is God bad ?

Have you ever noticed that when, say, a player catches a football for a touchdown, he thanks God for letting it happen but when he drops the ball, he doesn't blame satan?

reply to post by LiveForever8


Basically, the bible speaks of those hardening their hearts as "not being invited". In order to speak of this you must suspend your disbelief in God, is all.

reply to post by XXXN3O


The problem is that i dont "need an answer." An answer to what?

I have an open mind and to rule something like this out indefinitely would perhaps be foolish.

But i look to science/history etc for my answers. Things i can see. Things i can feel. Things i can research and question.

I have never looked to the heavens for answers and i never will.

Originally posted by karl 12

Originally posted by XXXN3O

Originally posted by karl 12
reply to post by nomorecruelty

 

I take it you don't agree with this quote then.

"The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully."
Richard Dawkins

Its amazing how much that sounds like a half educated child with a chip on their shoulder speaking about a father that they have never taken the time to understand.

I suppose if you've got a vested interest in believing the bible to be anything more than just a book then you may well hold that opinion but to me it sounds like a fair enough apprasial.

I also agree with this comment made by anthropologist John Hartung:

"The Bible is a blueprint of in-group morality, complete with instructions for genocide, enslavement of out-groups, and world domination. But the Bible is not evil by virtue of its objectives or even its glorification of murder, cruelty, and rape . Many ancient works do that-The Iliad, the Icelandic Sagas, the tales of the ancient Syrians and the inscriptions of the ancient Mayans, for example. But no one is selling the Iliad as a foundation for morality. Therein lies the problem".
John Hartung.

Nice sig by the way.

[edit on 02/10/08 by karl 12]

I dont particularly agree with the quotes your posting

I guess I can agree to disagree with what you are saying.

Thanks for the signature comment though, 2nd person to mention it but I have only come across one who understands it so far, as far as I am aware.

reply to post by heyo


It has nothing to do with belief.

Originally posted by LiveForever8
reply to post by XXXN3O

 

The problem is that i dont "need an answer." An answer to what?

I have an open mind and to rule something like this out indefinitely would perhaps be foolish.

But i look to science/history etc for my answers. Things i can see. Things i can feel. Things i can research and question.

I have never looked to the heavens for answers and i never will.

You might not have too though. Its important to keep an open mind though as you are.

I lost "faith" if you like, in science when I worked in the field. Many change data etc to suit there beliefs within trials due to financial pressure.

Do not get me wrong, science is beneficial to the world but some just like religion, is corrupt but not all.

Anyways im offski, think ive said enough and its not my thread.

Cheers



[edit on 7-6-2009 by XXXN3O]

reply to post by LiveForever8


exactly. some can feel God, and some cannot. Hence " a wicked generation asks for proof"
also, it is amazing what conclusions science is coming to these days, especially in the realm of particle physics and the like.

Great thread!

I decided to stop using the Bible at all, and simply get away from "God" "Satan" etc. There are lots of other less restrictive ways to look at the world, consciousness, and spirit.

[not that this matters, but, I really appreciate you're openness to new possibilites and the guts to say so.]

reply to post by XXXN3O


I dont disagree about corrupt science, however i believe there is alot more honesty in science than religion.

I just wish that science was as popular as religion is. The world would be a more informed and enlightened place.

God is neither good nor bad. God simply is.

It is the human mind that creates suffering and the concepts of good and bad, because it exists in duality. God is beyond duality.

Originally posted by LiveForever8I just wish that science was as popular as religion is. The world would be a more informed and enlightened place.

Neither science nor religion offers a fully comprehensive understanding of the universe and reality. Any belief system that is grounded in duality will fail to bring humanity out of suffering. Your statement is incorrect.

