And I never have to wonder if satan is alive and well - given all the comments that I read on this, and other, forums - it's proof that he has millions of people exactly where he wants them.

Taking a wild guess, I would bet most of the non believers on this thread are under the age of 40 -45? That would explain the anti Christ mentality for the most part.

Originally posted by nomorecruelty


p.s. enjoy your celebrating now - I got a feeling you won't feel up to "celebrating" when the end does finally come.

And yet, this God of yours doesn't sound very nice to me.

Hosea 9: 11-16
Exodus 12: 29-30
Isaiah 13: 15-18
2 Kings 8: 12

Of course, I could name more.

And so, I feel that your disturbingly gleeful inference that those of us who have espoused an opinion different to yours in this thread will soon be burning in hell, to be subjective and therefore without credence. You and I can read the same text and come to two different conclusions. This makes it subjective. I am willing to rationally explain my views, and back them up with examples. But, are you willing to do the same, as opposed to a lack of discussion and a lazy "you're all going to hell" response?

Originally posted by fatdad
i was thinking what if Lucifer was in fact the good guy and all the story's about him where just to make him look bad and make good look like the good guy....
what if the garden of Eden was in fact a sort of zoo where god kept all the animals he had made \ collected .
was it Lucifer who helped us escape by giving us the knowledge that there was a world outside the garden walls and giving us the knowledge we would need to survive in that world...

[edit on 6-6-2009 by fatdad]

Your answer is already in your question. Take a look at what you just typed again.

You already acknowledge that god made us in your opening post and that lucifer gave us the knowledge to live in the WORLD OUTSIDE! Man took it!

Theres your proof right there that he is not bad, why would something bad create us? God never gave us the knowledge to live outside because we were not created for that were we??

Human beings were made with innocence, we lost that when we took from the tree of knowledge through choice and continue to do so.

Life is a lesson and the phrase cruel to be kind is the justification for allowing it to continue but in the end it will be worth it because we will have more knowledge, experience and we will be able to return with it having overcome lucifer along with complete death. Everyone has the choice at the end of the day and nobody will take that away from you.



[edit on 7-6-2009 by XXXN3O]

Which god?

Theres quite a few gods (and goddesses) to choose from.

If you mean the abrahamic god then I'd say yes.

Originally posted by nomorecruelty
p.s. enjoy your celebrating now - I got a feeling you won't feel up to "celebrating" when the end does finally come.

How horrible it must be to live in a mental trap, your mind is locked up inside the confines of religious belief and you do not know what freedom of the mind is.



By the way, did god also create child molesters?

Originally posted by Hawkwind.

Originally posted by nomorecruelty
p.s. enjoy your celebrating now - I got a feeling you won't feel up to "celebrating" when the end does finally come.

By the way, did god also create child molesters?

I do not understand why are saying this apart from a misunderstanding.

Your given free will, you are not born a murderer, a rapist, a child molester etc. That is a choice that you make should you choose. That is what free will is, choice.

I do not agree entirely with nomorecruelty as the comment is slightly belittling toward others.

[edit on 7-6-2009 by XXXN3O]

i wouldn't take the words of the bible literally

Originally posted by Rezination
i wouldn't take the words of the bible literally

Exactly and that is why so many do not understand the parables contained within the pages.

I highly doubt many athiest's have actually read the full bible either, many christians have not read the full bible. Even christians struggle to understand the bible at times.

[edit on 7-6-2009 by XXXN3O]

Old Testament God is bad.

New Testament God is not so much.

Although seeing as there is no such being as the Biblical God these points are pretty useless.

"Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it, you'd have good people doing good things and evil people doing bad things, but for good people to do bad things, it takes religion."

namesake is not whats important, the developing christ conscousness construct proves this if one was to define it it would be too unstable to be universally accepted, it depends on survival physical survival of ideas and ideals and the survival of your soul on whatever level you beleive it to be a re-simulation or reverse quantum calculus anything that moves makes a sound working it in reverse could be challeneging and dangerous but possible.

What is always amazing to me, is people put God as a seperate being or enity. Would not God be everything GOOD BAD and everything in between if He created everything. ALpha omega and all the above. I think when we as people try to put God into a sepratness ,apart from us, it puts us in a prison type living. We are God He is us. HE is everything our energy in us is everything.People do not be enslaved by the belief of sepratness.

Wow this is like the total opposite of what i read in the ringing cedars. If only i could copy and paste the book of what our true origins are and who God is too us.

They both need time out's.

2 minutes for every year they are old too.

How is it that an alleged Single Creator of the entire infinite, incomprehensible universe has an "only begotten son" (per Christianity) that happens to be born on this planet - in the dark outer rim hinterlands of a nondescript galaxy? What are the REAL chances of that being true? I'll stick with my view of the universe being either the product of collective (pluralistic) creation or CONCEIVABLY a Single Creator where nothing or no one on Earth has ANY kind of special status.

