Famous SciFi Author Tells CETI and METI to STFU & Stop Shouting at Cosmos!

I like how this article states it:

"Suddenly keeping quiet would be like a drunk boyfriend carefully taking off his shoes after knocking over a bookshelf on his way to the bedroom."

link

I had those thoughts long ago. And while I'm not terribly worried about us becoming a food source, I'd be much more worried that our planet as a whole would be consider a bounty of resource riches. And there could be many species that indeed, have no emotion as we know it, and they don't consider good or evil to take what they want, it's just their nature. Or some may consider us so primitive, that they treat us the same way we treat animals on our planet. Inferior, and tools to be used, and animals don't own property of course.

It's like the disc they sent out. "We are HERE.. these are all our weaknesses and culture, just in case you want to more easily take our planet."

I'm thinking most species if evolved to the point of space travel though, would have a society that would at least recognize the rights of the local species. At least I always hope so.

If we have already attracted the attention of our galactic neighbors and u.f.o.'s are actually studying this planet, I wonder what the alien life forms would think of a story like this? I wonder if they have a sense of irony...

[edit on 02/21/09 by daeoeste]

Originally posted by Verd_Vhett
i'm of the opinion that we have already been contacted and if dinner was their plan we would be done already!

Nah, the worlds a farm! Old McDonalds is still fattening us up and lacing our bodies with the appropriate amount of preservatives to keep our meat fresh and tasty for the long trip back to Betelgeuse. *oink*

e-i-e-i-o

IRM

Really the bottom line is, we don't have a clue what is out there. As stated previously it would be extremely unwise to attract unnecessary attention from someone or something that may not have our best interests at heart.
Let us continue to listen, and develop our technology so that at some point we may be ready for whatever is thrown at us.
We are still too young and immature, let us not rush ourselves.

Originally posted by Kandinsky
...they are exercising excessive hubris or enthusiasm to make the call on behalf of the 6.5 billion people on this planet. It isn't their decision to make.

I concur.

This is an unnecessary risk - we ought to spend more time listening, and developing our arsenal in case we ever find something that might potentially one day pose a threat. ;-)

Heck, maybe we are the 'something-that-may-one-day- pose-a- threat' and we are being studied by artificially intelligent Von Neuman probes deployed for just such a task - here to track our progress and to pull the plug on our little operation should we over reach.... or to watch us the way we watch ants.

*Regardless, What if Shostak sends out a signal welcoming the aliens to earth, only to find out they have been here all along and were just waiting for this sort of overture before making themselves known....

I'd be pissed at Shostak.

Edit: What if the Aliens have time travel capability and instantly appear the moment this signal is sent towards their homeworld?

Perhaps time travel is their technological means to actually meet the individuals stupid enough to send out these signals, before they are destroyed by the predatory civilizations that waits for this sort of mistake - Perhaps they'll give us their version of the Darwin award.





[edit on 8-4-2009 by Exuberant1]

Any ideas we would have are nothing then assumptions. We can't compare an alien race to any human/earth reference.

We have no way to predict what would happen. I think we should mind our own business galactically.

Originally posted by Exuberant1
What if Shostak sends out a signal welcoming the aliens to earth, only to find out they have been here all along and were just waiting for this sort of overture before making themselves known....

I get it... Kinda like vampires! They can't come into your house without being invited first! That's some spooky sh!t right there man!

IRM

I agree with the fact of beaming out there, why not? I mean if we do attract some carnivorous beings and they dine out so be it! Live a little. However IMO it is dumb to assume anything at all.

Originally posted by 5thElement
Quote from the link you provided:

It is naive to assume there is no evil in the universe.

IMO, it is dumb to assume that our concept of good and evil is UNIVERSAL.

I believe, lol, that whoever is able to manage to come to Earth in interstellar spaceship is not only more technologically developed then we are, but also has more advanced society which is capable of recognizing and respecting life beyond their own world

I am in favor of the Earth Interstellar Beacon

Being Sci-Fi author does not make David Brin authority on this issue more then anybody else

Originally posted by hornum
Live a little.

That's just the thing...

I highly doubt the pleasure stimulus you receive from Seth Shostak sending out this signal is worth the potential risk that will be assumed by those individuals who had no say in the matter.

Time is a factor - this signal will traverse the cosmos for light-centuries; Future generations will be forced to assume the consequences of Shostak's risk-taking behaviour.

*I agree with Carl Sagan and myself- this idea is monumentally stupid and the derived pleasure stimulus will be highly selective on a personal level and would be undemocratic - which is just plain wrong ;-)

Can you please explain the risk?

Originally posted by Exuberant1

Originally posted by hornum
Live a little.

That's just the thing...

I highly doubt the pleasure stimulus you receive from Seth Shostak sending out this signal is worth the potential risk that will be assumed by those individuals who had no say in the matter.

Time is a factor - this signal will traverse the cosmos for light-centuries; Future generations will be forced to assume the consequences of Shostak's risk-taking behaviour.

*I agree with Carl Sagan and myself- this idea is monumentally stupid and the derived pleasure stimulus will be highly selective on a personal level and would be undemocratic - which is just plain wrong ;-)

Originally posted by hornum
Can you please explain the risk?

So you didn't even bother to read the article....

That's okay. ;-)

It's perhaps too late to worry about shouting at cosmos and putting ourselves on the menu for ETs. At this very moment someone out there may be discussing what "Happy Birthday" means... Rare, medium or well done?

SentForever was founded in 2007 by Stephanie Baillache and Chris Thomason. Stephanie was disillusioned with the way that standard greeting cards seemed so temporary in nature – often being thrown away just a few days after being sent. “I wanted to find a way to send personal messages that was much more meaningful, and a way that would help to get across the feeling and emotion behind an important message.”