Originally posted by XXXN3O

"The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully."
Richard Dawkins

"The Bible is a blueprint of in-group morality, complete with instructions for genocide, enslavement of out-groups, and world domination. But the Bible is not evil by virtue of its objectives or even its glorification of murder, cruelty, and rape . Many ancient works do that-The Iliad, the Icelandic Sagas, the tales of the ancient Syrians and the inscriptions of the ancient Mayans, for example. But no one is selling the Iliad as a foundation for morality. Therein lies the problem".
John Hartung.

In the old testement God was an *******. Case and Point, making Abraham wait 100 years before letting him sire a child, then when he has grown, God then tells Abraham to kill his only son, and at the last minute he says, more or less, that he was joking. Also, Jobe was the nicest, most helpful man you could ever meet, and most loyal to God. God kills his family, friends, and livestalk, destroyed his home, and then to ice the cake, he festers Jobes body with horrible boils. Now does that soung like a loving god to you? In the New, or cleaned up version as I call it, he was made into a loving God.

And the bible was a means to give the 'rightious' control over the masses to keep them uneducated and to be their slaves, all while satisfying their thirst for power an justifying their horrible crimes against people as 'God's Will' or that the bible/God said it was ok for them to do it.

There is no God. The very concept of a God has crippled humanity's humanity, he is a justification for genocide, and impedes scietific process.

That is my anti-Christian rant.

God in the major religious books (old and new testament, quaran) is very vengeful, does that translate to bad? maybe..But... ufos, aliens and traditional notion of God are not compatible concepts to say the least.

Implications of existence of Alien civilisations on the organised religions will be very destructive. I'm sure they will try to device some "rational" explanation for the aliens.

So the minute the chief grey says hellooo everybody, there goes the traditional god image (old guy with white beard, you can call him Zeus), cherubs/cupids. I can imagine the pope rolling his eyes saying "Oi!" )

reply to post by The Killah29


when i was a kid, i thought my parents we *******s.
maybe think of it in terms of each generation being metaphorically congruent to a year in terms of growth of each individual person?

Originally posted by XXXN3O

Originally posted by bloodline
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/39089a5f28ac.png[/atsimg]

I mean it's a good debate though.

Who created more people?

www.peterrussell.com...

At time of posting, God = 6749908833

Satan = 0

If your going to look at the negative, how can you see any positive

This life is our own choice and punishment, death is the end of it.

If you had bothered to look into it at all you would know that because its in the first few pages of the bible and you say you have read it but you clearly have not understood it if this is the type of justification you use.

If you were looking at it completely negative you could say god created and killed every single human being that ever has and ever will exist.

[edit on 7-6-2009 by XXXN3O]

Whatever man. The graph is funny.
If you didn't laugh then you're taking things to seriously.

The bible is a book. I've read it.
I don't believe that it is anything other than stories.

Do you comprehend this?
This is the simplest terms I can put it in.

Originally posted by scghst1
sheeple who get all pissy and defend the bible and try to say non-believers are going to burn in hell and what-not are the biggest kind of ignorance and are no better than a racoon. They are a smelly, disgusting, good for nothing race of people who have no purpose here other than to make the world worse.


If you believe in any religion, YOU ARE A SHEEP


P.S. -beliefs such as animism or wiccan are not the same thing

Raccoons are so cute. Never smelled one though.

[edit on 7-6-2009 by bloodline]

reply to post by nomorecruelty

You know what came to me after reading your post. Just what if your rapture is designed for you to think you are going to heaven & what it is, is some higher civalization that looks like a almighty god taken you to heaven. When indeed you are being used to A. either be harvested to make habitance on another planet or B.your soul will be used by that higher civalization for what ever energy source needed. See I could list many possiabltys about the god you are trained to believe in. But please, take a minute and ask yourself. DO YOU BELIEVE THAT GOD MADE EVERYTHING? If you answer yes, which b,y christiantys laws you must. That would make everything good, evil & in between GOD. Including you and I and everything in between. Freewill is true, we all have it because we are part of GOD or the energy source, but it is up to you how you want to distrubute your energy.It takes a balance for a universe to be stable. That is true physics. If you would like to funnel you energy to a church or whatever religion it may be, you as part of God take away or giveth to someone or something else. Now to me that is wasted energy. A god that creates everything would never ever imprison energy by the laws that are created by civalization. because if god created everything he would be imprisoning himself or itself. COME on see the logic set yourself free from the chains that bare our energy. It is beautiful to be free. I feel more loving now then ever before with people & nature & just everything. The TRUTH is what will set everything free, Just Ask with your heart & it will come. Do not let the bars set up by religion keep you locked up.