Abrahamic religions are THE biggest problems humanity has had since their inceptions. Religious beliefs prevent facts/knowledge and enable ignorance; far more than anything else has. Brainwashing (religious AND political) prevents progress. Period. Sorry if that's a bit off topic. Sorry I'm fed up and disgusted with these kinds of threads way beyond what mere words can express. end rant

Originally posted by Dean Goldberry
How is it that an alleged Single Creator of the entire infinite, incomprehensible universe has an "only begotten son" (per Christianity) that happens to be born on this planet - in the dark outer rim hinterlands of a nondescript galaxy? What are the REAL chances of that being true? I'll stick with my view of the universe being either the product of collective (pluralistic) creation or CONCEIVABLY a Single Creator where nothing or no one on Earth has ANY kind of special status.

Abrahamic religions are THE biggest problems humanity has had since their inceptions. Religious beliefs prevent facts/knowledge and enable ignorance; far more than anything else has. Brainwashing (religious AND political) prevents progress. Period. Sorry if that's a bit off topic. Sorry I'm fed up and disgusted with these kinds of threads way beyond what mere words can express. end rant

Well do not create threads of your own based on religion or read threads regarding religion then rant when someone opposes your view.

Do you expect everyone to agree with you?

Maybe your confused with yourself, not others.

[edit on 7-6-2009 by XXXN3O]

God is both Lucifer and God himself.

What you say? Lets open our minds this Sunday morning guys.

God is all knowing and all powerful correct?
God wants all of his children to do good correct?

Well....what is the way most people find good? By going and doing bad. You see, with good you also NEED bad. It's the old yin-yang, kain and abel, adam and eve, good and evil....

GOD KNOWS THIS.

Notice why every human/alien/hybrid/draco reptillian/zeta reticullan reading this post knows that with good you need bad.

BECUASE IT'S THE TRUTH

The ego in us would not want to admit it, but c'mon guys we all do bad. From the bottom to the top. From the poorest man to the richeset man. The most powerful person to the one with no voice whatsoever. WE ALL HAVE GOOD AND BAD.

The big secret is we have to learn to except them both. If you focus only on the good in life, you were decieved in life. If you focus on only the bad in life, you were decieved in life. You must have the balance. Yin-Yang.

When you get caught up in the game of life asking a bunch of questions you miss the whole point. Lets take a step back today. Put it all down and recognize our good and bad. Tell someone the bad things you've done in life and tell me if it doesn't actually make YOU FEEL GOOD.

That's how you win in life. Go about everything with your head up high. Look towards the sky do NOT LOOK AT THE GROUND.
NEVER GIVE UP
AND WHEN THE BAD HAPPENS, REMIND YOURSELF IT HAPPENS TO EVERYBODY. DO NOT LOOK DOWN, ALWAYS LOOK UP AND YOU WILL WIN IN THE END I PROMISE!!

So to answer your question, Yes, God is bad, but only because he has to be.

And people today lets not worry so much WHAT God is. God is Good. Lucifer is Bad. Take the names away. X is Good. Y is Bad. It doesn't matter WHAT YOUR GOD IS as long as it's always the GOOD you will be alright.

Have a great Sunday and remember, when the bad happens today, put your head to the sky and find the GOOD.

From childhood I had a very simple question that has not been fully resolved. In fact, all I remember is this one teacher giving me a mean look when I asked her. Either a)she was caught off guard or b)she thought I was only being a troublemaker and it was not worthy of any response.

If we assume the very basic concept we are taught that god = good and devil = bad , if you are good you go to heaven and get rewarded and if you are bad you go to hell and be punished and tortured then (see how basic it is yet this is where my compass goes crazy) I'm torn by this confusion. Wouldn't it seem logical that if you were tempted by the devil to be bad during your life and fell weak to his/her sinful influence and therefore wound up in hell with them being the CEO, instead of the whole suffering , nose deep in excrement scenario where satan goes water skiing every Sunday, wouldn't the devil 'reward' you ?? A couple of hi fives my brotha, you killed 7 and a half ppl and blew up a school bus, you da man - grab a corner office by me and enjoy the bonuses .......type thing??

It would appear that god and the devil are in total unison, on the same side just with a different job. Is this the case?
Somehow devil + god = the same if penance is to be had for being bad. I don't know. Please..

I confess I have never read the bible. I mean no harm by my ignorance. If my understanding of all of this seems neanderthal, it's just that I never assigned a high value to understanding this huge debate of conflict - creation vs evolution. I just chose not to.

So someone pls help . If devil stands for evil, and you are an evil person on earth, and when you die you take the elevetor down to his front door. Knock-knock....... what happens???? Is he that much of a deceiver?

Kind regards.
G.

ps. maybe I should just read the damn thing and get it over with.