Chris and I started discussing how to make important personal messages last for a lifetime. We eventually came across a way to make the messages last for an eternity by beaming them into deep space, where they will travel for the rest of time.

British Telecommunications is the UK's largest telecoms company and they have modified one of their dishes to be able to send our transmisions into deep space. We transmit people’s messages of love, remembrance, prayer, birth, hope and joy from BT's Goonhilly earth station in Cornwall, UK from where they start their eternal journey.

www.sentforever.com...

[edit on 8/4/09 by ziggystar60]

I totally disagree with the author David Brin. Unfortunately we always make the mistake of propagating theories and possibilities based on known scientific paradigms. If we’re thinking about ETs then we need to think out of the box. It’s a totally different ball game altogether.

SETI is an eyewash, probably a conspiracy to launder black money. It’s high time they realized the futility of using radio waves or the electromagnetic spectrum to contact other ET civilizations. Why has there been no contact for the past several decades? Are we barking up the wrong tree? Yes!

For starters, we will most likely NEVER find a civilization that is at the same level of technology as ours that uses the electromagnetic spectrum as a means of communication. What are the odds of finding one within our technological bracket? NIL!

On one side of the spectrum there would most likely be very advanced Type 1 civilizations and beyond that don’t use radio waves any more as a means of transmission of data and info. This method would be passé. They would have graduated to more advanced forms of communication which we haven’t a clue about. For them it would be like us trying to decipher smoke signals emanating from some antique Red Indian settlement!

At the other side, there could be life that is thousands if not millions of years behind us in evolution. So there’s no question of any contact with them as they would not have developed such capabilities.



That leaves an extremely miniscule or probably a non existent number of civilizations in the universe that are at the exact same technological level as we are and which have evolved at almost the same time and rate and also use radio waves as a means of communication. Such a planet could be millions if not billions of light years away – one amongst a trillion planets. So what are the chances of radio waves reaching them? Next to nix. If they ever did, then it would take millions of years for a reply!

So is SETI barking up the wrong tree? You bet they are!

We may NEVER be able to communicate with an Extra Terrestrial civilization until we have a highly developed technology that matches theirs.

In conclusion, would we spend the time and effort in re-learning how to respond to those smoke signals? We’d probably wait until the Red Indians have learnt the technology to communicate through cell phones or teach them how to communicate using them!

And then considering that civilizations that are Type 2 and beyond are flitting around the galaxy as a matter of course, even between galaxies and universes and dimensions as Dr Michio Kaku says, do we for a moment think that they are not aware of us? If they were hostile, Earth would have become a mud ball by now!

To SETI I would say – Stop blowing smoke signals! And to David Brin – Get real!

Cheers!

reply to post by ziggystar60


I checked the site out.

The transmitter they are using is nowhere near as powerful as the SETI array(along with whatever else Shostak decides to use) and the messages they allow you to send are quite limited: You cannot send out the galactic coordinates of Earth and requisite accompanying data to the degree that SETI is liable to do when they transmit their message.

*In any case, the Arecibo dish sent a high-powered message decades ago, containing information that should not have been sent.

No one had a say in that either - Especially the people born after it happened. (and who were forced to assume the potential consequences, with chances of presenting that increase with each passing generation)

Is this not just a publicity stunt. If Craigs List r signed up I can’t see why not. That site needs some publicity anyway, in the UK hardly anyone uses it. I am surprised Richard Branson has jumped on this band Wagon either as I know how much he enjoys promoting Virgin.

Quite honestly I believe we are already being visited and observed by Aliens so if they do do this so what! Whoever has the capability of Interstellar travel prob already knows where we are and they prob have to stick to some kind of Intergalactic treaty......

Originally posted by mikesingh
We’d probably wait until the Red Indians have learnt the technology to communicate through cell phones or teach them how to communicate using them!

But until then, we could study their primitive culture in our never ending quest 'to explore strange new worlds, to seek out new life forms and new civilizations, to boldly go where no man has gone before"....

Or maybe we would just deploy our nearest Von Neumann probes to study them ;-)

The article is ridiculous! I dont believe that theres anyone out there to communicate with anyway! We talk about "odds are" when this is purely theory! Imagine this. The universe was created, and everything in it. Suppose there is a battle going on, a battle of good and evil and we are smack bang in the middle of it. Suppose no matter how much we transmit and no matter how much we search our endeavors are set to fail. This is just as practicle theory as the one you share with whats his name.

Originally posted by Exuberant1

Originally posted by hornum
Can you please explain the risk?

So you didn't even bother to read the article....

That's okay. ;-)

reply to post by hornum


"The article is ridiculous! I dont believe that theres anyone out there to communicate with anyway! "

Then why do you want to send this signal?

*Your statements are conflicting.... You claim you don't believe in extraterrestrial life, yet you want to send a signal in attempt to contact them. ;-)

we ought to spend more time listening, and developing our arsenal in case we ever find something that might potentially one day pose a threat

Yes, lets spend more on developing our arsenal so when they do get here we can be even more ashamed of how we've wasted our resources to make war.

There is nothing on Earth which is unique to our planet - our resources are abundant in the universe.

I love David Brin, one of my favourite authors but I disagree strongly with his stand on this.

The bottom line is that we just don't know. However I find it highly unlikely they'd want to eat us, besides if they did they could just clone us and have a never ending supply of Filet human. It is our nature to want to humanize the unknown.

For me it boils down to if they have the technology to travel here, they have evolved beyond wanton destruction for the sake of power and/or resources.

A society which spends all their resources on making war has little left over for making progress in the sciences that improve life - Just look at us.