reply to post by XXXN3O


Not very contradictory actaully, I believe christianity is a virus too which add's to me theory really doesnt take away from it.

Its contradictory in my eye's for you to first denounce God then turn into a born again christian, Then come on here and try and tell me a thread i made


I dont have enough time for the 'father i have yet to get to know' to go through all of the threads you have made.

but if you actaully looked properly, what made me angry and to make that thread was that a poor defenseless girl was beaten to death because of religion.

I would still push the button.

If you take the Bible as a path to your answer its the wrong way.

Alas, if you want to know God, the Bible will provide very limited and perverted messages. Its good to know about, but in no way the ultimate truth and all that.

Good and bad is a matter of prespective. God is in all things.

Think of God as all experiences, take a criminal, God is there 100% living every moment when the criminal does his thing. Sounds odd? Well, we're bias when we think of God. He is not just a he, he can be a she an it, us, we, ...

God is both the killer and the victim, but if you are smart enough you will know that both are just two prespectives, while a third prespective will tell you that life on earth is not the end, but the means to something else...

Is God bad? Well, the question is a "bad" one. Its so limited and shows lack of awareness. The answer is yes and no. It all depends on the prespective.

Is God bad? YES he lets us suffer, children die of hunger... etc. That is stupid to say... If you know you are part of God, as in his will its your will... children die of hunger because we are too selfish to care for others, we chose this experience, god will not deny it to us.

Is God bad? NO he lets us kill each other, be evil, selfish, arogant, ignorat, ...etc... There is no higher proof of his love than that.

The best way to find your answer is to try and actually find your own answers, don't limit yourself to one book or paradigm. Those just restrict your awarenes.

Satan is just another name for God. Actually both God and Satan are bad names for what "God" is. Both are heavy of bias dogma. Maybe we could call god, hmm the infinite? The one, The all? God is both all and nothing. God is in itself a paradox. Our minds cannot see beyond the paradox.

Before I offer my opinion, I'd like to set some things straight.

1. Lucifer is not the big bad scary devil. The word that has been translated as Lucifer is Helel. Helel was a Canaanite deity and was associated with the planet venus or the morning star. The translators didn't really know what the passage was about so that used the word Lucifer meaning "light bringer". When the bible was translated into english the translators still did not understand the passage and just copied the word that was used in the Latin Vulgate. Most modern translators render the word as "the day star"
Rashi explains that the passage is referring to Nebuchanezzar. The biblical author most likely used an old canaanite story to symbolize Nebuchanezzar.

2. The snake in the garden cannot be the big bad scary devil. At the end of the narrative all three were punished. The snake's punishment was that had to crawl on his belly and eat dirt for all of his days. The big bad scary devil is most ofter associated with the satan, and we see the satan walking and standing on 2 legs and not on his belly.

3. In the Hebrew (often referred to as the older testament) bible the satan is in kahoots with God. In Job, the satan asks for permission to test Job and God grants it. In Zechariah, we see the satan as a prosecuting attorney in the heavenly court. It's only with the Christian movement that the satan becomes the personification of evil. To the Hebrews the satan was just an agent of God.

Now, to offer my opinion on the question in the original post. Its a matter of perspective. To use the bible as an example, the bible paints a picture of the god Baal as being wicked and evil. However to the canaanites he was a hero. Baal was the storm god. It was him that caused the rain to fall and water the crops resulting in a good harvest. So the canaanites treated him with respect.

It all depends on how you choose to look at it as to whether God is good or bad.