it happened on 10/26, I'd say timewave rocks.

The curve on this section of the wave is interesting to me because it doesn't really denote a RAPID shift...the trip to the elevated novelty is rather gradual when compared with other events. The novelty is high, but it doesn't seem to happen 'overnight.' I think SOME events regarding Iran could be novel...when considered from alternate perspectives...Israel being severely damaged, for example.

Whatever the case, I think it would be important to determine now what would constitute a "novel" event, rather than seeing what happens then and trying to retrofit it into the "prediction".

I recall that the web-bot was supposedly predicting an earthquake for a certain date. The earthquake never happened, but the Madoff debacle happened. This was considered a "hit". But seriously, that's lame. Any day is likely to have news; you can fit anything into a "prediction" after the fact.

That is really the goal for me with this. What qualifies as novel? To be honest, if this theory is accurate and we are to believe McKenna, in a short while, none of our speculation will matter.

The date of the use of an atomic weapon in WWII was used to seed the theory. I am very biased towards not the technological advancement as much as the impact on human life. when I see a new small gadget that can do whizbang stuff, it impacts me little. When I see the gadget explode and kill a couple hundred thousand people, it becomes a big deal. I'm probably way off, but that is really why I'm here today.

Thank you very much for your input.

The Manhattan Project began in 1942.
In July of '42 Kenneth Cole developed the health division in the metallugical laboratories in Chicago where the production pile designs were devoloped for the bomb.

There is some doom for ya'.
But that isn't to be taken very seriously as this wasn't a novel item occuring in '42 in fact, nobody knew about it.